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Gordon Hayward visits Cleveland, could get max offer from Cavs

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  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    July 2, 2014 12:31 p.m.

    Don't let the door hit you on the hindparts on the way out...

  • Uncle Rico Sandy, UT
    July 2, 2014 12:55 p.m.

    Gordon,
    Thanks for 2 great years.

  • RSL* Why, AZ
    July 2, 2014 1:00 p.m.

    I do not think he is worth a max deal since last year he was to inconsistent. But he could be a really good player over time. But maybe the Jazz want to sign him since they can see that future potential or they know that other teams may be willing to trade for someone the Jazz may want more.

  • TerryHaimes Sturgis, MS
    July 2, 2014 1:02 p.m.

    Sounds like the Hayward saga will be over soon. Jazz should have extended him when they had the chance. Question is, "Where does Hayward want to play"? If he wants to stay in Utah, he will take Cleveland's offer. If he wants to go to Phoenix or Boston then he signs the qualifying offer which will force the Jazz to trade him.

    Sounds to me like he might want to stay in Utah. If Rockets do manage to get Carmelo or James then Parsons is available.

  • golfrUte SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    July 2, 2014 1:13 p.m.

    Please don't match this offer. No way Hayward is a max deal player. He's a good player but doesn't have the skills to be the go to guy in the clutch. Nice 2nd or 3rd option but not the key to the Jazz' future. Good luck in Cleveland.

  • scodyshootfight KC, MO
    July 2, 2014 1:23 p.m.

    As soon as this deal is signed, he will be nothing other than a toxic, untradable contract. I really hope Lindsey steps up to the plate here by NOT matching this offer. This is ridiculous. If you're not good enough to get your team more than 25 wins, why are you worth all that money?

  • Jazz Fan in Potsdam Potsdam, NY
    July 2, 2014 1:29 p.m.

    LET HIM GO!!!! You cannot pay this guy 16 million dollars per year. No way is he worth that. If Jazz match this offer it would be a HUGE mistake. Worse than the Kirilenko contract. Rumors in Cleveland is they want to sign and trade and send us Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters. Much better deal than signing Hayward to 4 year 63 million dollar deal. I like the guy, but sheesh.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    July 2, 2014 1:55 p.m.

    Hayward is a worker bee - nothing more. Giving a worker bee a max deal is silly. Max deals are for Stockton and Malone type players but go for it Cleveland and stay medicore.

  • Nevada Ute HENDERSON, NV
    July 2, 2014 2:08 p.m.

    The negative comments about Hayward are incredibly short-sighted. The fact is that he is the best player on the team, with amazing potential for growth at 24 years old. Yes, he buckled a little under the pressure of being the go-to scorer last season, but he's only experienced one season in that role, and new additions will eventually alleviate that pressure. Remember that Malone and Stockton took years to develop. We Jazz fans are dreaming if we think management can bring in another player at Hayward's caliber through free agency. Where will he come from? Another salary dump? Lindsay's rebuilding plan is solid. The Jazz would be crazy not to match any offer to Hayward.

  • cyruszuo LAKE FOREST, CA
    July 2, 2014 2:28 p.m.

    I like Hayward, but $63 million would be a big mistake.

    I remember in the AK-47 years how we wished we hadn't given him a max contract b/c we simply couldn't sign anyone. He wasn't good enough to win on his own and kept us from getting the last piece next to Boozer/Williams to be a legit contender.

    A max contract limits the organization from making other signings. That's ok if you are signing a guy who will put you on his back and flat-out win, but Hayward shot 40 from the floor and 30 from three last year. That is just not good enough for max money (no offence to Hayward).

    Love the guy, but it would be a HUGE mistake to tie down the organization with this type of a contract on a player who can't carry the team. A max money deal needs to guy to a guy who can carry the team - period.

    We can get Chandler Parsons or Luol Deng for less and WIN the SAME number of games we'll win with Hayward - that's all you need to know.

  • SD_UtahUter San Diego, CA
    July 2, 2014 3:16 p.m.

    I think the Jazz should get Chandler Parsons in town ASAP and give him an offer he can't refuse. They are basically the same type player with Parsons being a much better shooter and Hayward a slight better playmaker. Parsons could even fit in better with Jazz with his great shooting. I would say frontload the contract and have it average out to $12-13Million. Houston is not in a position to match now since it would tie up their 'Melo money. Then see if any teams would have interest in sign and trade with Hayward. If so, match the offer and you potentially pry away Parsons + get return for Hayward. I think $15+ million for Hayward is WAY TOO MUCH for him. He is way too inconsistent to get that much money.

  • QDiesel SLC, UT
    July 2, 2014 3:52 p.m.

    The Jazz need to go get Lance Stephenson! Give him a max deal or close to it. I dont care if he's had problems the Jazz need this guy!

  • Richie Saint George, UT
    July 2, 2014 3:58 p.m.

    All of us experts should stand back and let Dennis Lindsey do his job and I hope that is to bring out the checkbook and give Hayward a max money contract. Then maybe bring back Williams and take care of Kanter and Burks. Oh, don't forget the rookies.

  • Kakashi Tokyo, Japan
    July 2, 2014 4:26 p.m.

    wow...i never thought Jazz fans would jump to conclusions quickly...i mean come on...all of this is speculation...it mentions he could get 4 years 60M...it doesnt say...he will get it...all of these right now are just speculation and people are jumping on it like the contract is already there to be signed...relax people...i mean really...i understand that he isnt a max contract guy...do you think Jazz brass would offer such an amount? all of these are just speculation...and i am sure...Dennis Lindsey would do the right thing...if the Cavs offered a max contract of 60 for 4 years to Hayward...them im sure Lindsey would call and ask for a sign and trade...we get dion waiters and Matthew Delledova and probably a first or second round pick...but to be honest...i'll just wait and see...as long as there isnt a contract everything is just speculation at this point...

  • Veracity Morgan, UT
    July 2, 2014 4:37 p.m.

    Richie

    Really...

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    July 2, 2014 5:32 p.m.

    Re Terry Haimes

    I don't understand why Hayward singing the Jazz qualifying offer would force the Jazz to trade him. Someone please explain. Thanks.

  • Thunder Mayf Salt Lake City, UT
    July 2, 2014 5:45 p.m.

    Later Hayward. We were burned by Andrei Kirilenko and I don't think the Millers will go down that road again.

  • Jazzsmack Holladay, UT
    July 2, 2014 6:19 p.m.

    @Thunder Mayf

    The jazz weren't burned by kirilenko they burned themselves.

    all AK did was sign a contract they offered.

    And then the coach wouldn't play him. What was AK to do?

    Gordon is not max player putting up max numbers.

    Maybe other teams are banking on the future.

    The jazz are building, banking now is not worth it. Gordon is not a great shooter and will never be a great shooter. I am pretty sure his numbers will not get much better.

    There are other young players you can get.

  • scalman Temecula, CA
    July 2, 2014 6:23 p.m.

    One of the best facilitating, dribbling and passing 6'8" NBA players in the past 20 years. And he plays defense and he can go to the rim, sometimes full court. You guys don't love him because he's had his shooting woes. If the Jazz don't sign him, they will miss him. Big time. This is a tough situation for the Jazz, and some team is liable to pull a Wesley Matthews and give Gordon too much. Life in the NBA 2014 with so many mega bucks owners who don't mind throwing it around. I wish Alec Burks was 6'8" but he isn't. He's a shooting guard who can play point. Gordon is a shooting guard who can play point, small forward and played defensively against power forwards some in college when necessary to shut someone down. See, you're going to miss him, people. Quin, get in his ear. Utah winning a championship...come on, how awesome would that be. Gordon, you're a core guy, be that guy in Utah. You and Derrick and Alec and Dante and Trey.

  • Iowa Jazz Fan 2 Cedar Rapids, IA
    July 2, 2014 6:31 p.m.

    The Cavs just gave Kyrie Irving a max contract ( 5 yrs/95 mil). And now they're ready to offer a max to Hayward (4 yrs/60 mil)?? How can they spend at this level?? What will be their financial situation in three years??

    By the way, C. J. Miles is now a Pacer (4 yrs/18 mil). Watch C. J. in the playoffs next spring.

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    July 2, 2014 8:06 p.m.

    The problem is: it's Utah. It's tough to get top free agents to Salt Lake. Period. You pretty much have to keep the talent you draft or you'll be left rebuilding year after year after year. Ask the Kings.

    That is why, although Hayward may not be a MAX money player for MOST teams, I think may be for the Jazz. The only way they can see him let go is if they can assure themselves of signing someone at least as good, such as Chandler Parsons or Trevor Ariza, but neither of them are likely to leave Houston and Washington to come to Utah.

    My guess is that Cleveland won't in fact give him the MAX (remember these are rumors), but will still offer a good contract, in which case the Jazz should match. If they do offer max, then it would be a tough call.

  • smoke american falls/power, ID
    July 2, 2014 8:49 p.m.

    The Jazz have a plan. Step 1-Sign Hayward!If it takes 75 mil over 5 yrs.,Frontload contract:23 mil-1st yr, 13 per for the remaining 4 yrs. I would rather they do that, instead of picking up expiring contracts.Then next year they have 10 mil per yr. extra to re-sign Burks and Kanter. they have spend the money any way, why not on their future?

  • Hey Baby Franklin, IN
    July 2, 2014 9:37 p.m.

    I can't think of another NBA player who is his size, weight and build who was ever a franchise player?

    Skin and Bones
    Low muscle mass
    Too big and slow for a 2
    To small and weak for a 3

    Can't build around him, in my opinion

  • AFCoug Colorado Springs, CO
    July 2, 2014 10:15 p.m.

    I like Hayward and maybe on potential he can be a max player but I do not see how the Jazz can do that right now. With drafting Exum we are now deep at guard and Hayward has been playing the 3. Over the last 2 years it has been Burks who has continued to improve Hayward who has stagnated a bit. Burks may be the max money player we need next year if he improves as he did last year. If we tied up max money in Hayward now we likely lose Burks in the future.

    Let Hayward go or sign and trade for assets. Start Burks and let Exum back up Burke and Burks so you know if he is a PG or SG next year and what he brings. Resign Marvin to play both the 3 and stretch 4 backed up by Hood. He provides a veteran presence. Might go get Parsons as well. Extend Favors and Burks for the this summer. Depth chart of

    Burke/Exum
    Burks/Exum
    Parsons/Hood
    Kanter/Williams
    Favors/Kanter

  • AFCoug Colorado Springs, CO
    July 2, 2014 10:37 p.m.

    Kyle Lowry scored 18 per/gm, 7 asst, and 5 reb with afg% of 48% 3pt of 40 %. He just signed for 4 yrs $48M.

    Hayward scored 16 per/gm, 5 asst, 5 reb, with afg% of 45% and 3 pt of 30%. Looks like Hayward is worth about 4 yrs $46M.

    Let Clevland choke on a max contract. They are the one franchise that will screw everything up. Why should the Jazz follow suite. Are we building in Cleveland's image or San Antonio and Indiana's image. Small markets cannot over pay for mediocre talent. Parsons looks like a much better option right now. He can shoot and does everything except assists a bit better. He is certainly more efficient.

  • B Russ Ephraim, UT
    July 2, 2014 11:38 p.m.

    I kinda think the Jazz will keep him. They have the upper hand if that is what they want to do. If Lindsay wants him he will keep him.

  • CJ Miles Dallas, TX
    July 2, 2014 11:41 p.m.

    CJ shoots the ball better than Hayward and you ran him out of town. The Pacers know what they are doing in signing him to a long term contract. The Jazz always let cheap players get away so they can pay huge dollars to guys like Hayward and AK who don't deserve it. And stop making excuses for Hayward. He has proven he is not a go-to guy in the 4th quarter. And no, Hayward does not play defense. He gets beat often off the dribble and he rotates way too slow on the three point shooters.

  • Kakashi Tokyo, Japan
    July 3, 2014 1:30 a.m.

    there still no contract in the table...and in my opinion...i dont think...Lindsey would bite on the max contract...if Cleveland offered max money...im pretty sure a sign and trade will follow suit...there are some pieces in cleveland that they would want to let go...like Waiters...that could help us...i dont think Lindsey will fall from other team's bluff...so everyone...chillax until the contract is there

  • ABELIEVER roy, UT
    July 3, 2014 1:44 a.m.

    I believe the Jazz should look at Lowry's contract and duplicate it for Gordon, expect instead of four years make it a five year contract. Lowry's contract (with the Raptors) is 4 years 48 million. So come on Jazz management, offer Gordon 5 years 60 million. If Gordon says no, then set your sites on Chandler Parson's before someone else does.

  • SD_UtahUter San Diego, CA
    July 3, 2014 5:40 a.m.

    @AFCoug
    The Kyle Lowery signing was huge! I agree, I think that may have set the bar for the Jazz to resign him at $11 or $12 Mil/yr, as what they offered last year. This may have been Hayward's agent's doing in an attempt to boost his stock. The fear that the Jazz matching any offer may completely dissuade any team making him an offer since it will remove that cap space money from signing other free agents until July 13 (the day players can officially sign on July 10 and Jazz would have 3 days to match). So I think it's looking good that Hayward will be in a Jazz uniform. I hope we can see some Parson's contract numbers with Houston soon and that will really finalize Hayward's salary bar. I would prefer Parsons over Hayward but I think he is not leaving Houston

  • cachekid MENDON, UT
    July 3, 2014 7:18 a.m.

    Good player, but not a great player. Worth good money, but not max money. Do not let the "supposed" market dictate overpaying a role player. Which is exactly what Hayward is. A really good role player. Seriously, look at the skill set. A good player is all he will ever be. Not a super star. Please don't tie up max money on this guy.

  • SlopJ30 St Louis, MO
    July 3, 2014 7:31 a.m.

    Nevada Ute says: "The negative comments about Hayward are incredibly short-sighted. The fact is that he is the best player on the team, with amazing potential for growth at 24 years old."

    I think everyone acknowledges he is a valuable player, which is why several teams have expressed interest. But when you start talking about max contracts, you HAVE to be nit-picky and look at the downside. It's not like every team has to have a couple of "max" guys to compete. Those deals should only go to proven elite players. Gordon, while young, doesn't seem to be made of "elite" stuff. He's potentially a second or third banana on contending teams. Let's not act like that's a huge insult . . being "merely" a very good NBA player still makes you rich and famous.

    Could he become elite? I guess it's still possible, but he just doesn't seem to have that alpha-dog attitude. And that's fine; not many guys with the skill to back it up do. But if you give a guy like him the max, you're putting a ceiling on the team's success for years.

  • ultragrampa Farmington, UT
    July 3, 2014 8:24 a.m.

    IMHO Jeff Hornacek will convince his good friend to head to Phoenix and Gordon Hayward will be plaguing the Jazz from there for the rest of his career.

  • JBQ Saint Louis, MO
    July 3, 2014 8:25 a.m.

    I believe that Hayward has reached his maximum potential. It is time for "sign and trade" which would leave openings in the spending cap. He wants to go to the Celtics. That is why he didn't sign. His former coach is Brad Stevens who is now with Ainge, from Utah, and the Celtics.

  • bretticus Saint George, UT
    July 3, 2014 9:43 a.m.

    If you are reading this article and still believe THE HYPE that Cleveland is giving GH a max deal, stop! Already been refuted! They sat down to talk in a preliminary get-to-know-you. the whole max deal was probably an agent ploy.

    I like Gordon. Yet, I agree he's not a max deal right now. It's been talked about how he was shooting different last year. He may have some injury. Of course he didn't get the shots he got when others created for him in past seasons either. My point is that his shooting percentages will most likely go up with improving players around him and as he adapts.

    Either way, the market will probably put him at a level the Jazz will pay. No, he will not be AK2.0.

  • bretticus Saint George, UT
    July 3, 2014 9:57 a.m.

    I have to shake my head when people say that Hayward has reached his ceiling. He's 24 years old! John Stockton was 25 before he started reaching double assists and points per game. Malone was 24, BUT his numbers got better over the next few years and didn't drop (Malone was special though.) For all the 25-and-done talk, many players improve (Stockton peaked around 27. Malone 26.) Of course that's based on statistics alone. As these players mature, they help their team win in veteran ways. If you don't believe me, look at San Antonio this past season.

  • Carnak Salt Lake City, UT
    July 3, 2014 10:04 a.m.

    See ya.

    It's been real.

  • CJ Miles Dallas, TX
    July 3, 2014 10:16 a.m.

    Haywards numbers are inflated due to playing on a really bad team last year. If he were playing with Dwill and Boozer, his numbers would be down. He is not a Max contract player. AK was better than him in his prime. AK could play defense and still have a good stat line in four catagories.

  • SlopJ30 St Louis, MO
    July 3, 2014 10:21 a.m.

    bretticus, I don't believe he's reached his ceiling; I'm just not convinced his ceiling is "perennial all-star," which is what a true franchise guy needs to be if you have any hope of contending. I would love to be proven wrong. If he blows up for a season of 22/6/6 with solid shooting splits next year, I'll gleefully reconsider.

    The Stock comparison doesn't fly because Stock didn't start playing starter's minutes until he turned 25. Overpaying Gordon and crossing their fingers he becomes a beast is a huge gamble. Hey, I like the guy, I just don't like the idea of throwing huge contracts at guys based on what you hope they will become. However, it may be necessary to keep guys in Utah, and I admittedly don't have a better answer.

    One thing's for sure . . the Jazz need a huge helping of good luck to become a contender again. Will a core of Burke, Burkes, Kanter, Favors, Hayward, Exum and Hood (or whomever any of the above are traded for) be good enough with a couple more years of experience? I have no idea.

  • Dr. Dunkenstein Salt Lake City, UT
    July 3, 2014 11:48 a.m.

    I think the Jazz should offer Hayward a 5-year, $57 million front-loaded deal ($15.5M the 1st year, $10.375M for each of the other 4 years). That averages out to $11.4M/year, which I think is reasonable for a player of Hayward's caliber, gives him a nice payoff up front, and doesn't saddle the Jazz with a horrible contract.

  • Objectified Richfield, UT
    July 3, 2014 11:49 a.m.

    There is no question Hayward is a good player. Very few people are disputing that. The Jazz did a good job drafting him.

    But common sense reality says that only consistent All-Star players who carry franchises should merit max-contracts... which truly are a lot of money to tie up on one player. They shouldn't be handed out willy-nilly to every good player who contributes and may or may not have additional potential.

    Unless the market is getting way out of kilter this year, a player like Hayward should be worth about 6 to 8 million per year... which is nothing to sneeze at. That's well above the NBA average.

    I do hope Jazz management tempers their desire to improve with common sense. Otherwise, when the dust clears, they will end up with some regrets... as will Cleveland if they sign Hayward to a max.

    @ Jazzsmack:

    No one said AK47 burned the Jazz. They said his contract burned them. They offered it and it ended up burning them. No one is blaming AK for signing it. I certainly would've.
    Hopefully, the Jazz organization learned from that episode in their history.

  • CJ Miles Dallas, TX
    July 3, 2014 5:11 p.m.

    Hood will be better than Hayward by age 24. Hayward has reached his ceiling for scoring. He does not have a natural jumper. If Hayward (big if) would learn to play defense with some heart, then I might have a change of heart. But Hayward had no heart in 2013-14 season.

  • Kakashi Tokyo, Japan
    July 3, 2014 5:55 p.m.

    @CJ Miles

    let's be honest here...Gordon Hayward played a role last season that didnt play to his strengths...but...it should have been an opportunity for him to rise up to the challenge but didnt...but saying that Gordon Hayward can't play D...is a bit of a stretch...he does play D...though its not elite level D...he plays average solid D one on one...and is a good help/team defender...chase down blocks? anyone?...now as for shooting %...last year...defense were focused on him...and his shot form was off compared to his first few seasons...like i said...different role...you get different looks...you have mentioned that Utah should have kept CJ rather than Hayward and is much a better shooter well....on average compared to CJ Miles career 35% 3PT% Hayward...is at 36%...best year for CJ...last year at .393 Hayward best year .473 rookie year...overall FG% career for CJ .420 Hayward .436...i dunno man...stats dont lie i guess

  • the truth Holladay, UT
    July 3, 2014 5:56 p.m.

    @Objectified

    Read the comment of whom I was replying too.

    It was Sloan that run AK out of town. AK didn't fit his system.

    Sloan also ran Matthews, CJMiles, Maurice Williams, and every big man they ever drafted. He didn't play them didn't develop them or didn't want to develop them and play them. But mostly they didn't fit his horrible system

    Or he didn't really want young players. He was intent on playing veterans even though it was getting the jazz nowhere.

    Utah Jazz is a victim of Sloan's system and compounded by bad contracts.

    I hope things for the Jazz are changing for the better. But a max contract for a fourth option is not smart.

    Chandler parsons may be okay even though he is more of a stretch four but jazz really need a center.

    I'm not worried about jazz defense right now. They are young and building and that will resolve over time.

    The Tennessee PF would've been interesting. I think more young players right now is better than veterans. They need a good draft pick next year more than anything veterans could give them.

  • WestGranger West Valley City, Utah
    July 3, 2014 6:03 p.m.

    The success of the Jazz in the past has come from sticking with good players and coaches. Let's stick with Hayward!

  • Kakashi Tokyo, Japan
    July 3, 2014 7:09 p.m.

    The only thing that could make this favorable for the Jazz is do a sign and trade with Phx...i'd probably trade Hayward and Evans for TJ Warren Miles Plumlee Archie Goodwin and 2 2nd round Picks....i think TJ Warren could score in bunches...Plumlee would be a solid starting C...moving Favors to PF...

    Plumlee
    Favors
    Warren
    Exum
    Burke

    bench
    Burks
    Goodwin
    Hood
    Kanter
    Gobert

  • byronbca Salt Lake City, UT
    July 4, 2014 10:01 a.m.

    I'm shocked about how negative Jazz "fans" are about Hayward. For all of the Jazz "fans" who are so eager to get rid of Hayward ask yourself 1 question. Who are the Jazz going to bring in that is better than Hayward at a similar price? I would gladly bet my next paycheck that the answer is nobody.

    People need to understand that it is the market that dictates worth, this is the way the world works. The Jazz will match any contract Hayward gets and they would be crazy not to. Personally I'm happy for Hayward and I can't wait to see him playing next to Exum this year!