Another Hollywood remake?
The book is way better than the movie.
ironmania wrote:"The book is way better than the movie."As is usually the case with fiction.
@The ScientistAnd what proof do you have that the book is
fiction?Perhaps a "scientist" who doesn't use the
scientific method to reach his conclusions might be better classified as a
"philosopher".Just a thought from one scientist to
So, Scientist, are you denying that the Man called Jesus didn't exist?
Coach, do you not understand what "Fiction" means.Philosophy
is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be
questioned.I wonder how it ends?
I don't understand people who make short, conclusive statements about the
"fiction" of religion. If there is something worth considering - speak
persuasively. Flip statements made in the guise of "fact" really offer
nothing but an angry drum to beat. @ Happy Valley Heretic,
"Religion is answers that may never be questioned." As a
very religious person I was unaware that we couldn't question religion. My
religion began with a question about religion and has grown to include millions
of others - because of their questions.
@ The ScientistThat Jesus Christ lived is a historical fact, just
like Caesar Augustus or Herod the Great. That he lived can be disputed only by
the ignorant or uniformed. Some say he was a man. Others say he was a great
teacher. I say he is the Son of God. Whom do you say he is?
@Harrison BergeronNeither ignorant nor uninformed here. He most
likely didn't exist. Like dozens of other mythical demigods, the story of
Jesus compiles awe-inspiring attributes and links the increasingly fractious
Jews with the other pagan worshippers. Were it not for the fact that the very
same scenario played itself out in every civilization, the uniqueness of
Christianity would be worthy of serious consideration. It's not however.
Hence The Scientist's deservedly flippant remark.
slcdenizenWhile they may disagree on the particulars of his life,
virtually all scholars of antiquity agree that Jesus lived. Events of his life
and his crucifixion were documented by non-Christians such as Roman historians
Josephus and Tacitus. In fact his life was more documented than any of his
contemporaries. To deny his existence puts one in the same category as those
who claim the moon landings never happened. That he lived is not in
question. The question you must answer is: "Who was he?" I
believe he is exactly who he said he is: The Son of God.
@HarrisonThe single mention by Josephus was almost certainly
inserted centuries after his death. It mentions Jesus being the son of God and
begs the question: why was Josephus certain about the divinity of Jesus but
never became a Christian? Why would a historian detail thousands of events but
write only one sentence about the son of God, as if in passing? Why did the
census from the bible not take place in any other historical record? It would
have been a significant event to require all individuals to return to their
hometown simply to take a census, right? Why do the apostles have conflicting
accounts of events? Only in the context of these records being created decades
after the events in question in order to convince the Jews of the arrival of the
Messiah does this make sense. The birth of Christianity is more a tale of the
transition of power from Roman rule to Roman Catholic rule in Europe. To each
their own, but when such certainty is echoed about ahistorical figures and
events only attributable to a religious text, free passes should not be given.
RE Slcdenizen, (Isaiah 9:6)For to us a child is born, to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful
Counselor, ‘Mighty God…”. Apostles' Creed,
390 A.D.(Jesus) Suffered under Pontius Pilate; was crucified, dead and
buried.Eusebius, quoting early apocryphal accounts, stated that
Pilate suffered misfortune in the reign of Caligula (AD 37–41).The First physical evidence relating to Pilate was discovered in 1961, when a
block of limestone, the Pilate Stone, was found in the Roman theatre at Caesarea
Maritima, the capital of the province of Judaea (Iudaea). Bearing a damaged
dedication by Pilate of a Tiberieum,[the dedication states that he was
[...]ECTVS IUDA[...] , prefect of Judaea. Sacred Names(nomina sacra)
used in Greek, Latin, and Coptic manuscripts, starting sometime in the 1st
Century CE, the nomina sacra were sometimes shortened by contraction in
Christian inscriptions, resulting in sequences of Greek letters such as IH
(iota-eta), IC (iota-sigma), or IHC (iota-eta-sigma) for Jesus (Greek
Iēsous), and XC (chi-sigma), XP (chi-ro) and XPC (chi-rho-sigma) for Christ
I actually had a chance to see that interview referred to in this article and
it's quite courageous to hear Roma talk about Christ with such faith and
conviction. She said she left satan "on the cutting room floor" where he
belongs because he gets too much air time as it is. I wholeheartedly agree.There is so much evil, saddness, terror etc., in the world and we need
to hear more about what the other side offers in this earth: light, love,
redemption, eternal life... Yes, indeed, satan does not need any more air
time, neither do those who call "The Son of God" a work of fiction.Let's use this space to say ONLY positive things about Christ and
the love and sacrifice he made for us until there is no space left for those who
oppose Him! Light blocks out darkness even with small flickers!
@SharronaThat evidence is ironclad. Thank you for doing twenty
minutes of research. Not quite sure I'll return to confession, but
it's comforting to know the evidence for Jesus remains scant. Point A:
Isaiah preceded the Bible, any prophecy therein would need to be confirmed by an
actual event. Point B: 390 A.D. is the date of the Creed. 32 A.D. was the event
in question. If I were to make historical claims on fresh documents regarding
the 17th century, would it be credible today? Point C: The rule of Pilate is not
in question/doubt. Not sure why that would be relevant. Point D: Jesus was a
common name, hence the frequent use of the name by our other dubious historian,
Tacitus. Moreover, why would such an event only deserve brief mentions and not
volumes of details? Criss Angel walking on walls gains millions of views on
youtube, yet when a man is performing miracles in Judea, no one but his
immediate followers take notice?
slcdenizen - Point 1. The mere fact that there is scant historical
evidence is actually proof that Jesus Christ was who he said he was. He was
clear, as were the prophecies many year previous to his earthly life, that he
would be rejected by not only his people but by the world. Why then would there
be evidence in abundance for a man who the world didn't believe to be
God's son? And just like today, miracles are explained away by those who
cannot abide that they happened or who are offended at the source. Point 2. While I disagree with many of Sharrona's posts, I'm not
sure what the dig at her was for. Believe me, she does much more than 20
minutes of research and in this post I stand with her.
RE: Slcdenizen “Jesus(Yeshua/or Joshua)was a common name.” True,
But Christ is a title.Christ is taken from the Hebrew
“Mashiach” or ”Anointed One“ in Greek
“*Christos” anglicized to Christ. The English translation of
Mashiach or “Anointed One” is Messiah. Examples of this title in the
O.T. are (Dan 7:13, Psalm 2:2). Jesus claimed this title in the N.T. (Mk 14:
61-62).Sacred Names used in *Greek manuscripts, starting sometime in
the 1st Century CE, (chi-sigma), XP (chi-ro) and XPC (chi-rho-sigma) for Christ
(Greek/*Christos). Other unique examples: Savior ΣΗΡ,
Cross/Stake=stauros ΣΤΣ, Mother of God (Mary) Theotokos
ΘΚΣ.Micah 5:2, Born in Bethlehem, Luke 2:4-7; Dan
9:25 Time for Jesus Birth Luke 2:1-2.Jesus and feasts of Israel: 1
of 7: Passover (Lev 23:5) The Messiah as our Passover lamb (1 Cor 5:7) whose
blood would be shed for our sins. Jesus was crucified on the day of preparation
for the Passover at the same hour that the lambs were being slaughtered for the
Passover meal that evening.
slcdenizen wrote: "Criss Angel walking on walls gains millions of
views on youtube, yet when a man is performing miracles in Judea, no one but his
immediate followers take notice?"really? I would venture to say
that youtube, cell phones, and other technology of the masses MIGHT just MIGHT
have some bearing on the differences in viewership. A comparison of the two is
illogical. frankly I think the fact that Muslims (he is mentioned in
the Qur'an some 93 times), jews (they view him as a false messiah but
acknowledge him as an historical figure), and Christian (real and divine) is
enough evidence to say that he was a real person. the only qusestion still up
for debate is his divinity.
jeanie - There are two lines of reasoning behind the purported
existence of Jesus in this argument. 1 - Jesus actually did live and was the
Savior/Messiah to the endless number of groups and religions on which they lay
claim. 2 - He did not live, or was not the Savior/Messiah and the story's
creation served a purpose other than is widely understood. I argue for the
second due to the shaky historical claims of number one which is debated above.
Moreover, the fact that there exists a convenient backstory explaining the
mysterious existence of Jesus as well as the warning that some would deny the
tale, does not contribute to the facts of the matter, but rather to the natural
mechanism humans have always used to dispel doubts. For example, many still
believe in the vague claims of Nostradamus who, prior to issuing prophetic
declarations, warned about those who may be skeptical toward his claims. Does
this tactic contribute anything to the actual claims of Nostradamus? Or is it a
simple method of charlatans to cast skeptics in an unflattering light? Ask
yourself, do you believe in Nostradamus? If not, then he prophesied correctly.
slcdenizen: "The single mention by Josephus was almost certainly inserted
centuries after his death."Not true. He also recounts Caesar
sending Albinus to have "the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose
name was James" tried by the Sanhedrin. And perhaps the account of John the
Baptists execution was also inserted? And I suppose you would say the same
about Tacitus and his references to Christ and the crucifixion? And Pliny the
Younger? And of course the same conspirators could have easily done similar to
the writings of the Greek satirist Lucian. And then there are sources such as
the Babylonian Talmud and the Mishnah which portray Jesus as a sorcerer
magician or aim to discredit his actions, but none deny his existence.
Questions or apparent incongruities are not evidence of an event not
happening. The moon landing hoax folks use the same tactic: Why are there no
stars in the sky? How come the flag seems to wave in the breeze where there
could be no atmosphere? Who filmed Neil Armstrong stepping onto the Moon?That Jesus lived and was crucified is accepted by virtually all
historical scholars. That he resurrected and lives still, is my personal
To those who doubt that Christ lived and is divinity is the very reason the Book
of Mormon was written. Another Testimony of Jesus Christ - seen by those in
this continent after his resurrection. Yes, you may try and refute
that the Book of Mormon is a fraud as well, but to those who seek and ask with a
sincere heart wanting to know, God will testify otherwise. To
reject these two testimonies is to acknowledge that life has no point, no
purpose, for then we are all created by happenstance, with no hope for the
future. If we are all created by happenstance, how do we have
individuality? How do identical twins have differing personalities? They came
from the same zygote and egg, fertilized in the same womb, born to the same
mother and father, yet are totally different in personalities.If
they have no soul, no spirit that existed before, from whence came this
difference? Scientist, please tell us! Please explain how each and every
person born on this earth is unique, yet still came oozing out of the mud in a
random chain of events.No, God lives and so does his son, Jesus
I saw this movie over the weekend, and as high as my hopes were for it, it
exceeded them all. It was the first, second, and third most moving thing
I've ever seen in a theater. Almost everyone in the room sat and watched
the credits, and when those were finally over, we all got up and left as the
most silent after-movie crowd I've ever witnessed.
Casey See"If we are all created by happenstance, how do we have
individuality? How do identical twins have differing personalities? They came
from the same zygote and egg, fertilized in the same womb, born to the same
mother and father, yet are totally different in personalities. ... Scientist,
please tell us! ..."Wow! Good point. Thank you. There is proof
of God all around us if we will just have eyes to see and ears to hear.As my son-in-law says, if there is no God, if there is no purpose to life,
then we all might just as well kill ourselves and be done with it and not waste
this precious space.
As a missionary in NY in the late 70's I learned that many preachers we
taught the LDS lessons to successfully practiced waiting for the influence of
the Spirit of God to move them as they taught their congregations. The spirit of
God testifies and is available to those that righteously petition God. I have
also spent time with religious Jews in Israel and have felt that same spirit of
truth among their people. The Spirit of God is moving across the world in
magnificent ways and I stand amazed at His grace that extends to all His
children. From what I have read, it is very obvious that the power
and spirit of God is present in this film. I look forward to taking my wife to
see the movie.
The purpose of the movie was not to create a debate about the reality of Jesus,
the movie was produced by believers. The movie creates an opporutinty to
discuss among all of us the life of a wonderful man and wonderful teachings.
Debate as you may his reality, but there is no denying the teachings make the
world a better place.
Roma Downey as Mary? Really? Egotistical wouldn't you think. If this is
anything like her Bible mess, I'll pass and read the book.
By the way, how is the movie? I thought that is what the article was about.
As I read all of these comments after seeing the movie I am amazed at the
controversy that still surrounds the Son of God coming to this earth, as was
prophesied in the Old Testament; but the real miracle is that He still lives!
He is not dead. He did Rise as was part of the Plan of Salvation. I am thankful
to Roma Downey for her testimony of Christ. Spiritual truth is real though
often not understood by the unbelieving. God does not need to prove his
existence. We need to prove to Him our love of goodness and righteousness is
real. We need to be actively teaching and love of Christ. I am thankful for the
knowledge I have, not just of Christ's existence in a historical light, but
in the higher spiritual truth that is true light; the knowledge that comes
through prayer, much study, actively going to where His spirt is, and keeping
His commandments. The closer we are to Him the more He allows us learn His
truths. Thank you Roma! Hollywood needs more of you. I am excited to see Russell
Crow play Noah coming to the big screen.
When they cut out things that might have hurt Obama they lost my business. One
can't trust Hollywood to do anything.