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Letter: Where's Al Gore?

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  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Dec. 13, 2013 3:47 a.m.

    Mr Gore is still around.

    And his logic and information concerning "CLIMATE" trumps your snarky remark about "WEATHER"

  • Ninjutsu Sandy, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 6:28 a.m.

    I am astonished. Why does the DN print letters like this?

    First, Al Gore said nothing of the kind. Mr. Haynes has distorted the man's message.
    Second, Global Warming models have never predicted a sustained and consistent raising of temperatures everywhere on earth. There is a difference between climate and weather.

    Doesn't everyone know this? There's a serious breakdown of communication going on here and I'm afraid Deseret News is perpetuating it.

  • Semi-Strong Louisville, KY
    Dec. 13, 2013 6:32 a.m.

    When a dear family member had terminal cancer there were good weeks and bad weeks. But each good week was a little worse than the last. Each bad week a bit worse as well. Finally that person died of cancer. The individual weeks made it hard to see the entire trend (and gave us some amount of false hope). But the overall trend was clear when seen in full (and with some dispassion).

    Many trend lines have a saw tooth type shape. One (or even two or three) cold winters or mild summers do not change that significantly. Further, you have to look at the entirety (not just your winter or summer but around the world).

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Dec. 13, 2013 6:37 a.m.

    The big news from Antarctica these days is the record low temperature of -135.8 degrees Fahrenheit, which is the coldest temperature ever recorded on the planet. What seems to be going unreported, is that on top of the record cold in Antarctica, the southern ice sheet is growing at a pace faster than Global Warming theories can account for. Sea ice around the Antarctic averaged 17.16 million square kilometers (6.63 million square miles) in November. The long-term 1981 to 2010 average for November is 16.30 million square kilometers (6.29 million square miles). The arguments from the Climate Change camp all seem to be “no matter what happens, it is still evidence of Global Warming.”

  • Ranch Here, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 6:42 a.m.

    Someone else who doesn't understand the difference between weather and climate.

    Just because you're freezing your buns off doesn't change the facts that 1) Artic ice is melting at an unbelievable rate. 2) The oceans are warmer and rising as a result of a) warmer water & b) more of it from melted ice. 3) Weather events are more extreme than usual.

    All of which is predicted by the climate models.

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 6:58 a.m.

    Don't worry. Al Gore is probably trying to organize a summit meeting on global warming up in Minnesota right now.

  • Res Novae Ashburn, VA
    Dec. 13, 2013 7:24 a.m.

    "He promised that, if we allowed coal-burning power plants to dump carbon dioxide into the air, we would never be cold again."

    I'm not sure what value a letter has when it begins with such a ridiculous strawman of Gore's position.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 7:39 a.m.

    He is smart enough to stay out of the dangerously polluted Salt lake Valley.

  • Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 7:49 a.m.

    @Semi-Strong "But the overall trend was clear when seen in full (and with some dispassion)."

    Correct! In the spirit of this statement, I would encourage everyone to look at the 3,000 year proxy record, and note that our global average temperature for last year is *below* the median temperature for that time period. A little perspective is all we need. We are still recovering from the Little Ice Age. We could use a little warming. Civilization flourished during the Medieval Warm Period.

    @Ninutsu "There is a difference between climate and weather."

    Yes. I think the rule is, if it validates my preconception, it's climate. If it validates the other guy's preconception, it's weather.

  • Blue Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:16 a.m.

    Thid Barker, polar ices are measured both in terms of their surface area and their thickness. Depth is as important as area.

    The "new" Antarctic sea ice is exceptionally thin, indicating that while freezing temperatures can occur in the atmosphere, ground and ocean temperatures are above normal. Nothing you're saying provides any valid evidence to support the idea that global warming isn't happening.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:34 a.m.

    "Yes. I think the rule is, if it validates my preconception, it's climate. If it validates the other guy's preconception, it's weather."

    No, but if a hot/cold day or a hot/cold month or even a hot/cold year constitutes Weather. A hot/cold decade is indicative of climate. And that holds true regardless of ones "preconception"

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:47 a.m.

    @ Blue. Nothing will ever convince you that man made climate change is a hoax, not even world record cold temperatures of -138.8 degrees. Doesn't that seem contradictory to you even when others are describing a planet, we are told, is warming up and all the ice on the planet will melt! Believe what you want but in 10, 20 years when the earth is still not warming, what new environmental hoax will you embrace? Someone looking to make a quick buck will come up with it and as PT Barnum said, "There is another sucker born every minute". The key to recognizing hoaxes is simple: follow the money and see who's pocket it goes too!

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:56 a.m.

    Just for the record - from the National Snow and Ice Date Center....

    "On September 16, Arctic sea ice appeared to have reached its minimum extent for the year of 3.41 million square kilometers (1.32 million square miles). This is the lowest seasonal minimum extent in the satellite record since 1979 and reinforces the long-term downward trend in Arctic ice extent."

    "The September 2012 minimum was in turn 3.29 million square kilometers (1.27 million square miles) below the 1979 to 2000 average minimum, representing an area nearly twice the size of the state of Alaska. This year’s minimum is 18% below 2007 and 49% below the 1979 to 2000 average."

    "Overall there was a loss of 11.83 million square kilometers (4.57 million square miles) of ice since the maximum extent occurred on March 20, 2012, which is the largest summer ice extent loss in the satellite record, more than one million square kilometers greater than in any previous year."

    The 2013 levels bounced back some. The fact that there is now a navigable northern passage in summer months is remarkable. This has huge impacts on my industry, something we watch closely.

  • SCfan clearfield, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:10 a.m.

    Like I said yesterday on a similar topic. Whether the climate in any given year has more heat, more cold, more hurricanes and toronados, less heat, less cold, less hurricanes and tornados, more ice melting, less ice melting, more wind, less wind, longer summers, shorter summers, longer winters, shorter winters, longer spring, shorter spring, longer fall, shorter fall, more solar and lunar eclipises, less solar and lunar eclipises, more birds singing, less birds singing. More pot smoking, less pot smoking, more Oscars to Meryl Streep, more touchdown passes from Payton Manning, more chokes by Ohio State football, (yes I really liked that one) ect. ect. ect. It will all be blamed on Global Warming. Who could prove different?

  • Schnee Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:19 a.m.

    "we would never be cold again."

    There's been around 2F of warming the past 100 years in this part of the world. Why would it never get cold again? The cold temperatures we set in Salt Lake were still 5+ degrees above the record lows. If you look at December record lows for Salt Lake none of them were set more recently than 1992.

    @Thid Barker
    "The big news from Antarctica these days is the record low temperature of -135.8 degrees Fahrenheit, which is the coldest temperature ever recorded on the planet."

    At a location that has no long-term temperature record to speak of. It could get that cold in that location more often the past century and we just didn't know about it until recently due to lack of observations.

    " Doesn't that seem contradictory to you even when others are describing a planet, we are told, is warming up and all the ice on the planet will melt!"

    Why do you trust that one measurement and not the other hundreds and thousands of measurements that make up our global temperature dataset?

  • Irony Guy Bountiful, Utah
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:20 a.m.

    This letter writer is totally uninformed. 5 minutes examining the NASA website on climate would give him the information he needs to turn his head around 180 degrees.

  • Schnee Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:23 a.m.

    @Thid Barker
    "The key to recognizing hoaxes is simple: follow the money and see who's pocket it goes too!"

    The fastest way to get money for climate scientists IF there were a hoax would be to expose it. The oil company money (speaking of following money...) and right-wing radio promotion of a book you write would make you rather wealthy.

    The fastest way for a climate scientist to get money in the normal realm of thinking is to be accurate in your research that finds new results. The scale of the hoax you suggest involves so many people it's just not practical or realistic.

  • Kalindra Salt Lake City, Utah
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:28 a.m.

    First, there is no debate over the fact they global climate change is occurring. The only debate is whether or not it is human caused or naturally occurring. Scientists have the same level of certainty that global climate change is human caused as they have that cigarette smoking causes lung cancer. The number who disagree with this is roughly the same number as still believe the world is flat and the moon landing was faked.

    @ Thid Barker: Instead of just reading and repeating the very edited talking points, you should take the time to read and understand the actual scientific papers on that really cold temperature and the ice sheets. The reality is actually quite different from the denial talking points.

    @ Nate: It is not what point of view it supports, but who is providing the data and interpretation. There is a valid reason why podiatrists don't perform brain surgery, and there are valid reasons why rocket scientists are different than climate scientists.

  • FT salt lake city, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:34 a.m.

    This letter and numerous poster have provided me with my allotment of humor for the day. Thanks for the satire.

  • Tyler D Meridian, ID
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:37 a.m.

    @Nate – “A little perspective is all we need. We are still recovering from the Little Ice Age. We could use a little warming”

    Glad to see you acknowledge that we (people) are helping this warming process along, although I’m skeptical of your faith in our ability to get it right (i.e., just how much do we turn up the heat on the stove?).

    Maybe, just maybe Nature (God?) might be a better cook than us…

    As for the letter I would have considered it a joke as well but when I listen to the verbal dysentery spewed on AM radio day after day I think it’s very likely the letter was in earnest.

  • trekker Salt Lake, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:40 a.m.

    Maybe the letter writer needs to watch The Day After Tomorrow. lol

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:54 a.m.

    The major climate models predict higher temperatures globally and more violent tropical storms - and it is happening. Just a little over a year ago a violent TROPICAL storm found its way to Colorado - remember that 12" rainfall. It could have been us, easily.

  • Blue Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 10:40 a.m.

    NASA's Earth Observatory program just today issued this press release: "Arctic Waters Keep Warming in 2013" detailing new research into the extent of polar ocean warming.

    Google it.

  • ProSteve Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 10:43 a.m.

    The letter writer clearly does not understand the difference between climate and weather.

  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    Dec. 13, 2013 11:37 a.m.

    Algore is likely out quietly enjoying the millions he made, off his foolish minions and followers, as the acting hypocrite spokesman/mouthpiece for the hoax everyone calls global warming or climate change. If I had scammed so many people into paying for my phony cause, I would be laying low also. However he could be spending all his time secretly inventing a replacement for the internet!

  • spring street SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 1:14 p.m.

    What I find most humorous is this letter is coming in the middle of nasty inversion trapping the pollutants and cold air in the valley. If you are to cold might I suggest you get up in the mountains (typically much colder then the valleys and visit park city.

  • nonceleb Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 1:16 p.m.

    Every time we get a cold spell the deniers come out of the closet. One frigid week in one locale debunks a century of the average temperature worldwide rising? "Think locally, act globally?"

  • WestGranger West Valley City, Utah
    Dec. 13, 2013 2:05 p.m.

    The Great global warming hoax. If you don't believe it, you must be uninformed. If you believe any of the scientific evidence that is contrary to Global warming theory, you must be an ignoramus. Mr.Gore's predictions haven't come true. Period.

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 2:59 p.m.

    When I was in elementary school they told us we were headed for another ice age. Now it appears its trying to come upon us, however lucky for us, we have put some carbon dioxide in the air and that will soften the blow, (one can only hope).

    Actually I was looking forward to a warmer earth. The balmier temperatures and the increased carbon dioxide are said to help increase crop growth, and also I hate winters, I really should move south.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 3:05 p.m.

    Since Saint Al of Gore makes millions/billions of dollars with this stuff, I choose to ignore him.
    Al Gore does what is good for Al Gore. He chases the dollar. Isn't that obvious?

  • wrz Phoenix, AZ
    Dec. 13, 2013 3:09 p.m.

    Snow in Egypt since 100 years ago... Snow in Israel for the first time ever?

    Al Gore, please come forward and explain yourself.

  • Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 3:30 p.m.

    @Tyler D "Glad to see you acknowledge that we (people) are helping this warming process along...."

    And where do you think I said that? Welcoming warmth and causing it are two different things.

    @UtahBlueDevil "The 2013 levels bounced back some."

    I'll say. Highest in five years. I see why you chose to talk about 2012 instead.

    @Kalindra "It is not what point of view it supports, but who is providing the data and interpretation."

    That's not the way it works around here. When a big storm hits New York, we blame it on global warming. Never mind facts and history with regard to the frequency of hurricanes. It's how we roll.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 3:51 p.m.

    RE: wrz "Snow in Egypt since 100 years ago... Snow in Israel for the first time ever?" I very much doubt the second statement. It snows like crazy in Syria. The climate on the macro level is getting warmer steadily - melting glaciers, Greenland ice cap melting, Alaskan permafrost melting. Good grief! How much evidence do you need?

  • David Centerville, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 4:41 p.m.

    How will Global Warming...er, Climate Change believers dig themselves out of their ignorant past when all of this is glaringly proven false?

    Its called "Weather" people.

    In the 70's the fear was global cooling. Now its global warming and climate change.

    Whatever. It's all an effort to control money and people's lives.

    Get over yourselves.

  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 4:45 p.m.

    Check out the documentary "Chasing Ice".

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 5:18 p.m.

    In utah, climate change is like gun violence. If it didn't happen in your back yard today, it's not happening at all.

  • Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:04 p.m.

    @JoeBlow "A hot/cold decade is indicative of climate."

    No, no. That's how it used to be. Then we went 16 years without any warming. So now it's only weather. The alarmists said so.

  • wrz Phoenix, AZ
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:11 p.m.

    @marxist:
    "Snow in Egypt since 100 years ago..."

    According to Drudge. Also, Huffington Post. Look it up. You have Google don't you?

    "'Snow in Israel for the first time ever?' I very much doubt the second statement."

    OK. It's: 'weather forecaster on public radio described the storm as 'historic.''

    "Greenland ice cap melting, Alaskan permafrost melting."

    Antarctic snow pack is growing. Record low recorded there. Try 135.8 degrees Fahrenheit below zero. Look it up. You have Google don't you?

    "Good grief! How much evidence do you need?"

    Evidence of what? Cooling?

  • Bubble SLC, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:18 p.m.

    @ranchhand

    Don't you know they filmed that on the same sound stage as Bigfoot landing on the moon and declaring the world round when we all know its flat.

  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 8:48 p.m.

    @Bubble;

    But they'll believe in some being that nobody has ever (verifiably) seen. They'll just take the word of anybody who seems believable.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    Dec. 13, 2013 9:21 p.m.

    WRZ…. you are way over simplifying what is going on. As arctic ice melts, it cools the average temp of the ocean. That has the effect of altering currents and jet streams. Those changes mean that you have extremes in all directions. Pointing to one data point here, or another there, proves nothing. It is taking the sum total of these that makes up the full story.

    Anecdotally, we were working with one of the largest oil companies on some new exploratory wells in the Alaska tundra. We had to abort the pad because the permafrost had thawed more than usual and the ground would not support the weight of the rig. Same year, a open sea rig had to be pulled early because that same year the ice came in earlier as well. Both events, one pointing to aberrant cooling, another pointing to an unusual thaw. Both just a couple hundred miles from each other.

    Don't take these data points by them selves. People who have no idea what they really mean are publishing trying to prove things without knowing that a warmer planet can also lead to cooler oceans.

  • Tyler D Meridian, ID
    Dec. 13, 2013 10:18 p.m.

    @Nate – “And where do you think I said that? Welcoming warmth and causing it are two different things.”

    You’re right… I stand corrected.

    I was confusing you with 97% of all climate scientists. And considering the margin of error (3%) is about the same as polled people who still believe Elvis is alive – and that based on some of your past (intelligent) comments I didn’t peg you for an Elvis-is-alive type guy – I hope you’ll understand and forgive my error.

  • high school fan Huntington, UT
    Dec. 13, 2013 10:46 p.m.

    I have only one proposal for each side, Show me the proof! As soon as either side truly can, then we can have a real debate. And don't use a con census of scientists, science and truth is not by concensus, they just are.

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Dec. 14, 2013 6:22 a.m.

    Hey folks, check out the weather (climate) forecast for the NE. More bitter cold weather (climate change) headed your way!

  • Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    Dec. 14, 2013 7:56 a.m.

    @Tyler D "I was confusing you with 97% of all climate scientists."

    Don't ever do that. That figure exists only in John Cook's imagination. His study has been debunked so many times, it's a surprise anyone still cites him without embarrassment.

    Dr. Richard Tol arguably did the best job of destroying this myth. A curious individual could start with him. For those who don't read much, a brief quote:

    "I think your sampling strategy is a load of nonsense."

  • mark Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 14, 2013 8:52 a.m.

    Yes, truth and reality are what they are, high school. But, see, the question is is how do you determine what truth, or reality, is? Gut feelings? Hunches? What some guy on talk radio tells you? A chain email you received? What you read here?

    You ask for someone to show you the proof. I'm curious. Do you think someone is going to deliver that proof to you personally? Come to your house and lay it all out for just you?

    I'd be surprised if that happens.

    No. It might take some effort on your part. Go research the science. It might take a while. You will have to put in effort. Go right to the original studies. Read the science behind the theories. Read the writings of people that actually work in the field. And read a wide range of these writings. And indeed, read from legitimate sources on both sides of the argument. And then read the counter arguments.

    Educate yourself. It might take awhile. Even more then one or two evenings. Some people dedicate their entire lives to it. But you can do it. Don't accept ignorance.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 14, 2013 10:29 a.m.

    @wrz
    'weather forecaster on public radio described the storm as 'historic.''

    Largest December snowfall since 1954 (up to 3ft).

    "Antarctic snow pack is growing. Record low recorded there. Try 135.8 degrees Fahrenheit below zero. Look it up"

    Actually, in locations where the temperature doesn't get above 0F during the year, a growing snowpack can be a sign of warming since warmer temperatures lead to more water vapor and more precipitation (since it doesn't get warm enough to melt it, sure there's sublimation but that only does so much). This is not the case in locations where temperatures do get above 0F since that runs into increased melting and some of that snow falling as rain instead.

    As for the -135.8F, that's a location that's barely been monitored, it might've been colder than that the past century, we just wouldn't know about it. Regardless, when making a point about global climate, one should be looking at the entire set of data rather than one point location.

  • Schnee Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 14, 2013 10:39 a.m.

    @high school fan
    I'd recommend the IPCC 5th Assessment Report: Summary for Policymakers or at least just look at the figures in it since even the "summary" is rather long.

  • the old switcharoo mesa, AZ
    Dec. 14, 2013 2:19 p.m.

    Incredible dishonesty from the author and from DN for posting such a ridiculous letter. Both should be ashamed.

    Every winter conservatives snark that it's cold so there is no problem with changing the atmosphere composition. What do you think it does to change the atmosphere by adding CO2? It's going to do SOMETHING.

    I may as well say, "where is George Bush? he promised we would never have to worry about terrorism again." Pffff!

  • the old switcharoo mesa, AZ
    Dec. 14, 2013 2:28 p.m.

    Please get a tatoo that says you don't believe in global warming. I just think your grandchildren should know who to slap.

  • Tyler D Meridian, ID
    Dec. 14, 2013 2:37 p.m.

    You mean Dr. Tol the economist?

    I suppose next you’ll ask us to review the latest findings from Dr. Such and Such the podiatrist, who likes to write papers (in between curing athletes foot) about monetary policy… forgive my skepticism.

    To be fair Dr. Tol may have something to say about the best (market friendly) policies to address climate change, but as an authority weighing in on whether or not AGW is a fact, I think we can dismiss that nonsense out of hand.

    No, I was talking about the survey that found in over 12,000 peer-reviewed papers by climate scientists only 3% (again, an Elvis-is-alive margin of error) explicitly rejected AGW. While it’s true that the Cook study was flawed in the sense that some among the other 97% still had questions (as all good science does), none of those 97% reject the hypothesis.

    When that trend begins to reverse in a significant way then I (and likely many others) will alter our views, but I’ll wait for the science (rather than a guy pontificating on demand elasticity) to inform me on this one.

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Dec. 14, 2013 5:47 p.m.

    Sure, there is man made global warming and if frogs had wings, they wouldn't keep bumping their bottoms when they hop. We have a consensus of scientists that agree about the frogs and all their computer models show it as well!

  • Semi-Strong Louisville, KY
    Dec. 14, 2013 8:19 p.m.

    Tyler D,

    Very nice.

  • high school fan Huntington, UT
    Dec. 14, 2013 9:44 p.m.

    Mark
    No I am not looking for someone to present me the reality but to present to all of us. You ask me to read, to study, to talk to knowledgeable people, I have done those things over the years and I have formed my opinion which is this, we do not have a clue what is going on as to whether it is good or it is bad or that any of it matters at all.
    Of course things change but we do not know if the change is what was meant to be. And so far I still have no proof just hypothesis. I also believe that we should be wise but we should also be careful that we don't overreact either way.
    As I said, as soon as either side can present proof on the national stage, we can then have the debate.

  • Tekakaromatagi Dammam, Saudi Arabia
    Dec. 15, 2013 7:20 a.m.

    "First, Al Gore said nothing of the kind. Mr. Haynes has distorted the man's message.
    Second, Global Warming models have never predicted a sustained and consistent raising of temperatures everywhere on earth. There is a difference between climate and weather."

    I agree that there is a difference between weather and climate and that the climate is changing.

    The letter writer has used the same bad logic that Al Gore used once when, in the middle of a summer heat wave, he said that we only need to feel the temperature to see that there is a problem.

    Both Al Gore and the letter-writer are making the same dumb error.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 8:25 a.m.

    What a shame...

    Not 1 single global warming denier remembers we JUST had the HOTTEST summer ever recorded!
    Right here, where they witnessed some it for themselves.

    Like Gold-fish - can only remember what they heard on their radios this morning.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 11:45 a.m.

    The earth goes through cycles. Many factors affect these cycles. The sun most of all. Then there's those pesky volcanos. I wonder how much C02 that he volcanos on the big island of Hawaii spew out? Not to mention the one in Mexico, the Philippines, and others. How about earthquakes and how they change the earth. Does something happen there? How about the natural winds? We haven't had an El Nino for a while. Could that have something to do with what is happening?

    Bottom line, man's puny efforts may be a small contributor, but with our limited knowledge and history, how can we be sure that we are the total cause of so called "Global Warming"?

    I remember well in 1976/77 Newsweek did a cover story which asked the question, "Are We headed for another Ice Age?" Back then, all the reasons outlined for the ice age coming are duplicated today with the global warming crowd.

    They rely too much on computer models, and computer models are only as good as the person who programs them. Also the science reflects the bias of those making the study. On both sides.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 11:46 a.m.

    Yea LDSLiberal, and our records here go back to what? 1847?

  • Sven Morgan, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 11:50 a.m.

    I have to admit, it’s hilarious watching the Algore devotes try to explain the cooling we’ve had for the past 15 or so years. The leaked IPCC report has said as much. Looks like the majority of their bogus models over estimated the “warming” we were supposed to be undergoing during this period. It’s also interesting that the cataclysmic hurricanes that were predicted due to AGW also didn’t seem to pan out.

    But wait, there’s more bad news for the Algore devotes: 1) this past summer had record cold temperatures recorded across the nation, 2) in July, Antarctica recorded a near record low temp of -135.3 degrees...burr!, and 3) the arctic ice cap has grown by 29%.

    Adding insult to injury to the AGW Alarmists is the fact that most people put the bogus idea of AGW at the bottom of their concern list. Strange the AGW Alarmists aren’t celebrating the good news that we aren’t warming…hmmm? Must be sad to have to deny reality.

  • Alter Nate Pleasant Grove, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 7:12 p.m.

    @Tyler D "You mean Dr. Tol the economist?....I think we can dismiss that nonsense out of hand."

    No, we can't, and here's why: you don't have to be a climatologist to know how to conduct an honest survey. Dr. Tol, economist, has all the skills necessary to expose the spectacular problems in Cook's survey, and he has done so.

    It got his attention when five of ten of his own papers were rated incorrectly. Of that number, four were classified as "endorse" when they should have been classified as '"neutral." And he's not the only person whose views were misrepresented.

    A few examples:

    "Certainly not correct and certainly misleading. The paper is strongly against AGW, and documents its absence in the sea level observational facts." (Nils Axel-Morner, Ph.D Quaternary Geology)

    "I am sure that this rating of no position on AGW by CO2 is nowhere accurate nor correct." (Willie Soon, astrophysicist and geoscientist)

    "Nothing could be further from either my intent or the contents of my paper." (Alan Carlin, Senior Operations Research Analyst, EPA, retired)

    Anyone who can read can understand that Cook's survey is bogus.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Dec. 16, 2013 11:58 a.m.

    Gore already made his millions selling his global warming fiction. Big Al is jetting across the world on his private jet ....I'm sure not burning jet fuel but sea weed most likely. Liberals are hypocrites ...what else is new?

  • Mexican Ute mexico, 00
    Dec. 16, 2013 1:32 p.m.

    What I see in all of this weather, is increased volatility in temperatures...

    It is pretty convenient for people to use one location or even one region to say that there is no global warming or climate change.

    Outside the USA there is an absolute consensus that there is climate change. You should look at the mountains here in Mexico. They used to be snowpacked year round almost to the Paso de Cortez. Now they are virtually nude.

    The winters have been getting colder, and the summers have been getting hotter. It used to be that there were no frosts here in central Mexico, whereas now we can get very severe frosts especially in the higher valleys surrounding Mexico City.

    It also used to be that 80 degrees was a scorcher in summer. We now regularly top that in the hot months sometimes even reaching 90 degrees. And that is in Mexico City, NOT on the coast where it gets even hotter.

    Global warming? Maybe. Climate change as a result of increased volatility in temperatures. More likely. The earth acting as it is to remove the sins from off of it. Maybe even more so.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 2:27 p.m.

    A corporate drama is being played out in Canada. It concerns the rail connection to Churchill on Hudsons Bay. Several years back one of the two major Canadian railroads (I don't remember which) sold off their branch to Churchill - then as they say in the rail trade, a streak of rust. But now with global warming Churchill will be a year-round port and the Canadian major is facing buying back the former "streak of rust" at a substantial return to the short line operator which purchased it. Global warming is real at Churchill.

  • Fender Bender Saint George, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 3:03 p.m.

    Attention climate change deniers: winter happens every year.

  • Open Minded Mormon Everett, 00
    Dec. 18, 2013 10:39 a.m.

    Why is every year about this time, when winter sets in,
    we get these same the Global Warming deniers running out telling us;
    "See? Global Warming is a Hoax, it's a Myth, all made by Al Gore to make himself rich!"

    THAT is the weather,
    BTW - Kevin Eubank, channel 5 KSL, life-long Utahan, Bountiful, Mormon, ...hardly what you can call a bleeding heart East-Coast liberal.

    Reported -- Yes, November 2013 (just like July)-- WARMEST November ever recorded, and the trend continues.

    You HAVE to look at the trends,
    the patterns,
    and not just the weather,
    and not just the last 10-15 years.