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Brandon Doman discusses quarterback Riley Nelson's legacy at BYU

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  • fender Washington, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 2:18 p.m.

    Wow! Doman's statements here say it all. He just doesn't get it. There are plenty of tough guys in the game of football, but being tough by itself doesn't qualify anybody as a QB. Doman may love Nelson's attitude, but it's his job to identify the guy who can make all the throws and get him on the field...this is just sad. I've seen this kind of thing happen at the high school level, but you certainly wouldn't expect this at the upper D1 level.

  • mightymite DRAPER, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 2:34 p.m.

    Why do Bronco and Brandon baby and make excuses for the Nelson. This little love triangle shows failing not only in Nelson lack of talent but also the coaching staffs lack of assessing talent and overall decision making. The plan fact of the matter is Nelson does not have the quarterback talent nor game savvy in order to play on the college level.

  • dbrbmw Orem, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 2:50 p.m.

    Riley legacy = possibly the worst BYU QB ever. If not the worst that the second worse BYU QB ever. Lesson learned!

  • Zorro Bakersfield, CA
    Nov. 22, 2012 3:46 p.m.

    4-5 as a starter this season and they are bragging!
    13 TD, 12 Pics and 21 sacks! No wonder Bronco said he was thankful for a job on True Blue monday night!

  • montanacutter2 KALISPELL, MT
    Nov. 22, 2012 4:10 p.m.

    You have to be kidding me. Nelson is the worst QB in modern times at BYU. How many pick 6s does he have? I think 4. And for Bronco and Doman to say Nelson is tough. What makes a good QB is knowing when he can help the team, not be in the game knowing he is not up to making the plays need to win. In fact, I have competed against Bronco in cutting. He would stick with a horse that really was not going to win for him. Bronco is still going with someone that has grit but knows he will not win with him. Life is to short not to have a QB that will give you the best chance to win. Nelson has proven he is not that QB. Nelson stay hurt and let Lark start for BYU Sat.

  • nairbnosral American Fork, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 4:39 p.m.

    Is Lark just not very good? I've never seen him play so I can't judge his ability as a quarterback. Has he made Mendenhall and Doman mad? I just don't understand why he hasn't been given a chance. If Riley really does give the cougars the best chance to win, that's a sad commentary on BYU football this year.

  • aunt lucy Looneyville, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 4:39 p.m.

    Could this have been the year heaps matured into his potential? This team would be possibly undeafted with just a little improvement in the QB play. I'm glad I'm not the guy who has to live with losing the number one ranked QB in college football only to have to rely on Nelson.

  • H-man Shreveport, LA
    Nov. 22, 2012 5:10 p.m.

    It seems to me there is a difference between determination, tenacity, and grit on the one hand and foolhardiness on the other. While I don't have any experience with football, I do have experience with running. If I injure my hamstring during the middle of the running season, I have two choices. I can continue to show grit by hobbling along and probably aggravating the injury even more, making the recovery even longer and more difficult. Second, I could bite the bullet and sit out and allow my body to heal fully so that I can return to running at full strength and sooner rather than later. In my example of running, I am the only one affected if I continue to race while injured. In Riley Nelson's case he has hurt himself as well as the entire team. C'mon, Riley, show that you're a sportsman instead of a selfish glory hog by trying to show you can play while hurt. Do the right thing and sit out this next game. Let a fully healthy James Lark start. Or are you and the coaches afraid that Lark might show you up?

  • Henry Drummond San Jose, CA
    Nov. 22, 2012 5:21 p.m.

    It is tough rising to the expectations the BYU community has of its quarterbacks. Last season people wanted Jake Heaps to lead them back to the Glory Years. It did not take long for fans to become disenchanted with him. They booed him off the field and wanted somebody else. Its not surprising they have run out of quarterbacks. It will take patience to build a winning program. Do BYU fans have that patience?

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 5:58 p.m.

    Wow Bishop, if the kid is hurt you have the responsiblity to protect him from himself. How do you simply let him run back on the field after the onside kick knowing he's hurt, but not knowing how badly? If you have a timeout you use it. If you don't have a timeout put in the backup QB until you know what is physically wrong with your Starter. Especially if your QB is Riley, who would play on just one healthy lung. I'd hate to work for you on Sundays.

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 6:00 p.m.

    Henry - to answer your question...no. No way! Look at how talented this team is.

  • Pa. Reader Harrisburg, PA
    Nov. 22, 2012 6:05 p.m.

    Since Bronco and Doman feel such a connection to Riley, wouldn't it be nice for the trio to all leave BYU together at the end of this season?
    There is no reason to believe things will get better next year with a rougher schedule and an inexperienced quarterback coming off a serious injury that happened due to boneheaded coaching.
    If changes aren't made in this off season it will be more of the same next year as a once proud and prolific offense swirls around the drain under an unqualified OC.

  • RockOn Spanish Fork, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 6:13 p.m.

    Good comments, patronizing article. Cheerleading Jeff Call! As Greg Wrubel pointed out, of all the BYU
    QBs who have thrown for 2000+ yards in one season, the worst is... Jake Heaps. Second worst... Riley Nelson.

    Bronco recruited 3 QBs: Heaps, Nelson and Lark (who was never given a chance to start). Enough said on Bronco's ability to evaluate and/or develop talent.

  • wer South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 6:41 p.m.

    While Riley has unfortunately, no "legacy" at BYU, let's quit harping against Bronco. He's BYU's coach and will continue to be until he decided to leave. It will be a sad day when that happens.

    (For those critics who have the same appetite for dishing it out as Riley has for absorbing it, name five current college coaches who could have even the remotest chance of being BYU's head coach next season. Don't even think of Detmer. He would be a great QB coach, not a head coach.)

  • GilmerTexasCougar Gilmer, TX
    Nov. 22, 2012 7:01 p.m.

    Admiration is nice, but that's about as dumb as anything I've ever heard. When you don't even know what the injury is you wait until the doctor has made a determination if the injured player can safely go back into the game. Since Nelson cannot pass why hasn't he been utilized in another position where he doesn't have to pass? Doman and Bronco should have made that decision last year.

  • Wayne Rout El Paso, TX
    Nov. 22, 2012 7:32 p.m.

    Riley? Legacy? He will be remembered as the most unqualified person to ever play the position in the last 50 years...but he is Bronco's friend.

  • Still Blue after all these years Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 7:33 p.m.

    To wer: Charley Strong @ Louisville.

  • BYU DUDE Provo, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 7:41 p.m.

    Brandon Doman is the most unprepared Offensive coordinator in BYU history , its time for him to move on and take Bronco with him.

  • stargazer Murray, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 7:44 p.m.

    Bronco and Brandon are in denial. Will be so "thankful" for the season to be over and the Bronco / Riley lovefest is history.

  • Uncle Rico Sandy, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 8:49 p.m.

    I don't blame Riley, I don't even care anymore.

  • Mildred in Fillmore Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 8:50 p.m.

    A quarterback other than Riley this year and we are National Champs.

  • UC Baller Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:12 p.m.

    After watching Timpview HS in the State Championship game, I would take that Lloyd QB right now over Nelson. Throws it a tone better. Has way better decision making ability. And is a winner.

    Of course, after this year and the way BYU treats their QB's....no way I would go there. This article is very interesting...

  • Cougar Claws Lindon, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:15 p.m.

    Riley Nelson's legacy at BYU is that he single handedly ruined the BYU football program for 3 straight years. Maybe he provided for some good entertainment at times for the viewership on ESPN but that is about it. He didn't get us to a relevant bowl game, he's wasted the potential of a lot of really talented players on both sides of the ball merely by taking up the quarterback spot and being unable to lead the team to wins. In what could have been Jake Heaps senior season, we are left to rebuild the entire team on the cusp of the most difficult schedule in BYU history. We're losing a myriad of seniors on defense and quite possibly Kyle Van Noy because of declaring early for the NFL. The offensive line will be in shambles as well. We can only hope that Taysom Hill gets healthy as fast as possible. With the new mission rule in place which will deplete depth for the next few years, and with the possibility of super conferences looming, and "earning a seat at the table" becoming increasingly important, the future of BYU football is really uncertain right now.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:25 p.m.

    A quick first read of this article gives me the impression that Doman is trying to justify playing Nelson, even when he was hurt. And for Riley to grab his helmet and go running onto the field in the middle of an injury assessment by a doctor speaks volumes about a dysfunctional sideline and coaching responsibilities. Of course that was obvious some weeks ago when Taysom Hill was injured needlessly.

    I am alarmed at Doman saying Nelson is "probable" for Saturday's game. We all know Riley would never come out of the game on his own, even when he was "at 65%" of his ability so I must ask this question: "Who is running the show in Provo?" And why are these poor decisions that have resulted in a loss of at least 3 (and more like 4) games not at all consequential to those who cannot see the forrest for the trees?

    Don't the fans and donors deseerve a better outcome, based upon what is best for the program and the team, than allegiance to one "gutsy" player that cannot perform due to injury? Hint: It's no shame to be benched due to an injury.....none at all.

    Really!!!!

  • jim l West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:44 p.m.

    I dont understand all the dislike or hate directed at riley or the coach. Go eat some more turkey and calm down. It is just a game. They have shown what real men are made of.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:51 p.m.

    Look, I realize none of us raised our arm to the square and sustained Riley, Brandon or Bronco, but the disloyalty shown here is nauseating. Breaks my heart a lot more than losing so many close games this season.

    I am ashamed of you all.

  • EdGrady Idaho Falls, ID
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:53 p.m.

    Oh the humanity! When will it end!?

  • Proud Ute ,
    Nov. 22, 2012 9:54 p.m.

    Damage control by Doman, nothing more.
    He knows he's in trouble.

  • SillyRabbit Layton, 00
    Nov. 22, 2012 10:08 p.m.

    Don't be ashamed Mr. Y. The BYU team gets to keep playing all the way to a bowl without any of our approval or criticism.

    Since the fans aren't the ones playing, there's no reason to be ashamed of them. The questions should be put to the team.

    Is the BYU team good or poor this year?

    What is the root cause of that goodness or poorness?

    Are you happy or ashamed of their successes and losses?

    Keep that feeling to yourself, and live and let live.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 22, 2012 10:58 p.m.

    SillyRabbit

    I'm proud of my team, win or lose.

    Fans will do what they do, whether I'm ashamed of them or not. But if it matters, then you should know, I feel this behavior is shameful.

  • gdog3finally West Jordan, Utah
    Nov. 23, 2012 3:30 a.m.

    Legacy? Really? It wasn't the right move to keep nelson starting. Still, I felt sorry for Nelson, as he left it all on the field each game, and emptied his tank, only to have that painful dejected look on his face with each mounting loss in meaningful games. The team had to feel those losses as well, but Nelson will be remembered for the rest of his life as a loser to many a BYU fan. But that is life at the QB position. It's like coaches. People want to worship you or lynch you. That is sports

  • Max Charlotte, NC
    Nov. 23, 2012 4:45 a.m.

    It seems like the problem is that the coaches keep letting him play hurt. He doesn't play well when hurt and he shouldn't be in there. Why do they keep letting him play? I would think that a healthy Lark would be better than a banged up Nelson.

  • Norge Coug WEBSTER, MA
    Nov. 23, 2012 4:52 a.m.

    I'm as diehard and at times critical as most Cougar fans but the constant complaining about Riley and Bronco get really tedious. Of course we would like to have a better record and with a little luck we could be 10-1 or even 11-0. For those of you calling for Bronco's head I would remind you that Bronco has the 10 best record of any active coach in Div.1. That means there are 114 others with worse records. Some may say it's been against inferior competition. If that was so easy there'd be a lot of non-BCS coaches with similar results. That's not the case. He has 5 10+ win seasons out of 8 which puts him in rather elite company. As a matter of comparison Lavelle only had 2 such seasons in his first 8 campaigns.

    The fact of the matter is that there aren't a lot of qualified candidates out their in any event. We're lucky to have Coach Mendenhall and I'm confident he'll lead us to great heights. I'd suggest the lemmings here exhale and enjoy the ride.

  • coleman51 Orem, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 5:55 a.m.

    I have a real problem with the coaching staff at BYU. They have been responsible for playing a quarterback when visibly injured last week at San Jose State. James Lark should have played that last drive which ended when Nelson threw a wounded duck that floated in the arms of a San Jose State defender while at the same time, Nelson could hardly lift his arm after the previous series. Further, they played Taysom Hill at the end of the Utah State game and allowed him to run that cause significant injury so he was out for the season. These were the most egregious examples, but there have been other examples as well throughout the entire season, mostly calling bad calls that resulted in the loss of close games. Rather than blame players, we should be questioning the bad play-calling of the coaches at BYU. Bronco should be held accountable for this season and not be held on a pedestal because he preaches values at BYU.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Nov. 23, 2012 6:08 a.m.

    I know it's not good the throw your players under the bus, but for Doman to continue to rave about Nelson is beyond me. Holmoe's comments about the offensive woes at the BB media day, put my mind at ease, knowing that at least one person gets it.

    By the way, when do we talk about Doman's legacy?

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Nov. 23, 2012 6:17 a.m.

    @Y Grad / Y Dad - And I feel it is shameful to put make a kid play who is grimacing in pain on the sideline. Nelson should have never been in the game against Utah, BSU on SJSU in the 2nd half.

  • See It SPRINGVILLE, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 7:50 a.m.

    The problem is what we read is how Doman will remember Nelson. The legacy that everyone will remember will be that Nelson wss the worst quarterback that BYU has had in a long time who was supported by a coaching staff who supported his mediocrity. I also believe that he puts his own personal desire to play above the good of the team. He would rather go in and play even when he isn't physically capable of performing. What's worse is the coaches have allowed him to do it. His selfishness and poor play cost us the season.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:03 a.m.

    The kid is surely a scrapper and has a lot of character. It's the coaching that is the problem. That seems to be the consensus.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:22 a.m.

    CougFaninTX
    Frisco, TX
    "@Y Grad / Y Dad - And I feel it is shameful to put make a kid play..."

    Fairly stated but I would believe inaccurate. Don't think anyone but Riley made Riley play, and THAT would be a fair critique.

    Max
    Charlotte, NC
    "It seems like the problem is that the coaches keep letting him play hurt. He doesn't play well when hurt and he shouldn't be in there. Why do they keep letting him play? I would think that a healthy Lark would be better than a banged up Nelson."

    THIS is a critique that is fairly stated and very accurate.

  • MizzouBlue Carthage, MO
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:37 a.m.

    Doman said, "I'll love him for that forever for being tenacious that way and never quitting. That's how I'll remember him." Tenacious, never quitting, gritty, or tough don't necessarily translate into a good QB. You have to possess the skill that goes with this or any other position. This goes for players and coaches. And I should add good judgment as well. As fans, we've had to endure the lack of skill & jedgment at both the QB & OC positions. For one who is true blue, one word will describe what I'll remember about this year: FRUSTRATING!

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:43 a.m.

    Despite all the negatives there are shining moments for Riley.

    First of all, BYU is bowling this year. Several of you Ute fans chiming in on this article need a Kleenex over that one. Let the sobbing continue.

    As much as a BYU fan wants to win every game and return to the wonder years of Lavell Edwards these are different times. It takes a lot of talent to make it all happen and with Riley, well it was inconsistent at times and these injuries were problematic.

    But in this kids defense I will never forget that USU game when Heaps was pulled and Riley pulled out the win. That was a game and there were others as well. I'll agree that some decisions have been questionable but I'll let the coaches figure it out.

    It's a game, it's entertainment, and I have enjoyed it all. Like Y Dad, I'm a little embarrassed at some of these comments of the so called BYU faithful.

    Lighten up, it could be worse, you could be a Ute fan with no post season.

    Good luck Riley as you move on in life.

  • Cougar10 West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:49 a.m.

    The issue is that Doman is commending Riley for going back in the game against San Jose State. If Nelson were a true leader, he would have recognized that BYU's best chance to win the game would be with Lark, not him. Had he done this earlier in the year, BYU would have more wins (Utah and Boise to name a few).

    He is selfish and doesn't understand the concept of a team. If you truly care about the team, you don't play with a fractured back. That is not tough. That is not feisty. That is just plain stupid and most of all, immature. Give the Cougs a chance and have Riley sit out. he is not the future, his time is over - thank the heavens!

    My hope is that Riley and Doman are a package deal and that they both are gone after this year.

  • Winglish Lehi, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 8:54 a.m.

    The legacy of Riley Nelson is having the 94th best quarterback rating in NCAA football. This is out of the 117 quarterbacks who had enough snaps to qualify. 94th out of 117 is apparently the new standard at BYU.

  • LonestarRunner Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:04 a.m.

    Cougar10

    "The issue is that Doman is commending Riley for going back in the game against San Jose State. If Nelson were a true leader, he would have recognized that BYU's best chance to win the game would be with Lark, not him. Had he done this earlier in the year, BYU would have more wins (Utah and Boise to name a few)."

    I blame that decision entirely on Doman and Bronco.

    Doman should have had the foresight to have a quality backup QB prepared to be ready to step in at a moment's notice (and he certainly much more time to prepare than that.).

    Bronco should have taken responsibility to intercede when it became apparent the Doman was unwilling to sit Riley as long as Riley was still breathing.

  • caleby Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:12 a.m.

    Rudy with all of his tenacious, gritty, never quitting attitude is probably wishing he could have come to BYU under Bronco instead of Notre Dame. He could have been QB forever instead of one play at the end of his senior year. And he could have gotten carried off the field by his coaches every game!

    From a fan perspective BYU shouldn't pay Bronco 750K+ a year to "mold young men", they should pay him that kind of money to win games. If they want to hold great firesides and mold young men there are a lot of guys on CES salary that could do just as good of a job.

  • Informed Voter South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:29 a.m.

    I too am one 40 year fan of BYU who doesn't care anymore. 8:00 PM games just to be on ESPN3 against weak teams has dampened my interest. Going independent to be on TV showed little regard for long time fans. I do not think Nelson is physically well enough to play....did the coaches not see his agony while being examined on the bench last Saturday as I did on TV? What does coach Mendenhall tell Lark....after loyally working and waiting?

  • deductive reasoning Arlington, VA
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:46 a.m.

    Riley's legacy will be a gritty player who gave it his all, but because of poor decision-making by his coaches, spent his time playing a position he was ill-prepared to play -- physically, skill-wise, and decision-making wise.

    Doman should have stayed with the plan they had when Heaps was made BYU's starting QB, to play Riley on special teams, as a half-back or defensive back. If Heaps wasn't ready to be BYU's starter after the Utah State game, Lark should have been made BYU's starting QB.

  • nothegame Saratoga Springs, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:51 a.m.

    I played college football i was as they say as competitive as they come. I wouldn't pull myself out of a game either. It's up to the coaches to do that. I am a Ute fan but i can't beleive how much trust this coaching staff has in RN. If i were a QB now way would i want to go play for that staff.And about the bowl game who cares. Yes i wish we were going but these lower bowl games aren't what we all want right?

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 10:08 a.m.

    @nothegame

    utah "fans" like yourself would love to be in any bowl game at all this year. There are maybe 4-5 bowl games that have enough prestige to make any kind of claim of superiority, and even those don't mean much, it is the National Championship that actually means something, so going to a bowl game, any bowl game, is pretty much all that matters other than for the 2 teams that have a shot at a national championship.

  • dbrbmw Orem, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 10:15 a.m.

    You fired the DC and it worked out great. Now be great and fire the OC. This does two things, it makes us better offensively and it helps you keep your job Bronco.

  • Two For Flinching Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 10:28 a.m.

    It's true Duckhunter, most Utah fans would prefer to go to a bowl game this season. But our team didn't earn it this year. The level of play in conf. has stepped up and Utah needs to step up with it because there aren't nearly as many built in wins as Utah had in the past. When Utah does get back into a bowl it'll be great because I will know that Utah truly earned that spot.

    I disagree about all-non BCS bowls being all the same. The Outback Bowl and the Alamo Bowl are not the same as the Potato Bowl and the New Mexico Bowl. They really aren't even comparable. The first two mentioned are far more prestigious which is why they have better contracts with conferences, higher payouts, bigger stadiums, better time slots, etc. In short, they are more prestigious because better teams play in them when compared to lower tier bowls.

  • SUNNY ALL DAY Saint George, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 10:53 a.m.

    BYU has a wonderful stadium, dedicated administrators, fully-invested coaches and hard-working players as well as a pathetic fan base that does not deserve any of the above.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 10:57 a.m.

    Two For Flinching

    Calling a bowl "prestigious" is largely in the eye of the beholder.

    For Utah, playing in the Sugar Bowl was the greatest achievement and most prestigious bowl in Utah football history.

    For Alabama, playing in the Sugar Bowl was a bitter disappointment and far less prestigious than Alabama was hoping for.

    There is a certain "prestige" level to various bowls, but the bowl opponent is more important, and the final end-of-season rankings trump everything else.

    To say that not playing in a bowl is no big deal, however, is simply denying reality.

    On a scale of national championship being the ultimate success, and winless being ultimate failure, finishing with a winning record and qualifying for a bowl are the mininum standard for grading success versus failure.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:16 a.m.

    SUNNY ALL DAY

    "BYU has a wonderful stadium, dedicated administrators, fully-invested coaches and hard-working players as well as a pathetic fan base that does not deserve any of the above."

    That is an over generalization. Although there's not much evidence on this page to disprove it.

  • William Wallace OGDEN, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:30 a.m.

    Wow, I can't believe what I'm reading. People saying maybe Heaps could be maturing at QB right now? You only gave him 1/2 a season before you boo'd him off the field. Now we're wishing he was back? Seriously? The most fickle fans ever. Just keep hoping for Detmer, McMahon and Young to come back. Those kinds of guys wouldn't dare come to BYU. No loyalty whatsoever. By the way, don't hold your breath for Jabari Parker. He's got bigger goals in mind. Coach K will love him.

  • BigCougFan Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:31 a.m.

    Doman's comments only show the lovefest that exists between the coaches and Riley. Sad sad commentary. Please give Lark the starting position this week. Riley deserves a week off.

  • Cougar Claws Lindon, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:44 a.m.

    Re:William Wallace

    Like most fans I agree that it was the right move to pull Jake Heaps in the Utah State game.

    But it SHOULD HAVE STOPPED THERE!

    Jake should have been put back in the following week against San Jose State, but it never happened.

    I personally thought that the coaches benched Jake as a temporary move, and as a wake up call for Jake. I did not see this as some kind of permanent move. If anything that was shocking. What I also didn't understand why the team played so much harder for Riley. Shouldn't you play hard for any starting QB? I realize he wasn't playing efficiently, but I have never seen so many dropped passes in my life. Then all of the sudden, Riley throws the ball to receivers and they remember how to catch passes? I'm not buying it.

    I never bought into Riley's "team first" farce. In fact, I really don't think he was ever about the team at all. If it were up to Riley, he would keep the ball on every play and never even throw it. He throws to keep playing.

  • mightymite DRAPER, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 12:10 p.m.

    If Bronco and Brandon only paid more attention to thier responcibility as coaches instead of coddling Riley, perhaps there would be a few more wins. The coaches are so concerned about this guys mental health that they failed the team. Changed need to be made in leadership.

  • ClarkeinAK Anchorage, AK
    Nov. 23, 2012 12:36 p.m.

    So, if the blame isn't on Nelson, then it is squarely on Doman and Mendenhall. Doman is terrible as an OC and Bronco's love of grit has cost the program...both need to be removed as soon as the final snap is made. Bronco can stay at the DC, if he will swallow a demotion, but Doman needs to find another line of work. Andy Reed needs to be offered the job - he will be unemployed soon - and BYU needs to pay whatever it takes to get him to Provo.

    Also, there is no way, shape or form that BYU should be considering rejoining the MWC. Indepence isn't all that it's made out to be because of scheduling, but as someone who lives outside the Utah bubble, that conference (and the WAC) are laughing stocks and BYU would be better served finding another conference besides either of those.

  • ClarkeinAK Anchorage, AK
    Nov. 23, 2012 12:39 p.m.

    wer: I can name five: Andy Reed, Andy Reed, Andy Reed, Andy Reed and Andy Reed.

  • phantomblade Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 23, 2012 12:43 p.m.

    Mildred in Fillmore

    "A quarterback other than Riley this year and we are National Champs."

    Despite your usual hyperbole, your statement has some elements of validity.

    Where would BYU be right now if the Cougars had had an offense to match their defense, starting at QB? Instead of starting Riley Nelson, they'd had a QB like Max Hall or John Beck or *gasp* James Lark, who could stand in the pocket, read defenses, and deliver an accurate pass. Instead of Doman, they'd had an experienced OC who ran a traditional BYU-style offense and could take full advantage of Apo, Hoffman, and Williams, instead of constantly putting his QB at risk running option plays? Instead of having an offensive line plagued by false starts, BYU had had a well-coached offensive line that could pass protect and not self-destruct.

    It's not a stretch to see that this team could have been undefeated IF the coaches had done a better job of utilizing the offensive talent BYU had available.

    Where would an undefeated BYU be ranked today, with a road win at Top 10 Notre Dame, and home wins against Top 25 ranked Oregon State and Utah State?

  • AZJazzFan Gold Canyon, az
    Nov. 23, 2012 12:52 p.m.

    As poor as Nelson has played, the thuoght is a painful one to imagine Heaps again. Heaps was the opposite, not gutsy, not a gamer but he had a good arm. Still, as poor as RN has been he is an improvement over Heaps. Despite it all I will cheer on the cougs at NMS and here is hoping Lark gets the start.

  • Outsideview Federal Way, WA
    Nov. 23, 2012 1:19 p.m.

    Yes, we know Nelson is a "tough guy". That image, however, got kind of old. It wasnt a question of "if" he would get hurt doing his tough guy act, but "when". The coaches should have known that and been prepared. Also, they should have been smart enough to make the decision to replace Nelson when he lied to them and said that he could play and be effective. Coaches were at fault there.

    IT has been a pretty bad year for coaching decisions. Especially on the offensive side. It was known that the kicking game was in trouble. Why not have a reliable option there even for point after kicks and modest field goals.

    I know BYU football is not really about football, but something needs to change for things to improve. It has been quite a waste of a great defense.

  • David Centerville, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:13 p.m.

    Football players love the game and want to be on the field. I am not surprised that Riley would grab his helmet and head back onto the field after the successful onside kick against SJS. The coaches need better sideline control and management.

    As for most of the comments here: fans want to win because they feel better about themselves, and they love being associated with a winning team/program. When things don't go well there is frustration.

    Fans pay the money to attend the games, buy the food, buy the Y sweaters, hats and t-shirts. Fans watch the games on tv giving ratings that yield contracts and negotiating positions.

    But fans don't usually know or understand all of the background information behind decisions and events on a team. We have to trust administrators, coaches and players.

    But administrators, coaches and players should respect fans because if the fans lose interest and passion, the program will suffer.

    It is a careful dance that isn't being managed well. There are many fans that are not satisfied with a 10 win season, where wins are against weak opponents. BYU needs to start winning big games.

  • David Centerville, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:17 p.m.

    Why isn't BYU winning big games? Are coaches not preparing and spending the time necessary to win these games? Are there coaches that are unqualified or not right for the program? Are the wrong players on the field? Who is providing subjective, honest feedback and assessment for the coaching and the team's performance? Is recruiting and player talent not up to par to win the big games? How well does the coaching staff make adjustments during the game?

    If the structure isn't in place to win the big games, then change the structure.

    If what we see from BYU is what the coaches and administration want, then we will continue to get more of the same. But I believe fans will stop spending as much time and money following the football team.

  • moderateinmagna MAGNA, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:23 p.m.

    Well all i can say is if the o line gets tired of not having a score they most likely wont give Nelson any protection and he could get badly hurt,i've seen this happen many times in high school games and a few times in college if he continues to be a detriment to the team i can see this happening,and it will be the coaches fault,they continue this love affair with Nelson but he has single handedly lost 3 games with his crummy play and Bronco and Doman just dont get it teams get tired of losing after a while and just decide that enough is enough,time to play Lark and give Riley a rest before he gets seriously injured or killed.

  • BigCougar Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:41 p.m.

    His Legacy? A selfish player who put himself ahead of his team. Even if you're twice as good as your backup, some injuries reduce your effectiveness to the point that you are hurting the team by trying to play. There is no question that was the case with the Utah and Boise St games and even the end of the SJSU game.

    Who's running this team anyways? Some of the blame is Riley for lying to the coaches and his teammates about the extent of his injuries but some of the blame lies with the coaches for not taking control of the situation and saying, "Sorry pal, we want to win the game more than we care about your wanting to play."

    This season will forever be known as the season of "What could have been"

  • Hegdehog Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:48 p.m.

    It's the coach's job to be objective and not play favorites. Why does Riley's inner need to play override the other 84 player's inner need to win the game?

    The one or two brilliant plays he makes a game are far outweighed by the dozen or so missed throws to open WR's, times he takes a critical sack because he held the ball too long and killed the drive, killed the drive with a fumble or INT, or held the ball on the option and took a loss instead of pitching it, etc.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:52 p.m.

    Again, I find it curious outside of the delusional BYU bubble that opposing coaches and the national media find Nelson to be a decent QB and for Bronco to be an exceptional coach. Of course all these people are idiots and most of these BYU fans know all.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 2:58 p.m.

    David:

    BYU IS winning games. Bronco has a better record than LaVell Edwards did through his first six seasons as a coach. I think Bronco has the fourth or fifth highest winning percentage of any coach over the period he has been coaching. There's about 120 BCS football playing schools so I would say that is pretty good. Again, I think BYU supporters are a bit out of whack with their expectations of the program especially with A) the school's higher mission which I think Bronco serves the school and church well and B) the challenges BYU has in recruiting with its honor code and being a church university located in Utah.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 3:06 p.m.

    ClarkinAK:

    Andy Reed is spelled REID. And I think Reid needs take some time off and attend to his family. He won't ask me of course but it would be in best interest. He will be fired by the Eagles and he had expectations as great as BYU fans had with their own team. Despite playing 16 games, his win total will not equal's BYU's who will play in three less. I think Reid is a great coach but he probably deserves some time off. I'm not sure he is a savior and like I have alluded to before, I don't think BYU needs a "savior". They have a good coach. They need to tweak things of course and there were some issues this year. I don't Nelson was as good as most of the BYU QBs of the last 30 or so years but he isn't as awful as people think. Lastly, there are more important things than football and I'm glad Bronco knows this and let's all know that he knows this...

  • Tenn12 Orem, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 4:55 p.m.

    Eagle, I don't think fan expectations are out of whack one bit. If you have paid attention the last few years, Bronco has mismanaged many situations. From the quarterback controversy, to hiring an inexperienced OC, to taysom hills injury, it all falls back on bronco. It is not fair to compare broncos and lavells first several seasons. Lavell took over a program in worse shape and was building it up. What marquee wins does bronco have in his career? I count one, Oklahoma. Check out his record against top 25 opponents. It is pretty dismal. Bronco needs to make significant changes to his staff this offseason. Anyone who knows the game of football can see they have not been well coached offensively this season.

  • Lavell Walnut Creek, Calif
    Nov. 23, 2012 5:13 p.m.

    I never thought I'd say this but I miss Robert Anae.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Nov. 23, 2012 5:31 p.m.

    @Y Grad / Y Dad - "Fairly stated but I would believe inaccurate. Don't think anyone but Riley made Riley play, and THAT would be a fair critique."

    Do you have kids? Do you let them do everything they want to do? I have no doubt that Riley wanted to play. But it's the coaches responsibility to determine that Riley would jeopardize his own health and the productivity of the team by playing. If I saw my kid grimacing in pain the way Riley was, I would be livid if the coaches allowed him to play.

  • Bomar Roberts, ID
    Nov. 23, 2012 6:11 p.m.

    Very curious to know what Riley is holding over Bronco's head. That can be the only reason that I can see that let's Riley determine if he play's or not. Riley is a very poor passer on his best day so when injured he's terrible. I've heard that Kuresa has the best arm on the team, so my question is why hasn't he been tried or utilized on an option from the slot receiver position. Also, why was Heaps on such a short leash while Riley doesn't even have a leash?

  • David Centerville, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 7:33 p.m.

    Eagle, for BYU to really be successful they must win big games. Under Bronco's tenure BYU's record against strong opponents is poor. Having a good overall record beating mediocre to poor teams will not lead to Conference invitations, good tv contracts in the future, national rankings. Fans are feeling frustrated because they see good athletes, great facilities, improved exposure, scheduling with great opponents, but a poor record against those opponents.

    Where does the administration, coaches & players want to go? Do they want high rankings, big bowl invites, more regular wins against strong opponents? If so the current structure isn't working. Evaluate & change the structure.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 23, 2012 9:21 p.m.

    CougFaninTX

    You said "made." That was my point.

    Two pictures:

    Bronco to Riley: "I don't care! We need you out there, now get out there and play! Or there's the door!"

    Or

    Riley to Bronco: "Come on coach, I can do this. They NEED me! I've earned this. Let me in, coach, please! I'm begging you."

    Neither extreme is likely, but one is closer to likely than then other, I'm thinking.

    And yes, I do have kids...

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:11 p.m.

    Eagle please stop comparing LaVell's first 6 years to Bronco's. Bronco has stated himself he has more talented players than LaVell ever had. I'm not bashing on Bronco, but the comparisons are apples and Oranges

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:13 p.m.

    And please don't tell me my opinion is pessimistic and meaningless. I've donated thousands to this program and have years of service invested in this university and its atheletics. The way Doman and Riley run this offense is embarrassing.

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:17 p.m.

    The bottom line is we are entitled to provide accurate feedback positive or negative. Bronco is paid over $1M per year from private donors. Brandon receives a nice six figure income. Plus great health insurance, 401K match, and a generous pention plan.

    THEY CAN handle the critics. They basically signed an employment contract saying they would and could deliver wins even amidst harsh criticism.

  • jasonlivy Orem, UT
    Nov. 23, 2012 11:48 p.m.

    I understand how internally a player may be respected. The coaches have seen things with Riley that have earned their profound respect. Those moments no doubt were special and personal.

    But...as a coach your first priority is to the team. Grit is an important element of football, but it alone won't win football games.

    I'm so frustrated that the coaches can't or won't see what everyone else sees...that Riley does not have the skills needed to be a D-1 quarterback. It doesn't matter that he kept getting up. In fact, there were many times I wish he would stay down.

    I applaud that he keeps getting up. That will serve him the rest of his life. But...BYU needs to step it up! No more allowing players to manipulate coaches into thinking that they are more important than the rest of the team. BYU won't be a winning program unless they have the players making plays consistently every game, especially the quarterback.

    All I know is this, if we continue to have lousy quarterbacks throwing interceptions to defensive linemen, we are going to be lucky to make it to the Potato Bowl.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 24, 2012 1:51 a.m.

    Tenn12: I don't want to disparage Lavell Edwards at all because he is a great coach. But I will probably come across as such to correct the record. But let it be known I've followed BYU football for part of five decades. Lavell wasn't perfect. If Bronco mismanaged Taysom Hill ask Glen Kozlowski how he feels about his knee injury being handled which took what I thought would be a great pro career to something substantially less. Edwards' record in bowl games is rather poor, I think he won about one-third of them. His record the last few years of his career was pretty pedestrian, he even lost to the Utes quite a number of times toward the end.

    But here's the ultimate rub. I think it is unfair to expect a coach like Lavell Edwards. Even with a couple of things I pointed out above, he's a great coach. Not just a great coach but a special coach. And for Bronco to even approach or surpass in some cases suggests something. Again, people outside the BYU bubble think highly of BYU and think highly of Bronco often calling BYU's players "well coached."

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 24, 2012 1:57 a.m.

    TroyO6:

    Just because you have given BYU a lot of money or your time or emotional energy doesn't mean the players or coaches owe you anything. I pay tithing and some of it goes to BYU. I'd rather make sure the players are good citizens rather than good football players. My most disappointing BYU moment this season is what happened at the Mexican restaurant, not any loss on the field.

    I figure you are a part of the problem if anything. And the way that many of these posters criticize a young man (Riley Nelson) is tiresome. Enough already. He isn't a professional athlete making millions of dollars. He has done nothing wrong but trying his best. I won't say he's the best QB ever because he isn't. In fact I hope Lark gets a shot to start, he deserves it. But I can't say what I read on these posts supposedly by BYU fans about Nelson, Doman or Mendenhall is Christlike or anything I want OUR faith to represent.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 24, 2012 12:32 p.m.

    eagle

    You are so spot on, all I can say is "Amen."

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 24, 2012 12:37 p.m.

    I am so frustrated that so relatively "many" THINK they see more than the coaches and the players see. It is time to pull back into balance your frustration with just not winning with the values this university, and the church it represents, espouse.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Nov. 24, 2012 12:57 p.m.

    Y Grad/Y Dad:

    Thanks for being one fan that is sane.

    TroyO6:

    Bronco has won 10 games a few times, BYU will have another winning season this season--they even played the #1 team in the country to a three point game at their place. The incident at the restaurant aside, his players are generally good citizens and reach out to the community in meaningful ways. Besides Utah, BYU hasn't lost to any team that is a poor team. San Jose State will likely have 10 wins and their best season in program history. ND is ranked #1 in the country and is 11-0. Boise State has lost two games all year long, those losses coming by a combined six points. Oregon State is on the verge of winning 10 games and is nationally ranked. The Cougs beat Utah State which has won 10 games for the first time in school history. By any standards HE IS DOING HIS JOB!

  • sg newhall, CA
    Nov. 24, 2012 5:05 p.m.

    It's time to find a better offensive coordinator. Doman is terrible. His schemes are predictable. Please for the love of the program, get rid of him and find a seasoned coordinator. Riley was good, not great and never a deep threat. He would have been better as a running back or receiver. BYU needs a better caliber QB. This season was frankly dreadful. We beat pansies, and couldn't beat good teams. In other words, this was a very average team. Boring to say the least. Not even worth time to watch.

  • Troy06 OREM, UT
    Nov. 24, 2012 8:24 p.m.

    Eagle, I'm sure you are aware that none of your tithing dollars reach the athletic department right? Yours either YDad - BTW your username is somewhat arrogant driving home the stereotype of an obsorbed arrogant BYU fan.

    You don't know what is happening behind the scenes at practice and you don't know the entire story of how Doman has treated certain players. Plus I have not been un-"Christlike" in any of my posts regarding Bronco or Doman.

    Did you know a certain BYU player midseason last year packed everything into a box from Jake Heaps locker? Guess what he did with Jake's stuff...it was dropped in Bronco's office with a hand written note stating "I quite". Who do you think drove this student athlete to empty Jake's locker? Are you aware of how the situation was handled by the coaches? I'm not going to tell you.

    Please get off your holier than thow pedestal.

  • RU Serious Washington, UT
    Nov. 24, 2012 10:50 p.m.

    @fender

    Upper DI? LOL. The BCS has the upper DI schools. Not even all those schools are Upper DI schools? Maybe once every 10-20years.

  • starthillnotnelson Kamas/United States, UT
    Nov. 26, 2012 2:54 p.m.

    It is definitely not just Nelson's fault, but he has not been too impressive. If he were a freshman, I think it would be fine, but this is just ridiculous. I am personally tired of running QBs. Seeing James Lark made me feel all depressed. We had this guy for 4 years, and when he gets his chance and shines, it doesn't matter because he will be gone. He will probably not start the bowl game either. I wish we could get a guy who is: 1) Not a run first guy, and when he runs, can do it well. 2) Who can get a 6 touchdown, 0 pick performance, like James Lark, and 3) Know when to keep a play going and when to throw it away or take a sack.

  • starthillnotnelson Kamas/United States, UT
    Nov. 26, 2012 2:56 p.m.

    I hope Taysom throws more next year. I am tired of the "short pass, option" offense.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Nov. 26, 2012 9:24 p.m.

    Troy06

    ????? Not sure about arrogant. I went to the Y, my kids went to the Y. Not a huge creative leap there.

    The fact that you imply/say you know something, but don't say what it is, doesn't make for a significant reason to change my mind about anything. But it's just one mind, and apparently an arrogant one to boot.

    You suggest I am arrogant - fair enough, that could be. I'll have to take a closer inventory and see what actions could be perceived as arrogant, and when they are not in line with the values I respect, I'll repent and try to do better. If my actions ARE in line with the values I espouse, then I will just have to learn to live with unjustified criticism.

    I suggest the same for many of the fans here who, I think, have allowed their passion for athletics to pull them from the values I think they also cling to. I just don't think many of us would like these words to come up in that inevitable last and final PPI.