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My view: Amnesty towards border children is not compassionate and will not solve problems

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  • Hamath Omaha, NE
    July 22, 2014 4:54 a.m.

    Just like welfare is not compassionate. Thousands in my city suffer from it. They don't have the initiative they would have had without the free handouts. I was about 40 before I finally made it above the poverty line. We never took food stamps nor lived gov't subsidized housing, even though by doing so we would have saved lots of $$$. BUT.... by NOT doing so, I had great incentive to improve my situation. I kept at it and kept at it and finally got to the point where I was making a decent salary. I'm not rich, but I don't qualify for food stamps anymore! And guess what... during those poverty years, without food stamps and all those "compassionate" initiatives, my family and I survived. We found ways. We were never destitute enough to even need to call on family or church assistance for food, rent, etc. We just adjusted and survived.

  • Say No to BO Mapleton, UT
    July 22, 2014 7:26 a.m.

    I have yet to hear a politician explain how "reform" in the form of legalization of those here illegally benefits our citizens and our society. As Mr. Herrod points out, it certainly rewards bad behavior, and it solves a myriad of problems for the illegal aliens themselves, but what are the benefits to the tax-paying citizens?
    I fear that the "reform" Washington is selling will not fix the real problem. I believe the real problem here is that no one takes our immigration laws seriously. The situation is out of control. In a shrinking world we need to control who (and how many) are allowed to come here. We cannot possibly accommodate everyone who wants to live here. And it is unfair to reward the self-selected.
    The current situation of children flooding the border is a microcosm of the larger picture; they are taking advantage of loopholes and a lack of enforcement. And no one in Washington has the political will to change that.

  • Ryan J Bozeman, MT
    July 22, 2014 7:34 a.m.

    I don't think we can generalize this situation. This article negative events of illegal immigrant in Utah to Children showing up at the U. S. border and makes the argument that we should not help these children because it would only hurt them. This does not make logical sense in my mind. Just because someone made bad choices in Utah doesn't absolve us from the responsibility of caring for the poor or those that are in need. This is a fallacy of association. Providing immediate relief to suffering people in my view is compassionate. I agree that providing basic needs of food and shelter are not enough to fix the situation. More can be done to educate and sustain. More can be done to help fragile governments. But I completely disagree with the argument that providing relief for these children is not compassionate.

  • Irony Guy Bountiful, Utah
    July 22, 2014 8:06 a.m.

    Obviously we have to navigate between compassion and sound policy. But conservatives like Mr. Herrod are whipping up so much hatred (oh, unintentionally, I'm sure) among the red-meat fringe that there is now a real prospect of riots and violence on the border--not from the immigrant side, but from our side!

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    July 22, 2014 8:10 a.m.

    This border crisis is just Obama's Mariel Boatlift fiasco. And, the Ukraine is his Iran Hostage Crisis; the Benghazi debacle, his Desert One; Lois Lerner his Bert Lance; etc., etc., etc.

    Rather than emulate America's greatest Democrat Presidents, Obama appears bound and determined to overtake Carter as America's worst President.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    July 22, 2014 8:18 a.m.

    The immigration issue is due to the working of the free market system, the law of supply and demand. The U.S. is creating the demand for cheap labor. We are benefiting from it. No wall in the world will stop the flow. No amount of additional "enforcement" will work. Besides, there is virtually no adherence to the law by Americans. My sister complains about all of the illegals, yet has one do her yard work and other activities, and has a very good relationship with the guy. This is emblematic of the situation. Another problem is the insatiable appetite for drugs, which creates all sorts of problems in Latin America. Frankly, I am weary of the moralistic huffing and puffing of folks, coming up with all sorts of pretzel logic like this op-ed piece, which is dead wrong and doesn't get to the root of the problem. The solution is not that difficult, but it is one that the right wing will never accept because they are concerned about illegal immigrants from Latin America but not those from other countries. Do I need to say what this is?

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 22, 2014 8:33 a.m.

    The people who brought the cheap labor to Utah and America, now balk at using their same argument of compassion and virtue in dealing with the little people.

    The answer to the question "Why wasn't there concern before" is simply that the real reason for the business people to support immigration was for money. American businessmen caused the poverty south of the border just as much as the poverty that is overtaking the people north of our southern border.

    If Americans were truly compassionate, they would not send the children and adults back to the misery of their dysfunctional nation, we would send ships and planes to get the children and not make them risk so much in their quest for survival.

  • cocosweet Sandy, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:03 a.m.

    I do find the hypocrisy of people complaining about illegals but then using them to do lawn work, housekeeping (etc.) very sad. I brought this situation up to a friend and she said it was the lawn service's problem not hers.

    It is about time we penalize the companies who hire illegal immigrants. No jobs, far fewer illegals. The employers are making all the money off of these people (paying far less than minimum wage). It is simple demand and supply...

  • Klarson Sandy, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:09 a.m.

    Finally someone who is willing to speak the truth on this subject. We need more leaders like Mr. Herrod.

    We need to enforce our existing laws, seal the border, streamline deportations, and close all of the loopholes that allow illegal immigrants to stay in this country.

    The U.S. is having trouble taking care of our own citizens. We can't absorb the population of Central and South America too.

  • Lagomorph Salt Lake City, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:12 a.m.

    Some valuable perspective on immigration policy can come from applying the debate issues to a different context. The political right has taken an immigration policy proposal, a simplified and short-circuited pathway to citizenship, and pasted the the word "amnesty" on it. Conservative talk radio (pardon the redundancy) seems to be sponsored in large part by a handful of income tax relief companies. Their business is to negotiate with the IRS on behalf of taxpayers who have fallen behind in their taxes and arrange simplified, reduced payment plans for pennies on the dollar. Their ads cite clients who "neglected" to pay taxes for years and owe hundreds of thousands in back taxes. (How is it possible for someone to fail to pay taxes for a decade? Can't anyone earning enough to owe $200,000 afford an accountant?)

    To those who ask "what part of 'illegal' don't you understand?" to brown-skinned border crossers, will you also ask the same question of the white-collar tax delinquents catered to by your favorite talk show host? Will you be honest enough to call their negotiated tax settlements what they are, amnesty?

  • Steve C. Warren WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:22 a.m.

    My understanding is that the majority of the would-be immigrants fit the definition of refugees, because they face hunger, poverty, assault, etc., in their home countries. If there were only 50 of them and they were Caucasians coming from Canada, I wonder whether Mr. Herrod might be more welcoming. In other words, does he merely view the tens of thousands of Latinos as way too inconvenient to deal with? Let's not be like those who passed the injured man by in the story of the Good Samaritan.

    Frankly, we in Utah need to carefully consider how we treat the "other." Our record wasn't great during the civil rights era, so let's not repeat it in dealing with immigrants.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:29 a.m.

    Initiative is when you find yourself in an uncomfortable status and you do something about it. The parents and children of poverty in South American are showing more initiative than most Americans in poverty show. The difference is that the South Americans are more desperate and all the risk is worth even the tiniest chance for survival. Americans in poverty probably realize there is no chance.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    July 22, 2014 9:56 a.m.

    Christopher N. Herrod is a real estate developer and Republican member of the Utah House of Representatives from Provo.

    ===

    Frankly,
    I could careless what Christopher N. Herrod says;

    This is what the LDS Church officially has said on the matter --

    "...this issue is one that must ultimately be resolved by the FEDERAL government.

    "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is concerned that any state legislation that only contains enforcement provisions is likely to fall short of the high moral standard of treating each other as children of God.

    "The history of mass expulsion or mistreatment of individuals or families is cause for concern especially where race, culture or religion are involved. This should give pause to any policy that contemplates targeting any one group, particularly if that group comes mostly from one heritage.

    And the text of the accompanying statement,
    "Responsibility of Church Members: Avoiding Being Judgmental"

    Amnesty most certainly can be part of the answer,
    that is called "compromise"...

    And don;t give me any of that;
    Reagan Amnesty - GOOD
    Obama Amnesty - BAD.

    I'm not buying into anyone's partisan hypocrasy.

  • Atlas Smashed Santa Monica, CA
    July 22, 2014 9:59 a.m.

    Until we stop employers from hiring illegals, nothing will stop illegals from coming.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 22, 2014 10:02 a.m.

    Ultra Bob is right that "The parents and children of poverty in South American are showing more initiative than most Americans in poverty show."

    However, we cannot afford to support both illegal immigrants and U.S. citizens who want (not necessarily "need") handouts from taxpayers. Those are actually two separate issued.

    Rep. Herrod has nailed the crux of the problem- rewarding illegal behavior begets more of it. Banks prosecute robbers, instead of giving them a $1,000 bonus on their third robbery because prosecution deters and punishes criminals. Rewarding criminals does not.

    While it may seem heartless to deny entry to illegals, and to deport those who make it across, it will benefit millions of Americans, and hundreds of thousands of potential illegal immigrants.

    Most of all, it rewards the admirable patience and law abiding behavior of the large number of people who simply obey our laws and immigrate here legally. They are welcome additions to our society. I urge all potential illegal immigrants to head for the nearest U.S. consulate and start the process to come legally.

    But, anyone coming here illegally must be denied entry and deported immediately.

  • Noodlekaboodle Poplar Grove, UT
    July 22, 2014 10:37 a.m.

    So what is the christian thing to do?(since the right is so fast to throw christianity out when they don't want to follow a healthcare law) You're really telling me that sending these kids back to an almost certain death is the right answer. Because so far all I can see is the right whipping up anger against children, then offering no solution. All hate, no plans, I guess that's the GOP of the 2010's.......

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    July 22, 2014 11:03 a.m.

    The republican lust for amnesty will only hurt the American worker.

    Just look, Reagan gave illegals amnesty. Did it stop illegal immigration? Nope, it encouraged it.

    Bush offered it.
    And now King Jon Boehner, by refusing to work with the President for a solution, is covertly demanding amnesty. The only reason why he doesn't come out and say it is because he knows his base would turn on him. So instead, he covertly offers it in hopes of gaining the Latino vote while pacifying his base.

    When will repubs place the well being of the country and the American people ahead of party? Why does Boehner want to hurt the American people so bad?

    Time to vote these bums out. Time to punish those who refuse to solve illegal immigration. No one should vote for any repub who wants to reward those for breaking our laws and punish American workers and legal immigrants.

  • TeaPartyImmigrationCoalition port charlotte, FL
    July 22, 2014 11:28 a.m.

    Unfortunately some of your readers are misinformed.
    Nehemiah thought that walls were necessary and a good thing. Apparently so did God. The walls saved Israel and are saving Israel again. Why would you not want to honor the God Jehovah and save his people here?
    So what scriptural basis do they have? NADA
    Now what is the Biblical thing to do? Sometimes, God's answer is "Do nothing". There are many very good reasons to believe that taking these minor invaders in is the right thing to do. Wrong, In addition to what the writer says, we have some other facts to put before you.

    Space does not permit us to give them all to you. However, a careful read of what we have written over time on our facebook page will give you all that you need.
    But consider this: What would the world be like without an America? Would we be speaking German, Russian or Chinese? For we are diluting America with illegals without the opportunity to "Americanize" them and thus we are the creators of our own demise.
    No nation can have open borders and remain that nation. No nation has an unlimited treasury. America must deport
    .

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    July 22, 2014 11:51 a.m.

    this doesn't have to be an either / or situation. We can and should be both compassionate as well as lawful. We can take care of these kids in a compassionate way (food - water - etc..) and then return them safely to their homes in Central America within 72 hours. Waiting to schedulue them for a court date is a joke and everyone knows it - they just disapear into society and end up on welfare at tax payer expense and of course voting for democrats. Barack Obama created this mess on purpose for pure selfish political reasons and now predictably he won't do anything except try to score dishonest political points. From a Demagogue like Obama this makes perfect sense.

    DEMAGOGUE: a political leader who tries to get support by making false claims and promises and using arguments based on emotion rather than reason

  • E Sam Provo, UT
    July 22, 2014 11:56 a.m.

    As Esquire pointed out, this is about supply and demand in labor markets. But the current crisis is likewise rooted in economics. The U.S. war on drugs reduces supply, without reducing demand. As a result, the multi-national corporations we call 'drug cartels' compete ferociously for the highly lucrative US market for illicit drugs. And Honduras ends up with a murder rate 500 times American rates, and these children are the collateral damage. At the very least, if we're Christians, we must let them in, let them stay, care for them. We created the problem, we need to help fix it.

  • Mikhail ALPINE, UT
    July 22, 2014 12:03 p.m.

    I was around in 1986 when amnesty was tried. The fact is that very few illegal aliens took advantage of the simplified registration process made available at the time. The border continues to be ignored. Yes, those who come here without following the necessary registration requirements (yes, there is an application for "refugees")simply ignore those requirements. We should do everything we can to assist these children. When I say "we" I do not include the Federal government. The people of the United States should be helping these children with food and shelter. The Federal government should be securing the border, processing the legitimate applications, and moving away from the attractions given to both citizens and non-citizens in the form of free things, so as to reduce the motivation to ignore the registration process. Companies that hire illegal aliens should be penalized (the laws are on the books but are not being enforced consistently). Get these children reunited with their families back in their homes. Being undocumented subjects these otherwise good and moral people to abuses by those whose selfishness reins supreme - both those with political and economic ambitions.

  • Mikhail ALPINE, UT
    July 22, 2014 12:10 p.m.

    By the way - if these kids were citizens of the United States - and their parents send them on their own to cover hundreds or thousands of miles, subjecting them to may dangers - Social Services would take them away from their parents and place them for adoption with people who were deemed more responsible than their birth parents. Maybe we should put them up for adoption with U.S. citizens.
    The foreseeable problem is that the children would not want to be adopted and would do anything they could to leave the adoptive family to be reunited with their birth parents. Lots of runaway street children would be the result. More danger. More problems.

  • FDRfan Sugar City, ID
    July 22, 2014 12:15 p.m.

    So the most compassionate thing to do in the long run is perhaps to gun them down as they try to enter our borders? This would certainly send a message.

    What we need to do is try to help make things better in the countries of origin. We are not being overwhelmed with refugees from any other places than South America. This is where we may need to focus our foreign relief programs. Let the Europeans and the Middle East solve their own problems. Our biggest threats may be from South and Central America.

  • Noodlekaboodle Poplar Grove, UT
    July 22, 2014 12:29 p.m.

    @patriot
    I don't know if you have kids, but if you do, imagine the type of situation where you live in such a bad place that sending your kids, alone, for a 1000 miles is better than them staying with you. It's pretty awful right? There is a reason these kids are here, and it isn't lazyness on the parents part, it's because there is a high risk of these kids dying if they are sent back home. So is it really compassionate to send these kids back?

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    July 22, 2014 12:44 p.m.

    I have always wondered what we could do on the front end of the problem. I know everyone hates foreign aid or intervention, but I wonder if it might be warranted here. What could we do to help the situations in these countries so there is less chaos and better economic opportunity. These children and young men and women are coming here because they are desperate and life in their countries not only does not provide opportunity but also is just plain life threatening. I think in some senses we might owe these places some more attention and funds. They were our "banana republics" and I think the economic and political interference we have shown these countries helped create the problem we have now.

  • nonceleb Salt Lake City, UT
    July 22, 2014 1:15 p.m.

    I have a problem with a standard argument that something like the Dream Act would encourage more illegal immigration. They will come here regardless of the laws we pass. They are coming now even though immigration reform has been on hold since 2008. As so many are desperate, they could care less about any immigration compromises or so-called "amnesty." This kind of argument was used during the Vietnam War years. Nixon aids blamed our eventually losing South Vietnam to the communists on protestors here in America. It was argued that it "emboldened" the North Vietnamese and the Viet Cong. They would have fought on relentlessly regardless of opposition to the war from Americans then. This "embolden" argument was used when the first initiatives were presented to gradually withdraw from Iraq back when Bush was the president. We underestimate the resolve of those determined groups we are trying to stop.

  • Third try screen name Mapleton, UT
    July 22, 2014 1:32 p.m.

    Amnesty is NOT the moral high ground here. Self-selected trespassers can hardly be considered the most deserving of our help. What about all those who apply through proper channels and wait their turn? What's that? Why not BOTH groups?
    Well, I think we all know the answer to that. Whose country is this, anyway?

  • JustGordon Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 22, 2014 2:01 p.m.

    I am amazed at those whose over simplistic solution to a complex social, economic and ethnic problem is to simply enforce a law that will separate families, leaving tens of thousands of legal minor citizens here but sending their parents home. The folks who advocate such simplicity are generally also telling us that they are pro family. Really?

  • JoeCapitalist2 Orem, UT
    July 22, 2014 2:37 p.m.

    LDS Liberal:

    Quote 1) "Christopher N. Herrod is a real estate developer and Republican member of the Utah House of Representatives from Provo. Frankly, I could careless what Christopher N. Herrod says;"

    Quote 2) "Responsibility of Church Members: Avoiding Being Judgmental"

    Quote 3) "I'm not buying into anyone's partisan hypocrasy."

    Did you really say these three things together in the same post?
    And FYI, conservatives do not consider the amnesty granted by Reagan as "GOOD". It was one of his biggest mistakes (and yes he had a few).

  • Casey See FLOWER MOUND, TX
    July 22, 2014 2:52 p.m.

    This could be the most complex, ugly, toughest situation that we will face domestically in decades.

    to apply to legally enter the US as one person put it, is the same as a death sentence for many as this takes at least 180 days for those with highly desired skills to 3-4 years for those who just want to be reunited with their family.

    Drugs and their illicite usage drives much of the problems in their homelands, but we can't dictate to those governments what to do as we are as much of the problem as they are (by our usage).

    Using lawn and maid services that hire illegal persons and then say we can't dictate who they use is also putting head into the sand.

    On the other side, we need to show compassion. But the compassion needs to have long term solutions added to it or all it does is create the equivalent of a open garbage dump near a forest full of bears. It just attracts and the requires lethal solutions to save lives.

    I don't have a good solution for all of it. Does anyone on this board?

  • GaryO Virginia Beach, VA
    July 22, 2014 3:23 p.m.

    Amnesty? Is it really “amnesty” we are talking about here?

    Ronald Reagan granted amnesty to over 3 MILLION illegals in 1986. And yes, those included families with children, but it’s not the same as what is going on now.

    Now, we have children coming to us . . . Unescorted by family members. Many of them are running from a dangerous existence in Central America. And they are seeking safety and shelter and REFUGE in America.

    They are REFUGEES.

    How does the inscription read on the Statue of Liberty?

    “Give me your tired, your poor,
    Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
    The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
    Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
    I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

    But that was some other America, wasn’t it?

    That was America before “Conservatives” began to routinely take their marching orders from know-it-alls like Rush Limbaugh. That was an America untainted by the likes of FOX “News” and Right Wing Radio.

    The Great Right Wing Hive Mind now decrees that the tempest-tossed should be tossed right back into the tempest . . . And obedient “Conservatives” can only agree.

  • watchman Salt Lake City, UT
    July 22, 2014 3:24 p.m.

    It is good to read information on illegal immigration and the invasion of the southern border that is written by someone who understands human nature as well as the problem at hand. The writer, Herrod, seems to understand true compassion as well as the rule of law and these two well known basic truths usually go together. Add to that the value of American citizenship and keeping integrity in the sovereignty of our nation and you can see more clearly what Herrod is trying to say.

    Regrettably, too many of our elected leaders, and even some church and civic leaders, do not possess this basic understanding that Herrod represents in his article.

  • dave4197 Redding, CA
    July 22, 2014 3:31 p.m.

    Mr Herrod is mixed up
    The refugees coming across our border with Mexico deserve our help, our compassion, indeed a showing of our Christian teaching and behavior, like the commandment to love our neighbor or like a casual reading of the parable of the good Samaritan. Mr Herrod is wrong. His attempt to re-define amnesty is a poor attempt at editorializing, why did DN print it.
    Mr Herrod, amnesty is always about compassion towards anybody who did anything you or others think wrong or ill advised.
    People, please step up and help the refugees coming across our border. Let's not debate in the same breath the need to help now! with long term complex "solutions".

  • GaryO Virginia Beach, VA
    July 22, 2014 3:36 p.m.

    Hey Casey See -

    "Drugs and their illicite usage drives much of the problems in their homelands, but we can't dictate to those governments what to do as we are as much of the problem as they are (by our usage)"

    Exactly!

    If the United States simply legalized recreational drug use, the cartels would pretty much vanish; because the United States is their number one customer now, and legalization would kill the illicit drug trade.

    And with the legalization of recreational drugs, the drugs could be standardized, regulated, and taxed much like cigarettes and alcohol.

    It's a straightforward solution, but not without difficulties. Still, it would be much better than the state of things now.

  • GaryO Virginia Beach, VA
    July 22, 2014 3:45 p.m.

    Hey Procuradorfiscal -

    "Rather than emulate America's greatest Democrat Presidents, Obama appears bound and determined to overtake Carter as America's worst President."

    No worries there.

    Obama will never come close to Ronald Reagan's standing as America's worst president.

    Don't worry - I'm sure Reagan will retain his position for quite some time.

  • SLars Provo, UT
    July 22, 2014 4:22 p.m.

    It should cost more to break the law than to obey it.

    On July 7th, the Federal Government issued an intelligence report analyzing the influx of illegal alien children appearing at the southern border of the United States. They collected data in May and June in preparation for the report entitled, Misperceptions of U. S. Policy Key Driver in Central American Migrant Surge.

    A survey of these migrants in late May revealed that 219 out of the 230 surveyed (that's 95%) came here because they had been told by the media that they would be given permisos simply by showing up at the border. Further, they were advised that immigration enforcement in the United States was so lax that the odds of being deported were NIL.

    Amnesty encourages people to break the law of Moses, is that compassionate? Have the 8th, 9th, and 10th Commandments been rescinded?

    Love is sending people down the path of righteousness; rewarding illegal/dishonest behavior is not love.

  • Say No to BO Mapleton, UT
    July 22, 2014 5:15 p.m.

    @GaryO
    Emma Lazarus was a poet, not an elected official.
    If our immigration requirements were limited to fatigue, poverty and a desire for freedom we would be overrun with a billion or so people. You aren't really suggesting that a poem serve as our immigration policy, are you?

  • prelax Murray, UT
    July 22, 2014 5:19 p.m.

    "The Obama administration moved Friday to stem a flood of Central American children and families that has overwhelmed the U.S. immigration system, dispatching Vice President Joe Biden to the region to warn against the perils of the trip and announcing that it will start to detain families at the border instead of releasing them on their own recognizance.

    After weeks of insistence that criminal violence was responsible for the surge of Central American migrants, the U.S. has begun a regional public-relations campaign to fight the widespread belief in Central America that children and families will be allowed to stay in the U.S. if they are caught by the Border Patrol." DN June 20

    Why do people still insist that they are coming to avoid violence? With a very short waiting list, why not come here legally. Central American countries have waits of a year or less. It's twice as easy to come here now, than it was before 1976.

  • prelax Murray, UT
    July 22, 2014 5:29 p.m.

    @Esquire

    It's not the law of supply and demand when one side breaks the law.

    Hiring someone here illegally is still a felony, and amnesty is not just for those here illegally, but for business also.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    July 22, 2014 5:38 p.m.

    ...this as we claim not only to know but to emulate the actions of Jesus.

  • RRB SLC, UT
    July 22, 2014 5:52 p.m.

    The children coming here for waivers are a great example of why rewarding illegal behavior just encourages more of it.

    We have had seven amnesties, and now find 12 million people here illegally. Those amnesties did nothing to stop illegal immigration.

    We have had seven amnesties.
    •The one in 1986 for 2.7 million aliens, the amnesty to end all amnesties.
    •section 245(i) rolling amnesty of 400,000 in 1994
    •section 245(i) extension in 1997 of over 400,000
    •Central American Relief Act that gave one million Central Americans amnesty 1997
    •Haitian Refugee Immigration Fairness Act a amnesty for Haitians 125,000 in1998
    •Late amnesty an amnesty for 400,000 that claimed they should of been included in the 1986 act. California courts were back up for years by the claims, finally we gave up. 2000
    •Life act amnesty a continuation in 2000 of the 245(i) act 900,000 (approx)

    It's not the Democrats or the Republicans, it's those that accept illegal immigration as acceptable.

  • anti-liar Salt Lake City, UT
    July 22, 2014 7:50 p.m.

    To those who imply that enforcement of immigration law is the opposite of compassion, do you believe that God will be lacking in compassion if He bars the unrepentant sinner from entering Heaven? Such non-compassion essentially is what is being imputed to God by false teachers who preach that a compassionate God would never bar anyone from Heaven.

    "And there shall also be many which shall say: Eat, drink, and be merry... and if it so be that we are guilty, God will beat us with a few stripes, and at last we shall be saved in the kingdom of God. Yea, and there shall be many which shall teach after this manner, false and vain and foolish doctrines..." (Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 28:8-9)

    No, God is not void of compassion.

    Neither are those who believe in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law -- including immigration law.

    After all, there is no true compassion in condoning -- and rewarding -- sin.

    The eternal principle applies just as well on earth as it does in Heaven: God sets down the law, gives everyone their agency to choose whether to repent and obey the law, and then holds men accountable for their willful choices.

  • Brer Rabbit Spanish Fork, UT
    July 22, 2014 10:05 p.m.

    The border can never be defended as long as illegal aliens are offered better paying jobs and welfare benefits for their children. Mr Herrod is right by saying that behavior depends on what is rewarded. So if you want more bad behavior (illegal immigration) all that you have to do is reward it.

    For those that sympathize with the illegal immigrants whether they are "children" or adults, I would ask, why sympathy for them and not for the children in our own inner cities, many of which suffer even more? Another question would be how many? a hundred thousand, a million, ten million, or more each year. It wouldn't matter how many, because there would always be hundreds of millions more living in substandard situations.

    The best and most efficient way to deal with world poverty is where they live. More can be helped there than in America where it takes much more resources per person.

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    July 22, 2014 10:12 p.m.

    anti-liar:

    So when a mother or father willingly sends their child to an unknown land so that they might not die or at worst to have a better life, this is a sin?

    Our government can make these children political refugees, which I would argue would be correct here based on the conditions of these countries. Immigration LAW not an issue here perhaps. But I don't think these children are committing sin nor do I feel that their advocates are either.

  • RichardB Murray, UT
    July 22, 2014 11:08 p.m.

    @Howard Beal
    Is sending children here for waivers a sin? I believe it is. And the LDS church tells people to come here legally.

    Gods laws never change, and Churches do not have the power to change them. When I see stories of people dying, raped and abused, I wonder how those hiring them can live with the fact that they encouraged it. Amnesty encourages more illegal immigration, it has to stop.

  • RRB SLC, UT
    July 23, 2014 12:38 a.m.

    Howard Beal, the children are coming here for the amnesty. It's well documented.

    Thinking amnesty will solve the problem has proven to be a mistake, it greatly increases the problem.

  • prelax Murray, UT
    July 23, 2014 4:31 a.m.

    Howard Beal

    They are not escaping violence, they are coming for amnesty. Parents all over the world could use the same excuse. We cannot make them refugees, a refugee has to apply from within their own country. Also two thirds of them came here with a parent or guardian.

    Anyone who encourages people to break the law are committing a sin. Under canon law a child that finishes their 7th year, has the ability to reason, and is responsible for their actions.

    Proverbs 22:6
    Train up a child in the way he should go,
    And when he is old he will not depart from it.

    The children are a diversion, as more adults are coming with them. If they counted 400,000 at the border, you can figure at least that many are being missed. The word is out, Obama won't deport you if you come here illegally.

  • dave4197 Redding, CA
    July 23, 2014 7:29 a.m.

    Mr Herrod, you are absolutely wrong.
    My ancestors came here as religious refugees from Europe. A Danish family (probably didn't speak english yet, parents plus 6 kids) and I'm not really sure how they got all the way to SLC but part by wagon. A Scottish family whose arrangements ended in Boston where they lived and worked a while until they could afford to pay their way to Illinois where they worked for a while til they could outfit a wagon, promises were not kept with this family along the way, and this family buried a child in Wyoming, talk about a struggle. An English family remember them we fought a war or 2 against them, this family came in several shifts to Illinois then SLC but one stayed in Nauvoo.
    My point is they were like today's refugees at the Mexican border, and they were welcomed, helped, loved by their friends and extended family, and allowed to settle.
    Let's get that attitude Mr Herrod. I'll keep trying to change your heart until you understand that compassion is helping a person in need now. It's not politics Mr Herrod.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    July 23, 2014 7:43 a.m.

    America is dying. Her death is reflected in the South and Central American nations that were ravaged by businessmen from the USA. When the corporations went international the USA went on the chopping block with the same predictable fate as other weak nations. So where will we send our kids?

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    July 23, 2014 8:04 a.m.

    I had a contractor a few years ago who did a major overhaul at my house. He worked by himself and subcontracted the work out he couldn't do. He was very vocal about his religious and republican views.

    I had him back last fall to do some work and as I asked him if could do something else while he was here he said sure. I have to leave but I'll just have my Mexicans do it.

    Seal the borders all you want you'll just find yourself trying to close underground tunnels all over Texas and Arizona.

    Border security is a bumper sticker..ask the Israeli's.

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    July 23, 2014 8:19 a.m.

    Saying amnesty is not compassionate is like your boss saying .. that you don't need a pay raise.

  • GaryO Virginia Beach, VA
    July 23, 2014 11:24 a.m.

    Hey Say No to BO -

    "Emma Lazarus was a poet, not an elected official."

    Uh huh . . . And George W Bush was an elected official, not a poet.

    And his immortal and incredibly naive words "Mission Accomplished!" . . . Are NOT emblazoned there.

    The copper-clad lady deserves wise words on her pedestal . . . Words indicative of a national spirit that once was, but is no more . . . Thanks to modern "Conservatism."

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    July 23, 2014 1:17 p.m.

    To "LDS Liberal" again you are wrong. Reagan amnesty=bad. He compromised with your ilk. Reagan was promised that if he gave in to the Democrat demands that the border would be secured and no more illegals would enter. The Democrats never lived up to their part of the deal.

    Conservatives learned that when it comes to illegal immigration that the Democrats will stab them in the back.

    There are many conservatives that are doing the Christ like thing. They are going to the border and going into the shelters with the detained illegals and are donating food, clothing, and toys to them. Those same conservatives say that we should care for them while they are here, but that the illegals must go to their home countries as quickly as possible. The US does not have the ability to absorb that many needy people all at once.

  • Shaun Sandy, UT
    July 23, 2014 3:45 p.m.

    @redshirt. Blaming democrats instead of Reagan is typical of the right. Of course Republicans can do no wrong.

  • prelax Murray, UT
    July 23, 2014 5:19 p.m.

    dave4197

    Your ancestors probably came here legally. There is a big difference. Back then 500,000 were allowed each year legally, now we allow over a million. This is the greatest wave of immigration this country has ever seen, legal or illegal.

    Cheap illegal labor saves business billions of dollars each year, at a cost to the taxpayers. It's no wonder this has become a mess, as the future of this country will be decided over the decisions made in the near future. We are losing this country and everything it stands for.

    Israel has a wall, they also have interior enforcement. Something Obama has refused to do. Israel puts people in jail for up to 17 years on the second offense, they also deport without a trial. Other countries enforce their laws, America can no longer afford this lax attitude.

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    July 25, 2014 7:11 p.m.

    Kind of hilarious. We took this land from the Spanish people by force 200 years ago and now they are just quietly re-claiming it piece by piece. Wall by wall, lawn by lawn, restaurant by restaurant, and all the armed macho dudes can't do a thing about it.