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Deal reached to avoid default and open government

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  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:13 a.m.

    Yay. My mutual funds won't tank tomorrow!

  • Anti Bush-Obama Washington, DC
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:35 a.m.

    They're whole gameplan for "economic recovery" is to raise the debt ceiling again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again and again. Good thing that we are headed towards a financial collapse and raising the debt ceiling won't avoid that. I live for the day that happens. Rather have anarchy than a dictatorship.

  • Anti Bush-Obama Washington, DC
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:46 a.m.

    Hutterite

    You care so much about money it's sickening. All the world needs is love.

  • GZE SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:50 a.m.

    Notice that they got assurances from Ted Cruz that he would not filibuster. No on asked, nor do they care, what Mike Lee does.

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:55 a.m.

    Gutless. The Senate is full of gutless hypocrites except for two of them.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 11:57 a.m.

    Senator Lee caused damage and failed.

  • Kaotic USA, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:00 p.m.

    Boy what the rest of the world must think about the "gentlemen" and ladies we have on both sides of the aisle running this once great country. Mike Lee, Harry Reid, John Boehner, Pelosi and Obama himself...they all need to be sent down the road. Our founding fathers are rolling over in their graves right now because the great country they created has been destroyed and can't be fixed. The word gentlemen above was edited from a previous denied comment so as to get approved this time hopefully.

  • JMHO Southern, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:01 p.m.

    GZE is right. Many have vilified Mike Lee on these boards when he had little or no power and really has nothing to do with this whole fiasco.

  • Ranch Here, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:01 p.m.

    Government open until Jan 15 and debt ceiling raised until Feb 7?

    Guess what we're all going to go through again in just a few months.

    Absolute nonsense.

  • Unclefred Ticonderoga, NY
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:19 p.m.

    Gutless, kick the can down the road, I had really hoped there was someone with morals and a spine involved in this, guess not....

  • SCfan clearfield, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:19 p.m.

    Want to bet that this same movie will be played over and over again again in the coming months and years? I'll bet that when the national debt is 25 trillion dollars, the same thing will be going on. Only problem is, eventually we won't be able to raise the debt limit any more because no one will want to lend this irresponsible government any more money.

    Politically, I've thought that the Republicans should just get out of the way, let the Democrats raise our debt as high as they want, which apparantly is "Unlimited", but always vote against it. Then, when the crash comes, the Republicans will not only win the White House, but almost every seat in Congress, House and Senate. However, most Republicans are not that cut throat, and want something to be done before a huge crash.

  • Craig Coleman Genola, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:25 p.m.

    Our founding fathers were as deeply divided and fought each other with as much or more acrimony than we are seeing today. The difference of opinion between people and the ability to express those differences forcefully is what has made this country great. It is a reason to celebrate and feel pride for our nation that people can voice opposition and not be shot.

  • Wanderer West Jordan, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:32 p.m.

    Let's hope that four years from now Utah voters remember what Mike Lee did to our reputation and integrity: a black eye!

  • Aggielove Cache county, USA
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:38 p.m.

    Chuck Norris would of handled this situation a lot better.

  • CHS 85 Sandy, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:43 p.m.

    @JMHO

    Mike Lee (and his "friends") hijacked a non-partisan veteran's rally to hammer home their rhetoric. That's enough to turn me off.

    Veterans are not political pawns and fodder!

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:44 p.m.

    @SCfan
    A huge crash is what Republicans were trying to cause with this nonsense.

  • Deamon North Logan, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:53 p.m.

    I'm happy to see the Republicans at least made a stand that something needs to be done about this runaway spending, but as long as Harry Reid and Obama are running the govt all they can do is raise awareness. Unfortunately it will probably backlash and give the Dems another majority in the next session so they can run this country further into the ground.

  • Ajax Mapleton, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 12:56 p.m.

    While a voice crying in the wilderness has a certain cachet, what Sen. Mike Lee and others like him are attempting arbitrarily imposes without consent or due process on the resources and dominion of others. An inflated sense of self has always been a particular weakness of the right and the domain of autocratic rule.

    The ideologically driven are unyielding in their conviction that they alone trod the higher ground. They are the people who once hunted witches in Salem, have always sought infidels in religion and currently are in hot in pursuit of communists, socialists and other libs in government.

    And while they cry freedom, it is plainly for themselves and the unrestrained pursuit of personal wants, not for others who in the process are manipulated and exploited. That is what they know best and perversely how they accuse others who might question their self-focus and paranoia.

  • ute alumni paradise, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 1:08 p.m.

    craig coleman
    the difference is there were true leaders and statesmen then. not now. only wimps and spineless jellyfish, headed by the best of the best barry.

  • podunk utah DRAPER, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 1:20 p.m.

    If the citizens of Utah do not vote Mike Lee out of office then we deserve to dwell in the lowest depths of Dante's vision of Hades

  • ego1968 provo, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 1:20 p.m.

    So I write to my representative in the house to express to him my disgust concerning his inability to work with the democrats in congress. Indeed, his willingness to work with the reasonable republicans in congress. I wanted to encourage him to stop playing games, putting the TEA PARTY ideology ahead of the good of the country and get the government working again. . . this is the response i received:

    Thank you for contacting me. Due to the government-wide shutdown as a result of a lapse in appropriations, my office is closed and I am unable to respond to email or
    voice messages. Your message is important to me, and as soon as the federal government reopens, I will respond to your message. I regret any inconvenience this
    shutdown may cause . . .Jason Chaffetz

    It would be nice if I could decide to stop working (with pay) and then tell the people I am supposed to be serving that since I have decided to stop working (with pay) I will get back to them as soon as I decide to start working again. Until then I will not be listening to you . . .

  • Fender Bender Saint George, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 1:30 p.m.

    In response to people who complain about President Obama’s “runaway spending”:

    In 2009, Obama's first year, the federal budget increased 17.9%, going from $2.98 trillion to $3.52 trillion. If you think that’s the result of Obama’s stimulus plan, you’d be wrong. The 2009 budget was the property of George W. Bush, and was passed by the 2008 Congress four months before Obama took the oath of office.

    How do the actual Obama annual budgets look?

    In fiscal year 2010 (Obama’s first budget) spending fell 1.8% to $3.64 trillion.

    In fiscal year 2011, spending rose 4.3% to $3.6 trillion.

    In fiscal year 2012, spending rose 0.7% to $3.63 trillion.

    In fiscal year 2013, spending is set to fall 1.3% to $3.58 trillion.

    Annualized growth of federal spending for Obama’s first four years in office is 1.4%. That means federal spending has grown at a slower average annual rate under Obama’s presidency than any U.S. president since Eisenhower.

  • bandersen Saint George, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 1:48 p.m.

    Did anyone here think that this 'deal' wasn't a forgone conclusion? As if our uni-party leaders were ever in any conflict! Guess what Democrats and Republicans, the uni-party won. The government got bigger and big brother just swiped some more liberty away from the deluded slaves, Republican and Democratic party members! Now the deluded followers can go back to their cushy jobs, double income-no children futures, and tell their friends how charitable they are because they have delegated their individual responsibilities to a faceless, bureaucratic government. The march of the naive, ignorant, and uneducated move forward with glory toward a socialized utopia that perverts true liberty and destroys the concept of constitutionally limited government. It makes it more difficult for the heavy lifters in our society who must navigate through the maze of non-sense and selfishness created by the Harry Reid's of our country. Where are the real leaders? Certainly not here.

  • SCfan clearfield, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:06 p.m.

    atl34

    Figure it out. If they had wanted to crash the government, they could have by just not agreeing to anything. That would have been easy to do. What you liberals have to come to terms with is the debt/spending that this country cannot afford to continue to do. Please address that before going any further because continuing this way, which it seems you people don't think is a problem, will one day bring about a crash that makes 1929 look like the good old days. If you think 17 trillion debt is not a problem, then say so. At least we will have one liberal on record. Obama, Reid and Pelosi don't seem to even understand the debt. Maybe someone needs to point out the difference between a "B" and a "T" to them.

  • Craig Coleman Genola, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:13 p.m.

    Mike Lee is doing exactly what he said he would do when he was elected by the people of Utah three years ago. You may disagree with his approach but it is consistent with who he said he was and what he said he would do. I cannot tell if his motivations are selfish and I honestly don't know how anyone else can discern such a thing. It appears to me that he believes he is representing the people who elected him to the U.S. Senate--the people of Utah.

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:13 p.m.

    What's another trillion dollars of debt to a Democrat?

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:22 p.m.

    Fender Bender

    I refer you to U.S. Debt Clock .org. Saying that Obama is spending less is like saying it is not as cold at -35 as it is at -38. Either one will kill you. And let's say that somehow the red became green. We still have Obamas 7 trillion in added debt, plus the 10 trillion Bush got us up to. And by the way no matter how you use your statistics, name a President who came anywhere close to adding 7 trillion to the debt in less than 5 years. You have no case in defending Obama no matter what tortured statistics you use.

  • Gildas LOGAN, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:31 p.m.

    The only Republicans that will come out of this fight with ANY credibility are those who DID fight and will CONTINUE fighting, without remission, for what the people want: no ACA and no increases in the debt ceiling. Ted Cruz, Mike Lee and all those who fight to the end are the only ones who have real respect among the people. I feel that the rest of the Republicans are history or soon will be. Some Dems likewise will never be elected again. They are supposed to be the party of the People. If they were I would support them to the hilt, but they have shown themselves, most of them, hypocrites.

    So will be the Republican Party history unless they fight to win and vote to live within our means and not to let ACA proceed any further so long as they have the power to withhold funding for it.

    Imo there is no better time than NOW to fight and any who cave will never have my support again. What's the point in mincing about, putting off the inevitable struggle. People will just say, and say with justice, "They've got theirs and they don't care!"

  • Anti Government Alpine, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:53 p.m.

    A deal has been reached. Now the wastful spending can continue along with the implementation of the UNaffordable Care Act which, depending on the poll, 53-57% of Americans disapprove of.

    I'm so glad these guys are back to "work" destroying America and implementing laws to make our lives more difficult.

  • Fender Bender Saint George, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 2:55 p.m.

    RE:happy2bhere

    There are two sides to the debt equation: expenses and revenues.

    During the first few years of Obama's presidency, revenues dropped to around 15% of GDP, whereas historically federal revenues have been near 18% of GDP. So even if there had been absolutely no increased government spending, debt would have substantially increased anyways due to less revenues.

    The problem with this most recent recession was not that we incurred more debt. Higher borrowing during periods of economic downturn is a good thing, as is paying off debt when the economy is booming. The problem was that during the prior decade, when the economy was doing great, we didn't pay off any debt. Instead, the Bush tax cuts went into effect, and we unnecessarily went to war with Iraq (which ended up costing us over a trillion dollars).

    So far, the federal government has behaved as it should during Obama's presidency, borrowing more to offset the effects of a terrible recession. To the extent that you can credit or blame a president for federal spending, Obama's true test will be whether he can start paying off the debt now that the economy is recovering.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 3:21 p.m.

    I'm a Democrat, and here's what needs to happen from this point:

    -Tax reform. We need to reform the tax code, lower the corporate tax rate and eliminate the myriad loopholes that allow companies like GE to get a refund and pay no taxes. As we've seen economic inequality approach third world levels, the better off will need to pay a bit more. That's just the way it is.

    -Entitlements reform. Social Security and Medicare need some serious tweaks, and we need our leaders to have the courage to reform these programs. These Democratic sacred cows need to be reformed. They just do.

    -Defense spending needs to come down. We need to maintain defense superiority while reducing the insane amounts of defense spending. Guess what? We just can't afford to spend more on defense than all the other nations combined.

    -We need to seriously invest in education. We are digging a deeper hole for the future as this generation of students - whose parents themselves are not very well educated, after decades of mediocre support for education - are set for more mediocrity, less affluence, less tax money for defense, etc.

  • Happy Valley Heretic Orem, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 3:26 p.m.

    @ ego1968– Chaffetz is hiding after he looked the fool when questioned a couple days ago...
    Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R-Utah), presiding over the chamber, told Van Hollen that the rule he was asking to use had been "altered" and he did not have the privilege of bringing that vote to the floor. In the ensuing back and forth, Chaffetz said the recently passed House Resolution 368 trumped the standing rules. Where any member of the House previously could have brought the clean resolution to the floor under House Rule 22, House Resolution 368 -- passed on the eve of the shutdown -- gave that right exclusively to the House majority leader, Rep. Eric Cantor of Virginia.
    "The Rules Committee, under the rules of the House, changed the standing rules of the House to take away the right of any member to move to vote to open the government, and gave that right exclusively to the Republican Leader," said Van Hollen. "Is that right?"
    "The House adopted that resolution," replied Chaffetz.
    "Under section 2 of H.R. 368, that motion may be offered only by the majority leader or his designee," Chaffetz said.

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 3:58 p.m.

    Fender Bender

    The total accumulated debt from Washington thru Bush was 10 trillion. Bush did add to that with his spending. Obama could have used the Reagan model of cutting taxes in ways that stimulate private sector growth. He didn't. That is why we are still not in a real recovery yet. After 5 years everyone should realize that Obamanomics is not working. A Reaganesque tax cutting program would have gotten us in the positive growth long ago. Remember, Bush in most of his years had much better GDP than Obama has had. Ironically, it wasn't until Reid and Pelosi took over Congress that the economy began to tank. Bush did pretty well considering he was inheriting a downturn from Clinton and of course 911. Can you imagine how much more the Federal Debt would be if the Democrats had had total control of D.C. for the last 5 years? We'd probably be at 20 trillion already. I ask you, does this worry you? If not at 17 trillion, then what number would worry you. Or can we just raise the debt to infinity without consequences?

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 4:26 p.m.

    Fender Bender,
    you will note that the periods with the smallest increases are with the GOP controlling the house. had nancy and the dems still held it, his spending would have been more.

    10CC,
    I agree with most of your proposals. Those who are well off already DO pay more - that's just the way it is. I wonder how the left will reply to your call for:

    lowering corporate tax rates. BO actually has called for it, but harry and chuckie shouted him down
    entitlement reforms - harry and chuckie shouted those down, too - purely for political reasons

    As much as you may have disagreed with Reagan, he and Tip O'Neal extended the life of SS by at least 30 years with a bipartisan deal. I cannot see harry and BO doing ANYTHING bipartisan or calling for compromise. they just do not do it.

  • bandersen Saint George, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 5:38 p.m.

    10CC: Did I actually read what you wrote? I'm pretty certain that instead of a Democrat, you will now be labeled a Tea-party extremist because you dared mentioned the unmentionable to most Democrats and Republicans--stop spending, stop the war machine, and stop giving tax breaks to the corporations. Now, where is the leader that can bring two disparate philosophies together to turn it around? certainly not happening with our current leader. Thank you.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 5:42 p.m.

    The great tea party revolution was a flop.

  • Badger55 Nibley, Ut
    Oct. 16, 2013 7:17 p.m.

    Fender Bender,
    Not sure where you got your data, but according to Obama's budgets submitted to congress and posted on US government printing office website(GPO.gov) the actual US budget data differs.
    2010: Total Outlays(spending)$3.45T
    2011: Total Outlays $3.6T
    2012: Total Outlays $3.53T

    From 2001-2007 total Outlays per year increased from $1.8T to $2.7T. An increase of $0.9T in Oultays over 7 years.
    From 2008-2011 total Outlays per year increased from $2.7T to $3.8T An increase of $1.1T over the span of 4 years.
    Funny part is that Dems were in control of the house and senate from 2007-2010. As we all know, Congress decides what the money is spent on, not the president.

    Somehow, 2012 and 2013 have seen a decrease in spending. You can figure out what happened, but I will give you a hint. It has to do with the House and 2010. Again, the president does not approve the spending, Congress does.

    You may want to research TARP. It was a democrat bill passed by a democrat held congress. Yes, Obama's stimulus went towards the 2009 budget, as it was dispersed in 2009.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    Oct. 16, 2013 8:37 p.m.

    The Tea Party is damaging the Republican Brand. They (originally) said the Tea Party were neither Republican nor Democrat. Perhaps time for them to form a third party and then fade into a footnote of history . . .

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    Oct. 16, 2013 9:58 p.m.

    I certainly will remember in four years what Mike Lee has done for us and the reputation of Utah. I can't wait to vote for him again. If only we had 50 more Mike Lees, Ted Cruzes, and Rand Pauls in the Senate then we would not be in the perilous situation our country is now in under the failures of the current apologist in chief. Truth and integrity need to be restored in Washington and the White House because it has been missing for the past five years.