Y'know who Lee and Hatch REALLY need to pursue for data mining?Walmart, Smith's Foods, our banks, your local auto dealership, your
insurance company, and the secret intelligence gathering arms of countless other
corporate members of the American "free enterprise" system. And while
they're at it, how about going after all those websites that will allow me
-- for a small fee, of course -- to learn virtually anything I want to know
about you and your family members?But if they tried that,
they'd be damaging the profit margins of the giants who pay our
Congresscritters' bills. Nah. Can't have that . . . .
Mike Lee was unaware of it!?As if this is some sort of acceptable
excuse???Outrageous!!!What exactly did Lee think NSA was
doing? What did he think this monstrosity being built here in Utah was going to
be used for?It's time for Mike Lee to stop acting like a child
and screaming about certain issues (like the UN and disability bills) and become
informed with what REALLY matters. He needs to know what is REALLY happening in
his own backyard. Being "unaware" of what the NSA is doing
is just plain unacceptable.
Where was the letter writer when Senator Hatch voted, openly and publicly, for
these things to happen over and over again? The original Patriot Act, its
reauthorization a few years later, the FISA amendments, etc etc.Senator Hatch was re-elected TWICE since he's made some of the votes
allowing these things, and I'm willing to bet that the letter writer helped
to make that happen with their votes.Many of us tried telling
conservatives that this was terrible policy and a terrible assault on civil
liberties, but we were shouted down as whimps who would coddle and embolden
terrorists. It was your elected Republicans that passed these laws--you helped
make this happen.
It's true that Mike Lee believes that the Constitution is the Supreme Law
of the land and that Orrin Hatch believes that he and other members of Congress
have the authority to write any law that they want as long as they think that
their law is good for the people.We're seeing the results of
that kind of thinking. Congress has authorized spending for personal welfare,
which is not authorized by the Constitution. If personal welfare needs to be
addressed, that is a duty of the State and of the people, not of the Federal
Government. Mike Lee understands that concept. Most members of Congress do
not.The NSA is just one of many problems facing the citizens of
America. Granted, it boils our blood to know that Uncle Sam is listening in on
our conversations and reading our email. Thankfully, those abuses prove to us
why we must never again elected someone like Obama who tells us that he is doing
it for our own good and why we must never let someone like Orrin Hatch write the
laws of the land.
re: isrredBack in the day, I wrote Orrin about the Patriot Act, TSA,
& DHS. I said they were bad ideas. My reply was full of post 9/11 rhetoric.
In short, the antithesis of Ben Franklin's quote about liberty &
security.If it were exclusively businesses that were "data
mining", I would not be crazy about it but could understand. Where would
America be w/o marketing and sales?I always thought that if
facebook, google, or apple got cozy w/ Uncle Sam then it would be light out,
game over. Silly me; I never considered the telecom angle. Bottom
line; I will not get a "smartphone"... I already have something to keep
track of my life... its called a brain.
It's really not Uncle Sam you need to worry about. It's who is
actually running these programs contracted out and that have used these systems
to attack those that bring them to light. Private contractors, many with foreign
investors. Privatizing our security, now that makes me feel secure.
We tried to replace Hatch a year ago, but he survived the primary. Don't
blame conservatives if Hatch chooses to ignore the constitution.
@Mike RichardsSouth Jordan, UtahIt's true that ... and
that Orrin Hatch believes that he and other members of Congress have the
authority to write any law that they want as long as they think that their law
is good for the people.9:03 a.m. June 14, 2013 @lost
in DCWest Jordan, UTWe tried to replace Hatch a year ago, but
he survived the primary. Don't blame conservatives if Hatch chooses to
ignore the constitution.9:04 a.m. June 14, 2013========== Good grief...You were the guys who voted for him,
re-re-(7x)-elected him.You in essence support him.So Yes, we
DO blame you for him and nearly all the other Republicans [and the handful of
Democrats - see, that's called someone being honest] who have voted for
this over the last 12 years.
Mike and lost, did you or didnt you vote for Hatch on this last election?
Good grief! There must have been a lot of people who were so afraid of making a
choice when they voted that they wanted to know how others vote.Do
they know that in America we have secret ballots? Do they know that in America
NO ONE, not even the Supreme Court has the right to ask us how we voted? Do
they understand WHY we have privacy in America, or, are part of the liberal left
who think that the government, and those who are part of the liberal left, have
the right to look over our shoulder when we write emails and listen in when we
use the telephone. Don't they know that being free means that asking a
question about how we voted means that they don't have a clue about liberty
and freedom?But, just to make them feel better, at the caucus
meeting some of us voiced strong opinions about NOT electing delegates who had
already made up their minds to vote for Hatch at the nominating convention. Did they actively campaign against Hatch, or, do they just think its
their business to tell Republican how to vote?
In the midst of this ridiculous catfight, let me point out that the NSA has been
functioning under orders from the secret FISA court, which was created by a
joint decision of the Republicans and Democrats in Congress a decade ago. What
they are doing is perfectly "legal." If we don't like it,
let's inform our Congresspeople to walk back the Patriot Act and eliminate
the FISA court. The FISA Court always struck me, a Democrat,as an innovation
dangerous to our civil liberties.
Good Grief!Now it's the "left's fault" for not
doing more to keep Hatch from being elected? Huh? As if the left hasn't
already been marginalized in Utah? Yes Mike Richards, you're
absolutely right. It's CLEARLY the left's job to find the GOP a
conservative candidate so mindless drones don't continue to merely pull the
"R" lever without ever using their god given brains. Please.You know the GOP is tearing itself apart when you have posters on here
attacking the left for the mistake of electing Hatch.The truth is
just so obvious, Utah voters have become lazy and content. Instead of actually
researching candidates and becoming informed on the issues, they merely elect
the "R"/most familiar name. Instead of electing a conservative, the
people of Utah elected a Republican Politician. This isn't the
left's fault. But a problem with the voters who are overwhelming affiliated
with the GOP. Again, I ask, Mike and Lost, did you or didn't
you vote for Hatch in this previous election?
What the NSA/FISA/Obama Administration does is only legal if you throw out the
Constitution. They have ignored our rights. Why is what they're doing
legal? Is it legal because they say it's legal? Is it legal because they
have a court that says it's legal? Is it legal because the Constitution
says it's legal?No law in America can conflict with the
Constitution and still be legal. Either the Constitution is the Supreme Law of
the Land or it is not. If it is not, then all is lost because the Constitution
protects the people from an "out of control" government. The
Constitution puts limits on what the government can do and what it is restricted
from doing.We, the people, have explicitly told the government that
they cannot search us in any way unless they prove to a judge that what
we're doing has probable cause for a warrant. If that judge agrees, then
he issues a warrant to search a specific area. What the Obama
Administration is doing under the guise of the "Patriot Act" is
illegal.Everyone seems to know that - except the Federal Government.
to Mike Richards per his 11:32 a.m post"...and those who are
part of the liberal left, have the right to look over our shoulder when we write
emails and listen in when we use the telephone. Don't they know that being
free means that asking a question about how we voted means that they don't
have a clue about liberty and freedom?"Its strictly the left
responsible for Big Brother? Wow!? What about Stuff like Prop 8 and the whining
about trying to overturn Roe v Wade i.e. matters involving personal choice."Did they actively campaign against Hatch, or, do they just think
its their business to tell Republican how to vote?"Some of us
have lives and a clue. We think both major parties are joke and vote 3rd party
no matter how insignificant it may be in the long run. Politically,
my conscience is clean knowing there independents/Libertarians sans Ivy League
degrees who aren't lackeys of Wall St or other special interests that I can
Thanks for the biggest laugh I've had so far today Mike Richards!Blaming the left for Big Brother AND Orrin Hatch? (Let me pause while I stop
laughing again...)Hatch is a Republican and therefore is voted for
in caucuses by Republicans (closed caucuses, if I remember right), and by
Republicans in the general election. Case closed.While I certainly
think that President Obama's administration shoulders some blame in
secretively collecting data, you do realize that the Patriot Act, the ramp up in
FISA and the NSA, the creation of the TSA and DHS, and warrantless wiretapping
all came to us courtesy of President Bush (a Republican, if you'll
remember) and by overwhelming votes by Republican members of Congress.You claim that we must "never again elect someone like Obama," but you
might want to be honest and add President Bush, and most members of Congress as
well.Talk about spinning things- you are the master, Mike.
Is it possible that Mike is really a plant from some comedy club or maybe
Saturday Night Live?
Can you imagine how some of the posters are "laughing" at Conservatives
because a Republican is a liberal? What irony! They're attacking a
liberal Senator who is supporting Obama's administration and the spying
that they endorse. Talk about throwing under the bus those who do exactly what
you want them to do.Hatch is no conservative. He might call himself
a Republican, but he espouses the values of Obama and Obama's followers.Mike Lee is our only Senator who believes in the Constitution. Hatch
has been in Washington so long that he's become an active liberal. Those on the left should be applauding him instead of attacking him.
They got exactly what they wanted - a liberal who supports Obama (and then tells
us how he will do away with ObamaCare). Hatch and Obama must have taken the
lessons from the same "truth" coach.
@lost in DC"We tried to replace Hatch a year ago, but he survived the
primary. Don't blame conservatives if Hatch chooses to ignore the
constitution."We tried too but too many Republicans who dislike
Hatch were allergic to Ds and voted for him anyway.
Maverick,You ask if Lee was unaware.You buy that excuse when
BO, Holder, and Hillary sell it. Why not with Lee?LDS? lib,
maverick, atl134In the general election, you bet I voted against giving
harry reid and the dems a better shot at further destroying our country. Had
there been a plausible alternative, they would have my vote. When dems remove
their toxicity (or repub toxicity reaches the same level) I’ll find
something else. Of course, if they removed their toxicity, I wonder if they
would still garner your undying support?Irony Guy, Verizon
reports data requests from NSA have increased 15% per year in the last 5 years.
Those are BO, not bush years. Bush could drop a bread crumb in a stream and you
liberals would use that as an excuse for BO dumping 40,000 tons of toxic waste
in the same stream (bush dropped stuff in it first!!!!!, you’d all
scream). BO turbo-charged what was going on and turned the NSA into the Stasi.
@one old manActually, I'm leaning more towards Mike Richards
actually being John Swallow, Mike Lee, or Jason Chaffetz. Either way it's
still great stuff for late night TV. :)
@J ThompsonI'm laughing because I find it funny that
Republicans bemoan the fact that Senator Hatch is too liberal, but it was them
who put him there- again, and again, and again. I'm no fan of Orrin Hatch,
nor President Obama, nor Republicans or Democrats in general. I'm neither
a liberal nor a conservative. I'm what you might call a thinking
moderate.I've never aligned myself with Democrats (I grew up in
a conservative Republican household). I used to call myself a Republican, but
during a PoliSci class at the University I was required to intern for a party or
campaign of my choice. I interned for the Utah Republican Party. It was after
that experience that I shied away from ANY party. It was absolutely amazing how
those who run the party behind the scenes, as well as some (not all) of the
candidates some real amoral, win at costs, individuals. Openly talking about
how to break campaign laws in front of interns just because they know nothing
will happen to them? It solidified my feelings about parties. I vote for
individuals, sometimes those with party affiliations, sometimes not.
To one old man 6/14MR is funnier than Will Ferrell, Mike Myers,
& Kevin James but that really isn't aaying much.
@Mike Richards:"Congress has authorized spending for personal welfare,
which is not authorized by the Constitution."What!?? It says
right in the front part something about promoting the general welfare. It
doesn't say how... just promote it. Congress, in its collective wisdom,
has decided that transfer payments including such things as food stamps, would
do the job nicely. Furthermore, it would almost guarantee to keep the
politicians in office for a lifetime provided the benefits keep coming.
I voted for the third party. Will not vote Republican or Democrat ever again.