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Dick Harmon: New college basketball rules will benefit the game

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  • LEDSFW Las Vegas, NV
    Nov. 18, 2013 8:21 p.m.

    There really wasn't a rule change. The hand and forarm checking rules used to be in the enforcement interpretation section of the RB Appendix. They were always a part of the game, but they were not being used properly - much like touching the rim offensively is still a technical foul. The fact is, they did alter the rule book by making the old Appendix language a permanent part of the rule definition as opposed to the rule interpretation process. So technically the rule hasn't changed, but the emphasis on it being enforced properly, an action that makes the game somewhat less physical, is now emphasized.

  • oldcougfan North Ogden, UT
    Nov. 18, 2013 8:27 p.m.

    It is about time they started calling the game like a non contact sport. Now they need to quit calling fouls on the defensive player who just stands there with his hands in the air and the offensive player runs in to them.

  • Pops NORTH SALT LAKE, UT
    Nov. 18, 2013 9:05 p.m.

    From what I've seen so far this season, they're missing one call, which is when the post player gets the ball and backs into the defender. If the defender doesn't just let the guy with the ball push him out of the way, he gets a foul. They need to call it both ways.

    I would really like it if basketball again became a non-contact sport. I have my fingers crossed.

  • TheOfficalCall Provo, UT
    Nov. 18, 2013 10:34 p.m.

    Looking on the website StatSheet, one can look at the officials and what they do. Looking at the officials who have ref'd 8 to 10 games thus have a called a significant amount of fouls this year. Normally a good quality officiating crew will call between 34 to 36 fouls per game. This year it is up to 42 to 44 per game. That's almost 25% more fouls per game. Which means games are going to be that much longer. 8 fouls will be about 10 to 15 more minutes in a game.

    Look forward to longer games.

    Of the BYU games I have seen which is all 4, I don't think I have seen one charge call, All the block-charge call have gone to the Block foul.

    But then BYU isn't getting the best officials, the Stanford game did have Dave Hall. The WCC has some pretty "lame" officials in my opinion.

  • Aggie84 Idaho Falls, ID
    Nov. 18, 2013 11:42 p.m.

    They need to get rid of the skip hop and jump dribble penetration. What a bunch of garbage is that?

  • SLCWatch Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 18, 2013 11:42 p.m.

    I hope it extends into all games. Last time I played, which is years ago because I quit playing after the last time, I left the game with cracked ribs in a no contact gentlemans game of Church Basketball which we started with a prayer and ended in an ER.

  • Back Talk Federal Way, WA
    Nov. 19, 2013 12:17 a.m.

    As others have mentioned, the thing I hate and what this rule interpretation allows, is that an offensive player can come down the lane and basically jump into someone and they call the foul on the defensive guy.

    If no contact is what they want to see, then a foul should be assessed to the player who "initiates" the contact.

  • Max Charlotte, NC
    Nov. 19, 2013 4:48 a.m.

    When I was a kid, basketball was considered a "non-contact" sport. LOL! We have laughed about that over the years as basketball has become one of the roughest sports around. It is nice to see an attempt to take the game back to its roots. Players will adjust to the "new" game.

  • deseret pete robertson, Wy
    Nov. 19, 2013 6:55 a.m.

    The biggest thing it will help,( if its enforced equally around the country )will be to force players to learn how to play defense.Now if we could get rid of the 4 second rule.

  • Lone Star Cougar Plano, TX
    Nov. 19, 2013 7:31 a.m.

    I have not enjoyed pro basketball and some of the college game too as it has become rife with a thug mentality. I applaud the enforcement of the rules and I hope it brings basketball around to be more of a sport and less of a brawl.

  • AzTim Gilbert, AZ
    Nov. 19, 2013 7:32 a.m.

    Tyler Haws will be one of the biggest bennificiaries of this new emphasis of enforcing old rules. Last year the poor guy was mugged, hacked, pounded, grabbed, thrown to the floor, and darn near decapitated all with impunity. It was an orchestrated assault by coaches to prevent Haws from lighting up the score board like a Christmas tree with an array of moves and shots that are jaw dropping. In other words, 'take out the guy who dares to play nearly fllawless basketball.' But then, preventing basketball really isn't basketball at all, is it?

  • pby47 St George, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 7:49 a.m.

    I had become so disgusted with the violent and physical nature of basketball, I could hardly stand to watch it anymore. This change is long overdue. Now if they would eliminate at least half of the timeouts allowed each team, that would fix the other problem with college basketball. Let the players play. We also did not pay to watch 15 timeouts in the last two minutes of the game, we paid to watch basketball.

  • bradleyc Layton, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 8:18 a.m.

    Anything we can do to help BYU score more I am all for. :)

  • Serenity Now Highland, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 8:21 a.m.

    The enforcement of no-hands defense is a good thing for the game, but I agree with Dick Vitale that the number of fouls required before ejection should go up to 6 instead of 5. Let the fans see their stars play longer.

  • Hochmut West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 8:26 a.m.

    As an official for over 40 years, I applaud this change. It will be tough for a few months, but the basketball quality will rise and the game will be cleaner. Now to speed up the game we also need to reduce the number of time-outs, maybe change a few "full" to "30 sec" variety; also, prevent this hand-slapping every time a player shoots a foul shot with his other teammates--what purpose does that have; when you are on the line, shoot the foul shot. Next I'd like to see the jump ball come back instead of the alternating possession--if the official is compitant enough to throw it up to start the game, then why not on a held ball.

  • SLCWatch Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 8:47 a.m.

    @Serenity Now

    Let the stars keep their hands to themselves. Letting the "stars" get away with muggery is how we got to this point. How many fouls would we see if one foul meant immediate ejection from the game? Five is more than enough to prove a player can't contest a shot without getting slap happy. I've had enough of hackball.

  • Daved6 Sandy, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 8:58 a.m.

    Am I the only one who doesn't like this? I like the physical play. I like to play physical and I like to watch it. I like tough defense. I think the offense has gotten the benefit of calls for forever. This just turns it up a notch in the wrong direction. Tyler Haws didn't get mugged to any degree. He spent some time getting stronger, but that doesn't matter now.

  • fan in orem Orem, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 9:12 a.m.

    Yes, Daved6, you are the only one who doesn't like it. My basketball playing ended about 30 years too soon because of "physical play". Now that I am older, I have a hard time even walking because of my knees. Basketball was designed for players to use their talent, not their muscles.

  • AZ Ute Scottsdale, AZ
    Nov. 19, 2013 9:18 a.m.

    ....and Rick Majerus is rolling over in his grave.

  • yourstruly PAUL, ID
    Nov. 19, 2013 9:34 a.m.

    Coaches need to adjust by going to the hole more. Rose is doing a good job with 6 guards who can play attacking the rim in the early offense. Colinsworth is the big surprise as he looks at times like the best player on the floor to me. Probably going to see more zone defense as well with the new rule change.

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 9:38 a.m.

    Turning basketball back into a game of finess. What a concept. I don't pay to see the "stars", I pay to see the game. I don't care which player scores the most points.

    It's like Football. Putting emphasis on penalizing illegal helmet contact is starting to have a positive effect on the game and will eventually result in less injuries for players (except for those little league coaches re-living their "glory days" and teaching their players incorrectly).

    It will be nice to see Haws without all the bruises and contusions.

  • California Steve Hanford, CA
    Nov. 19, 2013 9:41 a.m.

    I agree with you Daved6. B O R I N G. Too much time at the line.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 10:17 a.m.

    Some teams, like utah for instance, are going to struggle with this. Last year utah couldn't do anything but play thug ball, I had it out with several utah "fans" on these boards about it. They did it because of a lack of talent in an attempt to slow the games down and keep them close. They had some success with it and probably were in some games their level of talent had no business being in, probably won a couple of games they shouldn't have because of it as well. Frankly this change is going to set them back even further as they are going to have to recruit more actual players and not so many hacking stiffs.

    Other teams, like BYU, are going to benefit from this because they have actual athletes on their rosters, guys that run and jump and shoot. It is an exciting brand of basketball to watch and once some of these other teams get with it and start recruiting to play it that way basketball as a whole will be a lot more fun to watch.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    Nov. 19, 2013 11:08 a.m.

    The rule that needs changing now is the timeout situation. Currently, each team gets five per half. That means, there is often a timeout called for every two minutes of play. If a game is close at the end, forget about it. I get so tired of waiting 25 minutes to watch the last minute and a half of a basketball game. Reduce the number to three and make all timeouts in the last two minutes of the 30 second variety.

  • Henry Drummond San Jose, CA
    Nov. 19, 2013 11:10 a.m.

    It will be nice to see Basketball become a non-contact sport again. There's no question things have gotten out of hand.

  • Tim Flaherty Gilbert, AZ
    Nov. 19, 2013 12:09 p.m.

    @ David6
    Really? You apparently didn't watch any BYU games last year. It was almost obscene what took place against Tyler Haws.

    @California Steve
    When teams discover that fouling out their stars early will cost them victories, then they will make the necessary adjustments and stop fouling, and then we won't have those "BORING" games with "too much time at the line."

    We will actually be watching basketball.

  • truebluecougar Orem, Utah
    Nov. 19, 2013 1:33 p.m.

    Advantage to BYU. With the skills of BYU's shooting guards, Carlino, Haws, Collingsworth, Bartley, Halford, it will be more difficult to guard them and they will get to the hoop more often or get fouled. This should be a huge advantage if the refs call the game consistently and according to the rules. Go Cougars!

  • caleb in new york Glen Cove, NY
    Nov. 19, 2013 1:43 p.m.

    free throws are the most boring part in the entire sport of basketball. I'd rather watch a guy dribble the ball up the court. They won't reduce the timeouts because the would mean less money from advertisers and TV companies. So of course they won't change that rule.

  • Blind Zebra Ogden, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 1:52 p.m.

    @ Hochmut

    I too am an official, hence the blind zebra name. So let me get this straight, you want to speed up the game by having less timeouts, i agree with that, but then you say lets bring the jump ball back? um, have you refereed girls games or lower level jv, soph games?

    Maybe not since you've refereed 40 years and i'm sure you are way ABOVE that level.

    Jump balls slow the game down, lets line all of the players up which takes 5 minutes, then lets toss the ball in the air 3 times because we can't do it right the first time, yep, that will definately speed up the game.

    How about we get rid of the 2 shot foul and just shoot 1 shot for 2 points, we shorten halftime to 5 minutes, this would help out on the berating of players by coaches for 10 straight minutes also. I got all sorts of ideas to shorten the game.

    Jump balls aint one of them.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 2:37 p.m.

    Teams will adjust. When the NHL had a crackdown on obstruction penalties spiked temporarily but then leveled off again once teams figured out what they can and can't do.

  • DRay Roy, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 4:40 p.m.

    AS long as the referees are consistent it will be a great rule. Use of force is not talent in Basketball, it's for other sports. Josh Sharp should really benefit, as he was also relegated to the bench, I think, because of his slight build and getting pushed around by the D.

  • yarrlydarb Ogden, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 6:02 p.m.

    Basketball strategy coming from coaches to players has for a long time been, "break the rules and take advantage."

    Sure, they didn't use those words but in effect that is exactly what they have been saying.

    The truth is, it's against the rules to use all these "defense strategies" to take charge of the game. But breaking the rules (which fouling, by definition, is) should be punished not rewarded.

    When human beings are rewarded by breaking rules in sports and in life itself, they are "taught" to be cheaters. And, by darn, there are a heckava lot of athletes in all sports who are indeed rewarded for breaking the rules. Thank both coaches and fans for that regrettable and undeniable outcome!

    Things need to be reversed or we will indeed create a situation in all sports competition comparable to professional wrestling ... which in truth is not even close to sports; it's no more than a form of inane entertainment.

  • Informed Voter South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 19, 2013 10:00 p.m.

    Long over due. I stopped watch "commando basketball" as I call it. Too much of a gang mentality. It is no fun watching college players physically attack opponents on the court and certainly not enjoyable watching the NBA play like the NFL.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 19, 2013 10:16 p.m.

    Duckhunter
    Highland, UT

    Some teams, like utah for instance, are going to struggle with this. Last year utah couldn't do anything but play thug ball, I had it out with several utah "fans" on these boards about it....

    Other teams, like BYU, are going to benefit from this because they have actual athletes on their rosters, guys that run and jump and shoot.

    ------------

    That's obvious, why waste your time stating the obvious.

    In fact, players like Loveridge, Wright, Chapman were players no one wanted. That's why Utah's 2014 class was ranked #4 in the PAC-12.

    I remember when the Jazz were labeled "dirty", that was when they were winning under Malone and Stockton. Ironically, they weren't dirty when they were losing.

  • rmk South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 20, 2013 6:29 a.m.

    It is now not even fun to watch anymore its all about the refs the only benefit is those schools with a deep bench. You have everyone in foul trouble within 5 to 10 minutes into the game. Its added another team to beat, the team you're playing and the refs.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Nov. 20, 2013 8:21 a.m.

    @uteology

    What does that have to do with utah's thuggish style of play last season? Are you really trying to pretend that isn't how they played?

    As for the rest, well we'll find out if utah can adjust and play actual basketball because it looks like they aren't going to have any choice.

  • Here's the Truth Park City, UT
    Nov. 20, 2013 10:14 a.m.

    Not to many against - but I am againt it overall. I like the change regarding hand checks - but they don't seem to be differentiating between guard play and post play. Case in point, look at Mika's fouls thus far. He's getting called for barely touching his man, if he has the ball. As thin as BYU is at the post, this is not good. Davies wouldn't make it through a half with these rules. Mika and Austin will constantly be in foul trouble this year as a result.
    Also, excited about Rose's new man defense? Watch BYU go more and more back to zone as a result of these changes. As a matter of fact, more and more college teams will now play zone.
    Last, no mention was made of the fact that they just made it more difficult for players to draw a charge. Basically, if a player hasn't been a statue for 10 seconds before contact, no offensive foul. Another one that will hurt the Cougs' front court depth.

  • BC CougFan Brigham City, UT
    Nov. 20, 2013 1:58 p.m.

    I like the new emphasis, however I think they need to find a happy median. Players yes need to learn how to play defense with their feet not there hands, but even the slightest of touch is a foul. I think a defender should be able to bump a little bit but nothing at all is a little extreme. We were at one extreme and now we are to the other extreme. Also I wouldn't mind seeing them changing the fouls from 5 to 6. Its gonna be tough for most to stay out of foul trouble with the new emphasis even when they learn how to play good defense.

  • StGtoSLC SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Nov. 21, 2013 6:59 p.m.

    Very interesting decision, DesNews moderators. Allow comments that call 18-23 year old student-athletes thugs because the commenter doesn't like the team they play on, but deny and remove comments that question the motives of such commenters and point out inconsistencies in the argument these accusations are based on. Real civil dialogue you're encouraging there.

  • moderateinmagna MAGNA, UT
    Nov. 24, 2013 5:53 a.m.

    StGtoSLC
    SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Nobody called anybody thugs he said they were playing thug ball,there,s a big difference,but Haws did get mugged a lot last year in a lot of games not just by Utah,but he is right that is thug ball and the NBA does it a lot and so do some college,s/universities and it needs to stop before someone gets seriously hurt or even killed.

  • VAggie Bristow, United States
    Nov. 27, 2013 4:15 p.m.

    I only wish the game was called more consistently. It is ridiculous anytime USU, BYU or any other decent school from a smaller western conference plays against a Big 12 type team, and they "let them play" by not calling things they should. Either have the rule and enforce it, or do not have the rule at all.