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In our opinion: Boy Scouts of America and building responsible men

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  • Christopher Mann Rxburg, ID
    March 7, 2014 6:11 a.m.

    You do not think Boy Scouts of America is expensive? The top CEO of Goverment makes $400,000 a year,(the Presidentt) the top CEO of Boy Scouts makes $916,000 a year. I'll keep paying my "friends of scouting" donation every year because I know our poor Bishop needs to fulfill his ward quoata,but their is cetinly less return on that than the gas taxes I pay at the pump, at least we see where that money goes, we drive on them.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    March 7, 2014 6:26 a.m.

    Adults have blown this into a bigger issue than it is.

    My son is in scouting. I have listened to some, not all, of the other parents and their opposition, (and obvious contempt) for the scouting change and gays in general.

    The boys hear this. Their sons hear this.

    I don't think that a fathers opinion towards homosexuals has any bearing on whether their son turns out gay or not. But is would have a huge affect on how their gay son may handle it.

    Think about the message that you are sending to your son, gay or strait.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    March 7, 2014 7:13 a.m.

    The BSA does much good in the world, but I think it's a stretch to say that "no other program or organization has matched the record of the Boy Scouts in helping boys grow to become responsible men and fathers."

    I think that bringing up boys in religious faith has done more. There are also other organizations like 4-H which serves 6.5 million youth in America alone, both boys and girls.

    For my family, scouting was a disappointment. We were involved, heavily, in a suburban community scouts, and that was probably the best one, but it was still a shoddy organization. As the mom "who only stayed home," much of the work was dumped on me. Our oldest son was also in Church scouts, which was a bad experience in two states. Half-hearted men who barely functioned as leaders. Not much positive role model there.

    When we moved to rural Wisconsin we discovered 4-H. A refreshing change and the whole family participated together. I've been a leader for 25 years now. A great program for all 6 of our children. The main thing is to work with kids with what works for them.

  • Ranch Here, UT
    March 7, 2014 7:16 a.m.

    In trying to teach boys to be good citizens, you can't condone bigotry and/or discrimination. Preventing good men and women who are LGBT from participating in scouthing teaches young men that bigotry AND discrimination are okay. Good citizens condone neither.

    Businesses and other organizations have begun to recognize this and are taking steps to address the problem. Good for them.

  • Jamescmeyer Midwest City, USA, OK
    March 7, 2014 7:29 a.m.

    I'm grateful for what scouting has done for me, and continue to support scouting so far as it's integrated into the young men's activities of the Church. I am, however, on guard against the scouting program faltering indecisively on one of -the- most important of the skills it taught me: To be mentally awake and morally straight, presumably even when it's unpopular. This they're not so clear-cut on anymore unless the Church is involved.

    The article is correct in stating that homosexuality has nothing to do with scouting. What's happening to the Boy Scouts is a result of their own decision to step into it, rather than ignoring something that doesn't have anything to do with them.

  • liberty or ...? Ogden, UT
    March 7, 2014 7:45 a.m.

    To progressive liberals this is just another example of undermining religious teaching and getting those with religious morals to capitulate and bow to the mob of secularism by cloaking their intolerance behind a mask of supposed discrimination. No one forces you to donate or be apart of the scouting problem it is a private organization. What is happening to the scouts is the equivalant of going to the National Black Caucuss or NAACP and accusing them of being racists(unfortunatley the latter is more true than the former). Let us not forget the reason the founder of the Boy scouts started the organization was the deterioration of moral values noticed in the male youth of his day (Oh what would he say now?).His purpose was to instill those values and lets face it largely based on Judeo-Christian morals into young men to inspire them to be better. If you believe in the scout oath and law as they are written then I'm sorry Gay leadership or active gay youth are in violation of the values of being a scout just as any heterosexual man or boy would be if they were engaging in similar behavior.

  • E Sam Provo, UT
    March 7, 2014 8:01 a.m.

    I don't think that being a Boy Scout had a darn thing to do with me becoming a responsible adult. Sure was fun, though.

  • TMR Los Angeles, CA
    March 7, 2014 8:08 a.m.

    The logic in this editorial is specious. If it is true, as stated by the editorial, that "[s]couting itself has nothing to do with issues of sexual orientation," then why ban gay leaders from scouting? If gay leaders were not banned, then Disney would not have cut its donation to scouting and this editorial would have never been written. It appears that BSA's "political" agenda may be the cause of its misfortune.

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    March 7, 2014 8:12 a.m.

    Unfortunately, Midwest Mom's comment is too true. Church Scout leadership is too often a short term calling that doesn't allow leaders to become properly trained or experienced. Too often, the men called have little or no interest in the program. I've seen requirements for Scouting advancement completely ignored and some troops are simply Eagle factories where Eagle awards are handed out and not earned.

    Then there was the "leadership" of the two clowns who were working on their Goblin Toppling Merit Badges . . . . .

    Scouting is a terrific program. But it can only be as good as those who lead its boys.

  • Coach Biff Lehi, UT
    March 7, 2014 8:36 a.m.

    Ummm...somewhere along the way to earning my Eagle Scout badge I memorized a passage that said "Morally straight". What do you think that means? And Ranch, if you don't like what the BSA is founded on, then you are free to found your own version of scouting. Unfortunately, I know that the gay agenda isn't interested in founding their own narrative, they are only interested in changing mine to match theirs. No thanks.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    March 7, 2014 8:45 a.m.

    Scounting helps build responsible men, that is why it is under attack from the left. The left attacks anything that emphasize's men's roles in society.

    Why do you think almost every father in a sitcom is shown as blithering idiot?

    why does society no longer look down on women bearing and raising children without a father around, despite the statistically proven fact such activity leads to higher and higher poverty rates and other social ills?

    anything to degrade the role of fathers and men in society that can be done, will be done.

    and those who decry those with religious beliefs that hold homosexual behavior as sinful are only showing their own intolerance and bigotry.

  • Owl Salt Lake City, UT
    March 7, 2014 8:54 a.m.

    Scouting was a very positive experience in 3 different troops for our sons who all achieved Eagle rank. There were dedicated leaders who were skilled and had been in their callings long enough to know the ropes. Combined with the Duty to God award, it taught character building. Thanks BSA. When I was young my experience in a community troop convinced me that Scouting was irrelevant. Thankfully, my mind was changed.

  • RFLASH Salt Lake City, UT
    March 7, 2014 9:25 a.m.

    If they wanted to fix it, it wouldn't take much, would it! They just need to stop discriminating and allow gay people to be a part of them! They imply some really bad things by not allowing gay leaders. People are more aware of things now. It isn't right to make a statement that there is something wrong with gay people! These religious groups, including Mormons have some degrading beliefs about gay people and they treat gay people according to these beliefs. They pretend to care a little, but in the end they insist on discrimination and they use their power to do nasty things to gay people. Why shouldn't somebody stand up to the garbage they dish out. Why doesn't this article talk about why they discriminate towards gays? What is the problem ? Don't pretend not to know! What is done to gay people is morally wrong and yet the religious hypocrites wont let go of their hate. I think that standing up to these things is exactly what is needed. We need to show that some things are no longer acceptable!

  • Sven Morgan, UT
    March 7, 2014 10:12 a.m.

    TMR said:

    "The logic in this editorial is specious. If it is true, as stated by the editorial, that "[s]couting itself has nothing to do with issues of sexual orientation," then why ban gay leaders from scouting? If gay leaders were not banned, then Disney would not have cut its donation to scouting and this editorial would have never been written. It appears that BSA's "political" agenda may be the cause of its misfortune."

    No, the article/editorial isn't specious at all. Nice deflection though. Again, please tell us what Scouting (e.g. camping, hiking, earning merit badges, being a good citizen has to do with sexuality? You and I both know it has nothing to do with scouting.

    This was nothing more than homosexual/LGBT activists pushing their lifestyle agenda on our kids, and cloaking it in the tired worn out claim of "intolerance." Sadly, the BSA caved to this faux outrage. We warned them that the next step would be the Left's demand for the admission of Gay Scout Leaders. Again, this is nothing more than an agenda to indoctrinate our kids into the LGBT lifestyle.

  • Go Utes Salt Lake City, UT
    March 7, 2014 11:06 a.m.

    I love the Boy Scout organization. It has had a powerful impact on my life. It now has a good impact on my own son and I have seen it have great success in the lives of other boys. It is the best organization I know of for helping boys become responsible men. So sad to see it under attack.

    The uproar over gay scout leaders is interesting. I see it boiling down to this though: As a heterosexual male, would it be proper for me to take a bunch of teenage girls on a camping trip, with just one other adult man around? I think most people (and with good reason) would consider this improper. Even if I am an upstanding person, etc., it is just a matter of propriety for me to not do that. Isn't it the exact same scenario for a homosexual man to take a bunch of teenage boys camping? I see no difference. Perhaps some research would show otherwise if this were looked into, but until there is something that shows convincingly otherwise, the BSA should err on the side of protecting boys. The boys' safety is more important than some political agenda.

  • One opinion west jordan, UT
    March 7, 2014 11:34 a.m.

    Scouting is a wonderful program for young men. I have participated as a leader more than once in scouting. It enlightens the mind to the different opportunities we have - the merit badges are truly great educational tools. It is a program that teaches youth independence skills and gives them an opportunity to look at different educational pursuits they may be interested in. It gives them something to focus spare time on when they are preparing to become Eagles. There are good and bad leaders in all organizations. It would be up to the parents to know what their children are learning and doing and if there is a bad leader, do something about it. I learned so much teaching scouting and don't regret one moment of my service.

  • Sven Morgan, UT
    March 7, 2014 11:57 a.m.

    Ranch said:

    "In trying to teach boys to be good citizens, you can't condone bigotry and/or discrimination. Preventing good men and women who are LGBT from participating in scouthing teaches young men that bigotry AND discrimination are okay. Good citizens condone neither."

    1) The BSA are a private organization, this means they can set their own rules and standards. If LGBT activists don't like these standards, they don't have to join. Ever hear of Freedom of Association? This was the intolerance and bullying of the LGBT community forcing others to accept their lifestyle.

    2) Since scouting has nothing to do with sexuality, it is fair to conclude that this demand by homosexual activists to be able to join the BSA was nothing more than an agenda to indoctrinate our kids into this deviant lifestyle.

    3) The only intolerance and discrimination was that which the LGBT community perpetrated on the BSA.

    Very sad the BSA caved to the mean spirited, intolerant tactics of the LGBT activists.

  • Tiago Seattle, WA
    March 7, 2014 12:09 p.m.

    Good points in the editorial. Scouting, combined with the LDS youth program, was a huge influence on me as a young man. My favorite experiences were the high adventure activities where we all learned that we could do hard things and take care of ourselves.
    I support the recent BSA membership policy update. The old policy specifically excluded people who openly deal with SSA. It said: "We do not grant membership to individuals who are open or avowed homosexuals."
    That policy needlessly excluded and stigmatized people who deal with SSA. The new policy allows all boys to be members regardless of their stated sexual orientation as long as they live the Scout Oath and Scout Law.
    This is similar to the BYU honor code change in 2007. Previous to 2007 it ambiguously said "any behaviors that indicate homosexual conduct, including those not sexual in nature, are inappropriate and violate the Honor Code."
    In 2007 it was changed to: "One's stated sexual orientation is not an Honor Code issue. However, the Honor Code requires all members of the university community to manifest a strict commitment to the law of chastity."

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 7, 2014 12:35 p.m.

    Boy Scouts is not about sex. It's not about your sexual orientation. It's not about the LGBT agenda. Why is that all some people can talk about?

    Scouting is about boys learning how to be responsible. Experience being a patrol leader. And learning some new skills. It has nothing to do with sex. So let's not try to make it all about sex.

    Scouting is about so much important stuff... I wish we could get past the LGBT complaints and talk about what it's really about.

  • I know it. I Live it. I Love it. Provo, UT
    March 7, 2014 12:46 p.m.

    The Boy Scouts have mostly seen a response from 3 groups...

    1 - Agreeable Christians who welcome others, but not behaviors.
    2 - Disagreeable Christians who simply started their own system.
    3 - Disagreeable SSM-proponents who have bullied the BSA.

    Only the first two are peaceful and respect the nature of freedom. Those who fight other's right to peaceably assemble and believe what they will... and the companies that support them are doing the same thing. Whether their incentive is hatred, ignorance, or profit, it will never stand the test of time. Marriage is eternal. Freedom (as correctly understood) is eternal. Long after the faulty desires of men have fallen into chaos, there is one work that will continue on.

    You'll never stop people from procreating. You'll convince millions not to, and millions more to hate the people you hate. But billions and billions understand their design, their potential, and the love that families bring. No person or social movement can stay the hand of God.

    The real question is why would you ever want to resist the one person who will always love you, and who continually extends His mercy and help.

  • well informed Salt Lake, UT
    March 7, 2014 12:49 p.m.

    If BSA really was an inspired program than the Church would make a consistent effort to take the program to the rest of the world. Why isn't Scouts in Brazil? I know we shouldn't waste our time with the less desirable people but still. I think the Church will have a hard decision to make in the near future in regards to scouting.

  • Tiago Seattle, WA
    March 7, 2014 12:50 p.m.

    I agree that sexual orientation has nothing to do with scouting. The BSA policy before 2014 brought sexual orientation into scouting by excluding boys who are known to be gay (experience SSA)-regardless of all other factors. This lead to situations where good young men who exemplify the scout oath and law were forced out of scouting or not awarded their Eagle when their orientation became known.
    Individuals should be judged by their individual actions and behaviors--not judged as a class based on a category they belong to. It is unhealthy to create an environment where boys grow up with shame about feelings they have and feel like they need to keep them a secret from everybody because they would be excluded if their feelings were known.
    If the only single thing you know about a boy is that he is gay, you don't know anything about whether or not he is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, or reverent--because you are right, sexual orientation has nothing to do with those things.
    The BSA was right to remove sexual orientation as a qualifier for membership.

  • CHS 85 Sandy, UT
    March 7, 2014 1:16 p.m.

    I had fun in Scouts. The camps were great, but my father and mother taught me to be a responsible man. Scouts taught me some skills, but it certainly wasn't the life-changing, life-affirming experience it is painted out to be in this opinion piece.

  • Mack2828 Ft Thomas, KY
    March 7, 2014 1:46 p.m.

    My wife and I raised six boys. We lived in 3 different states while they were growing up. We never found scouting to be even remotely like it is portrayed in this editorial. Our experience was that of apathetic, unprepared leaders and boys who didn't want anything to do with scouting after about age twelve. They really just wanted to play basketball on Wednesday night.

    When we are asked to give to friends of scouting we just politely say "no thanks, we won't be able to contribute this year."

    I pray that our church leaders will consider leaving the BSA and starting our own program. Not an old fashioned relic from the past like scouting, but a program that contains all of the things that the youth are truly interested in in this day and age. Check out 4H, they really have it figured out.

    I know many people have strong sentimental feelings about the BSA of days gone by. But it's not fair to our youth to hang on to it. They deserve better.

  • 2 bit Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 7, 2014 4:02 p.m.

    Re "I agree that sexual orientation has nothing to do with scouting. The BSA policy before 2014 brought sexual orientation into scouting by excluding boys who are known to be gay"...Tiago

    Clue... there is no Scouting policy to exclude boys who are known to be gay. If you know of one... could you share it? I've never heard of this policy.

    ===

    Scouting was not about sexual orientation before 2014, and it's not about sexual orientation after 2014.

    BSA doesn't exclude boys who are known to be gay. Not before 2014, and not now. LDS troops don't exclude boys for being gay. Not before 2014... not after 2014.

    I grew up with friends who were gay (whether they knew it then or not) and none of them were excluded from Scouts. I've never seen any BSA instruction to exclude boys who are gay. I've never seen a boy kicked out of Scouts because he was gay. Do you know one example of a boy who was kicked out of scouts for being gay (before OR after 2014)??

    This is a non-issue. It doesn't happen (boys being excluded for being gay).

    Now leaders... that's a different story.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    March 7, 2014 4:19 p.m.

    BSA is a really good organization but any more bowing to homosexual inclusion will be the end of it.

  • Tiago Seattle, WA
    March 7, 2014 4:57 p.m.

    @2 bit
    You can read all the details about the changing the BSA membership policy on Scouting's official website.
    The previous policy stated: "While the BSA does not proactively inquire about the sexual orientation of employees, volunteers, or members, we do not grant membership to individuals who are open or avowed homosexuals or who engage in behavior that would become a distraction to the mission of the BSA."
    The problem with that wording is that some people could and did use to removing a Scout from the program solely on the basis of sexual orientation as opposed to behavior. As the BSA surveyed and talked with its membership, they saw that the majority of members, especially younger parents and the boys themselves disagreed with this policy.
    The new policy maintains the strict behavior expectations for participation but removes the ability to exclude someone strictly based on stated orientation.
    Additionally, I would add that I think it removes a layer of fear and shame and allows boys who might deal with SSA to realize that they are not fundamentally broken or bad, but are expected to live the same moral principles as every other boy.

  • Really??? Kearns, UT
    March 7, 2014 11:37 p.m.

    I have to admit, I did not have a positive experience in the Boy Scouts. I was bullied constantly, and I dreaded the Wednesday evenings when I was expected to participate in this wonderful program. As I look back, I feel like the scout leaders were there to put in their time until they were released and given a different calling.

    I often wonder now if the leaders were even aware of the harassment I experienced each time I attended a scout meeting. Did they see the need to intervene or just turn a blind eye to what was happening?

    I wondered why the other boys didn't accept me, and it was painful to go to the activities and camps and be rejected. The worst part was that I felt like I was the one who tried the hardest to follow the rules and be obedient to the commandments. It was difficult watching the other boys being honored for their accomplishments knowing how horribly I and other boys who didn't fit into the mold were treated.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    March 8, 2014 12:43 a.m.

    Free scouting from church. It will do fine.

  • TMR Los Angeles, CA
    March 8, 2014 7:19 a.m.

    Seven, you criticized my post without answering the question - if scouting has nothing to do with sexuality (a premise upon which the D-News, you, and I agree), then why ban gay adults from leadership? A gay man, for example, could serve as a member of a LDS Bishopric and associate with the youth in his ward and thereby have an even more profound mentoring role with young people than would a scoutmaster. The D-News editorial takes a pass on answering this simple question and so do you. I wonder why?

  • SuperMom West Jordan , UT
    March 8, 2014 10:24 a.m.

    I have 4 boys, 3 of them are involved in scouts, and for me scouts has been FRUSTRATING. In the article it says, "Those who shun the Boy Scouts of America will have to turn to expensive and generally ineffective government programs to fill the leadership vacuum." What evidence do you have that that statement is even true?? Not only do I have boys in scouts but I have also been called in my ward to be over the scouting program. I see how much money is dumped into the scouting program. It is also so crazy how little money is given to the girls for activity days. It is unfair and shows favoritism towards the boys. I feel like we have been forced to participate in the scouting program. If the church wasn't involved I wouldn't choose to put my boys in it. I think a better way of building better men is by teaching the boys in their own homes how to become responsible adults. The church doesn't have girls do Girl Scouts and the girls do just fine. This is a frustrating topic for me. I just wish the church would stop doing scouts.

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 8, 2014 4:03 p.m.

    Tiago
    You said boys CAN be excluded for being gay, and said it was all on the official BSA website.

    I went to the official BSA website (Google "BSA Membership Standards")...

    This is a quote from that page...
    "Youth may not be denied membership in the BSA on the basis of sexual orientation or preference"...

    If you can find anywhere where it says boys CAN be denied membership for sexual orientation.... please post it.

    It doesn't exist. It's not the policy. No person has ever been denied membership because of their sexual orientation (before 2014 or after). I don't know any boy in my life who was denied membership (for any reason, including sexual orientation). Do you know any?

    Most 12 year olds are not sexually active, so it really doesn't matter.

    Most adults ARE sexually active. I think that's why their sexual orientation is relevant.

    ===

    Being disingenuous about this doesn't help your cause. It is absolutely (and provably) not BSA policy to exclude boys for sexual orientation.

    This issue (that boys are denied membership for their sexual orientation)... is a pretend issue.

    We should move on to something else.

  • Tiago Seattle, WA
    March 10, 2014 1:40 a.m.

    @2bits
    The policy you quoted is the new membership policy that went into effect in 2014 . I support this new policy.
    I already quoted the old policy from prior to 2014. There is a detailed section on the scouting website discussing the change in the policy. Google "Scouting Membership Standards."
    I agree that this doesn't affect most troops or boys. The new wording is a small change that affects very little for most people, but removes ambiguity and allows a moral boy who deals with SSA to participate in Scouting without fear or shame. For families and friends of those scouts, it is a big deal.

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 10, 2014 2:21 p.m.

    Tiago,
    The point is... you said boys can and have been removed from Boy Scouts because of SSA. That's not true. You can't name a single instance of that happening.

    Because it doesn't happen (not before 2014 or after 2014).

    I've never seen a boy banned from scouts for anything (much less being gay). Even boys who commit crimes and go to Juvenile Detention participate in Scouts IF they want to. I've never seen a boy kicked out of Scouts... for any reason. Have you?

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    March 11, 2014 12:12 a.m.

    I was in boy scouts and it was a positive and a fun experience. In It I set and achieved a lot of goals.

    I think it would be a stretch to say that for me scouts had a major positive lasting impact. I had decent parents and was quite interested in mathematics taught in school. I was not an at risk kid. But for at risk kids I can see that scouting probably would be a major positive lasting experience. But this isn't the majority of kids.

  • Bob K portland, OR
    March 12, 2014 1:49 a.m.

    Jamescmeyer
    Midwest City, USA, OK
    "The article is correct in stating that homosexuality has nothing to do with scouting. What's happening to the Boy Scouts is a result of their own decision to step into it, rather than ignoring something that doesn't have anything to do with them."

    Gay people do not invade scouting. They have always been there --- boys in scouting sometimes realize that they are Gay.

    Do we tell the boys to lie or hate themselves? Or do we say that they are welcome to stay with their lifelong friends, and they do not have to go to some Gay only scout thing that some DN readers would create to house Gay scouts?

    Millions of the finest Eagle Scouts have been Gay young men, over the decades -- now that boys are seeing who they are sooner, and wish to speak up, rather than lie and violate the honor code, some of you want to punish them.

    The Gay issue in scouting is the same as in churches -- they are already there.

  • bw0467 Draper, UT
    March 12, 2014 9:15 a.m.

    Yes, it is indeed sad that all the goodness and benefits the BSA Scouting Program has to offer are now being overshadowed by the issue of sexual orientation. However, I find it ironic that they themselves (the BSA) and a host of liberal media outlets are now crying foul over such overshadowing. The statement below in the article is absolutely false:

    "It is doubly sad that these attacks center on the issue of gay Scouts and leaders — given that Scouting itself has nothing to do with issues of sexual orientation."

    Wrong! The BSA made it an issue of sexual orientation the minute they went against the overwhelming majority of Councils all across the country and ramrodded their political agendas and policy changes down everyone's throat. Sound familiar? And if that wasn't enough, the LDS Church, with its powerful relationship with the BSA, got involved by issuing a press release just a few short weeks before the vote, which, in my opinion, aided in altering the very outcome of that vote. THIS THEY DID OF THEIR OWN FREE WILL AND VOLITION! Nobody else was responsible! Nobody else is to blame!

  • bw0467 Draper, UT
    March 12, 2014 9:48 a.m.

    Yes, it is indeed sad that all the goodness and benefits the BSA Scouting Program has to offer are now being overshadowed by the issue of sexual orientation. However, it’s ironic that the BSA and several media outlets are now crying foul over such overshadowing. I respectfully disagree with the statement in the article which reads:

    "It is doubly sad that these attacks center on the issue of gay Scouts and leaders — given that Scouting itself has nothing to do with issues of sexual orientation."

    The BSA made it an issue of sexual orientation the minute they went against the overwhelming majority of Councils all across the country and forced a vote that was directly contrary to previous District and National straw poll votes.

    This they did of their own free will and volition. Nobody else was responsible. Nobody else is to blame. And for that, it is hard to find much sympathy…

  • Brian Westley St. Paul, MN
    March 12, 2014 9:25 p.m.

    "Rather, governments and private institutions ought to embrace the Boy Scout movement."

    Governments CANNOT embrace the Boy Scout movement as long as the Boy Scouts require a belief in a god to be a member; no government under the constitution can practice such religious discrimination.

  • Bob K portland, OR
    March 14, 2014 5:01 p.m.

    bw0467
    Draper, UT
    "Wrong! The BSA made it an issue of sexual orientation the minute they went against the overwhelming majority of Councils all across the country and ramrodded their political agendas and policy changes down everyone's throat."

    A-- where is actual evidence that the BSA ramrodded it? Isn't the board made up of folks from all over? Or do you mean that you imagine the majority did not want it?

    B- I am sick to death of the ignorance about what a Gay person is: the definition is "someone who is attracted to, and identifies romantically with, the same sex"

    Since boys recognize their orientation earlier these days, rather than going through a hell of uncertainly until college, are they supposed to LIE to remain in Scouting?

    All of this smacks of "Why can't those Black people just shut up, act nice, and stay in their neighborhood?", which I heard 55 years ago.

    Mormons produce thousands of Gay children each year. How about a plan to help them?