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BYU football: Sophomore QB Taysom Hill ready to take the reins of Cougar offense

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  • Reno Cougs Fan 68 Reno, NV
    June 28, 2013 1:17 p.m.

    No comment from Chris B or the rest of the BYU haters!!! I think I might die from shock!!! LOL
    I am really looking forward to see how this team performs this year!!! A better O-line and a Great QB!!! Glad they got the deal with Bronko done!!! The team needs to stay healthy, play hard and win!!!

    Go Cougs!!!
    Go Utes!!!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    June 28, 2013 1:46 p.m.

    This guy is a stud, and if he can stay healthy it could be a great year for him and BYU offensively. The way he plays reminds me so much of Tim Tebow, and as a Georgia fan it pains me to say that. I think he is faster than Tebow, but his mechanics are similar which means Anae and Beck will need to help him with his low release point and quicken his release, instead of the half wind up he does. I'm excited to watch what he can do in this "go fast, go hard" offense.

  • spudlydoright McCammon, Idaho
    June 28, 2013 1:52 p.m.

    I watched Taysom play almost every game in high school. I know you can't always equate that with college ball, but he is such a tremendous talent that if he stays healthy he should be one of the greats at the Y; he is that good.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:04 p.m.

    He must be so pumped to continue to recent byu tradition of winning .200 of games against top 25 teams, .200 record against rival Utah last 5 years.

    1 good win, 4-5 losses against good teams.

    2-3 games that only Mormon byu fans care about

    That pretty much sums up byu's season, year after year.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:07 p.m.

    I wonder what he thinks when he sees his former Stanford teammates going to prestigious BCS games, beating teams like Oregon, beating their rival Cal, top 5 rankings...

    and now

    his teams BCS hopes end after game 2-3, goes 1-5 every year against only decent teams they play, are at risk of having graduating class go 0-4 against rival, and not be ranked.

    He wont say it, but he regrets that decision.

    Big time

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:15 p.m.

    Based off of past experience, I can almost guarantee the trolls will be soon be showing up. In fact, it's inevitable with a BYU article.

    I don't remember ever looking forward to a BYU - Utah rivalry game as much as I am the one on September 21st. All the chips are in place to swing the last few years around and send the trolls scrambling for something else to tout about. But until then, the past never seems to get old with them... even if it does with the rest of us. However, the future counts much more than the past. And BYU is set up for an extra good one.
    It's going to be a challenging year, with the extra tough schedule, but I truly believe BYU will win their share and qualify for a bowl game. The magic is in the air.

  • Missouri loves BYU Lebanon, MO
    June 28, 2013 2:15 p.m.

    Trolls are distracted by the NBA Draft/Brandon Davies Article.....Someone could write an article about the manure at BYU's dairy farm and would jump into that as well.

    I am very optomistic that this will be a good year for football. Coach Mendenhall has proven he knows how to put a good defense on the field week after week. I expect a much more cohesive offensive unit this year with Anae. The fact that Alabama and LSU are raising a stink about no huddle offenses suggests that there is validity to BYU being able to running that type of an offense successfully against other division 1 programs.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:20 p.m.

    Hill will be lining up behind 2-3 o-linemen who have never taken a snap at the d-1evel.

    They will prepared to run a new offense with an o- line coach who has never coached at the D-1 level.

    Hill will hand off to RBs who are coached by a lawyer who has never coached.

    On top of that Hill is still inexperienced and recovering from injury... he hasn't faced live action since the injury and no one knows how he will respond to live DEs attempting to sack him.

    There are a lot of things that can go wrong under these circumstances...

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:20 p.m.

    Wow. Now Chris B did show up and has even expanded to not even talking for the U players, but also now for BYU players. Unbelievable. Are there truly no ends to ways you find to try touting??
    Here's a novel idea. How about letting the players speak for themselves. We'll get much better idea of how they really feel... even if it isn't in line with how you wish they would.

    After last season, I wonder how many U players are regretting their choice of school. Some of them may never know what it feels like to play in a bowl game. Rather sad.

  • rph Arlington, VA
    June 28, 2013 2:23 p.m.

    But of course, Chris B says nothing about the state of the Utah football program and its PAC 12 glory.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    June 28, 2013 2:25 p.m.

    Does anyone have a fly swatter? Lol

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:25 p.m.

    One other question, Chris B:

    If it's only Mormon BYU fans that care about those games, then why is it you write about them multiple times a week? Obviously, you care very much.

    You won't say it, but you regret that decision of not becoming a big-time BYU Booster.

    Big time.

  • STuFOO Korea, AE
    June 28, 2013 2:40 p.m.

    Chris B

    Now your clairvoyant? Nice try

    I wonder hat all the other teams in the Pack 11 think about when they see utah pulling down their conference, listening to utah fans pound their chests and and talk about their greatness...

    Oh wait, I already know. They think it's pathetic.

    They won't say it, but they regret that decision.

    Big time.

  • Aggie84 Idaho Falls, ID
    June 28, 2013 2:48 p.m.

    It was a shame that the coaches left him in the game or least didn't have him take a knee last year. As much as I want the Aggies to thump the Y I hate to see needless injuries. Looking forward to a great game between the Y and the Aggies on our turf this year. If Ty can watch a truly great qb run an offense he might learn a few things this year. Go Chuckie, Go Aggies.

  • steeleute Sandy, UT
    June 28, 2013 2:49 p.m.

    Ute fan here, and I just want to have a civil discussion about football. I'm curious to know what expectations are for BYU fans heading into this year as the schedule is much more difficult than in years past. Are you happy to have Anae back? Will you be comfortable with Hill running the ball like he did last year even though it led to an injury? Personally I think it's great that BYU and Utah are both going into very tough schedules this year. Plenty of opportunities for the state of Utah to represent and make a statement against some elite teams this year.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    June 28, 2013 2:49 p.m.

    And now Chris B is even speaking for Taysom Hill! LOL

  • Virginians for BYU Lebanon, MO
    June 28, 2013 2:57 p.m.

    Taysom Hill already knows he made a great decision by picking BYU. He gets to play on national Television every week, He gets to play against quality teams from across the country. He has skilled coaches that support him. He is getting a quality eduction. He is surrouned by great students and is cheered by quality fans. As the quarterback he plays a major role in determining the wins and loses. If BYU wins all their games they get to play for all the marbles. If they don't, he isn't going to wish he was playing somewhere else. Chances are, he dosn't pay much attention to what everyone else is doing because when it comes to his life, the choices other people have made about where to play football don't matter very much.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 28, 2013 3:00 p.m.

    8, that's the number of years that Utah has had a better win loss record than BYU over the last 41 years (that's right, only 8 seasons out of the last 41 seasons has the BCS Utes had a better record than BYU and they played in the same conference for 3 of those years... I suspect that Taysom will make it 42 seasons with the same number #8 for the Utes...

    9 of 15 is the record that BYU has over the past 6 years against members of the PAC12 (a 60% win ratio)... Iam certain that Taysom will make that 10 of 16 over 7 years this season.

    5 of 17 is the record tha Utah has against members of the PAC12 just over the past 2 years (a 29% win ratio)... Their 6 year record agaist these opponents is slightly better, it jumps up to 8 of 23 games (a 35% win ratio)... That's right folks, BYU has more total wins against PAC10 memers than Utah who has played in that conference for 2 years and has played the oponents 8 more times...

    I predict it will only get worse for the little brothers on the hill.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 28, 2013 3:13 p.m.

    The odds makers in Vegas know what Hill, Hoffman, Appo, Kaufusi, Hadley, Sorenson, and Van Noy bring to the Cougs and that is why they are not only picked to beat Utah this year at an 8 to 5 ratio but also picked to win 8 or more games on a BCS quality schedule... Once they see Taysom play, and see the numbers he and his teammates put up I fully suspect that 8 to 5 ratio to jump to 3 to 1...

    These same odds makers predict a 3-9 finish for the Utes... I personally don't think that they will do that well... In fact, I am betting the under on them. I think that it will be a 1-11 year for them and they will continue to be at or near the botom of the conference... The DN will help them out however, and describe how they wll "snag tenth or eleventh place"... Unfortunately, I'm thinking dead last is more probable...

    The U just doesn't have the talent of Taysom Hill... Sad but true.

  • Hondo Scottsdale, AZ
    June 28, 2013 3:15 p.m.

    "The magic is in the air."

    I think I've read this once or twice before.

    I can't quite remember when or where. Oh yes, I have read this quote or a variation thereof every year for as long as I can remember from fans in the bubble. My favorite was the lead up to Heap's sophomore season when the band o' lil' bros was thinking Hypes was a Heisman candidate and a perfect season was in the works. Then Hypes started playing........

    As for Hill, he seemed like he was a decent enough talent until the Cougar coaching staff put him in harm's way with the nonsensical coaching in the USU game.

  • Billy Budd Saint George, UT
    June 28, 2013 3:15 p.m.

    Taysom was amazing to watch as a running QB.
    He had Riley's grit but more speed.
    Combine that speed with an improved passing game could be difficult for teams to defend.
    Looking forward to see what BYU does against a much improved schedule.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    June 28, 2013 3:17 p.m.

    rph,

    The state of Utah football program is this:

    5 years removed from an undefeated season, last time to beat Alabama in a bowl game, a BCS win, top 2 final ranking.

    EARNED invite to the Prestigious Pac 12 Conference of Champions. There are dozens of school NOT in power conferences. Out of all the choices(including BYU), the Pac 12 WANTED Utah(due largely to our BCS success and proven track record)

    We have won 4 out of last 5 against our former rival.

    We have won the recruiting battle the last 3 years between Utah, USU, and BYU. This "win" can be in terms of average star rating OR number of guys with offers from all 3 and who picked Utah.
    Either metric, we win.

    We have had a tough time in the Pac 12, as we knew we would.

    But the money, prestige, and rose bowl within our grasp every year is WELL WORTH IT!

  • Todd Christiansen's Thesaurus Ogden, UT
    June 28, 2013 3:23 p.m.

    Good luck to Taysom and the cougars this year. Hoping for big things. Also I have it on good authority that Mr. B is taking the discussions and with that, he's seen the light and will soon renounce his devotion to the "prestigious" PAC10.2 and become a BYU Cougar booster.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 28, 2013 3:37 p.m.

    8, that's the number of years that Utah has had a better win loss record than BYU over the last 41 years (that's right, only 8 seasons out of the last 41 seasons has the BCS Utes had a better record than BYU)and they played in the same conference for 39 of those years... I suspect that Taysom will make it 42 seasons with the same number #8 for the Utes...

    9 of 15 is the record that BYU has over the past 6 years against members of the PAC12 (a 60% win ratio)... I'm certain that Taysom will make that 10 of 16 over 7 years this season.

    5 of 17 is the record that Utah has against members of the PAC12 just over the past 2 years (a 29% win ratio)... Their 6 year record against these opponents is slightly better, it jumps up to 8 of 23 games (a 35% win ratio)... That's right folks, BYU has more total wins against PAC10 members than Utah who has played in that conference for 2 years and has played the opponents 8 more times...

    I predict it will only get worse for the little brothers on the hill.

  • WACPaddingOurSchedule pocatello, ID
    June 28, 2013 3:43 p.m.

    Next great quarterback?
    Some prediction, rather it's lowering standards at LES. Got to keep the Coug fans excited!

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    June 28, 2013 4:08 p.m.

    steeleute,
    I believe the expectations of Cougar fans are along the line of at least 8 or 9 wins this year. Hill's injury last year was the result of a coaching mental lapse. I don't think that will happen again if Anae learned anything since he was at BYU last time. I can't speak for others but I believe Anae will be a big improvement for BYU's offense for one reason: It's my opinion that he will have more control over the offense and who plays than Bronco had last year. Doman had to constantly look over his shoulder because of the man crush Bronco had on Riley Nelson. Anae won't care about such issues. He will be in charge of the offense as much as Doman wanted to be.

    Todd,
    I hope Ms. B is not taking any kind of "discussions" because Cougar Nation does not want her, no matter how repentant she becomes.

  • Striker Omaha, NE
    June 28, 2013 4:53 p.m.

    "I predict it will only get worse for the little brothers on the hill."

    It already is. Pre-ranked just above Colorado, no QB to trust, a much improved PAC (although it seems half are under sanctions of the NCAA), etc.

    BYU has a NFL-producing WR coach, top WR, top defense, and top 25 offensive coordinator returning. BYU is on top of the hill right now.

  • theDailyObserver Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 28, 2013 5:02 p.m.

    Like Mike Tyson once said: "everyone has plans until they get hit."

    Taysom....meet Trevor.

    Gonna be a long season for a slow byu squad.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    June 28, 2013 5:04 p.m.

    Chris B
    Salt Lake City, UT

    Thanks for the template:

    "(T)He(y)must be so pumped to continue t(he) recent Utah tradition of " having a losing season and sitting home for the holidays.

    0 good win, 4-5 losses against good teams.

    1 game that Utah fans only care about

    That pretty much sums up Utah's season, last year, this year.

  • Silver Maned Cougar American Fork, UT
    June 28, 2013 5:08 p.m.

    We do indeed have a young offensive line, loaded with freshmen and sophomores. On the other hand, we will have senior Houston Reynolds back. If we hadn't lost him early last season I think it would have been a difference maker in several games. And who wouldn't be excited about Brayden Kearsley? I'm especially excited to see the development of Ryker Matthews from my home town of American Fork. He started all year last year as freshman, and was ranked as the 11th best offensive lineman candidate last year nationally. All of these guys were recruited by programs like Notre Dame, Arizona, UCLA, Oregon, even Utah. And the abundance of young talent might mean the OL can play even harder without wearing down. I like the new guys, and I like Anae's motto, of playing faster and harder. Go Cougars!

  • CO Ute PARKER, CO
    June 28, 2013 5:29 p.m.

    I think Hill has the potential to be a good QB is he develops this year and can keep from being injured. Many of the Y posters make some good comments and no argument from me but a few need to get a grip.

    Hill is not, at this point, a GREAT QB. His only win against a reasonably good team was last year over the Aggies in a game where the offense scored 6 points. The Y defense won that game.

    BYU has improved their schedule but it is far from a 'BCS caliber' schedule. Yes, about 1/2 the teams are good competition but you still have MTSU, Houston, Idaho State, Nevada, and USU. While Nevada and USU have had an occasional good year; they are not BCS caliber at this point. Nearly half the schedule is not 'BCS caliber'.

    You want to compare records against PAC 12 teams, use a reasonable parameter. Arbitrarily comparing the Y's record since 2005 to the U's record in the past 2 years is ridiculous.

  • LonestarRunner Salt Lake City, UT
    June 28, 2013 5:50 p.m.

    Chris B

    "He must be so pumped to continue to recent BYU tradition of winning .200 of games against top 25 teams, .200 record against rival Utah last 5 years."

    He's obviously extremely pumped to be the starting QB of BYU's perennial Top 25, Quarterback Factory, a program that's finished in the Top 25 five of the last seven seasons.

    Unlike that wannabe program on the hill that only has five AP Top 25 finishes, in their entire history.

    btw, did you bother figuring out Utah's winning percentage versus Top 25 teams last season?

    It's considerably lower that 20%. In fact, the ONLY Top 25 team that the Utes have beaten since 2008, is ur/#25 BYU.

    Meanwhile, BYU has wins over #18/#18 Utah and #16/#17 Utah State.

    Utah's lifetime winning percentage versus Top 25 teams - 16%; 1-8(11%) since 2008.

  • LifeLibertyHappiness Draper, UT
    June 28, 2013 5:54 p.m.

    @steelute,

    Awesome to have a genuine question instead of the constant barrage of criticism that flies both ways. I'm not sure about having Coach Anae back yet. He seems to have learned quite a bit from Rich Rodriguez and that he may add multiple formations and be less predictable. But, we'll have to wait and see. Taysom Hill running the ball is fine as long as he is smart about it. He's bigger, much faster and has a better arm than Nelson. Steve Young did both well and Taysom seems to be cut from that athletic mold. Again, we'll see. Every team is good in August.

    I think an 8 win season is a reasonable expectation.

    Would love to see the offense more flexible, more formations, more reads & audibles like the good teams of the past. Having coached myself for years, it's easier to keep defenses off balance with multiple formation looks and audibles.

    I'm sure I'm not the typical BYU fan, but have a lot of respect for Coach Whit. I know him personally and he's a good man and a good coach. What is your honest take on the Utes?

  • DPTCougar Eagle Mountain, UT
    June 28, 2013 5:56 p.m.

    I'm a die-hard BYU fan, but I'm sick of talking about potential year after year for the past 3 years. The offense has screwed the pooch the past 2 years with only having 2 plays, the QB Draw/Sweep, and the shovel pass. Will this year be different? Absolutely. Anae brings back grit. If anyone watched his son Famika Anae play last year for a couple of games you would see that he was plain nasty. He learned that from his father. Anae was largely criticized before he left before because he had a nasty attitude. Well, he's back and you could see that attitude as he ripped apart fans and media (sorry Jason Franchuk). That's what he brings to Provo this year, and I look forward to a gritty attitude from the offense. The O-line recruits they have coming in, especially some JUCO recruits, will bring nasty back (oh yeah, I just went there). BYU beats Utah this year, loses too good teams ND, Texas, and Wisconsin, beats the rest.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    June 28, 2013 6:07 p.m.

    steeleute
    Sandy, UT

    Ute fan here, and I just want to have a civil discussion about football. I'm curious to know

    1. what expectations are for BYU fans heading into this year as the schedule is much more difficult than in years past?

    A. Even with a tougher schedule, our (my) expectation is to do better than we did last year. So many games, one more touchdown would have won it. We have better expectations for line play, running game, qb production and offensive scheme. Any ONE of those could have got us one more touchdown.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    June 28, 2013 6:12 p.m.

    steeleute
    Sandy, UT

    a civil discussion continued.

    2. Are you happy to have Anae back?

    A. It seems obvious that, although somewhat predictable, we didn't know how good we had it the first time. Fortunately, the "awkward" way that Bronco handled the situation left the door open. I think most of us prepared to "wait and see.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    June 28, 2013 6:17 p.m.

    steeleute
    Sandy, UT

    a civil discussion continued.

    3. Will you be comfortable with Hill running the ball like he did last year even though it led to an injury?

    A. We (I) would prefer BYU to NEVER run the ball with the quarterback the way we did last year, ever again. But if Hill plays more like Steve Young, I think most of us would be pleased.

    Thanks for the reasonable exchange of questions and answers. You are welcome by our fire any time.

  • Striker Omaha, NE
    June 28, 2013 6:17 p.m.

    DPT,
    BYU bad a bad offensive coordinator who was clueless. To have an experience OC, with a great defense, this team will be quite good this year.

  • hobbes1012003 Kaysville, UT
    June 28, 2013 6:24 p.m.

    Everyone is still going after BYU for its schedule since they apparently still have some patsies on their schedule. I have news for you folks, even the mighty Alabama puts patsies on its schedule every year, and you wanna know why? because no team in the country wants to face a top 25 team every week in and out. that is the fastest way to get yourself out of the top 25. BYU is facing 7-8 preseason top 25 teams. that is an excellent percentage, and they fill the rest of the schedule with easier games to lighten the load. Every top program does this on purpose!
    Even the Utes. Alabama plays a D-2 team almost every year! so enough with the scedule bashing. it is an amazing schedule and I cannot wait to watch this season!

    Go Cougs!

  • LindonMan Lindon, UT
    June 28, 2013 6:31 p.m.

    People, stop saying Go Cougars and Go Utes in the same post! Choose a side and stick to it. If you cheer for both sides, you really shouldn't be a sports fan.

  • Old Navy Provo, UT
    June 28, 2013 6:42 p.m.

    I was at the USU game. That was the most epic coaching failure in the history of BYU football by an OC.

    We can all take comfort that Doman isn't there anymore to call another needless QB keeper.

    The Cougars will have a fine season.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 28, 2013 6:43 p.m.

    @howie

    "Hill will hand off to RBs who are coached by a lawyer who has never coached."

    You've tried to pass this lie off multiple times now so let me expose you once again.

    Atuaia was indeed a graduate assistant at BYU for several years before taking 2 years off to work in administration. He has coached before, you are either ignorant or trying to be intentionally dishonest about it. I don't know which one it is but it doesn't really matter because both are embarrassing for you, and your fellow utah "fans" cheering you on, now that you have once again been exposed.

    LOL!

  • Reno Cougs Fan 68 Reno, NV
    June 28, 2013 6:54 p.m.

    LindonMan,

    Growup!!! I have friends and family on both sides!!! I grew up a BYU fan and I will always root for the Blue first but that does not mean I can't also root for the boys on the hill when they are not playing BYU!!! I do not sit on the fence when it comes to the head to head rivalry, it will always be BYU!!!

    Go Cougs!!!
    Go Utes!!!

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    June 28, 2013 7:10 p.m.

    CO Ute
    PARKER, CO

    I think most BCS teams would recognize the recent success of Houston, Nevada and USU (especially) as more BCS caliber than Washington State (alas) and Colorado.

    Meaning nothing personal of course.

    Being IN a BCS conference means no more that a team is BCS caliber than being OUT of a BCS conference means a team is not BCS caliber, ala Boise State. Hopefully this is the year that people begin to put BYU in that category.

    Hopefully this is the year people begin to put Utah in that category, too. Just not at BYU's expense.

  • Virginians for BYU Lebanon, MO
    June 28, 2013 7:31 p.m.

    I am happy to have Anae back. BYU usually keeps their dirty laundry from flying out in the open but it has been pretty clear that for the past few years they have had chemistry issues between the coaches and subsequently the players. No question now that Anae is the OC and he has been able to arrange his staff according to the direction he feels is best for the team and the offensive playbook he wants to run. Metaphorically speaking, now we all know that Anae has the ball. I give him the benefit of the doubt and want to see what he can do with it.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 28, 2013 8:37 p.m.

    Aaron Sharp will be a UTE! Hoorah! Hoorah!

    In other news, injury-prone th is ready to see his bu take snaps! Aaron Sharp will be a UTE! Hoorah! Hoorah!

  • Alpine Coug Alpine, UT
    June 28, 2013 9:24 p.m.

    @ Lindon Man

    You couldn't be further offbase. Although a life-long Cougar, I also cheer for the the Utes in every game they play except one.

    I will always root for the Utes and wish only the best for them and their classy coach.

    Go Cougs and yes, Go Utes!!

  • Osgrath Provo, UT
    June 28, 2013 9:42 p.m.

    Sorry, LindonMan, I like both teams because they both play an interesting brand of football, and they both represent the state I call home. I am a sports fan, as in a fan of sports. I am a fan of specific teams, as well, but I also choose not to let irrational hate dictate my actions and thoughts.

  • Osgrath Provo, UT
    June 28, 2013 9:43 p.m.

    steeleute - I will always respond positively to tact and decency. You ask legitimate questions so I will give you my thoughts.
    My expectations are that the team will struggle, especially early on, as they build a cohesive unit. They will not win every game. But I think they will do better than some expect.
    Looking at the schedule:
    Virginia - it is always more difficult to travel from west to east than vice-versa, but Virginia isn't all that good.
    Texas - as a home game, this looks good, but Texas will probably be a top 20 team this year; 2011 the Cougars gave them a scare in Austin with no quarterback - we'll have to see how Taysom progresses.
    Utah - at home, but historically the emotions involved generally negate home-field advantage, so who knows? The team whose quarterback progresses best will win.
    Middle Tennessee State - pretty close to a gimme in LES.
    USU - tough situation in Logan - great quarterback, solid team. Cougars will have to play their best.
    Georgia Tech - home-field advantage and a team that BYU easily handled back east last year.

  • Osgrath Provo, UT
    June 28, 2013 9:43 p.m.

    Houston - flying to Houston is a lot less taxing than flying to Virginia, and Houston hasn't been Houston of the past.
    Boise State - another scary match-up - top 20 team; how much impact will home field provide?
    Wisconsin - this has potential to get really ugly. BYU must play way over-their-heads to come close.
    Idaho State - a chance to rest up after the Badgers.
    Notre Dame - top 10 program in their lair; good experience for the players and visiting fans.
    Nevada - New, unproven head coach; great bloodlines but unproven. Without Kaepernick Reno should be ordinary.

    I’m happy with Anae because this time around he has been given more authority to put his stamp on things, plus a year working with Rich Rod raised his awareness.
    All indications are that Hill will not be running as much as last year: new OC and new awareness. Besides, the running backs are stronger, too.
    Notice the lack of predictions. I really don’t want to make a fool of myself. Anything can happen and I am sure a couple of these games will not go the way anyone expects at this time.

  • Hugh Janis South Jordan, UT
    June 28, 2013 10:02 p.m.

    Future Star!

  • idaho cougar fan Twin Falls, ID
    June 28, 2013 10:09 p.m.

    A lot of civil comments is nice to see! Us BYU fans tend to be a little unrealistic, but I think most BYU fans expect an 8-9 win season. We should be competitive in all the games with a chance to win them, but history has shown the team has turnover issues in big games. If they take care of the ball and the offense gets better every game, they have a chance for 10-11 wins and a possible BCS bowl! Yes Ute fans, I think 11 wins gets BYU a BCS bowl invite especially if Utah can muster up a 6-6 or 7-5 type of year. (Makes the win look better instead of a 3-9 or 4-8 team, so don't be that team again this year Utah.)

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    June 28, 2013 10:16 p.m.

    Parker CO ute,
    If USU is not a BCS caliber team at this point, even though they are the top team in the state, does that mean the Univ. of Utah is not a BCS caliber team either?

    Even though most of the comments, including this one, are totally off topic, what do you think Utah's record will be in December?

  • CO Ute PARKER, CO
    June 28, 2013 10:40 p.m.

    Best set of posts I have seen on a Y or U article in a long, long time. Nice to see the discussion focus on the article and other topics without the majority of posts focused on one team being superior to the other.

  • CO Ute PARKER, CO
    June 28, 2013 10:55 p.m.

    @whoa Nellie

    Except for one game a year, I root for USU every week. Make lots of positive posts about their football team and was thrilled for them last year. All that said, they are not - in my opinion - a BCS caliber team at this point. They have some very good players but the overall talent of the team has not caught up to either Utah or BYU. I'd love to see them have another season with double digit wins this year but my feeling is they aren't at that level right now.

    For you other question, which has no bearing on this article, I think the Utes will win about 5 games this year but am hoping for more.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 28, 2013 11:25 p.m.

    @Duckhunter

    Graduate assistant?

    Well that answers all questions about Atuaia's qualifications to coach.

    Unpaid volunteer clipboard carrying experience certainly qualifies him to coach mid-major running backs.

    Add that to an o-line coach who has never coached at the D-1 level and o-linemen who have never taken a snap at BYU and who wouldn't expect record setting BYU success this year?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 29, 2013 12:08 a.m.

    Utah, BYU and USU will ALL struggle. I hate saying it and hope I'm wrong.
    The Ute defense is inexperienced in the front and back, while just plain outmatched in the middle.
    Ute offense could show improvement but the receiving position is getting thinner every day. There's a stable of RBs but they're all unproven or injury prone.
    BYU fans ... I don't wish it upon him, but Taysom Hill only makes it through the season if he holds back. And if he holds back ... well ... I don't see good things happening against a much improved schedule.
    I'd also start getting a bit nervous about the last couple of recruiting classes ... I know you guys don't like to acknowledge it, but it'll start taking INCREDIBLE coaching efforts to make up for some talent deficiencies that are bound to be creeping into the program. Good RB, great receiver, great LB ... inexperienced OLine, fragile QB, real schedule.
    USU could surprise me, Chuckie's awesome. However, the bottom line is ... SCHEDULE ... as in, toughest ever for USU.
    Advice to all ... pick an out of state team to add to your DVR schedule this year.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 1:04 a.m.

    @poyman
    9 of 15 is the record that BYU has over the past 6 years against members of the PAC12...
    5 of 17 is the record tha Utah has against members of the PAC12 just over the past 2 years (a 29% win ratio)... Their 6 year record agaist these opponents is slightly better, it jumps up to 8 of 23 games (a 35% win ratio)... That's right folks, BYU has more total wins against PAC10 memers than Utah who has played in that conference for 2 years and has played the oponents 8 more times...
    ------------

    Nope!

    Utah was 4-5 and 3-6 in the PAC-12: 7-11 (39%)
    Over the same period BYU went 2-3 (40% - wins over 3 win teams)

    Over 6 years (arbitrary number picked by you):
    Utah went 3-2 ... so overall 10-13 (43%)

    BYU went 6-2 ... so overall 8-5 (62%)
    * 6 wins were against teams with losing records
    * 4 teams with 4 or less wins

    When you play a real schedule week-in-week-out, like Utah and TCU have, then come talk.

  • mindgames Aurora, CO
    June 29, 2013 6:55 a.m.

    How far off is the start of this season...I can't wait any longer.

    Gooooooooo Cougars!

    Gooooooooo Taysom!!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 7:08 a.m.

    @Duckhunter

    @howie

    "Hill will hand off to RBs who are coached by a lawyer who has never coached."

    You've tried to pass this lie off multiple times now so let me expose you once again.
    Atuaia was indeed a graduate assistant at BYU for several years before taking 2 years off to work in administration. He has coached before.

    -------------------

    What you exposed is the lack of research skills.

    Yes "he as coached before" so much that the experience he gained isn't even acknowledged on Mark Atuaia's official Bio page:

    Prior to joining BYU Coaching Staff
    Worked as assistant to the athletics director for student services at BYU (2012)
    Worked as assistant to the dean of student life at BYU (2011-12)


    Instead of calling out others, do yourself a favor and look up Robert Anae's official bio page to see the difference.

    That being said, Utah's CB coach Sharrieff Shah went from being a reporter and lawyer to a coach. Personally I think he struggled in year one due to a "learning curve". I would think Atuaia will go through the same "learning curve" phase.

  • Wiscougarfan River Falls, WI
    June 29, 2013 7:15 a.m.

    RE: LindonMan

    I second what others on this board have said... that you can cheer for multiple teams as a matter of in-state pride. I would add that often people (like myself) will post "Go Cougs! and Go Utes!" on these boards, not so much because we're legitimate fans of both teams but as a token of appreciation for fans on the other side of the rivalry being civil (i.e. SteeleUte on this thread). I can't say I'm truly a Ute fan because I only watch a few of their games each fall, rarely read articles about them, and know little about their actual team. However, I love the BYU/Utah rivalry and I do wish the best for the Utes except one game a year (or perhaps two if they play USU). I spent my childhood in Utah and am a college football fan so I have no quals with honestly saying...
    Go Cougs!
    Go Aggies! (except in one game)
    Go Utes! (except in two games)

  • USNGary South Jordan, UT
    June 29, 2013 7:34 a.m.

    You know, since BYU went independent and utah not wanting to play the next two years, BYU got a 2 for 1 with utah. Funny....

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    June 29, 2013 8:21 a.m.

    Uteology

    As usual, our friends on the hill get so caught up in labels, that they're blind to the overall picture.

    Wins versus teams with winning records

    Bronco 25
    Kyle 25

    Losses versus teams with losing records

    Bronco 4
    Kyle 6

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 8:27 a.m.

    poyman
    Lincoln City, OR

    8, that's the number of years that Utah has had a better win loss record than BYU over the last 41 years (that's right, only 8 seasons out of the last 41 seasons has the BCS Utes had a better record than BYU)and they played in the same conference for 39 of those years... I suspect that Taysom will make it 42 seasons with the same number #8 for the Utes...

    -------------

    Nope!

    You need to stop wasting peoples time with bogus stats.

    I went as far as the 90s, already wasting too much time as it is, found BYU dominated the WAC with Edwards in the 70s and 80s but since then not so much.

    Better win loss records:

    In MWC: Utah 7 and BYU 5

    WAC in 90s: BYU 5 and Utah 2 (with 2 seasons with identical records)

    Overall: BYU 10 and Utah 9

    WOW!! Talk about BYU dominance.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 8:48 a.m.

    @poyman

    But WOW! Look at BYU’s impressive winning percentage (62%) vs PAC-12 teams in 6 years.

    Which indeed is impressive, until you ask “Who they beat, Bo Diddly Techs?”

    That’s right folks, of the 8 wins:

    A) 6 were over teams with losing records
    B) Of which 5 teams had 4 or less wins
    C) Of which one team went 0-12 where BYU (the top 25, 10-3, “Quest” team) needed a bad call on the last play to win 28-27 (avg margin of loss for Washington was 25 ppg, offense avg 13 ppg, yet the closest they came to victory was against BYU).

    @Solomon Levi

    So you're saying Kyle has 2 more loses to bad teams? So what? What's your point?

    Kyle also has two more wins over top 10 teams. More importantly he has a #2 team that went undefeated, something Bronco is still has a quest out "Quest" for.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    June 29, 2013 10:24 a.m.

    Uteology

    "So you're saying Kyle has 2 more loses to bad teams? So what? What's your point?"

    SO WHAT?

    Both coaches have been good at beating good teams (teams with winning records), but Bronco has been MUCH better at NOT LOSING to bad teams.

    While Bronco is undefeated against conference bottom dwellers New Mexico, Wyoming, Colorado State, and UNLV, Kyle lost to every one of them, including two UGLY losses to 10-loss UNLV and 10-loss Colorado (at home).

    Losses to bad teams explains why Kyle trails Bronco in conference championships, Top 25 finishes, and overall record.

    Bottom line:

    Bronco - 74-29, FIVE Top 25, THREE Top 15, TWO Conference Championships, EIGHT Bowls
    Kyle - 70-32, THREE Top 25, ONE Top 15, ONE Conference Championship, ONE Bowl

    Kyle's had one great season, and bad season.
    Bronco's had three very good seasons and no bad seasons.

    Kyle has lost to as many 10-loss teams in the last six years, as BYU has lost to during BYU's ENTIRE HISTORY!

    Even more embarrassing for Kyle; BYU has NEVER lost to a 10-loss team at home.

    Advantage: Bronco

  • TEXASBYUFAN Mckinney, TX
    June 29, 2013 10:31 a.m.

    It is so funny to read Chris B's comments. He talks like Utah is something. I'm serious when I say people outside little SLC think Utah is a Joke. The future for Utah is sub .500 seasons and a bowl game every five years or so. Standford and Oregon will dominate the PAC12, USC is dropping but only a little. Washington, UCLA, and Arizona are on the fast rise. Cal, Wash St, and Arizona St are Avg. That leave Utah, Col, and Oregon St to bottom feed. Yes, Wash St has pasted Utah. Oh, Utah did have a few good years, but it seems that Gary Anderson was more the reason than Witty. 2013 UTAH 5 AND 7.

  • TEXASBYUFAN Mckinney, TX
    June 29, 2013 10:37 a.m.

    Here is a quick fact. Utah has become a losing team (no bowl) since Gary Anderson departed. Sorry to tell you this, WITTY isn't all that!

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2013 10:38 a.m.

    Be leery of giving Taysom Hill too much pre-season praise. He has talent, and may develop into McMahon/Detmer/Beck by his senior year, but as a sophomore he is not there. I've watched Cougar fans and their love/hate relationships with the last few quarterbacks. Heaps and Nelson were heroes in pre-season; reviled in post-season. Cut Hill a break. Give him some time. The Cougars have a tough schedule this year that will provide Hill some great experience.

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 10:43 a.m.

    Uteology

    "But WOW! Look at BYU’s impressive winning percentage (62%) vs PAC-12 teams in 6 years.

    Which indeed is impressive, until you ask "Who did they beat...?"

    LOL at the delusional spin constantly blowing from the hill!

    One might rightly ask, "Who has Utah beaten as a "mighty" weak bcs team?"

    Since joining the PAC, the Utes are 7-11 versus PAC opponents, with NOT A SINGLE win against a PAC team with a winning record and TWO LOSSES to PAC teams with LOSING records, including one of the worst teams in the country.

    Of Utah's FIVE wins last season, BYU was your ONLY opponent with a winning record and it took a lot of luck at home to win that game.

    BYU beat #16/#17 Utah State(11-2), Sun Bowl winner and ACC division champion Georgia Tech(7-7), and MWC tri-champion SDSU(8-5).

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 10:46 a.m.

    Solomon Levi

    Obviously a typo - Kyle has taken his team to seven bowls - still one fewer than Bronco.

  • Tom in CA Vallejo, CA
    June 29, 2013 10:46 a.m.

    " ...... wonder what he thinks when he sees his former Stanford teammates going to prestigious BCS games, beating teams like Oregon, beating their rival Cal, top 5 rankings.."

    Chris B - you can add utah to the aforementioned list getting beat by Stanford. And everyone still knows how much you love your bcs membership.

  • oddman ,
    June 29, 2013 12:06 p.m.

    Steeleute - Frankly I am optimistic to have coach Anae back. Apparently he wasn't able to select his offensive staff last time around and feels a cohesiveness that was lacking. I believe he has acquired additional tools to help this offense. I think our chances of keeping up with the pack of obviously better competition is 50/50 but breaks could improve or diminish that in either direction. I don't see them going undefeated but believe they will become bowl eligible prior to the last game or two. I am pleased we have selected a qb prior to the start of fall ball and believe Hill has the components to have a breakout year barring injury and then the backup has fire in his eye and I believe will become a factor in our winning. I'm no coach and my opinion is based on what I glean from the hype.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 2:05 p.m.

    @Uteanymous

    Please, lets not talk about bowl games. That horse has been beat to death on other articles this week.

    Anyway you spin it, bottom line is Utah played a tougher bowl schedule and went 10-1, BYU played a weaker bowl schedule and went 6-5.

    The fact that not a single Ute "Quested" for BYU's BCS accomplishments while 50,000 Cougar fans bought t-shirts on what Utah did twice speaks volumes.

    @Solomon Levi: "Both coaches have been good at beating good teams (teams with winning records), but Bronco has been MUCH better at NOT LOSING to bad team."

    Nope! Bronco has a losing record against BCS teams. Kyle does not.

    @Whoa Nellie

    Both Utah and TCU dominated the MWC and have struggled at the next level, neither are BCS teams yet.

    Only BYU, according to some fans (poyman and those that liked is analysis), can compete in the BCS tomorrow.

    For the rest of us, it takes time to build depth to compete in a BCS conference. I think Utah needs 2 more years, after the first PAC-12 class graduates.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 29, 2013 2:30 p.m.

    @Uteanymous: "One might rightly ask, "Who has Utah beaten as a "mighty" weak bcs team?"

    Valid point, and the answer is mostly bad teams as well.

    But then again it was poyman (BYU fan) that took bogus stats to show how impressive BYU was by going 8-5 vs PAC-12, not me.

    I have always maintained that with our current talent we OWN teams like Wazzu and BYU but we must build depth to compete against the mid-to-upper half of the PAC-12.

    "Of Utah's FIVE wins last season, BYU was your ONLY opponent with a winning record and it took a lot of luck at home to win that game."

    News flash Utah was a horrible team last year. We were so lucky to win that we NEVER trailed in the game and went into the 4th being up 24-7. BYU almost had their 4th miracle (the penalty against MUSS) in 11 years to negate a blocked field goal.

    Your only opponent in the regular season with a winning record was Utah State, so is a 6-3 win at home lucky or a miracle?

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 29, 2013 2:36 p.m.

    JWIV on ESPN2 right now!

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 29, 2013 2:52 p.m.

    @utieology

    Correction:

    For the past 7 years PAC vs BYU (I picked 7 years because that's the period of time that Utah fans have been beating their chest about their Football program):

    2012) BYU 30 WSU 6, BYU 21 Utah 24, BYU 24 OSU 42;
    2011) BYU 10 Utah 54, BYU 38 OSU 28;
    2010) BYU 23 Washington 17 (Has Utah ever beaten Washington??? Not in the past 40 years that I checked out (0-3 is their record)
    2009) BYU 44 OSU 20;
    2008) BYU 28 Washington 27, BYU 59 UCLA 0, BYU 21 Arizona 31;
    2007) BYU 20 Arizona 7, BYU 17 UCLA 27, and BYU 17 UCLA 16,
    2006) BYU 13 Arizona 16, BYU 38 Oregon 8...

    A record of 9-6 in 15 games (a 60% win ratio).

    Now Utah:

    2012) Utah played 9 games against PAC opponents and won 3 (beat Cal,WSU,Colorado).
    2011) Utah played 9 games against PAC opponents and won 4(AZ,OSU,UCLA,WSU)...7of 18 (39% win ratio).
    2006-2010) 6 games and Utah won 3. Overall 10 of 24 (42% win ratio).

    Utah played 9 more games than BYU (60% more)and only one more win. LOL.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 29, 2013 4:29 p.m.

    Too many stats people... Or should I say "folks" in the current politically correct fashion...

    All you need to know about the relative strength of Whit and Bronco... and Utah and BYU... is that Bronco has an overall losing record when he plays the big boys of college football and Whit has a winning record.

    Oh... and Whit wins head to head against Bronco...

    Oh... and Cougar Nation rejoices with a "big announcement" of a 2 for 1 schedule with USC... while Utah enjoys its perpetual home and home with USC.

    Those few facts tell you all you need to know about the place of Utah and BYU in the modern era of college football.

    Oh, and it's also of note that BYU has a running back coach that has never coach at the D-1 level... Or any level as near as I can tell.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 29, 2013 5:12 p.m.

    poyman--

    There's an enormous difference in playing against PAC-12 schools in a week-in, week-out grind than it is to play against them in a "hit-and-miss" scenario where they get sandwiched in-between the bottom-feeders typically constituting 2-Star byu's schedule. The former not only requires a higher level of overall-talent but, more importantly, it requires BCS-level depth. These 2 things are precisely what UTAH's currently addressing in their BCS recruiting-classes as they transition into The PAC-12.

    Despite this all-important difference, 2-Star byu can still only beat 2 PAC-12 schools which finished at the very bottom of the conference standings in 2011 OSU and 2012 WAZZU and got absolutely brutally curb-stomped at home by the only 2 PAC-12 schools which finished the season with a winning record, 2011 UTAH and 2012 OSU, to the tune of 96-34!

    The 5th-game was yet another loss to UTAH in 2012, making 2-Star byu 0-2 against UTAH!

    UTAH has now won 3 straight over 2-Star byu, 4 of 5, 8 of 11 and owns the overall record by miles and miles, 56-34-4!

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 29, 2013 5:21 p.m.

    Somebody mentioned it the other day regarding bm's record against The PAC-10, '05-'10, versus Coach KW's--

    bm was 7-4 and Coach KW was 4-3. So, UTAH played in 4 fewer games and lost one fewer game. Yawn.

    Here's something interesting to point-out, however--

    7 teams 2-Star byu beat had a cumulative overall record of 37-51. UTAH's 4 schools finished 26-24.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 29, 2013 6:31 p.m.

    Here's are some of my favorite numbers for you AZutie,

    8...That's the number of seasons out of the past 41 that your team has had a better record than BYU... That's less than once every 5 seasons... And 39 of those seasons(95%)your team was in the same conference as BYU...

    15... That's the TOTAL number of times that your team has beaten BYU in the past 41 games (41 seasons)against each other... that is a winning percentage of 36.6%... Your team has done better against PAC12 opponents over the past 2 years than your team has done against BYU the past 41 years. Of those 15 games, 4 of them came under BYU coach Gary Crowton who ran our program into the ground and Mendenhal is still picking up some of the pieces.

    3... That's the number of games that your team is picked by Las Vegas Odds Makers to win this year (out of a 12 game schedule)...

    8... is the total number of wins that BYU is picked to win this year... and "1" of those 8 is against Utah.

    In short... Utah's supposed dominance is a little less than overwhelming.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    June 29, 2013 8:54 p.m.

    Uteology

    "Anyway you spin it, bottom line is Utah played a tougher bowl schedule and went 10-1, BYU played a weaker bowl schedule and went 6-5."

    Utah's bowl schedule was soooo tough, that only 4 of Utah's 10 bowl winning teams were considered good enough to be ranked in the final Top 25. Sorry to burst your crimson bubble, but the only people impressed with a mediocre Utah team beating an even more mediocre opponent in a bowl are Utah fans.

    Win or lose, SIX BYU bowl teams finished in the Top 25.
    Only FIVE Utah bowl teams achieved the same accomplishment.

    Despite your jealous whining, BYU was better where it really counts, in the final polls.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 29, 2013 9:52 p.m.

    poyman--

    "In short... Utah's supposed dominance is a little less than overwhelming."

    Please....In short, you evaded me on what I posted down below!

    That's cool, since, in reality, my comments literally said it all!

    Finally, by golly, if PRE-season predictions go against UTAH/in favor of 2-Star byu, as you yourself claimed in your previous post, then what's the point of even playing the games in 2013?

    This sort of wishing something to happen, so desperately, since the alternative appears to be utterly unbearable, is what I also witnessed prior to last year's annual UTAH victory over 2-Star byu!

    The final margin predictions for 2-Star byu over UTAH grew to the point of being so utterly obscene/outrageous, some by 4-5 TDs and they weren't kidding, so extensive was the frenzy they'd worked themselves into!

    I kid you not, a large contingent of the 2-Star byu fanbase had reached the point of believing beating UTAH was a forgone conclusion and, instead, were debating eachother as to how many more wins it'd take, 'til 2-Star byu moved into the Top 10 rankings! Seriously!

    Remember, UTAH 4 straight recently, from 2002-2005!

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    June 29, 2013 10:57 p.m.

    @Hondo,
    Uh, those coaches from last year's offense are gone. Your point is ... what?

    @steelute. Good post, good questions. Speaking as a Washington grad and a fan of UW and BYU, who has been watching PAC12 and BYU football since 1960, I can answer your questions from my perspective.

    I'm very happy about independence. At UW, I always looked forward to the non-conference games, especially against big name opponents. Of course, it would sting when we lost, but we won our share. I first noticed BYU when they beat Oregon State in Portland after OSU had beaten the nation's #2 teams twice in a row. The Holiday Bowls were always on my list and I became a huge BYU fan. Lavell Edwards revolutionized college football.

    I was living in Omaha when Nebraska lost to Pitt (I think) and opened the door for BYU to win that NC. I watched BYU beat Michigan and UW beat Oklahoma. BYU #1 and UW #2. Didn't get better than that. Now that's how they rank in my heart. BYU is special, and I've come to really appreciate it. No knock on any other school, but BYU is unique.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 29, 2013 11:57 p.m.

    @ AZutie,

    Why do you cover your posts with boastful words but never back them up with facts?... I gave you hard numbers... Facts.

    You actually make me smile... You refer to BYU and it's Fan Base as a two star program... If we're two star what would Utah be? Seriously?... I've pointed out how your team has been obliterated in head to head competition with BYU over the years and how BYU has done far better in the PAC than Utah (with the actual numbers)... Facts.

    The reference on the predicted outcome of the 2013 game is Marc Lawrence's Playbook released this month... BYU is favored by an 8 to 5 ratio... Utah is suppose to win 3 games this year and BYU is suppose to win 8.

    You don't like preseason predictions that go against Utah but you want to make hay on Rivals Recruiting Ratings... That my friend is hypocritical...You see the number of stars that you get from Rivals for recruiting doesn't count as wins... You actually have to play the games... And, with the help of guys like Taysom it's easy to see why they think BYU is the stronger team... Yet again.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 30, 2013 12:05 a.m.

    Great post Blue Husky... I too went to both schools... I have a Bachelors from BYU and an MBA from the U of Dub... And that is exactly how those two teams rank with me as well... BYU #1 and U of Dub #2...

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 30, 2013 12:13 a.m.

    @AZute

    I had pointed out in a previous post that some of the wins that Utah had in the past decade came under Crowton's tenure... You pointed out 4 wins in a row in early 2000... Three of those were Crowton years... Our team was the worst that it has been during the last three years of Crowton's tenure...

    BTW, another subject... Why would you get so excited about a 3 star qb from a small high school who gave a committment to the Utes??? If he were a 5 star or even a 4 star I could see the justification for the excitement... But he is a 3 star...

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 30, 2013 2:39 a.m.

    poyman--

    "You actually make me smile... You refer to BYU and it's Fan Base as a two star program... If we're two star what would Utah be? Seriously?... I've pointed out how your team has been obliterated in head to head competition with BYU over the years and how BYU has done far better in the PAC than Utah (with the actual numbers)... Facts."

    LOL....I literally don't know what else to point to, except to go back/carefully read what I previously posted, as I straight factually blew-up each and every one of your Spin-based "points"! I can't force you to acknowledge what's directly before your eyes in black-and-white! I sense enormous frustration rapidly growing within you, but this wasn't my intent, merely the natural by-product of remaining Spin-free in each and every one of my statements! Also, I quoted Scout, not Rivals!

    Among other points, you didn't comprehend, for a reason only you know, this difference when playing PAC-12 schools in a week-in, week-out grind! Another point you somehow missed, was the breakdown of 2-Star byu's 2-3 record against The PAC-12!

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 30, 2013 8:13 a.m.

    @azute

    Where's aaron sharp?

    LOL!

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    June 30, 2013 10:15 a.m.

    "They serve as an interesting talking-point to little extent, but otherwise serve exclusively to entertain the masses, nothing further! Some may prove to ultimately fall "within the ballpark", but many don't even achieve this! Even fewer achieve 100% accuracy or even resembling it, if any whatsoever!"

    Now take that quote and apply it to your "star" ratings...a little food for thought. Stars mean nothing, production on the field is what matters. That's why BYUs last CONSESUS All American was a 0 star walk-on. Maybe if U worried less about stars and more about production you could actually swim with the sharks in your big boy league rather than relegated to the kiddie pool with your floaties.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 30, 2013 11:45 a.m.

    cougsndawgs--

    "Now take that quote and apply it to your 'star' ratings...a little food for thought. Stars mean nothing, production on the field is what matters. That's why BYUs last CONSESUS All American was a 0 star walk-on. Maybe if U worried less about stars and more about production you could actually swim with the sharks in your big boy league rather than relegated to the kiddie pool with your floaties."

    I'm not even remotely "worried" about Stars! HaHa. I'm more than pleased with the fact we're clearly trending upward in our recruiting! Thanks for your concern!

    What continues evading 2-Star byu fan, in general, is what transitioning into PAC-12 inherently requires, in order to successfully compete in its fundamental week-in, week-out grind of a schedule, namely upgrading overall talent-level/building legitimate depth! Not being close yet to our targeted depth was especially exposed early during last season!

    We UTES welcome/are thrilled about this overall-challenge, yet must endlessly explain to 2-Star byu fan who refuses to acknowledge this fact! No comparison in schedules, whatsoever! Since exiting MWC, this is our reality, thankfully, but NOT 2-star byu's!

    [Cont'd]--

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    June 30, 2013 12:08 p.m.

    cougsdawgs--

    "Now take that quote and apply it to your 'star' ratings...a little food for thought. Stars mean nothing, production on the field is what matters. That's why BYUs last CONSESUS All American was a 0 star walk-on."

    I'm sure a solid football player, but in order to successfully navigate a week-in, week-out grind of a schedule, a team's overall talent-level would reflect kids, across-the-board and beyond starters only, on this kid's [per your reference] same level of play, not merely a few such players on the team's entire roster!

    Reality is 100% contrary to the position 2-Star byu fan traditionally wishes to debate from, but from which zero legitimate consideration is ever given and, invariably, always descends into a non-sensical woven mess of pure Spin!

    In other words, reflecting reality means giving full-credence to such things as SOS/legitimate week-in/week-out grind of a schedule and the fundamental requirement in successfully transitioning into The PAC-12, namely escalating overall talent-level, building legitimate top-to-bottom depth, both of which mandate multiple recruiting classes constituted by the majority being significantly higher rated recruits! All being 100% irrefutable!

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    June 30, 2013 1:12 p.m.

    AZutie... We have both laid out our cases of BYU vs Utah through the years... The people who read them will be moved one way or the other... I personally think that my numbers are far more convincing of Utah's lack of dominance than your rambling verbage supporting such dominance...... But the readers can decide that...

    I am not frustrated at all... You can't teach those who refuse to learn...

    I think that I clearly pointed out that pre-season predictions are educated guesses on what will happen based on what the experts see... It doen't always happen as predicted, but more times than not it does...

    What's amusing to me is that you cling to the judgement of so called experts in rating potential recruits and use that as the soul criterion for determining the quality of a team... But, you won't have anything to do with Odd's Makers (also considered experts) who predicte how a team will do in a game before it's played... It seems to me that if one is legit then the other also is legit...

    Odds Makers say BYU is again the better team... And I agree.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    June 30, 2013 1:21 p.m.

    AZUTE1

    What would a Ute know about SUCCESSFULLY navigating the week-in, week-out grind of a PAC schedule? You've had two straight losing seasons and haven't beaten a single PAC opponent with a winning record.

    It's laughable how Utah fans used to beat their chests about being to hang with the big boys just a couple of years ago, but now, the only thing we hear from the kids on the hill is whiny excuse-making about SOS. Your week-in, week-out grind doesn't explain why you had a complete melt down at home against one of the worst teams in the country to blow a gift-wrapped PAC South.

    The truth is, you're all talk, but no walk; at least WSU and Colorado enjoy the company.

  • BigCougFan Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 30, 2013 4:27 p.m.

    I love reading the comments from the Ute fans on the BYU stories. Their comments give me better chuckles than I could get from the funny pages. Chris B., AZute, and the others could make a good living on the comedy circuit. But the facts prove they don't know the sports they spout off about.

    Go Cougars!!!!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 5:06 p.m.

    @mussingaround

    Utah's bowl schedule was soooo tough, that only 4 of Utah's 10 bowl winning teams were [ranked] ...Win or lose, SIX BYU bowl teams finished in the Top 25.

    --------------

    That's because BYU lost and Utah won. I don't think you understand how final rankings work. Let me give you some examples:

    2001 #23 Louisville 28 #16 BYU, If BYU had won, Louville would drop from top 25.
    2005 #31 Cal 35 BYU 28 ... Cal finished #25 by beating BYU.
    2006 $24 Georgia Tech 10 Utah 38 ... IF Utah lost, Georgia would have remained ranked.
    Same for #28 SM loss to Utah and #16 OSU loss to BYU.

    FACT: During the BCS era, 36% of Utah’s bowl opponents were ranked in the AP top 25 and 55% in the AP top 30.

    FACT: Over the same period, 27% of BYU’s bowl opponents were ranked in the AP top 25 and 36% in the AP top 30 (55% in top 35).

    The difference, Utah went 10-1 (91%) and BYU 6-5 (55%).

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 5:43 p.m.

    @mussingaround

    Win or lose, SIX BYU bowl teams finished in the Top 25.
    Only FIVE Utah bowl teams achieved the same accomplishment.

    Despite your jealous whining, BYU was better where it really counts, in the final polls.

    ---------------

    Jealous of what? Unlike you I didn't buy a $20 "Quest for what our Rival did Twice" t-shirt.

    Again, Utah didn't "Quest" for anything BYU did in the BCS era. We're not impressed with BYU's accomplishments.

    So spin away, but 50,000 BYU fans that bought the t-shirts think 2 undefeated, top 4, BCS bowl seasons is more impressive enough to "Quest" for.

  • Wiscougarfan River Falls, WI
    June 30, 2013 6:19 p.m.

    RE: Uteology

    The Quest t-shirts were $5, not $20 and 99% of BYU fans will tell you that slogan was a mistake. Mendenhall would probably agree. Setting your sites on a national title is a good idea. Creating a slogan that can easily be taken the wrong way is a bad idea. "Questing for Perfection" was a good idea but a dumb thing to put on a t-shirt. The other slogans the Cougars have had have been pretty decent (Band of Brothers, 2012, 2006; Raise the Bar, 2007).

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    June 30, 2013 6:48 p.m.

    Uteology

    So you're saying that Utah's goal for 2008 was to finish with multiple losses, so they missed their goal by finishing undefeated?

    Unfortunately for U, your best, was only 2nd best, in ONE poll.

    Call us when U actually win the ultimate prize - a national championship!

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    June 30, 2013 7:17 p.m.

    Uteology

    You're obviously having a hard time understanding that the subject is where BYU's and Utah's bowl teams finished in the polls, NOT where their bowl opponents finished.

    The main reason only 4 of Utah's 10 bowl winning teams (40%) managed to finish in the Top 25 is because the Utes simply weren't very good to begin with. A mediocre MWC also ran like Utah barely beating an even more mediocre PAC 10 also ran like USC(6-6) obviously didn't impress anybody except Utah fans.

    By comparison, 4 of BYU's 6 bowl winning teams (66%) and 2 of BYU's 5 bowl losing teams (40%) all managed to finish in the Top 25.

    It's laughable that during Utah's greatest period ever, the bcs era, BYU's bowl losing teams were just as likely to be ranked in the Top 25 as Utah's bowl winning teams.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 30, 2013 8:14 p.m.

    @Rockwell

    How about you call us... when that back door NC gets your Cougs anything more than a place on the outside looking in on the modern era of college football.

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 8:37 p.m.

    howie

    Despite the jealous rants of the kids on the hill, BYU's National Championship is just as legitimate as any national championship ever awarded - a consensus of ALL FIVE major national organizations (including Utah's favorite, the AP Sportswriters) selected BYU as the major college football national champion for 1984.

    You're just jealous that the best U could do in your best season ever was finish a distant 2nd in the AP poll and 4th in the Coaches poll (the official final poll for the bcs).

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    June 30, 2013 8:40 p.m.

    Howard,

    Better yet. Why don't YOU call us when a publication lists Utah as a top 25 football dynasty. Oh, and that included the modern era of college football.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 30, 2013 9:15 p.m.

    @Cougars1

    Oh wow... A publication names BYU a dynasty... It must be true.

    How proud you must be... as you wait for that phone call from the real power brokers of college football.

    Oh, btw... no 1st tier "dynasty" celebrates a 2 for 1 scheduling agreement with USC.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 30, 2013 9:27 p.m.

    @Uteanymous
    Salt Lake City, Utah

    Jealous?

    You must be kidding... there is no Ute fan anywhere that covets a 28 year old 2nd tier trophy and the glory of mid major independence.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    June 30, 2013 9:28 p.m.

    Howard,

    Well known publication and Utah was nowhere to be found. Enjoy BCS obscurity.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 10:48 p.m.

    Wiscougarfan
    River Falls, WI

    RE: Uteology

    The Quest t-shirts were $5, not $20 and 99% of BYU fans will tell you that slogan was a mistake. Mendenhall would probably agree. Setting your sites on a national title is a good idea.

    --------------

    Your sites were on a National Title? I must have been sleeping in 2008, remind me again when BYU was ever a national title game contender. Utah, TCU, or Boise have never been contenders, BCS busters yes, not title contenders.

    BYU's sites were on a BCS game:

    "BYU's quest for an undefeated season came to an unceremonious end Thursday night against TCU... and, almost certainly, their shot at a BCS bid... "It just hurts. The BCS, winning streak, when you get beat 30-something to seven, that stuff doesn't matter," BYU defensive lineman Jan Jorgensen said.

    Regardless of the cost of the t-shirts the fact is BYU "Quested" for Utah's accomplishments while Utah did not "Quest" for anything BYU has done in the BCS era.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 30, 2013 10:54 p.m.

    @Cougars1

    You know very well that the dynasty referenced in the publication of which you speak is from 1979 to 1985.

    It ended 27 years ago... As of today... No dynasty... only mid major Indy waiting for a call from a big boy conference.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 10:56 p.m.

    Rockwell
    Baltimore, MD

    Uteology

    So you're saying that Utah's goal for 2008 was to finish with multiple losses, so they missed their goal by finishing undefeated?

    -----------

    We set goals like everyone else, just not on t-shirts.

    Again, I can't be anymore clear:

    Utah did not "Quest" for anything BYU has accomplished in the BCS era.

    Your goal wasn't an undefeated season, since several undefeated mid-majors have not made a BCS game.

    Let's not rewrite history, your goal was what Utah did: being the next BCS Buster.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 30, 2013 11:13 p.m.

    Marked it Down
    Park City, UT

    Uteology

    You're obviously having a hard time understanding that the subject is where BYU's and Utah's bowl teams finished in the polls, NOT where their bowl opponents finished.

    The main reason only 4 of Utah's 10 bowl winning teams (40%) managed to finish in the Top 25 is because the Utes simply weren't very good to begin with.

    --------------

    Again, not all rankings are equal.

    When playing a similar schedule... BCS ear Final AP Rankings:

    BYU (5): #12 10-3, #25 10-3, #14 11-2, #16 11-2, #25 12-2
    Utah (4): #18 10-3, #2 13-0, #4 12-0, #21 10-2

    So BYU has TWO #25 rankings by losing to:
    * 7-5 Arizona 2008
    * #23 Louisville in 2001.

    While 2010 #22 Utah finished #26 when losing to #10 Boise in Vegas.

    Congrats, you were able to make a top #25 team and Utah #26 ONLY because more teams around Utah won than BYU.

    The difference, we have two undefeated, top 4 teams.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 12:43 a.m.

    @Uteology...

    Urban Meyers is gone, your glory days are gone... He's on his 2nd school since leaving the flailing Utes... He knew your venue was small time... He didn't want to be trapped with a team that consistently finishes in the bottom fourth or third of it's conference...

    Your obsession with the achievements that occured with his recruits is humorous... You guys won 2 BCS Bowls... Big Wow... One against the weakest team to play in a BCS Bowl that year and the other against a team that basically blew the bowl off after losing the SEC championship game to Florida...

    Ask any college team coach or college fan, for that matter, that's not a Ute fan who they think is the "most storied college football program" in the state of Utah and the vast majority (well over 65%) will tell you that it is BYU, hands down... Then ask them what they would prefer to have in their trophy case... A National Championship that is 29 or 30 years old or a couple of BCS Bowl Trophies that are 5 and 10 years old... I guarantee you that they will opt for the National Championship!

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 1:02 a.m.

    @Howard, the publication was in 2010... So how did you come up with the deduction that it ended in 1985?... We beat Kansas State in the Cotton Bowl in the 1996 season (going 14-1 only losing to the U of W in Seattle... a team that you have never beaten)... In 2001 we were undefeated until our Doak Walker winner (Luke Staley) went out with an injury with only 2 games to go in the season... In the past decade we have had four seasons at 11-2 ( your team was one of those 11 in3 of the 4 seasons.

    @utiology, I have never heard of someone beating their chest over an honorable mention finish before (was that #26 rating you talked about a BCS finish?) Because Historians only care about the USA Coaches Poll and the AP poll... And history shows, y'all didn't make the top 25... sorry, but it is what it is...

    The DN needs to put a word limit or a comment limit on the number of words people can write on a given article or a thread... Anyway you slice it, you U-trolls are way over your limit...

  • Wiscougarfan River Falls, WI
    July 1, 2013 6:03 a.m.

    RE: Uteology

    "Regardless of the cost of the t-shirts the fact is BYU "Quested" for Utah's accomplishments while Utah did not "Quest" for anything BYU has done in the BCS era."

    Thanks for ignoring everything I said (the hallmark of a true troll). Nope, we didn't "Quest" for a #2/4 ranking and invite to BCS bowl. Mendenhall has always been clear that "perfection" (as in "quest for perfection") was another national title. Like I said earlier, printing it on a t-shirt was a mistake and you're delusional if you think any BYU fan felt we were in a position to compete for a national title after having lost a game... the "quest" was and is quite simply Mendenhall's goal for the program. A goal which he has repeatedly indicated would likely take two or three stellar seasons in a row to achieve (similar to what happened 1979-1985). This is what BYU fans have and currently want for the program--I challenge you to find any evidence that suggests otherwise.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    July 1, 2013 7:11 a.m.

    @poyman

    Which would they choose between mid major Indy and a PAC 12 invitation?

  • 2BCSWINS West of I15, UT
    July 1, 2013 8:49 a.m.

    @Marked it down...."Utah barely beating an even more mediocre PAC 10 also ran like USC(6-6) obviously didn't impress anybody except Utah fans."

    Yet a win over a 6-6 less than mediocre Michigan team highly impresses you?...LOL!

    @Poyman

    What you have made clear on this thread is how jealous you are of Utah. Anybody that thinks they need to throw out that much spin has some jealousy issues. I just have one question for you why the last 41 years? I don't understand if your going to go back 41 years 4 decades why not just list the entire history head to head record? It wouldn't be becasue your searching for just when the Y was better would it?

    @Solomon Levi....One question for you to my friend. I've asked this before but didn't get response from you. Why do you list top 25 and top 15 ranking for bronco vs. whit but stop at 15? I could understand just listing top 25 but if your going to go down to 15 why not go all the way down to top 10 or 5? It wouldnt be becasue bronco has 0 would it?

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 9:53 a.m.

    @twomeaslybcswins

    The reason that the past 41 years were used is because 1972 is when Lavelle Edwards took over the Program... BYU had a couple seasons of success before then but that is when BYU began to get serios about Football... I received my bachelors in 74 and I can assure you, BYU treated FB before that time like the Utes treat Basketball today... If you want to say that your program was better than ours before then, it probably was... But since then, Utah has take a seat towards the back of the bus when comparing the two programs.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    July 1, 2013 10:51 a.m.

    @poyman

    Which Urban recruits were on the 2008 team?

    "You guys won 2 BCS Bowls... Big Wow... One against the weakest team to play in a BCS Bowl that year and the other against a team that basically blew the bowl off after losing the SEC championship game to Florida..."

    Bama blew off the Sugar Bowl game as much as 2009 Oregon State blew off the Vegas bowl after losing the Rose Bowl to Oregon. You are aware that Oregon State was your toughest bowl opponent since 1996?

    I love how BYU fans make excuses for Bama, more so then their own fans.

    * Bama in 2008 was playing in its FIRST major bowl game since 1999 (Orange Bowl)
    * Bama hadn't won a major bowl game since 1992 (Sugar Bowl)

    Yet they weren't motivated?

    * Bama was playing in it's own back yard, SEC country
    * Bama was motivated enough to smack talk about being 12-0 in a "real" conference

    If they weren't motivated in 2008 they need to thank Utah because after we spanked them, they started getting motivated and winning championships.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    July 1, 2013 11:21 a.m.

    @Wiscougarfan: "Thanks for ignoring everything I said (the hallmark of a true troll)"

    That's because everything you said was wrong.

    "Nope, we didn't "Quest" for a #2/4 ranking and invite to BCS bowl. Mendenhall has always been clear that "perfection" (as in "quest for perfection") was another national title."

    The annual pre-season national title quests, hallmark of Cougar Nation.

    You weren't questing for a title because you were never going to get it. BYU fan's knew it, Bronco knew it, his team knew it. Why? Because of this:

    BCS denies Cougars; BYU headed to Liberty
    Dec 4, 2011

    Here's your evidence that suggests otherwise:

    It was "Quest for Perfection" not "Quest for Perfections". Singular not Plural.

    Two to three stellar seasons in a row like:

    2008 11-2 #7
    2009 12-1 #6
    2010 13-0 #2

    TCU was denied a BCS title game in 2013 despite going being a top 10 team 3 straight years.

    Yet BYU fans were skipping BCS berths and wins and "questing" straight to a national title game. That's just priceless.

  • Cougsndawgs West Point , UT
    July 1, 2013 11:33 a.m.

    Howie:
    "Which would they choose between mid major Indy and a PAC 12 invitation?"

    I'll answer that question. I would choose independence again over being in the PAC 12. BYU gets more exposure than Utah. BYU has more freedom and isn't told what to do and how to schedule by a conference. BYU doesn't have to wallow in mediocrity playing elite programs in a conference way over their heads. BYU can schedule how they want and travel to venues and new places all over the country. BYU already has great facilities and amenities, and unlike Utah isn't in the red on budget (so money isn't an issue).

    Trust me on this Howie. 6-7 yrs from now when Utah has been to 1, maybe 2 bottom tier bowls, had 5-6 losing seasons and the honeymoon with the PAC12 has ended while licking your wounds from the beatings U take, independence will look pretty good. And in honesty and fairness, BYU would be in the same boat as U if they were in the Big 12. It's reality, and after the newness has worn off those beatings are going to test ute fans' loyalty.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    July 1, 2013 11:46 a.m.

    BYU looks to apply lessons learned from its ‘Quest for Perfection’
    By Ryan Greene

    Consider it a slogan that was maybe misconstrued a tad.

    Either way, BYU set out last season on a "Quest for Perfection" — a saying found on numerous T-shirts and whatnots throughout the greater Provo area. What it came up with was a disappointing 10-3 finish.

    Of course, 10-3 is nothing to scoff at for most college football programs, but the Cougars reached for more. And though they wouldn't say it before the season began, they had dreams of filling the shoes ultimately worn by Utah as a BCS buster.

    "I think a lot of people outside of the program saw the 'Quest for Perfection' motto and took it definitely out of context," Cougar defensive back Andrew Rich. That whole thing was that we were definitely going to try to play as best as we could every Saturday. Not necessarily a perfect season as far as wins and losses go."

    -------------

    @Wiscougarfan

    Now I'm confused. You just said it was for a national title. But Rich said "Quest for Perfection" is "play as best as we could every Saturday".

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 12:09 p.m.

    @utieology... The team lost starting QB tand started something like 16 freshmen in the bowl game itself... A starting line up that was far different than the one that they lost the SEC Championship with a few weeks earlier... So yes, that doesn't sound like a team that is extremely motivated to me... But hey, you guys won and they were wearing Alabama uniforms... So get as much milage out of it as you can... LOL.

    @twomeaslybcswins... Jealous??? Of Utah??? That one made me chuckle.... Sure I am one of the BYU fans that would like to be in a BCS conference... I feel we are far more deserving of it than about 50% to 60% who are currently in one... But we're not, we're Independent and there is alot to be said for Independence... Great travel to some storied football programs and famous Stadiums all over the country...while Utah College fans get to see these programs come to their state... So I'll take it...

    Now would I trade trophy cases and our current position with Utah... NEVER... LOL...I love our National Championship, our Heisman, Doak Walker, and Outland Trophies and our dozens of Conference Championships.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    July 1, 2013 12:33 p.m.

    Cougsndawgs:

    "BYU doesn't have to wallow in mediocrity playing elite programs..."

    No, the Indy-WACers have to wallow in playing mediocre opponents from midmajorey conferences.

    "BYU already has great facilities and amenities, and unlike Utah isn't in the red on budget (so money isn't an issue)."

    I've never seen the Indy-WACers financial statements. Have you? If not, then you don't KNOW whether or not your athletic department has been leveraged, and you don't KNOW whether or not money is an issue. And if you don't KNOW...

    ...then you're just acting out all frantic and emotional, like a typical Indy-WACer.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    July 1, 2013 12:38 p.m.

    Cougsndawgs:

    "Trust me on this Howie. 6-7 yrs from now when Utah has been to 1, maybe 2 bottom tier bowls, had 5-6 losing seasons and the honeymoon with the PAC12 has ended while licking your wounds from the beatings U take, independence will look pretty good."

    Trust me on this Cougsndawgs, you don't KNOW how things will be looking for your big brother 6-7 yrs from now. Suggesting anything otherwise just makes you sound like another typical bitter, frantic and emotional Indy-WACer. But here's something that I DO know...6-7 yrs down the line, Utah will have a choice: We can choose to stay in the Pac-12, or we can choose to go Independent. What choices will YOU have?

    Edge: Utah.

    For what it's worth, whether we flop or thrive, Utah I believe the MOST LIKELY scenerio would be Utah stays in the Pac-12. It's better here.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    July 1, 2013 1:41 p.m.

    poyman:

    "The team lost starting QB tand started something like 16 freshmen in the bowl game itself..."

    Nope. You made that up. How frantic and emotional of you.

    John Parker Wilson went 18 of 30 in passing for 177-yds, and rushed for -31 yds on 12 carries in the Sugar Bowl vs. Utah. No other QB attempted a pass in that game, and the only other ball carriers were RBs (G.Coffee & M. Ingram).

    The Sugar Bowl opened via a 69-yd kickoff by Utah's Ben Vroman that 'Bama returned to the 28-yd line. The first play from scrimmage was Wilson handing off to Coffee for a 4-yd gain. the second play was Wilson completing a 6-yd pass for a first down. The Tide's LAST possession in the game went like this...

    (1) Wilson sacked by Sylvester (-8 yds)
    (2) Wilson pass incomplete to Jones.
    (3) Wilson pass intercepted by Johnson

    Then the Utes ran out the clock to close out the game.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    July 1, 2013 1:55 p.m.

    poyman (cont.):

    Wilson was a 3-yr starter for the Tide. His backup, Greg McElroy, went 8 of 11 for 123-yds, and did not play in the SEC Championship or Sugar games.

    "A starting line up that was far different than the one that they lost the SEC Championship with a few weeks earlier"

    Wilson was the starting QB for both the SEC CCG and the Sugar Bowl.

    Coffee and Ingram were the lead RB tandems for both the SEC CCG and the Sugar Bowl.

    Jones and Walker were the Tides top wide outs in both the SEC CCG and the Sugar Bowl. Stover caught one pass for 15-yds vs. Utah, but despite playing in the CCG, had 0 receptions vs. Fla.

    Arenas ran back both punt and kickoff returns in both games.

    Only Ingram and Jones were Freshmen, but they totaled 782 and 924 all purpose yards respectively, so you can't blame their "youth" for "lack of production".

    You're dubious claims are proof positive that you're still insanely jealous of your big brother's accomplishments (2 BCS Bowls, Pac-12 invite), so you have to rewrite history to assuage your soul crushing anguish. I love it!

  • 2BCSWINS West of I15, UT
    July 1, 2013 2:59 p.m.

    @poyman..."If you want to say that your program was better than ours before then, it probably was... But since then, Utah has take a seat towards the back of the bus when comparing the two programs."

    LOL...They were definitley better before then thats why you didn't list anything prior. I have no problem saying the Y was better in the 70's and 80's. The U however has been better for the last 20 years we can list head to head for that period if you want.

    As far as being jealous you trying to change my screenname from 2bcswins to twomeaslybcswins says it all....LOL!! No other fan in the country would call 2 BCS wins measly but a cougie fan. If it's so measly then tell me why the cougies have 0 BCS wins? Thats like me saying the cougies have a measly Nat title but that would sound ridiculous. Although I think Utah proved more in 2008 I still give the Y credit for winning a Nat title 30 years ago.

  • Cougars - Wise Older Brothers Anaheim, CA
    July 1, 2013 5:17 p.m.

    2B

    "The U however has been better for the last 20 years we can list head to head for that period if you want."

    Unfortunately for U, head-to-head isn't the sole factor in determining which team was better.

    Top 25 Finishes
    BYU 8
    Utah 6

    Top 15 Finishes
    BYU 5
    Utah 3

    Top 10 Finishes
    BYU 3
    Utah 3

    Conference Championships
    BYU 7
    Utah 5

    10+ Win Seasons
    BYU 8
    Utah 6

    National Individual Awards
    BYU 2
    Utah 0

    BYU had a great Cotton Bowl win
    Utah had a great Sugar Bowl win and a mediocre Fiesta Bowl win (despite the BCS hype, BYU's dismantling of then #16 Oregon State in the 2009 Las Vegas Bowl was much more impressive)

    BYU 1996 beat SEVEN teams with winning records including three Top 25 teams - #16/#15 Washington in Seattle, #22/#22 Wyoming in the WAC CCG, and #17/#17 Kansas State in the Cotton Bowl

    Utah 2008 three nail-biting home wins versus ranked teams and a big win over Alabama in the Sugar Bowl

    Utah 2004 only FOUR wins against teams with winning records including ONE "barely" ranked team - #25/unranked Pittsburgh in the Fiesta Bowl

    Advantage - BYU!

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 7:54 p.m.

    @navel and utieology... I guess it was their outland trophy winner that was suspended and couldn't play... He was Alabama's Mr. Football in 2006 and considered the primary protection for Wilson (their QB) and a highly rated run blocker... He was drafted #6 overall that year and went to the Cincinatti Bengals... His absense left a huge hole in the Offensive line....

    Oh and 2measlybowlwins... LOL... playing and winning two bowls is far different than winning a national championship... simply ask reps from a team that has done it... They will tell you there is no comparison. When you guys are good enough to win a NC then you have license to come back and talk about how bad y'all are...
    And 2measly, we weren't just better than your team in the 70's and 80's we Dominated you in the same fashion as Sac State dominated your guys on your home floor last year in basketball... You won 2 games in 20 years... 2... LOL... And the 21 year period from 1990 thru 2010 shows BYU winning 10 and Utah winning 11... Hardly a case for dominance (particularly when you consider that 3 of those came during the Crowton years.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    July 1, 2013 7:58 p.m.

    2measly, I have already said this twice in this thread, but here it goes again...

    Think of the number 8... That's the number of times your team has had a better record than our team in 41 years... soon to be 42.

  • moderateinmagna MAGNA, UT
    July 2, 2013 3:37 a.m.

    Not only was Atuaia a coach before he was a running back at BYU,years ago with Lavell ashis coach so i think he knows a little bit about running backs.

  • moderateinmagna MAGNA, UT
    July 2, 2013 4:41 a.m.

    since when did the topic change to utes vs cougars ,this is an article about Taysom Hill,almost every poster on here is off topic, get on topic and stop being disruptive,you are all abusing this thread to spout your hatred and it needs to stop.

  • k56sportsfan Draper, UT
    July 4, 2013 8:58 a.m.

    I thought that this article was about Taysom Hill?
    Anyway, Ammon Olsen will earn this starting spot by the 3rd game of the 2013 season... Last thing we need is to repeat the same type of a skill set that this position has had the last couple of years... BYU needs to go back to what brought BYU greatness - Emphasize the Passing Game, Good D and now add an Up Tempo O!

    We need a QB that can make plays within the context of this O. We need a QB that can read + make decisions via a passing play's progression (let alone understand how to do a presnap read) + is accurate enough to throw past 5-7 yards... Ammon will be the next Great BYU QB.

  • iNKSpot Wilsonville, OR
    July 4, 2013 5:24 p.m.

    We all hope Coach Anae keeps his word about benching Taysom when he fails to protect himself. With a previous coach a few years ago we had a talented running back who seemed to get injured whenever he was tired. At the beginning of the season, they told him to protect himself by taking himself out of the game whenever he got tired. He tried to do that late in a game against Mississippi State. The coach rushed him back into the game next play, and he got injured.