Illogical is a very polite word for what the leg is proposing.
Yes Governor it may be illogical, but it sends a "message" and our
legislators love to send "messages" to the federal government with tax
Thank you, Governor. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I just hope the Leg
will listen to you.
I agree with Governor Herbert. Why should the state turn down $500 million in
money that we Utahns have already paid to the federal government, only to raise
our taxes to come up with $35 million MORE to invent an inferior program -- one
that will cover fewer people and not give good coverage to those few that it
does cover? Illogical, is right! Please accept the Medicaid Expansion!
Illogical? How is extortion from the federal government logical? obama care is a
train wreck. 500 million dollars of borrowed money is not logical at all. I
think we can make it on 35 million dollars, it's called budgeting. Will it
hurt? perhaps, but not nearly as much as the noose. Does the
Governor know, the US is close to 20 "T"rillion dollars in debt with an
estimated 90-100 "T"rillion in unfunded liabilities? Mr
Herbert, you will mortgage more of the soul of Utah to the feds? Independence
from federal binding ropes should be much more preferable to you and all
Even a college dropout can see that my Republican party's plan is idiotic.
G-Day-M8 is fine with budgeting for someone else's healthcare. There is no
message to send. The only message you send by turning down the money is that
you're illogical. The ACA has been adopted. Live with it or have it
Does anyone else find it ironic that BO has caused the GOP to discuss and debate
an issue they have choose to ignore for years?
It would be helpful if the Governor would protest the individual mandate - to
send a message to Washington - and to protest the levels of insurance and high
deductibles that are planned for us without such a message being sent and oft
repeated. Does anyone speak up for justice and common sense any more? Being
logical, fine in itself, is not what will hearten the oppressed, and the
oppressed don't begin to exist below some magic level of income and cease
above that level. It would help if Mr Herbert expressed heartfelt
sympathy and empathy for this and every other state where people will be
impoverished by the requirements of the ACA legislation, and the loss of freedom
that we all are suffering these days.Would that do any good? Yes,
it would do a great deal of good, spoken with feeling here and throughout the
nation. It would show that governors live on the same planet as so many of the
rest of us. If he doesn't live on the same planet he could still show
compassion and a determination to use his influence towards turning the tide of
oppression and tyranny.
Governor Herbert, please expand Medicaide with the available federal funds. We
must now alllow needy folks without insurance to become sick and not have access
to good healthcare. Basic access to healthcare is a basic human right, not a
privledge available only to those well heeled and well employed! Now granted,
we have to find reasonable ways to pay for Healthcare for the needy and our
broken Healthcare system must continue to find ways to lower the cost!
@GildasI think you make some good points about compassion and common
sense. However, I would like you to help me understand how you would provide
access to healthcare for those who don't have insurance? Can you tell me
that if an individual buys a health policy outside of the mechanisms of the
Affordable Care Act that it will not have high premiums and high deductibles?
Do we not lose our freedom to the healthcare empire now if we get really sick
and go to the hospital without insurance? I call it loss of freedom when the
hospital goes after everything I own to re-pay them for their over-priced
services. Please offer how you would solve the problem of affordable access to
healthcare for folks that are un-employed or underemployed. Should these folks
just suffer and die without any medicine or care for their infirmities?
ACA is the law of the land and it is working better and better each day. The
reason we know this is the lack of attacks on it by the Republicans! They know
they lost that one and so far 6 million people have better and in most cases
cheaper and wider coverage. As for turning down the 500 million (800 million in
the Salt Lake Tribune). Shame on Becky for her lack of understanding and
compassion. Governor Herbert will beat her in a landslide when he decide to
takes the money, and proceeds with proven programs. Finally we will have a
leader instead of a politician like Becky that is only concerned about getting
in the Governor's Mansion.
I agree with Gildas. We are not citizens of Washington, D.C. We are
citizens of Utah. All duties not enumerated in the Constitution are to be
handled by the States or by the People. Healthcare is not an enumerated duty.
The Supreme Court told us it was a tax. If it is a tax, then we owe the Federal
Government that tax and the State of Utah should have no claim on that money.
If the Governor thinks that Washington is our nanny, then perhaps he
does not understand our heritage. We are not subjects of a King. We are free
people who have the responsibility to pay our own way through life - including
paying for our own medical expenses. If the Governor thinks that government
should pay for those costs, perhaps he could show us exactly when and were we
authorized the State of Utah to provide medical care.
Im curious Mike, do you have health insurance, or do you "pay for your own
medical expenses"?If you don't have insurance, and
therefore truly do pay your own way, then congratulations, You join the 60,000
Utah's trapped in the gap between ACA and the unwillingness of the State to
participate in the expanded program.
We need to be careful how we might be contributing to the economy damaging
policy of the Obama administration to print money (Fed buying the debt) to pay
for everything where they are coming up short. The feds medicare plan is like a
pension plan, set benefits with no gaurantee of funding. Every time the Fed
prints money to by the debt the buying power of the dollar drops thereby taxing
everyone to pay for unfunded programs. So, how much of the $500 million from the
feds for medicare will be printed?
@MeckfahessMy first concern was with the individual mandate. If I
cannot, or do not want to, pay for a health plan of a certain kind, I cannot, or
should not be required to, pay a fine. Many people, apparently, are faced
with higher health care costs under ACA, and higher deductibles. How is it
compassionate to force them to do what will impoverish them? If they could have
afforded the kind of plan that many are being forced into, they would presumably
have sought one already.What would I do, or propose to do? A fair
question. I would leave health insurance to the States and to private
philanthropy. I would not force anyone to have health insurance. I would
insist legally on (advertized) 'a la carte' prices for common
procedures (take the average cost of the procedure over time), promote healthy
living, and warn people about the results of bad diet (the cause of most of our
ills) and promiscuity (of growing concern), as well as smoking, drinking, and
drug abuse. I would not subsidize any policy that is not actuarily sound. That
would be a start.....
The answer to the Medicaid question is quite simple. Does the current
legislature really think they can come up with the full funding for Medicare
when the "free money" from the national government runs out.How WILL they fund it? Raise taxes? Have a very large bakesale?The legislature needs to understand that if they DO fund the Medicaid
expansion, they will be "on the hook" for much more in the future. Is
it fair for the current legislature to commit future legislatures to the
Medicaid expansion?How would they propose to tell the recipients in 2020
that they can no longer afford to fund it? Once citizens receive a
service (especially free ones) it becomes increasingly difficult to take it
Hey Governor - how about counting ALL members of the family when it comes to
medicaid. As a family of 2 our spend down would be about $40. But instead they
are counting one person's income and applying it to just the one person in
the family who has applied for the medicaid making the spend down unpayable. We
don't qualify for the insurance through the healthcare network but we
supposedly make too much money to qualify for medicaid. Something is not right
here. Start counting all family members using the same income to live on not
just the one that has applied for medicaid. the system is broken.
Lockhart says it is not "illogical" and "makes sense" to reject
Medicaid expansion. If you go by the numbers, $524 million from the feds covers
111,000 people. Doing the match, the states alternative of $35 million would
cover only about 7,400 people. And our fiscally conservative state will lose
$559 million to cover that 7,400 and send an anti-fed message, which will have
no affect and they will gladly receive, as they will save a half a billion
dollars. Sounds logical and sensible to me.
G-Day-M8......YOU think we can get by on $35 million???? You do understand of
course that providing many fewer services to many fewer people is a 35 million
dollar definition of "getting by." You do understand, of course, that
this $35 million is IN ADDITION to the money we have already sent to
Washington....our money that you suggest we refuse. "Yes, there is waste in
government....Yes, we need to curb spending. No, government can't and
shouldn't do everything for us. BUT....this is an area where it can and
should. You may not benefit from this, but many people need it. We sent the
money to Washington....to refuse to take some of it back, is crazy, and in this
case heartless. The ACA is a boondoggle. But it is OUR boondoggle. We need to
grow up and work to make it work, rather than just sit back and complain and
send messages. ( By-the-way, seceding from the Union is also
It is NOT illogical to not accept Federal funds as an inducement to surrender
more state and personal freedom. Federal government money ALWAYS comes with
strings attached.Further, I thought Obamacare guaranteed all American citizens
affordable access to health care. Medicaid expansion is not and should not be
considered a part of this guarantee and as I u8nderstand, the Supreme court
affirmed this. It is indeed tragic that so many Utahns do not have adequate
medical coverage, but the state cannot exhaust what few remaining resources it
has to try and solve these problems. Churches, charities, and hospitals can do
step in to the tune of millions of dollars each year to aid in this effort. The
solution, ultimately is not to strip the rich of their wealth, or to further
squander more money on useless programs like Obamacare, but to repeal such laws
and return to true market based solutions, balance the federal budget, get more
people back to work and rely less on government dole to solve our problems.
What is more logical, saying, "We, the federal government, cannot afford out
of pocket to pay for this, but we have an open-ended tab that we know we really
aren't going to have to pay off, so let's run it up," or, "No,
Uncle Sam, bills do come due. If we are part of the household, we'll pony
up for as much as we can and cover our part of the family on our own."It is not logical to suppose you can run up a bill forever and without end. It
is logical to worry about how you are going to pay your bills. Not expanding
Medicaid might seem like passing up free money, but it is also passing up unfree
debt, for debt is not free. Passing up medicaid expansion is not saying,
"No, we won't help you." It is saying, "We will help as many of
you as we can, but we are going to pay for what we give you, instead of running
deeper into debt.
Sundriver you're dreaming about putting people back to work. If you're
over 35 in this state no one will hire you because you might hurt yourself doing
the job you're qualified to do. Instead employers prefer to hire someone
new to train every two or three months because the last one quit because they
didn't make enough money, didn't climb the corprate ladder fast enough
or just didn't understand what was expected of them.