Giving the Earned Income Tax Credit instead of a wage increase works much like
illegal immigration. Cheap labor subsidized by the taxpayer. Let's take away the retirement of federal workers and send them three
cases of chili each year instead.
Farm jobs and household labor still exist, have not been taken over by modern
technology, and are not covered by standard minimum wage rules. The
fact that you don't know this (or willfully misrepresent the facts
concerning it) invalidates the entirety of your column. You either
lack knowledge of the situation or your point does not stand on facts.
Mr. Bennett trots out the usual objections to raising the minimum wage, but his
argument does not survive the application of simple reality.In terms
of real purchasing power, today's minimum wage is far below any minimum
wage of the past 60 years. Case in point, my first minimum wage job in 1970 at
$1.60 per hour had the equivalent buying power of $9.50 per hour in today's
dollars. The business that paid me that wage in 1970 is still going strong. If
it paid the equivalent of $9.50 per hour then, it'll survive just fine
paying its entry level employees $9 per hour today.Moreover, several
states in the nation today already have minimum wages established well above the
federal minimum, and yet there is _no_ correlation between their higher minimum
wages and the health of their economies. In fact, the unemployment rates in
states with higher minimum wages is below the national average.There
is simply no rational basis for permitting employers to pay wages that are so
low that they ensure that their employees will live in poverty.
If you are a person who is working for minimum wages, you had better be a
teenager or and unskilled worker at an entry level job. If you do not have
marketable job skills, what were you doing when you should have been developing
them? All higher minimum wage laws do is decrease the number of entry level jobs
and increase unemployment for teenagers.
"Why not make raise the minimum wage to $20 an hour?"This is
the standard conservative argument, but many economists tell us that SMALL
increases in the minimum wage is neither inflationary or job killing. SMALL
increases draw more young and poor people into the work force because the
slightly higher pay becomes an incentive to work.You would think
that conservatives would embrace an idea which encourages people to work!
Minimum wage is the best way to hurt poor people. Why not just make it $100 per
hour. That way everyone could be rich. In fact, every time the minimum wage is
raised, unemployment goes up. It does the opposite of helping people. It just
makes uninformed people think Obama is doing something for them.
The EITC creates people who don't owe federal income tax--that 47% of
Americans much maligned by Republicans.It is ironic that Mr. Bennett
would propose increasing it.
Sorry, Senator, but most other economic studies show no loss of jobs, and a mild
stimulative effect. I do agree that we need to do more in areas of rural
It should be noted that there is sharp disagreement among labor economists on
whether raising the minimum wage actually results in decreased employment among
the poor. The quality of Wikipedia articles varies in general, but on the topic
of the minimum wage, there is an excellent review of the extensive research and
literature on the subject, from different viewpoints.The interesting
question is why have labor economists gone from (in 1978) 90% supporting the
idea that minimum wage increases hurt the poor to roughly an even split pro
& against increasing the minimum in a survey in 2013 (with a clear trend
line toward less certainty among economists about minimum wage effects and
greater support of the idea that increasing the minimum wage does NOT impact
employment significantly)?Based on the rigorous analysis done by
economists Krueger and Card, and subsequent challenges and confirmations of
their research, it's simply not a cut & dried truth that increasing the
minimum wage negatively impacts employment.The data doesn't
clearly support what should be a clear supply & demand truism. Possible
explanations include as the minimum wage rises, there is less turnover among
low-end employees, and thus greater productivity.
yawnThe same old arguments of failed economics, the likes of which,
led us to the horrific economic situation we are in today.How many
more times do we need to hear that more money to richies=more jobs for us and
that less money for richies=less jobs for us? How many more times does this need
to be debunked?Over the past few years many businesses and CEOs have
seen record profits. So where are the jobs?If tax cuts and record
profits (at the top) meant more jobs for the rest of us bums, then why was this
past decade so pathetic in job creation?Repubs? Where are you?!Even Bruce Bartlett, former Reagan cabinet member and once big time
promoter of these voodoo economics, admits that they were wrong. Time for America to wake up and take its country back from the rich, corrupt,
and selfish. We're being robbed of our wealth and democracy.
Raising the minimum wage will do two things: Send jobs overseas and raise the
unemployment rate for the American work force. The minimum wage... any wage is
not the business of government.I can't believe the abject
stupidity of some of our politicians (actually, most politicians).
Re: "Raising minimum wage won't help poor"Of course it
won't. It wasn't even intended to. This
Washington-mandated move was motivated by the same leftist political motives as
the sequester, gun-rights battles, demands for tax increases, the federal
takeover of American healthcare, leftist environmental and land-use scams, the
destruction of our national defense capability, and the co-optation of American
academe.That motive -- admitted last week by unashamed NC Democrat
apparatchiks -- is "evisceration" of any opposition to socialization and
perpetual leftist control of America and its economy.
So a minimum wage increase will do nothing for poverty but an earned income
credit will? Was it not just last fall that every republican was crying that
Romney was right and half of Americans were government leeches?Why
don't republicans admit that in capitalism there will always be poor
people? Why do they not also admit they do not want or have a plan to help
people move up? What have they proposed to move people out of poverty?
The problem with the Earned Income Tax Credit is that it is too little and may
be too late. But it is a step in the right direction. In order to
make any head way in the path toward civilization, along with the idea of equal
justice for all, we must find a better way to redistribute the wealth created by
the people for the people to the people. History is full of
examples of nations and societies that toppled when the weight of the wealth and
privilege gets too heavy at the top. America will be no different. The real solution is to eliminate unemployment. The EITC is only a tiny baby
step toward the goal of full employment and a balanced redistribution of the
life force of a stable society. But it is a start.
As I'm sure Senator Bennett knows, there are studies on both sides of the
question of the effect of minimum wage laws on employment. Mr. Saltsman is a
conservative who works for a business supported think tank. Not surprisingly, he
supports a point of view. There is nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong
with Senator Bennett adopting that view in an opinion piece. But no one should
come away thinking the question is clear-cut, as Mr. Saltsman and Senator
Liberal Larry: Increasing the minimum wage, pushed by liberals, is in reality
just more contempt heaped upon those who can't get anything better.
Increasing the minimum wage only tells those who get those jobs that
'paternalistic' government is looking out for them because they just
can't figure it out by themselves. What a poor way to raise a child.
Liberals, where is your faith in your own child's ability to succeed
without you giving them your contemptable mimimum wage jobs (contemptable to
them, not to those who believe any job is worth having, no matter what it pays)?
What kind of thinking is this? Did you not teach your child anything but
'daddy will take care of you?' If this isn't the grampa claus
mentality I don't know what is! Come on, teach your child to live in the
real world and go to work to improve his/her life! It makes them better
citizens, parents, and children. The problem we have today is not the children,
its the parents of the children who are teaching them.
@Shaun:"Was it not just last fall that every republican was crying
that Romney was right and half of Americans were government leeches?"Republicans were crying because it handed the Dems a powerful talking
point. But Romney spoke the truth. He forgot that, in a campaign with Dems,
you need to avoid the truth at all costs and tell the people what they wanna
hear. That's what Obama did. And that's what got him elected.
Examples? 'I'm for abortion, illegal immigration, open borders,
amnesty, same-sex marriage...'"Why don't republicans
admit that in capitalism there will always be poor people?"Again, you can't speak the truth or you'll never win an election
because 'low information' people vote. And there's more and more
of them as the years go by. And they flock to the Democrat party.@Ultra Bob:"In order to make any head way in the path toward
civilization, along with the idea of equal justice for all, we must find a
better way to redistribute the wealth..."Try socialism. It
worked... for awhile."The real solution is to eliminate
unemployment."Obama is trying... by having his governmnet hire
more government workers.
@wrz: The term "low information voters" is a little
disparaging, don't you think? After all, you apparently don't realize
that there are fewer government employees now than there were before President
Obama took office, and only marginally more federal employees. But I would never
call you a "low information voter".
If we drop minimum to $2 per hour who would it help? Not the people making the
wage, that's for sure.
Are more minimum wage jobs with small business or big corporations? If it is the
former, not sure how raising minimum wage is going to help employment. These
small businesses are struggling right now. Either they will have to lay off
workers or they will have to raise prices to consumers or some combination of
both. If it is the latter, then of course more can be done on this matter.
Teenage unemployment is as high as I've ever personally seen it. I'm
not sure how raising the minimum wage is going to help that. I think it would
make most businesses (big, medium and especially small) less inclined to hire
Raising the minimum wage may not help get people out of poverty, but it sure
won't hurt them, either.As for some claims that only entry
level workers are getting minimum wage, that's simply false now. I know
several well educated, very experienced and skilled workers whose jobs were
killed by the Cheney/Bush depression. Despite months of looking and looking
very hard for work, these workers have been forced to accept jobs at minimum or
near minimum wages -- probably because of their age.I wonder how
quickly the tone of many comments here would abruptly change if the people who
write them suddenly found themselves to be "obsolete?"
@one old man:"Raising the minimum wage may not help get people out of
poverty, but it sure won't hurt them, either."It's not
too smart to raise wages in the middle of a recession. The net result is to
either raise the unemployment numbers or send more jobs overseas... or both.
Count on it.Matter of fact, the government should not be in the
business of deciding what employees should be paid. That's the job of the
economy. But, trust Democrats to get their fingers into everything.
@Alfred"Matter of fact, the government should not be in the business
of deciding what employees should be paid. That's the job of the economy.
But, trust Democrats to get their fingers into everything."I
suppose if we disregard world economic history and US political history, your
assertion makes some sense. However, as an example, unregulated capitalism (or
the "economy" as you put it) has shown quite a strong demand for 6
year-old children working 80 hours a week for minimal wages. Child labor laws,
the number of hours in a work week, minimum wages, and countless other
regulations have been enacted by Democrats AND Republicans over the years to
help the "economy" do its job in a manner that respects individual
rights and liberties. If you believe Democrats are solely responsible for this,
then you can thank Democrats for making this country a great place for you to
live and raise your family.
Sen. Bennett points out that a "low wage family can file a tax return and
get a check from the government, which encourages work even at entry level, low
paying jobs." I agree, but simple human psychology tells us that prospect
of receiving a reward (i.e., a tax refund) up to 14 months in the future is not
going to affect behavior (getting and keeping a job) remotely as effectively as
making the same investment in higher wages today. All animal trainers (and we
are animals) know the proximity of the reward to the behavior is essential.
Therfore, the same money (spent on the EITC) channeled to hiring employers to
offset a higher minimum wage law would be much more effective than Sen.
Bennett's proposal. Sen. Bennett makes the easy
intellectual argument that $20/hr is the wrong (too high) minimum wage, but
provides absolutely no evidence that the increase proposed by the president is
wrong or that the current minimum wage is correct. Absent all of this
discussion, his piece is not compelling.
Have we all lost our minds? Do we forget how we manage our own finances? Why
do we keep asking someone for something that is not practicable? It's like
a small child asking that Santa come live with them so they can have any toy
they desire. Sure it would be great if we all made more than enough money.
Americans have confused wants with needs. Each of us have made life decisions
that have had a consequence as to our ability to make money. Do we really
believe in the Wizard of Oz? There is some magical solution to correct our
decisions? Put away the electronic devices and get out there and find a
different path. Stop asking for the Wizard to fix what we should be able to
fizz for ourselves . I remember being told-why should I dot for you what you
can do for yourself? Unions and unfunded pension plans have promised more than
we can give.
If we, as Republicans, expect to win elections beyond Utah, we need to come up
with ideas. Throwing rocks at Democratic ideas is not very creative. It is not
a new idea, and it is not good politics. It demonstrates a lack of cooperation
and a lack of compromise. This negative attitude permeates Utah politics and is
hurting all Republicans. If we expect potential candidates, like John Huntsman,
to have a successful future in the Republican Party, we need to stop throwing
rocks at the ideas of others and present good idea for the future of America.
Oh, I get it. The illustrious former Senator wants the taxpayer to foot the
bill for pay raises via the EITC. Spoken like a true politician... hide the
raise in a tax return so the taxpaying public won't see it.The
EITC was a bad idea from the start and should be canceled post-haste.
micawber"After all, you apparently don't realize that there
are fewer government employees now than there were before President Obama took
office, and only marginally more federal employees."Just curious
where you got your figures. I was in a meeting with Mr. Bishop who said the
good news was that the stimulus had created 130,000 new jobs - the bad news was
that they were all in govt.Please qualify your remarkes.
The necessities of life can only come from two sources, pay checks from the
private sector or welfare programs paid by the taxpayers. The lower the wage,
the higher the cost to the taxpayer.
"The idea of a federal minimum wage arose when many Americans worked as
unskilled laborers on farms, in factories, or retail stores or as household help
and were often paid less than their work was worth. That situation has changed
as most of those jobs have disappeared in the age of technology."Retail jobs have been eliminated by technology? Really? What part of your
average Wallmart expereince has been replaced by technology? What part of
technology has made farm workers redundant? I generally enjoy Mr.
Bennetts thoughts.... but really?There isn't a week that goes
by that the Deseret News doesn't have some piece extolling the values of
stay at home moms. And yet, the only way for minimum wage workers to raise a
family is to have multiple incomes in the same household.I do think
obsurdly high minumum wages are simply bandaides.... but still. He does get a
bit oversimplistic here.
IJ -- you say your source was Rob Bishop?That explains why it is not
Raising wages hurts jobs so I told my employer "no, I would not like a raise
this year" - said no one ever.
A rising tide lifts ALL boats -- Ronald ReaganQ: Why is it a GOOD
thing when Pres. Reagan propossed it, but a BAD thing when Pres. Obama
propoesses the exact same thing?A: petty politics
Yes, a rising tide lifts all boats. The problem is that we are dealing with a
falling tide, which grounds the boats in the shallowest water first.Standard of living is inextricably linked to energy costs. The Obama
administration is intentionally pushing up energy prices, and many are calling
for carbon taxes that will drive energy prices even higher. So what should
happen when our standard of living goes down?When standard of living
goes up, there is a general migration of workers away from agriculture and
manual labor into other areas. It seems logical there should be a reverse
migration when the standard of living goes down. However, practically all
laid-off workers are content to accept welfare rather than migrate to manual
labor, so illegal immigrants are taking all those jobs.The focus on
"soaking the rich" is a red herring that distracts us from the real
problem. The entire wealth of all the rich wouldn't run our government for
very long. Then what? Low-cost energy is what we need, and that won't
happen with wind and solar. We need nuclear power.