Many people commit a crime to better their circumstances. Empathy and reality
must have a balance that leads to a solution of the problem. Empathetic words
are cheap and solutions are difficult.
Love is sending people down the path of righteousness; rewarding
illegal/dishonest behavior is not love.Mercy cannot rob justice and
4601 and prelax aren't getting the point made by the letter writer. The
point is "empathy." That is the ability to see the world through
someone else's eyes.Let's try this with Mexican
immigrants. Let's say I am a poor Mexican farmer whose livelihood had been
wiped out by NAFTA (happened lots of times). Let's also say I have 5 or
six kids and wife to feed. I am just not making it in Mexico. Would I be
tempted to head north in spite of the risks to get some income to feed my
family? I would seriously consider it, law or no law.
The letter-writer's premise is false. Most likely there is virtually no
one who lacks empathy for illegal aliens. The problem is that one
cannot give them a pass at the law in the name of "empathy" without
WITHHOLDING empathy from their victims. This is why the scriptures
say "obey, honor and sustain the law of the land."
Jeb Bush is right on in his sentiments towards immigration and it would do the
Republican brand well if they took his lead or the lead of the LDS church and
have some compassion and sensibilities on the matter. Its no wonder many
hispanics don't feel welcome with some of the vitriol and black and white
thinking. How many of our ancesters came to America for a better life? No one
is going to send back the 12 million illegal immigrants in this country, so get
over yourselves. Yes, build a fence. Yes send all you catch or the new illegal
immigrants back, but yes, we should have a path, perhaps a long path and with
signifant penalties, but a path for those who have been here for years and have
been law abiding productive members of society. Don't break up families.
Anyone willing to serve in our military should be granted citizenship.The Republican party will be in a sad and lonely state if they allow the far
right of the party to run the show and drive moderates to be independants or
democrats. . What happened to "compassionate
Christ has pure empathy for all mankind. He has pure empathy because He paid in
full the price for sorrow and for sin. He and He alone has the right to be
empathetic. Without payment, empathy is hollow. Those who think
that illegal aliens should be welcomed into the United States have a simple
choice. Are they willing to pay the price in full for a family? Are they
willing to serve prison time for a felony (stealing an identity, non-payment of
taxes, Social Security fraud). Are they willing to pay fully for
"public" services that that family received, including repaying doctors
and hospitals for health care received; repaying schools for the costs of
education; repaying any and all whose taxes paid for non-citizens?Hollow empathy is what is being preached by Bush and by those who repeat his
words. Those who have true empathy have a perfect example of someone who knows
what empathy means. He paid the price. If you are willing to fully pay the
price, then pay it fully, including prison time, before telling us that we are
wrong because we only have hollow empathy.
Unlike Jeb, I am more concerned about the love for the potential legal
immigrants, numbering in the millions, waiting in line all around the world, to
become a legal immigrant and citizen of the USA. They are not yet my neighbors
or can/will vote for me or make me look like a compassionate figure but rather
they are the ones who I have seen in line at our embassies in the 24 countries I
worked in during the 30 years I worked abroad. They are patient, honest,
educated, mostly with English speaking skills and desiring to be a good citizen
of a country they have longed to see and live in. Just the kind of immigrant we
need. Most will wait 12 years to realize their dream. Contrast that with an
Illegal who jumps the line and sneaks across the border having no regard for the
laws of our country. Sorry, but my compassion is with the LEGAL immigrant. I
think it is clear that Jeb is running for office. Shame on him!
Re: Mike Richards "Hollow empathy is what is being preached by Bush
..." Hollow empathy, what's that?Once again, empathy is
the ability to see the world through the eyes of another. Try it with the
It's interesting to see the double standard the right has.On
one hand, the law is the law when it applies to Latinos.On the other
hand, some laws are worth breaking, when it applies to Clive Bundy.Are we to obey the law? Or not? That is the question. It appears to me that
the law applies to Latinos but it doesn't apply to anti-tax tea party
Let them go...If the hard-hearted GOP wants to shut-out Hispanics,
Women, GLBT, the Young, Sick, and Old -- LET them.It just shows how
Anti-Reagan they really and truly are.
None of us who turn to Christ for his empathy pay the full price for our
sins.The empathy here sought is to change the law by removing some
of the penalties.If folks disagree, fine. But let's not
pretend that we could not change the law to lessen the penalties and open the
doors if we so chose.As to the concept of "go back, stand in
line and you'll get in when it's your turn" line of thought.
Please research the caps on legal immigration from Mexico. For many folks (who
have been here for a decade or more) this would mean never returning.Our govt. winked at them to get across the border (and please, it was not this
administration) and winked again to let them work here for cheap.We
need a solution that recognizes the realities - including that we (the business
community and the govt.) let these folks come in the first place.Seal the border? Sure. Put in place E-Verify? Yep. But let's do
something kind and reasonable with those already here.
NAFTA raised Mexico to the 12th biggest economy in the world, that's not a
valid excuse anymore. There are hundreds on millions of people world wide worse
off than the people of Mexico. Shouldn't our empathy be with them? What about empathy for the taxpayer who subsidizes business with cheap
labor, then has his id stolen or has to clear his name from the social security
fraud? How about America's children who will grow up only to find they
can't get credit because someone stole their id. How about empathy for
those who did it right, and are punished by rewarding the wrong doers?Empathy for the millions waiting to come here legally?Business
lobbyists are using every trick in the book to try to retain their cheap labor,
including using a guilt trip on Americans.
To the Javerts who advocate strict enforcement of the law against illegal
immigrants, you are the ones to whom Jesus spoke when they brought the woman
taken in adultery to him: "He that is without sin among you, let him first
cast a stone at her."Happy Easter everyone.
Curmudgeon, what happened to the rest of it, " go now and sin no more".
This would require a person here illegally to return home and come back under
our laws. Staying in the country would require them to break the law everyday
they are here.Twin Lights, there is a long line in Mexico and the
Philippines because of the demand to come here. It has little to do with the
caps as they have been exceeded during Obama's administration. There are
only so many seats in the show house. That does not give those waiting in line
permission to enter out of turn. Besides, I thought that illegal immigration was
slowing down from Mexico. I think you're beating a dead horse there. After seven amnesties, we know they just add to the problem. After 28
years of little enforcement, we know the solution. Stop business from hiring
them, and let them go home without punishment. Id theft and social security
fraud, plus perjury (I-9 forms) are felonies and should be punished. The same
with hiring a person here illegally.
SLars: You missed an important part of the story. Though the woman
had broken the law, Jesus did not cast a stone himself, rather he said
"neither do I condemn thee." He encouraged her to obey the law in the
future, but he did not compel that obedience, nor did the government. What
Jesus offered the woman was--wait for it--amnesty.Immigration reform
would change the law so that certain persons who came here in violation of the
former law would not be compelled to leave; they could stay by meeting certain
conditions (kind of like repentance). They would, therefore, be in compliance
with the law.
Mike Richards: Wrong again. illegal immigration does not constitute
a felony, sorry. By the way has there ever been a study conducted to determine
how profitable companies are when they hire illegals. I wager that illegals tend
to be hard workers provide a needed service making bother company owners and
cmsense"No one is going to send back the 12 million illegal
immigrants in this country..."False argument. That only is true
if a conscious decision is made to abandon the rule of law and the sovereignty
of this nation.CurmudgeonTou are missing the point.
"Sin no more" means just that. Allowing them to stay is tantamount to
allowing a bank robber to not only escape justice, but to also him to keep the
bank loot. And no it is not "kind of like repentance,"
since in that case Christ paid the penalty for sin, on a spiritual level. When it comes to earthly SOCIETY and the laws of the land, on the other
hand, there is no actual amnesty in the name of "repentance" without
shifting the penalty to some innocent scapegoat other than Christ. Such
scapegoats would include hundreds of millions who have it far, far worse than
illegal aliens but who respectfully wait in line to come into this country, and
the Americans who suffer in a wide variety of ways because of illegal
immigration. Where is the compassion for them? Retroactive
legalization is a rationalization. It would signify that the law finally means
CurmudgeonIf he gave her amnesty, he would of allowed her to continue
committing adultery. That's what people in the country want, to be able to
continue breaking the law.Or to have the law changed and allow them
to stay. Did Jesus change the law to accommodate the woman's adultery?I don't believe for a minute that it's about empathy, or it
would be for anyone committing a crime. It's all about cheap labor.
@CurmudgeonIf 12 million adulterers had been brought before Christ, do you
think he would of realized the situation was out of control? How about Javert
looking for thieves that stole 12 million loaves of bread? @ronnieComing here illegally is a misdemeanor, working commits multiple
felonies. Harvard Economist George Borjas (from a Harvard study),
"In dragging down wages, immigration currently shifts about $160
billion per year from workers to employers." You can find other
@Mike RichardsSouth Jordan, UtahChrist has pure empathy for
all mankind. He has pure empathy because He paid in full the price for sorrow
and for sin. He and He alone has the right to be empathetic. Without payment,
empathy is hollow. Those who have true empathy have a perfect
example of someone who knows what empathy means. He paid the price. If you are
willing to fully pay the price, then pay it fully, including prison time, before
telling us that we are wrong because we only have hollow empathy.8:43 a.m. April 20, 2014==========True Jesus paid the
price Mike, I agreebut, What did Jesus command his followers
to do?Come, Follow me.Do as I do.Do unto others as I
have done unto you.It's called being a Christian.
Being a Christian one would not look past the person who has lost their job, or
the immigrants waiting in other countries, or those with stolen ids, and social
security cards, etc. Being Christian does not allow us to ignore the
laws of the land. By coming here they have to lie every day. And
business commits felonies and shows a lack of compassion for the honest
immigrant when he hires them. Being a Christian means not lying, stealing or
coveting. Nationwide poll, Catholic voters were three times more
likely to say the government has "a lot" of moral responsibility to
protect American workers from competition with immigrant workers than to say it
has "a lot" of moral responsibility to protect illegal immigrants from
being separated from their families by deportation.
Republicans get very legalistic about the subject of illegal immigrants yet
support ranchers that don't pay their grazing bills in Nevada.The LAW! But not THAT law...It's not a new phenomena, Christ
was frustrated with the Publicans too.
@ScrewdriverCasa Grande, AZRepublicans get very legalistic
about the subject of illegal immigrants yet support ranchers that don't pay
their grazing bills in Nevada.The LAW! But not THAT law...[Agreed! In Utah, 75% of the State is Republicans. You should
witness all the self-righteous "law abiding citizens" speeding and
tailgating on I-15. Hypocrites.]Oxymoron of the day :
I know Republicans, most don't agree with the BLM actions, but believe he
broke the law by not paying the fees. Don't judge all by the actions of a
few. Just like I know Democrats who oppose amnesty. Remember when
Cesar Chavez let the march to the border with Walter Mondale and the Reverend
Ralph Abernathy to protest illegal immigration? The only people I
know that are 100% for amnesty, are the business owners that use illegal labor,
those that hope to, and their lobbyists.
Empathy from Republicans does seem uncommon when their primary competing
platform is built on saying they aren't empathetic, which isn't true.
Then there's also balancing empathy for people willing to live here without
following the law with empathy for people who suffer due to the harmful things
that exist as a result of illegal immigration.
What do you call a country who bans:drugs,abortions,smoking, drinking,pre-marital sex, homosexuals, pornography, That sponsors a strict Thiestic society, church, public prayer, Government display of Religious symbols,
a strict and rigid corporal punish, and basis all most of
their laws on scriptures?Answer: Iran, Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, and
the former Nazi Germany.
OK. How many should we have empathy for, Mr. Waddell? 100 million? 200 million?
A billion? Do we have a right to set a limit on how many come here?How many of these illegals will you empathetically take into your home, Mr.
Waddell? According to the Census data, your town of Barnstable, Mass is 91.85%
white, less than 3% black, and just 1.7% Hispanic. Sounds to me like the
residents of Barnstable aren't keeping up with their empathy quota. Many of
us here in Utah would be happy to send Barstable 10-20 thousand illegals. Are
you game, Mr. Waddell?
Fine those that hire them. Make them follow the law. Most of those here
illegally will go back home if there are no jobs.