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Commentary: Utes will come short of a bowl game, and the program will regress

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  • EdGrady Idaho Falls, ID
    Nov. 3, 2013 10:26 p.m.

    Whittingham is about to be McBrided - but he'll love it at Weber, and it will be a better fit for him.

  • PACute_ Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 3, 2013 10:49 p.m.

    What's the point?

    Even if the Utes manage to qualify for a bowl, the best they can hope for will be a berth in the New Mexico Bowl against a team like Wyoming - that'll really get juices flowing for Utah fans.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 3, 2013 10:55 p.m.

    There are a long list of negatives about the Utes in this article. I actually feel quite sorry for them and most of their fans. It's a bit more difficult with Chris B and a few other hardcore anti-BYU Ute fans who laid it on so thick when BYU was struggling early season and still couldn't (can't) give any credit when they got things turned around.

    It's tempting to play that same tit-for-tat game now. It would be very easy to do under the current circumstances. But I've decided to take a higher road and wish the Utes well in being able to salvage whatever they can with the remainder of their season. Kyle is a good coach (who does seem to have BYU's number) and there are some good people on his team. Good luck with the rest of the season.

  • goutahutes Cedar Hills, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 12:35 a.m.

    This article seems to be written with the purpose of attacking the Utah program. It seems to be out of line calling for Kyle Whittingham's job. It is clearly written by a pro BYU fan/journalist with an agenda. Unprofessional journalism.

  • canadiancougar624 Provo, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 12:50 a.m.

    How much longer will Kyle have a job?

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:07 a.m.

    Maybe we can fire Kyle and pick up Gary Patterson from TCU?

    Oh wait, Patterson after going 77-13 in the MWC with:

    * Six 11 wins seasons (in 7 total seasons)
    * 4 MWC titles
    * 2 BCS bowls
    * 1 BCS bowl win
    * 6 ranked teams (3 in the top 10)

    is 10-12 in the Big 12.

  • Stay the Course Salt Lake City, utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 6:43 a.m.

    WOW blistering article
    Chris what do you Think about it?

  • Cletus from Coalville Coalville, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:04 a.m.

    We won byu and are in a bcs conference so that makes us awsome. It dont matter if we will be watching byu play a bowl game on tv because we won them anyways and Kyle gets our team up to win them every year.

  • Real Bass Idaho Falls, ID
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:15 a.m.

    Face it playing in the big leagues isn't easy. And Utah isn't ready for the big time. They will roll around the bottom of the PAC for decades. Look at asu and Arizona who both had better programs when they left the WAC. Maybe by 2035, eh Utah.

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:17 a.m.

    Oh wait, Patterson after going 77-13... is 10-12 in the Big 12."

    With a blow out loss to Texas, 30-7, a team BYU dominated 40-21.

    More evidence that BYU would be more competitive in the Big 12 or PAC 12 than the Utes have been.

    Let's face it, the TCU and Utah teams of the mid-2000's have tanked.

  • Swoop Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:25 a.m.

    Break out the whiny SOS excuses again.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:37 a.m.

    If Utah plays like they did against Arizona from here on out, no bowl game for sure. It will probably come down to the WSU game; but nothing is a given at this point. A win against ASU would be HUGE, but I'm not holding my breath. Either way, I"m hoping hope for the best.

    GO UTES!
    >---->

  • Steven S Jarvis Orem, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:38 a.m.

    Utah with three years of PAC12 recruiting is what it is. Utah is a very dangerous team on occasion, but unable to sustain winning week to week. I believe that Utah will compete with three of the four teams left on the schedule. They should beat Colorado. Should. What they do for the rest of this season will be determined this Saturday. Take down Arizona State (hopefully in a blizzard) and the Utes will make a bowl.

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:53 a.m.

    RBN

    Shooting the messenger?

    Best case scenario for Utah: beat ASU, stay within 3 touchdowns of Oregon, beat WSU and Colorado to finish 7-5 and play BYU in the Fight Hunger Bowl

    Worst case scenario for Utah: get blown out by ASU, get curb-stomped by Oregon, lose at WSU, tank season finale at home to Colorado to finish 4-8

    Likely scenario: lose to ASU, get stomped by Oregon, beat WSU and Colorado, to finish 6-6 and play Wyoming in the New Mexico Bowl

    btw, I haven't seen any recent bowl projections that include the Utes.

  • Kralon HUNTINGTON BEACH, CA
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:08 a.m.

    You can choose to be optimistic or depressed, I choose optimism. Go Utes!

  • Adirondack Cougar Loon Lake, NY
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:15 a.m.

    Looking at the remaining Utah schedule it's interesting because both Washington St and Colorado could need their games against Utah to become bowl eligible themselves. It will be a war of wills and quarterbacks.

  • CougarSunDevil Phoenix, AZ
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:19 a.m.

    "Where will the Utes’ mentality be after falling to ASU and getting crushed by the Ducks?"

    Finally some respect for the Devils. The utes would be a lot more tolerable if they'd act this way year round.

  • Hawk Littleton, CO
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:32 a.m.

    Interesting points made by Mr. Wilkinson. Weird how 6 weeks ago it seemed to be HILARIOUS to ute fans to see a QB with a passer rating in the 30's, yet now I don't hear ANY of them them laughing. Oh wait -- it was only funny when it was a BYU QB. Got it.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:58 a.m.

    Obviously, the Utes head to head domination of byu football hurts the DN writers as much as it hurts the byu "fans". Go Utes!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:03 a.m.

    Uteanymous
    Salt Lake City, Utah

    Oh wait, Patterson after going 77-13... is 10-12 in the Big 12."

    With a blow out loss to Texas, 30-7, a team BYU dominated 40-21.

    More evidence that BYU would be more competitive in the Big 12 or PAC 12 than the Utes have been.

    Let's face it, the TCU and Utah teams of the mid-2000's have tanked.

    -------------

    Mid 2000s? TCU was 11-2 in 2011 and 13-0 #2 in 2010.

    Here's some more evidence:

    * BYU vs. Big 5 teams: 2-2

    * BYU is 0-8 against both teams

    * TCU and Utah have better talent than BYU according to the NFL

    Yes I can see how BYU would be more competitive with lesser talent in tougher leagues.

  • The Solution Dayton, OH
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:14 a.m.

    It's too bad that Wilson got the laceration injury in his hand. That can really mess a QB up, both in the physical mechanics in what they do, and also mentally in being able to trust your offensive line and those that are supposed to protect you. It certainly does mess with your head. Travis is a good QB, as I witnessed when he beat my Cougs a few games ago.

    This article is exaggerating a bit because that's what sportwriters do to get readers interested. Utah has every chance in the world to become bowl eligible. ASU at home is a good thing. U might not win, but I expect it will be close. Oregon is a bad thing no matter where it happens this year. WSU and CU--U got to win these, and I think U will. Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl will choose Utah when it is their turn to pick, so there is a bowl game waiting for you in San Francisco. Oregon and Stanford go to BCS games this year, so this is a very likely scenario.

    Go COUGS!!

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:53 a.m.

    @ Uteology:

    Uteanymous was referring to the current BYU and Utah teams... not the ones from last decade or even several years ago. Same reference about who is currently playing in the NFL. Those guys are all from teams of the past.

    Truth of the matter is that this year BYU did manhandle the Texas team that is currently leading the Big 12 with a 5-0 conference record. They also handily beat Boise State this year... something Utah or USU have never been able to do... ever. And for icing on the cake, they are the only team to beat Houston this year (on the road, no less)... a team that is also leading their conference.

    Even though you are known as a hardcore Ute fan, it's okay to occasionally give some credit where credit is due... even if it happens to be to your rival. And right now, BYU does deserve some credit after their 5th win in a row.
    And if Utah wins this Saturday, I will be one of the first to give them credit for bouncing back.

  • 81Ute The Middle Of, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:17 a.m.

    Intersting, many more comments by the haters of Utes that are of a 'higher standard' than by Ute fans.

    @Uteanymous
    Seriously? BYU had the exact same advantages as TCU and Utah and failed miserably in the MWC. Only one time were they seriously considered for BCS invitation and an injury to a single player (Luke Staley) dashed all hopes. You can huff and puff all you want, you can get your 10 wins against mediocre competition, and you can 'what if' your life away. Nobody cares. BYU isn't in the drivers seat for anything regarding college football and nobody cares.

  • Who am I sir? Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:36 a.m.

    What a season! Not what I expected - Not what I had hoped for! Nevertheless what a great season.
    Consider: Utah's schedule ranked from 5th to 14th toughest. Winning the non conference games. Then conference. (A conference ranked 2nd best in the country). Our only win to date was against the then ranked number 5 team in the country. (Stanford currently ranked 6th.) An overtime loss to a team either ranked or receiving votes throughout the year (Oregon State). Lost to nationally ranked UCLA. Losses to USC and Arizona both ranked or receiving votes consistently throughout the year.
    Where do we stand now? All that remains is a game against the number 2 ranked team in the country, a game against another top 25 team, and finally two games against respectable PAC-12 opponents (and Utah might(!) be favored in one of them.)
    Do I love the PAC-12 membership? Yes! Not only yes but yes!
    I would not have been happy to know months in advance that we would go to a bowl and to which bowl. With the only surprises to date a win over Texas and losses to Virginia and Utah.
    Four games to go - can't wait!

  • BigUtahFan BOUNTIFUL, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:45 a.m.

    Okay...so a negative article written by some Aggie. Yay! Our offensive problems come from a beat up hand and a sprained index finger. TW has no touch on the ball because he's not healthy.

    It's pretty bush league to call out Utah's QB, Head Coach and AD in one article. As a "Die Hard Utah Utes" fan, I would much rather read a red goggled, homer written article than this. Please change how you do things DN

  • RSLfanalways West Valley, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:46 a.m.

    I am surprised I have not heard any comments saying that: Ute's beat all the other Utah teams so Ute's are still the best.

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Nov. 4, 2013 11:04 a.m.

    Here's some evidence that debunks your evidence:

    Versus PAC 12 teams
    Bronco: 9-8(53%)
    Kyle: 12-18(40%)

    Versus BCS teams
    Bronco: 15-15(50%)
    Kyle: 21-20(51%)

    Wins versus teams with winning records
    Bronco: 31
    Kyle: 28

    Losses versus teams with losing records
    Bronco: 5
    Kyle: 6

    Conference championships
    Bronco: 2
    Kyle: 1

    See how when you compare oranges to oranges, Bronco out performs Kyle?

    LOL at how you have to piggy-back off of TCU in order to feel good about yourself. TCU had a nice little run going for awhile, but, just like the Utes, the Horned Frogs have faded considerably in the last couple of years, and it isn't simply a matter of increased SOS. The Frogs only beat miserable Kansas by 10 points AT HOME and TCU was beaten AT HOME 23-37 by extremely mediocre Iowa St(6-7) in 2012.

  • Mt Rushmore Arlington, VA
    Nov. 4, 2013 11:27 a.m.

    81Ute

    "BYU had the exact same advantages as TCU and Utah and failed miserably in the MWC."

    Explain how THREE 11-win, Top 15 finishes in the last 8 seasons is "failing miserably".

    That's more 11-win seasons for BYU during the Bronco/Kyle era, than the Utes have had in their ENTIRE HISTORY.

    Explain how FOUR AP Top 25 finishes in a row (from 2006 to 2009) is "failing miserably".

    That's TWICE as many AP Top 25 finishes in succession for Bronco as the Utes have had in their ENTIRE HISTORY.

    Despite the obsession on the hill, BCS bowl participation isn't the sole measure of major college football success and even in terms of BCS bowls, the Utes only had one truly successful season, 2008.

    2004 was a farce. Seriously. "Busting the BCS" by only beating three teams with winning records (all 7-5) while playing the 67th toughest SOS? And then beating a "BCS bowl" opponent that was barely ranked in ONE poll.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Nov. 4, 2013 12:05 p.m.

    Worse case situation this Saturday:

    Wisconsin 24
    BYU 17

    Utah 17
    Arizona State 7

    Won't happen, but can you imagine the resurgence of ute fans?

    Everything will be marked down.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 4, 2013 12:16 p.m.

    @ Worf

    Actually the best case would be for both teams to win, of course. Don't bother marking it down; nobody cares.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 12:44 p.m.

    @ Spokane Ute:

    How can you say not to bother marking it down when the Ute's touted leader, Chris B, is constantly admonishing us all to "mark it down"?

    And how can you say that nobody cares? I guarantee you that after 5 wins a row, all BYU fans are now caring more than ever.
    But after what's been happening to Utah lately, I can totally understand the recent plethora of apathy creeping in... and just not caring anymore... at least on the hill.

    But hey, there's always next year (2014) and a whole new chance to try to qualify for a bowl game... like the most recent one Utah was able to qualify for back in 2011.

  • truthsandwich RANDOLPH, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:09 p.m.

    @Rockwell

    "See how when you compare oranges to oranges, Bronco out performs Kyle?"

    LOL at "teams with winning records"

    Winning records? Against whom?

    Bronco Vs. Kyle in the past 4 years: 0-4
    Kyle Vs. Bronco in the past 4 years: 4-0

    See how when you don't cherry-pick stats, Kyle out performs Bronco?

  • Samurai Jake Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:19 p.m.

    Beat writers get paid to produce objective material, not biased gibberish. Boorish attempt, Mr. Wilkinson.

    The focus should be on the Utes getting their confidence back. The same confidence that led to wins over Stanford, USU, and byu. Travis Wilson has played injured, but has also looked lost at times the past few games. Here's to hoping that the Utes can start and end a season with one gunslinger in 2014...!

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:23 p.m.

    @Who am I sir?

    "All that remains is a game against the number 2 ranked team in the country, a game against another top 25 team, and finally two games against respectable PAC-12 opponents (and Utah might(!) be favored in one of them.)"

    Keep drinking that PAC-12 kool-aid, but WSU is a below .500 team and Colorado has been one of the worst teams in Div. 1 football for years now. That must be the opponent that Utah might(!) be favored against (because it's at RES!).

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:23 p.m.

    @Tators

    Nice job of grouping all Utah fans as "Chris B". I also find it funny when BYU fans only reference to an extreme fan is Chris B. BYU has a ton of fans, with the same M.O. Heck look at this thread; and even in the mirror. BYU fans, trolling Utah articles, and busting on the Utes. It's become the norm, and the only defense is "what about Chris B?" The funny thing about the whole "mark it down" deal, is that's all I heard before Utah's Stanford and BYU games. After the game? Dead silence. Now that's curious. It must really be frustrating to lose to your bitter rival over, and over, and over, and over again. You make it somewhat challenging to pull for BYU, but then again, how serious can you take someone named Tators?

  • eastcoastcoug Danbury, CT
    Nov. 4, 2013 1:56 p.m.

    I've always thought BYU or Utah would have a much tougher time playing a decent stable of teams like in the PAC. So no stone-casting from this BYU fan. I respect Utah for having EARNED their way into a BCS conference by going to and winning 2 BCS bowls in the last decade. How many of those have we won??

  • MyPerspective Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:01 p.m.

    RSLfanalways

    "I am surprised I have not heard any comments saying that: Ute's beat all the other Utah teams so Ute's are still the best."

    Does the obvious need to be stated for you?

  • BeSmart Cheyenne, WY
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:11 p.m.

    One thing that is concerning to me is that Erickson's offenses in the Pac-10 or Pac-12 have always struggled in the second half of the season.
    I hope he can get things improved but usually at ASU his teams especially the offenses started strong then struggled halfway through the season.
    That said I think the Utes have a decent shot this weekend.
    They seem to perform a ton better at home than on the road.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:13 p.m.

    RepresentBlue,

    We'll keep drinking that "Pac-12 kool-aid" and enjoy it, knowing that it's to strong for byu and it's fans. Would a perennial loser to Utah be favored vs any team in the PAC 12?

  • 81Ute The Middle Of, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:15 p.m.

    @Mt Rushmore in Virginia
    1. Isn't there something in VA that you can nickname after?
    2. During the reign of the BCS system the measure of excellence is BCS participation, only those that couldn't get in argue otherwise.
    3. Whoa! Top 15 and still only played in the Vegas, NM, and Hungry bowls - I stand corrected, the cougs have all the credibility in the world.
    4. Lots of wins against poor competition is only of value to fans of teams that win lots of games against poor copmetition.
    5. AP rankings, see #3
    6. Nobody cares about your opinion regarding 2004, the truth is Utah was invited to the big money bowl and a perfect season.
    7. BYU football is irrelevent to everybody but BYU fans.

  • red.diehard The Middle Of, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:19 p.m.

    @RepresentBlue

    The PAC12 does offer tough competition it is difficult to be favored every game. However, Utah is usually favored and usually wins against the might cougs.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:25 p.m.

    @ekute

    Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better about being the doormat of the PAC-12 along with Colorado. Head to head record aside, BYU would do no worse in the PAC-12 than Utah has done, the only difference would be that you wouldn't see BYU fans putting PAC-12 logos on everything they see.

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    Nov. 4, 2013 2:41 p.m.

    truthsandwich

    Unfortunately for U, one game does not a season make.

    Bronco has finished ahead of Kyle in record and ranking in 5 of the 8 seasons during the Bronco/Kyle era; soon to be 6 of 9.

    Overall record and ranking trumps individual game success; always has and always will - see Alabama versus Texas A&M last year and Stanford versus Utah this year as just a couple of examples out of literally thousands.

    btw, 14 of the last 17 BYU-Utah games have been decided by a touchdown or less in the closing minutes or in overtime, including three of the last four - hardly proof of head-to-head domination by either team.

    If you want to see what true head-to-head domination really looks like, see BYU-Utah 1972 to 1991; Utah versus Washington, lifetime; or Utah versus Arizona State, lifetime.

    Don't even bother with Utah's pre-Cambrian era domination when Utah was nothing more than a mediocre team beating up on even more mediocre teams in conferences that don't even exist today.

  • Mt Rushmore Arlington, VA
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:05 p.m.

    81Ute

    "During the reign of the BCS system the measure of excellence" - sorry, but no defining measurement exists; there are numerous examples of BCS bowl participants who had absolutely no business even playing in an elite bowl - see Pittsburgh(2004) and Hawaii(2007).

    The true measure of excellence in every era since the polls began in 1936 is being ranked higher at the end of the season, with #1 being the highest measure of excellence.

    BYU did that in 1984, finishing #1 AP and #1 Coaches.
    Utah has never finished higher than #2 AP and #4 Coaches.

    Rankings are a measure of success versus schedule.

    How else do you explain teams with better records being ranked lower than teams with worse records?

    Call us when Utah finishes #1 in one of the polls and we'll discuss SOS.

    btw, Utah's SOS: 2004 - #67; 2008 - #56

    BYU's toughest SOS's: 2004 - #11; 2003 - #14; 2013 - #21
    Utah's toughest SOS's: 2013 - #4; 2012 - #41; 2011 - #49

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:17 p.m.

    @ Spokane Ute:

    Your extreme bias for Utah combined with their huge fall since the Stanford game seems to be making you quite cantankerous and ornery.
    Chris B was mentioned because he's the only Ute fan that seems to be even more extreme than you and writes in on more articles... both BYU and Utah than anyone... though you're a fairly close second.
    The "mark it down" comment was made in jest because it's so funny that chris B uses it to the extreme and ends up with egg on his face more often than not. It's not so "curious" when that's mentioned, unless you're seeing things with blinders on. Timing is everything when critiquing games. Chris is constantly setting himself up. Even most Ute fans roll their eyes at him.
    Don't take it so personally that BYU fans do still have an interest in what's currently happening while some ute fans apparently have nothing left to do but huff and puff and jab at other people's monikers. Lighten up a bit.
    For the record, like most other BYU fans, I seldom take your comments very seriously, either.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:38 p.m.

    @ ekute:

    To answer your question, yes, BYU would currently be favored to beat more PAC12 teams than Utah. And certainly more than Utah recently has. That's why BYU is currently so much higher ranked in the polls than Utah and at least half of all the other PAC12 teams.

    History also vindicates as much. Other than Utah (and unlike Utah), BYU has won most of their games against PAC12 teams in the past half dozen years or so...
    We handily beat Washington State in 2012, Oregon State in 2011, Washington in 2010, Oregon State again in 2009, both Washington and UCLA in 2008, both Arizona and UCLA in 2007 and both Oregon and Utah in 2006.

    So the answer to your question is a definite YES. BYU has been very competitive with PAC12 teams. And based on their percentage of wins, they definitely could not and would not be considered a cellar dweller contender, like some other local team has been doing. But don't take that too personally. The facts speak for themselves.

  • 81Ute The Middle Of, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:45 p.m.

    @Mt Rushmore in VA

    Please believe me when I say that I will never call you, ever. I do not troll BYU articles and only comment on them with respectfull opinions that in no way demean BYU. Your opinion of the status of the University of Utah and its athletics offer the value of a cup of cold spit. It is obvious that others think very highly of the academics and athletics on the hill hence, an invitation to a premier conference. The value of that championship 30 years ago is self evident (you were probably not even born), meaningless, today.
    Now shoo, and do your geography homework on South Dakota.

  • Who am I sir? Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:54 p.m.

    @RepresentBlue
    "WSU is a below .500 team." True. Now one step further. How many teams would be above .500 playing Auburn, Stanford, Oregon State, Oregon, Arizona State, USC. and California. (Before you say too much remember California and Texas are the Y's highest profile games next year and Cal is ranked below both Colorado and WSU this year.) Also consider WSU beat USC. Think what the Y will say if they are able to beat USC 10 years from now when they play each other.

    Your argument holds water if consideration is given only to a W or a L and given no weight to the quality of opponent. This is the position of many fans in Utah; however, the strength of schedule is becoming even more critical now that a "playoff" approach will determine the national championship team in the future.

  • red.diehard The Middle Of, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 3:55 p.m.

    @Tators
    Who cares? BYU is not in the PAC and it probably never will be.
    The facts speak for themselves.

  • WA_Alum&Dad Marysville, WA
    Nov. 4, 2013 4:39 p.m.

    First time I've posted on a purely Ute article (go back and check if you like).

    We should all agree to save the endless bickering until the season is over and the teams' bodies of work are in. Then for the month of January (or April for hoops), the haters can hate, and the losers can whine and make extravagant claims and comparisons using irrelevant stats from past seasons.

    Better yet, Ute fans stop posting on BYU articles, and Coug fans, leave the trolling to those who can't seem to live life any other way.

  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 4:54 p.m.

    Its like a 1970's Ute Dream and team mantra...........a win over BYU is a winning season in Utelogy's Book! Let's hope that those who were thinking about playing for the Utes...think again, this program is a loser!

  • Sparkley Briefs New York, NY
    Nov. 4, 2013 5:11 p.m.

    With the exception of the USC game, this has been a really fun season to watch. The Utes are going toe-to-toe against great competition and have been in every game but one right to the end. Sure I'd love to have seen a couple more wins, but I do see competitiveness and improvement. I think that we are on the right track and still believe the Utes get to six wins. With this schedule and a young QB, that would be a pretty good accomplishment. Sure we will never be able to reload like USC or Oregon can right now, but we will have years when we are good enough to compete for the conference title, and have games like this year's Stanford game regularly. With BYU getting great teams scheduled and USU moving up to a better conference and tougher competition, football in the state is going to just keep getting better.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 4, 2013 5:15 p.m.

    @Tators

    Fair Enough. As far as Bias for Utah goes, just a big fan. Thank goodness for the Seahawks this year. You will notice, unlike your self, I don't troll the BYU threads. Generally my comments on BYU articles are brief, supportive and constructive. If that's being "extreme", then so be it. I find that label odd coming from you though. You love to come on the Utah threads and stir the pot; much like Chris B. Hey, to each his own. I don't read Chris B's comments; what's the point? He really seems to upset Cougar nation though. I will lighten up, and you should follow suit. We will mix it up, hopefully in a more civil manner, in the future. Have a good evening!

    @Red.diehard

    Bingo!

  • Bleed Crimson Sandy, Utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 6:54 p.m.

    @ BigUtahFan

    "It's pretty bush league to call out Utah's QB, Head Coach and AD in one article. As a "Die Hard Utah Utes" fan, I would much rather read a red goggled, homer written article than this. Please change how you do things DN"

    I disagree! How many years now has Kyle Whittingham dealt with QB problems? Ever since the Sugar Bowl year (5 years ago) Utah has had QB problems. It's unfortunate a starting QB gets hurt, but the blame should be on Kyle because he hasn't been able to groom a second string QB to be sufficiently prepared to take over the offense when he's called upon. That's where Kyle has failed! It's because of his mismanagement of the QB position which has lead Utah down the road of mediocrity and now sitting on the brink of a second straight losing season. As a Utah fan, I'm getting tired of seeing these QB problems and watching it ruin a promising season. If Utah finishes the season with a losing record again, It's time to put Whitt on the hot seat.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 4, 2013 7:03 p.m.

    TRUTH
    Salt Lake City, UT

    Its like a 1970's Ute Dream and team mantra...........a win over BYU is a winning season in Utelogy's Book!

    --------------

    Why would our annual gimme game be a dream victory?

    This preseason I said if we are a horrible team then we will win our only 3 gimme games:

    1. Weber
    2. BYU
    3. Colorado

  • deductive reasoning Arlington, VA
    Nov. 4, 2013 8:28 p.m.

    Uteology

    "Gimme game" in Ute parlance - a 7-point win over BYU not decided until the final play of the game.

    "Close loss" in Ute parlance - an 11-point loss to Arizona in which the Utes only lead by a single point until Arizona's next score.

    The inconsistency of Utah fans and their spin is hilarious.

  • Don't Feed the Trolls Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:13 p.m.

    Do they not teach reading comprehension at the U? The article was by an Aggie, not a Cougar.

  • BleedCougarBlue Enid, OK
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:37 p.m.

    Article quote: "And remember that the Utes lost to a 2-10 Buffs team at Rice-Eccles Stadium in 2011, when a spot in the league title game was on the line."

    So can the Utes win when it's really on the line?

    Apparently not lately.

    Article quote: "Even if the Utes get to six wins, the Pac-12 will not be able to accommodate them for a bowl."

    Ooooh, that's gotta hurt.

    Better not show this article to Utah fans. They still think they're the best team in the state.

    (Personally, I'd LOVE to play Utah in OUR bowl game and crush them like a grape.)

  • Rational Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 9:44 p.m.

    @Bleed Crimson

    As a point of comparison for both Kyle and Bronco in managing the QB position, compare them to LaVell Edwards:

    Gifford Nielsen started his Soph year as a backup, won a championship
    Gifford Nielsen went down as a SR, Soph Marc Wilson threw 7 TD's his first start, won a championship
    Marc Wilson went down, Soph Jim McMahon became All-WAC, won a championship
    Ty Detmer came off the bench.

    Other years, there was sufficient depth to redshirt the heir apparent.

    Great coaches know what position on the team is the most important, and start their recruiting there.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:08 p.m.

    represent blue and taters,

    In the PAC 12, byu would lose at least one more game than Utah, to Utah.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Nov. 4, 2013 10:49 p.m.

    ekute

    "In the PAC 12, BYU would lose at least one more game than Utah, to Utah."

    Sorry to burst your delusional, crimson bubble, but Kyle's head-to-head wins prove NOTHING. Even with two losses to the PAC 12 Utes, Bronco still has a better winning percentage versus PAC 12 teams than Kyle.

    Bronco - 9-8(53%)
    Kyle - 12-18(40%)

    A much as you may hate to admit it, Bronco has been far more successful against PAC 12 teams than Kyle.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Nov. 4, 2013 11:31 p.m.

    Solomon Levi--

    Sorry to burst your delusional, crimson bubble, but Kyle's head-to-head wins prove NOTHING. Even with two losses to the PAC 12 Utes, Bronco still has a better winning percentage versus PAC 12 teams than Kyle.

    Bronco - 9-8(53%)
    Kyle - 12-18(40%)

    A much as you may hate to admit it, Bronco has been far more successful against PAC 12 teams than Kyle."

    Both had success against PAC-10 teams, yet once we joined the conference, we began playing them in a back-to-back, week-in, week-out grind w/more total games. This type of schedule is entirely foreign to byu.

    Even with the enormous disparity in schedules and the fact byu's played weaker teams in between games, byu has played six PAC-12 teams to date and the results are hardly something to be boasting about, sitting squarely at 2-4. The breakdown--

    byu's 2 wins came against teams finishing last in the conf stand -- Only 2 finishing w/winning rec smashed byu in provo ['13 U's rec still TBD] -- 0-3 against The U.

    Why not attempt respectability by first scheduling toughest games back-to-back, then consistently winning them?

  • Sparkley Briefs New York, NY
    Nov. 5, 2013 6:22 a.m.

    Bleed Blue,

    You DID play Utah already and got HAMMERED. Deductive Reasoning notes the final score being a 7 point differential, but at what point in the second half did you think that the Y was going to win? When were they leading or in position to win like the Utes were against AZ, UCLA, and OSU. Never. Utah was never threatened down the stretch and you know it. You had your chance to prove it on the field and were crushed at home. But hey, you can always claim victory on the comment boards.

  • ekute Layton, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 6:59 a.m.

    levi,

    Occasionally playing a random PAC 12 team over the course of 8 years is different than playing a complete schedule, week in and week out.

  • North Guy Corinne, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 7:36 a.m.

    Wow an article that actually paints a bleak outlook for the Utes. Here's hoping that BYU & Utah both finish strong and "both" have a bowl game. "But don't play each other".

  • jaxon Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 7:41 a.m.

    I wouldn't worry about Utah. Utah State and BYU should worry about how they lose all the time to the Utes.They both would change places with the Utes right now.The Utes will be fine just going through some growing pains with a great win over Stanford and normal wins over the Aggies and Cougars.

  • scott Alpine, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 8:37 a.m.

    azute1

    "Even with the enormous disparity in schedules..."

    spin city, what enormous disparity?

    BYU's schedule is ranked #21; Utah's schedule is ranked #4 - only a red-koolaid drinker would call that an enormous disparity.

    The truth is, just as in the WAC and MWC, BYU is just plain better overall.

    ELEVEN 11-win seasons to two (3 to 1 in the Bronco/Kyle era)
    SIXTEEN 10-win seasons to six (5 to 3 in the Bronco/Kyle era)
    TWENTY-THREE WAC/MWC conference championships to six (2 to 1 in the Bronco/Kyle era)
    SEVENTEEN AP Top 25 finishes to five (4 to 2 in the Bronco/Kyle era)

    All prove that BYU is simply better than Utah when it comes to performance over an entire season.

    Bronco is 2-0 versus Washington; BYU 4-4
    Kyle is 0-2 versus Washington; Utah 0-8

    Get over yourselves already. The Utes are just what most objective observers expected them to be when they joined the PAC - perennial conference bottom dwellers.

    Three seasons and you've only beaten one conference foe with a winning record.

    Pathetic.

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Nov. 5, 2013 9:39 a.m.

    Ute fan circa 2010 - Utah can compete with anybody
    Realistic fan circa 2010 - Utah isn't good enough to compete in the PAC

    Ute fan circa 2013 - Utah isn't good enough to handle the weekly grind of playing in the PAC
    Realistic fan circa 2013 - See realistic fan 2010

  • MountainMan25 Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 10:46 a.m.

    Hate to say it, but this article is spot on.

    We have had THREE years to become competitive in the PAC 12.

    Ute fans - stop mentioning the difficult schedule and the week-to-week grind. Those are excuses for going 8-4; 9-3; not 5-7 (likely TWO years in a row...)

    The fact is we are a mediocre/non-factor PAC 12 program. We are the Kansas of the BIG 12, the Illinois of the Big 10; the Kentucky of the SEC; the Wyoming of the MWC.

    And the article is right. We are getting worse! It is time for a change. We are better than 5-7 and maybe sniffing a bowl every few years. We should be going at least 8-4 every year, going to a decent bowl game, and occasionally making some national noise.

    We should be the best team in the state, hands down. We should dominate BYU every year, not brag about upsetting (it was an upset) a BYU team every national poll regards as a better team.

    Whit needs to go. He just can't hack it in the PAC 12. No more excuses.

    And don't get me started on basketball...

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 5, 2013 11:00 a.m.

    Mountainman

    Let's way until after this season before throwing in the towel on Utah's basketball program. Pretty early to give up on coach K, it's been two season for gosh sakes.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 12:39 p.m.

    @ Spokane Ute:

    You're wrong about me loving "to come to Utah threads and stir the pot". The only thing I do is try to reply to negative comments by some Ute fans that seem off-key and out of context about BYU. If you actually paid much attention to most of my comments, you'd know that's pretty much all I do... stick up for BYU when it seems unfairly dissed by ute fans spouting BYU miscarriages... and nothing more.

    Please read my comment on the first page of the comments to this article. That comment was about as civil as a comment could be, by actually wishing Utah well with the remainder of their season. It has double digit approvals. Any subsequent comments were simply replies to negative comments by Ute fans.

    I actually think you are one of the more objective and rational Ute fans. It's usually people like uteology, azute and of course Chris B that have tendencies to get overly biased and almost beg BYU to reply to them.

    You have a great rest of the day. And yes, I sincerely do hope Utah can salvage the rest of their season.

  • MountainMan25 Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 12:47 p.m.

    Not giving up on the basketball season just yet, but I don't have high expectations either. And for all of our dominance of BYU football, it has been just as one-sided in their favor in basketball. We are probably the third/fourth best basketball program in the state now...

  • slcjimmy SLC, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 1:10 p.m.

    @ Tators. @ Uteanymous. @ Swoop...I'll play the tit-for-tat game. Has your university found a conference? Do you know what college football team will more then likely play #1 schedule in the entire country after it's all said and done? Would you like a hint? You haven't beaten them in the last 4 meetings and counting! Where does "YBU" rate on strength of schedule? Go ahead and research that and get back to me. Also do you know how many wins UVA has? 2! "YBU" & Virginia Military Institute (Wasn't aware they even had a team) Consistently beat mediocre teams such as UVA and then possibly talk about playing in a power conference such as The PAC 12 or Big 12. Until then enjoy your "Independence"

  • steeleute Sandy, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 1:16 p.m.

    This was a stupid article and shows the author has no idea what he's talking about. If Utah goes 6-6 they will definitely go to a bowl game. There are actually several options for Utah. They could go to the Las Vegas Bowl, New Mexico Bowl, or the Heart of Dallas Bowl (which the Pac 12 analysts for ESPN have predicted). Also, I'm not impressed at all that BYU has more wins than Utah. All BYU does is beat lesser opponents and then pound their chest at the end of the year because they have the better record. All you have to do is look at the strength of schedules between the 2 schools.

  • Tomahawk Red North Salt Lake, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 1:48 p.m.

    Sorry to say it, but this article is spot on.

    Utah is in bad shape right now, and Whittingham is the reason.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 5, 2013 2:50 p.m.

    @Tators

    I stand corrected. Fair Enough Guy. I could list the same type of BYU fans, but what's the use? It doesn't take long to figure out rational fans, from angry bitter haters. Regardless of whether you are a BYU or Utah fan. Rock On Tators!

    @Mountainman

    Yep, this is a pivotal season for Hoops. I thought the basketball program made some nice strides last year. Anything short of Post Season, and really the NIT, would be dissapointing this year. I'm optimistic that Utah will be the 2nd best team in the state in Hoops this year; right behing BYU. Utah State didn't look so hot last year either. The PAC 12 is a tougher football, than basketball conference.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 5, 2013 3:28 p.m.

    MountainMan25
    Salt Lake City, UT

    Hate to say it, but this article is spot on.

    We have had THREE years to become competitive in the PAC 12.

    ------------

    And we have been competitive, in every game except USC it came down to the last minutes. Did you even watch the games?

    Utah is on the right track, it takes more than three years to build PAC-12 depth.

    Eric Weddle said after we accepted the PAC 12 invite that it would take about 4-5 years to start winning consistently. I agree with his analysis and so does ESPN.

  • SyracuseCoug Syracuse, ut
    Nov. 5, 2013 4:52 p.m.

    @81Ute

    "7. BYU football is irrelevent to everybody but BYU fans."

    You forgot one, every body but BYU fans AND ESPN:The Worldwide Leader In Sports.

  • CG Orem, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 5:06 p.m.

    So 4-5, 3-6, 1-4, 8-15 overall is "being competitive", according to our delusional friends on the hill?

    Of course if that was BYU's record in any conference, and BYU fans tried to claim that record show that BYU was "competitive", our friends on the hill would laugh us to scorn.

    Utah fans were boasting before the Utes had played a single game in the PAC, that the Utes could compete with ANYBODY and they'd being playing in the Rose Bowl within a very short time. They laughed at anybody who suggested that the Utes wouldn't be any better than Arizona, a perennial conference also ran and bottom dweller who hasn't played in a Rose Bowl in 30+ years in the conference.

  • nosaerfoecioveht NSL, UT
    Nov. 5, 2013 7:57 p.m.

    @Scott

    "The Utes are just what most objective observers expected them to be when they joined the PAC - perennial conference bottom dwellers.

    Pathetic."

    And the Cougars are just what they've been since Utah joined the PAC - perennial losers to Utah. It's why you're obsessed with this "bottom dweller" and feel compelled to read and comment on articles about our team.

    Pathetic.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 5, 2013 10:51 p.m.

    CG
    Orem, UT

    So 4-5, 3-6, 1-4, 8-15 overall is "being competitive", according to our delusional friends on the hill?

    ----------------------

    Is 1-11 vs Utah, TCU, and Boise last 5 years?
    Is 3-9 vs your rival in last 12 years?
    Is 15-14 vs Big 5 teams under Bronco?

    Yes you've beat tons of cupcakes. Congrats!

    But then who hasn't:

    * Utah finished 33-6 in the MWC and 8-1 since then (all 7 loses to AP ranked teams)

    * TCU was 77-13 in the MWC and 4-0 since then against mid-majors

  • Y>U Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 6, 2013 9:59 a.m.

    Uteology

    More deflecting?

    Bronco is 9-8 (53%) versus PAC 12 teams. Bronco is 2-0 versus Washington.
    Kyle is 12-18 (40%) versus PAC 12 teams. Kyle is 0-2 versus Washington.

    Please explain the relevance of BYU's record versus Boise St or TCU to Utah's "competitiveness", or lack thereof, in the PAC 12.

    If Bronco has only beaten up on cupcakes, while Kyle has been beating up on AP ranked teams, why does Bronco have TWICE as many AP Top 25 finishes (2006 to 2009) as Kyle (2008 and 2009)?

    Despite your spin, Bronco has finished ahead of Kyle in record AND ranking in 5 of the last 8 seasons, soon to be 6 of the last 9.

    Break out the whiny SOS excuses.

  • redthunder Ogden, UT
    Nov. 6, 2013 1:16 p.m.

    Not sure why I even read DNews anymore. I grow weary of reading the same old anti-Utah sentiment regardless of the author. Yeah, Utah is struggling, we all knew they would. The PAC is a conference that seems to get stronger every year. But so is Utah. Sure USC and AZ were WTF? games but the 2011 or 2012 squads would be 2-6 with blowouts to UCLA and OSU. They're not quite there yet but they're improving, that's for sure. Not that you would know by reading ANY of the local media. Sigh.

  • JonA Ogden, UT
    Nov. 6, 2013 1:16 p.m.

    I just don't understand why it always has to come back to who's better between Utah and BYU. Neither team is a national contender and both are playing for nothing more than somewhat of a joke bowl games.

    BYU fans go crazy over their Texas win and say nothing of losing to Virginia and Utah. Utah fans go crazy over beating Stanford and BYU and say nothing of losing to USC or Arizona. Both teams' fans just have blinders on. Both teams are flawed, but both can be dangerous on any given week. Truth be told they are almost the same team. They can dominate non-BCS opponents and can beat a ranked team every now and then. They both have great wins over the last few years and sad losses.

    Things aren't as bad for Utah as this article and BYU fans want you to believe, and things aren't as good as Utah fans would have you believe. BYU would struggle just as much as Utah with the same schedule only they'd have one more loss (against Utah).

  • Samurai Jake Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2013 4:14 p.m.

    @slcjimmy:

    Right on, my man! Your comments are refreshing, because they're backed by actual facts, not delusional happy valley wordplay.

    Yes, the Utes have been snake bitten with 15 turnovers in 4 PAC 12 games. That fact alone is putrid and horrific. However, turnovers aside, the Utes have had legitimate chances to win every game except for the SC no-show.

    The keys to Saturday's matchup:

    *Healthy TW hand
    *Confident TW mind
    *TW not turning the ball over
    *TW's receivers not dropping balls that should be caught
    *The defense flying around and matching the speed of the Sun Devils
    *The coaches, team leaders, and TW displaying some healthy intensity and emotional passion during game time - they need to get more fired up! This is football, not a mere job
    *Playing with a chip on their shoulder; not letting anybody waltz into RES take the game away! WE MUST PROTECT THIS HOUSE!

    Go Utes!

  • Surf is Up Miami, FL
    Nov. 6, 2013 9:01 p.m.

    Back in 2008 KW was touted as Urban Meyer II. He was the greatest coach ever. The fact that KW originated from BYU was ignored and or largely deflected.

    I predict that, if the Utah program declines, the only thing ute fans will be pointing at is that KW originated from BYU. I think that there is hope for the U, but KW will need to quit obsessing over defense (which is important but out of balance with offensive needs) and recruit quality quarterbacks to the first and second team.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 7, 2013 11:52 a.m.

    Y>U

    Anaheim, CA

    Uteology

    More deflecting?

    Bronco is 9-8 (53%) versus PAC 12 teams. Bronco is 2-0 versus Washington.
    Kyle is 12-18 (40%) versus PAC 12 teams. Kyle is 0-2 versus Washington.

    -------------

    Playing a similar schedule in the MWC (aka 1-3 BCS teams per year):

    Kyle: 11-5 (68.8%) against teams with a combined record of 107-82 (56.6%)
    Bronco: 8-9 (47.1%) ... (53.7%)

    Kyle vs. PAC-10: 4-3 (67.1%) against teams with a combined record of 49-29 (62.8%)
    Bronco vs. PAC-10: 7-4 (63.6) ... 65-73 (47.1%)

    I am sure Gary Patterson has similar numbers before joining the Big 12.

    You're the ONLY one on this planet that thinks BYU, the 3rd best team in the MWC, would be competitive in the PAC-12 or Big 12.

  • Russell Spencer Boise, ID
    Nov. 7, 2013 3:28 p.m.

    I'm a Cougar fan--loyal, strong, and true; bleed blue; etc., etc.--and I still think Utah can pull it off. The writer notes all the big games Utah has left on its schedule (visiting Arizona State and Oregon), but seems to discount the fact that Utah (from what I've seen) gets up for big games. Yeah the next couple of games will be tough, but they surprised a lot of folks with their win over Stanford and their physically dominant performance over the Cougars. They could surprise again. Here's wishing them good luck.

  • BigCougar Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 7, 2013 3:31 p.m.

    @PacUte
    "Even if the Utes manage to qualify for a bowl, the best they can hope for will be a berth in the New Mexico Bowl against a team like Wyoming"

    No, I think the writer made it clear that all of the Pac12 bowl commitments will be taken and that includes the New Mexico Bowl. There are worse bowls out there, however, that might not be filled that Utah could maybe get invited to.

    There's always the Famous Idaho Potato Bowl in Boise against a lower tier MAC team or lower tier MWC team if one of those conferences aren't able to fill all their bowls. The good news with that is you'd get a good matchup, you're likely not to get slaughtered, and it's close to home so whatever fans are left at that point of the season can carpool to the game.

  • BigCougar Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 7, 2013 3:39 p.m.

    @Uteology
    "Maybe we can fire Kyle and pick up Gary Patterson from TCU?"

    Didn't you know?! Dr Hill has already hired Kwhitt's replacement...he's now coaching your offense. Credit to Dr Hill for looking ahead at the downward trend Kwhitt's team was on and getting ready for the inevitable after a 2nd consecutive season with a losing record.

    Dr Hill's promoting of Dennis Erickson in December will sound like a good move and temporarily buy him some time and hold off the wolves that are howling for his job after he ran both the football and basketball programs into the ground, mishandled the swim team debacle, etc.

  • 79Ute Orange County, CA
    Nov. 7, 2013 10:00 p.m.

    Posting on my own behalf:

    I think we'll lose the next three. We lose to ASU because they have owned us since WAC days and are better this year than we are (the only chance we would have is if Dennis Erickson was still coaching them). We lose to Oregon, catching their wrath after they were embarrassed by Stanford. We lose to WSU because we won't be able to stop their offense. We beat CU after Dr. Hill announces the firing of KW and the players decide finally to show up to give him a good send off.

  • 79Ute Orange County, CA
    Nov. 7, 2013 10:31 p.m.

    Prior post was denied. Here's the gist:

    We beat Stanford, Stanford beat Oregon, so we'll beat Oregon...right!

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    Nov. 8, 2013 10:29 a.m.

    My Huskies have lost to Oregon 10 years in a row. They've lost 7 of last 10 to Stanford. Utah fans were excited and optimistic about PAC-12 success, in spite of my dire warnings. The reality is that just as the Big12 is dominated by Texas and OU, the SEC by Alabama and LSU, PAC12 is dominated by Stanford and Oregon, with UCLA and USC upcoming, Utah will seldom if ever be a dominant team in the PAC-12. Is anybody afraid of WSU, Colorado, Iowa, Iowa State, Kansas, etc. ? No. Big conference membership guarantees nothing but a chance to go to a big bowl. It does not guarantee a good team.

    Utah went to a BCS bowl twice in recent years. Probably won't happen again anytime soon. ND and Penn State as independents went to "championship bowls". Penn State, since joining the Big 10 has not seen a major bowl. ND is a special case.

    BYU has a better chance to be in a big bowl than most conference members.

    That being said, Utah like the rest of the PAC12 will be happy with winning seasons and decent bowl games. That's reality, and it's fine.

  • Scores Idaho Falls, ID
    Nov. 8, 2013 4:31 p.m.

    Poor Utes.

  • Truth Machine Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 8, 2013 4:56 p.m.

    Uteology

    "Playing a similar schedule in the MWC (aka 1-3 BCS teams per year):"

    Bronco finished in the AP Top 25 FOUR straight years (2006-2009)
    Kyle finished in the AP Top 25 TWICE (2008 and 2009)

    -------------

    Playing FIVE AP Top 25 teams in 2012, BYU finished 8-5 with a bowl win
    Playing TWO AP Top 25 teams in 2012, Utah finished 5-7 with no bowl

    -------------

    Versus BCS teams this year

    BYU 3-2
    Utah 1-4

    -------------

    Spin away, but good luck trying to convince potential recruits that's better to beat BYU, but finish with a losing record and no bowl, than to lose to Utah, but finish just out of the Top 25 with a bowl win.

    I suspect that most recruits would rather spend bowl week playing in San Diego or San Francisco, than spend it watching from the comfort of their couch.