zzzzzzzzzz... Who cares. Not a big deal.
Sold your souls for a mess of pottage...and what a mess it is!
Utah State had postseason game on Sunday one the the cbi games. Pocatello and
Logan probably not well attended. LDS people shouldn't go to games on
Sunday though some do. WAtching games on tv, doing work around home and car
things like caffeine certian r rated movies well those are debated ad nauseum in
LDS culture. Back page of Ensign talked about that. I doubt Utah
will sell out or lose attendance. Until recently High School had to use light
source 93 million miles away for football and had 7th day adventist on team.
Traveled to afternoon games but if lights were closer couldn't play as sun
up to sun down sabbath friday. Jews some I think are orhtodox in there sabbath
but many I don't think are.
Ouch. Last place all for more money. Now they have to go against their
principles as well. Tell me why they wanted to go to the Pac
again?Put up another Pac 12 banner and throw a parade!
Utah is a secular school, so there is absolutely no reason not to play on
Sunday. If somebody chooses not to attend because of their religious beliefs
that is absolutely fine. Everyone is free to make that choice for
I've never read anything as disjointed and confusing as higv...wow...Anyway, I try to keep the Sabbath Holy and enjoy that change of pace
once every 7 days. Basketball on Sunday for the Utes? It can be changed. NCAA
athletics is about cash. If attendance and ratings are consistently low, things
will change. its really up to the fans! Agency is a great thing,
the free market system is a great thing. It will work out just fine.Utah is playing horrible...that might be the larger sin.
This, and many other reasons, is why I love BYU. Utah is now in bed with the
devil...hope they play to an empty building--the Pac12 would modify its
scheduling in a New York minute if that happened and there would be no more
Sunday games at the Huntsman Center.
Bottom line Brad.....As much as you hate the UTES...one thing that even you know
down deep and that is, Sunday play in the Pac-12 is better any day of the week
than playing in some po-dunk obscure mini-conference.
All the more proof the only reason why BYU is not in the PAC is because of the
religious thing. I think it is hilarious that all these Utes fans were denying
that was the reason BYU wasn't in that conference. Now we know for sure.
The PAC 12 is a conference full of liberal, biased, hypocritical institutions
that preach acceptance of all, but discriminate if you are not like them, just
like all liberals.
Participating in the Pac-10 will aid the Utes in recruiting a few borderline
"secular" players who have no interest in honoring the fifth commandment
(of God's Ten Commandments). Interestingly, it will give BYU a leg up in
recruiting local high school stars who do desire to keep the Ten Commandments.
Reminds me of Joshua's famous declaration, "Choose ye this day . .
I find this so stupid and hypocritical of BYU fans. Do they not watch the Super
Bowl? Of course they do. Does the Jimmer play on Sunday? Of course he does. Does
Dennis Pitta play on Sunday? Of course he does. What a funny double standard;
come to the 21st century...sheesh!
"hypocritical institutions that preach acceptance of all, but discriminate
if you are not like them"Couganate:Funny, the exact
same thing could be said of BYU fans and the "holier-than-thou" comments
on this article.Oh wait, maybe that's who you WERE referring
Spokane, and yet many of your own will likely not go to the Sunday games. So as
much as you would like to believe this is a byu only issue, some of your own
fans won't go. I am happy that it makes you upset that some people
don't like Sunday games. Thanks for being bitter. I like that you are
I find it interesting that the people who are complaining about the University
of Utah playing a Sunday game are commenting on a story that appeared in a
Sunday edition of the Deseret News. Do you realize that employees of the paper
have to work on Sunday to publish the paper? Do you realize that when you watch
KSL television or listen to KSL radio or any of the other media outlets that
people are working on Sunday? If you watch the tabernacle choir on television
or listen to the btoadcast on Sunday employees are working on the Sabbath.The
LDS church, which owns and operates BYU, has many commercial enterprises that
operate 7 days a week. Many LDS/BYU athletes compete on Sunday in their job. If
those who are bitterly opposed to Utah playing a game on Sunday it would seem
they would also opposse any business that requires their employees to work on
Sunday. Or is it more of a matter of bashing the way the University of Utah?
Spokane Ute - Stop feigning ignorance as to how this works. The LDS Church
controls BYU and BYU will NEVER play on Sunday. End of story.The
LDS Church does not control the lives of individual members, irrespective of
where they went to school. Each is free to chose for himself - and I say that
without making any judgments of those who have professions that require work on
Sunday.This has nothing to do with Jimmer, Pitta or any other
professional athlete who plays on Sunday. There is no double standard here -
and you know it.
Joe, there are a total of zero "Pac-12 banners downtown right now.The fact that you are so bothered by light pole signs speaks volumes about the
bitterness and jealousy of BYU fans. The signs have a drum-and-feather and the
text "Home of the Utes" with a smaller PAC-12 logo underneath it
all....but for some reason that is all you can see.
@RayVauggen,See "Sports Are Great's" comments. A Ute at
church today told me he didnt like the Sunday games.
All the non mormons and the rest of the world can only shake our heads and
sigh...Not only does the PR machine that represents bYu ring their
hands and worry about their best interests.... thy worry about everyone elses as
The underlying objective of this article is at the end…
“There's a reason the Utes are in the Pac-12 and BYU isn't, and
part of it is Sunday play.”Why do we find it so difficult to
simply say…congratulations U of U for your inclusion in the Pac-12? Why
can we not acknowledge that the criteria, off the field of competition, set by
the Presidents and Chancellors of the Pac-10 was to further the mission of
academics and research by the member institutions; it had nothing to do with
Sunday play. There was no conspiracy against BYU. Being numbered among the
finest is a blessing not only for the UofU but also for the state of Utah, of
which BYU is a part. President Uchtdorf, October 2010 GC…
“[P]ride turns to envy: they look bitterly at those who have better
positions, more talents, or greater possessions than they do. They seek to hurt,
diminish, and tear down others in a misguided and unworthy attempt at
self-elevation.” BYU fans…let’s simply
say…”well done, U of U.”
Theres a reason BYU is not in the PAC 12 and it's ALL about Sunday play.
Either that's true or Cal and Standford were lying.
re:myperspective...nice try. Why don't you write Elder Uchtdorf and ask how
he feels about keeping the sabbath holy?No conspiracy? Which
articles during that time period did you decide to ignore? The PAC was very
clear about BYU's Sunday play. Don't believe the smoke screen of
"academics and research". Why in your pride is it important to insinuate
BYU is 'not worthy" of the PAC? I can't believe for a minute you
really believe BYU wasn't discriminated against, especially when compared
to Colorado.Why are you trying to diminish and tear down others in a
misguieded and unworthy attempt at self-elevation.
Ray No BYU Athletes while they are at ByU compete on Sunday that I am aware of.
No games are scheduled then. Food service, When they had dairy don't know
if the do anymore, MTC Phone Directory people pre cell phone days maybe now of
course they worked sundays. Some jobs require 24 hour service. Same as Police
or Medical people. What someone does when they leave is up to them.As for the Sabbath I remember tracting on SAturday and some 7th day Adventist
was going to the beach. Like LDS diffrent commitments of sabbath on there
religion. Jews maybe same way. Kid could not do Friday night or Saturday
Afternoon school activities. A 7th day adventist school can't compete at
State Tournament for those reasons. Same reason Byu won't compete on
Sunday as instituion. Doctrine of LDS church what individuals do is up to them.
Re: 3grandslamsEveryone knows that keeping the Sabbath day holy
means commenting on Sports articles and watching BYU sports coaches shows.Oh yeah, and watching the Superbowl next week is ok, because Pitta is
Is Rock suggesting the University adopt the values of the LDS Church?Is Rock suggesting the Jazz adopt the values of the LDS Church?Is
he suggesting that in accord with the values of the LDS church he has never
covered or reported on a Sunday athletic event?I'm guessing
Rock will be there front and center during the Super Bowl next Sunday, and he
will have no comment about the former BYU players performing in the game on
Sunday.Keep your religious values to yourself Rock, and let others
keep their values to themselves.I suggest that we refrain from
passing judgment on the values of others? I suggest that we refrain
from accusing others selling their souls to the devil? I suggest
that if there are some whose values are offended when the Utes play of Sunday,
that they simply cheer for the Utes on days other than Sunday.
Just sitting down to watch Michigan vs. Illinios..... As Brad points out, I see
the sadness in the players and standing room fan's faces for being forced
to play on Sunday....a tear drips slowly down th check of coach Beilein.I hope some how, some way, the Utes can find a strength of making the
best of of sinful situation.
Re:3grandslams, The Pac said nothing about BYU's Sunday play as it was
never a point of discussion. However, the Utah media said plenty about
byu's Sunday play. Huge difference. Over time, BYU fans have embraced the
notion it as fact.There was no "smoke screen" regarding
academics or research. The criteria upon which the Pac-10 Presidents and
Chancellors based their decision was, in order of priority: 1.
Academics2. Research3. Athletic ProwessMost schools, BYU
included, do not meet this stringent criteria particularly when it comes to
research. Colorado? Outside of sports, you don't know much about
Colorado.Just say..."Congratulations UofU" and stop with the
pride as we have been asked to do.
One more thing…Chris B's momma: “Sold your souls
for a mess of pottage…”Dumprake: “Utah is now in
bed with the devil…”COUGARNATE: “only reason why
BYU is not in the PAC is because of the religious thing…The PAC 12 is a
conference full of liberal, biased, hypocritical institutions that preach
acceptance of all, but discriminate if you are not like them, just like all
liberals.”Dante: “Participating in the Pac-10 will aid
the Utes in recruiting a few borderline "secular" players who have no
interest in honoring the fifth commandment (of God's Ten
Commandments)…”Again, President Uchdorff: It
“leads some to revel in their own perceived self-worth, accomplishments,
talents, wealth, or position. They count these blessings as evidence of being
“chosen,” “superior,” or “more righteous”
than others. This is the sin of “Thank God I am more special than
It seems the DM moderators are okay with Rock accusing the University of selling
its soul to the devil... But, they really don't want any
rebuttal or comment on the matter.
COUGARNATE:"All the more proof the only reason why BYU is not in
the PAC is because of the religious thing. I think it is hilarious that all
these Utes fans were denying that was the reason BYU wasn't in that
conference. Now we know for sure."So because Brad Rock said so,
that counted as "proof", and you now "know for sure"?Wow! You clearly need to believe that so desperately. Too bad for you that
the truth of the matter is, Utah's selection to the Pac-12 was a Football
decision. THAT's where all the money is. Utah's 2 BCS bowls mattered
more to the Pac-12 than Utah's 10 national championships in both Gymnastics
and Skiing, and Utah's 4 Final Fours (including 1 national championship) in
Basketball. The cougars had zero BCS bowls, and weren't the nation's
winningest team vs. schools from BCS conferences from amid all the mid-major
schools, and neither were they the nation's winningest postseason team.
Utah was selected because the U > Y. End of story.
@myperspective,Is it tough cheering for a team with a 1-14 PAC 10
road record the past two years?Go cardinal
3grandslams:"Theres a reason BYU is not in the PAC 12 and
it's ALL about Sunday play. Either that's true or Cal and Standford
[sic] were lying."Where had it been reported that Cal and
Stanford kept the Indy-WACers out due to Sunday play. Did you frantically and
emotionally make that up?
@Howard S.@MyPerspectiveFrom Moroni 7: 12
Wherefore, all things which are good cometh of God; and that which is evil
cometh of the devil; for the devil is an enemy unto God, and fighteth against
him continually, and inviteth and enticeth to sin, and to do that which is evil
continually. 13 But behold, that which is of God inviteth and
enticeth to do good continually; wherefore, every thing which inviteth and
enticeth to do good, and to love God, and to serve him, is inspired of God. 14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that
which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the
devil. 15 For behold, my brethren, it is GIVEN UNTO TO JUDGE, that
ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know
with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.It
is given unto us to Judge.MyPerspective, One apostle's teaching
does not make other teaching's less important.Everyone is given
to make their own choice even on breaking the sabbath.
The PAC-12 didn't want BYU because it's not a tier 1 research
Utah is a secular school. For those that are offended that Utah is playing a
Sunday game then just don't attend or watch. I'm more
offended by our play: Utah 26 Stanford 46 @HALFGo UTES!!
Jazzsmack...The University of Utah and the Pac-12 do not need a hall pass from
byu. I am devout LDS. Judgement results from envy and pride; it's part of
being human. Go back and read what President Uchtdorf has to say about sports
and pride and take responsibility for your own actions and words. The UofU has nothing to do with you or with byu so why do you care if Utah
plays games on Sunday? Answer that question honestly and maybe then you will be
able to say..."Congratulations UofU" and move on. It's time you,
byu fans, and the local media walk the talk instead of finding ways to blame
others for their disappointments.
Based on the embarrassing results of the game I'm guessing the Ute players
and coaches themselves would have elected to skip this Sunday debacle if they
had it to do over again. If anybody wasted their time going to the Huntsman
Center tonight I'm guessing they were back home reading the Ensign by half
time anyway. No harm, no foul.
I don't hold anything against people that have work on Sunday or boycott
the business. Some people don't have a choice. I keep seeing where
BYU fans are pulling the "PAC 12 did not invite us for religious issues and
no Sunday play" Well I don't exactly see any other conference knocking
on BYUs door do you? Other than a desperate Big East conference that will do
anything to stay relevant. Don't think for a moment that other conferences
don't have an issue with BYUs no Sunday play.Perhaps BYU should
eliminate all sports programs. This would keep players from turning pro and
playing on Sundays.Unfortunately we are going down the road of big
money and corporate sponsorships. Especially with how the new playoff is being
set up. I predict we will see corporate sponsorships attached to conferences in
the near future. Another layer of decision makers in other words. The Dr. Pepper
SEC or Frito Lay Big 12 does not sound interesting. Unfortunately that is the
direction we are going. Make fun of Utah all you want. The future looks limited
for BYU sports, especially football.FCS football sounds better
Mr. Rock,Please provide your religious insight as to 1) which
supreme being was responsible for the snow to fall at such a time and in such an
amount as to keep so many of us sinners from attending the Sunday game (was
someone trying to save our souls? Or was the devil backing out of the
"deal" made between us? Or?) 2) Which devine being was responsible for
such a poor showing by my Utes? I look forward to reading your next
discussion be it in the sports section or the religion section.
re Naval Vet: no I didn't make it up. Here's just one
"outside" report that really saw what was going on...Go to the bleacher
report and search for BYU PAC 10 discrimination.Lighten up guys,
you're really messing up. You lecture BYU fans but are guilty of the very
things you say you detest. It's ok just admit that BYU was very
qualified for the PAC but they were discriminated against because of their
religion. Why can't you admit it? Does it make you smaller somehow?
spokane ute how dare you lump all lds people in 1 category you mention that
all lds people watch the super bowl well guess what i have not watched the
super bowl or any other pro football in well over 25 years it does not
interest me in the least,and i seldom watch sports on sunday anyway i,m not
even an active mormon but to lump all lds people in 1 category is ludicris.
MyPerspective"There was no "smoke screen" regarding
academics or research. The criteria upon which the Pac-10 Presidents and
Chancellors based their decision was, in order of priority: 1.
Academics2. Research3. Athletic ProwessMost schools, BYU
included, do not meet this stringent criteria particularly when it comes to
research."The gaping holes in your argument:1. BYU
has superior undergraduate Academics to Utah and many other schools in the PAC
122. Some of the schools in the nearly completed PAC 10 / Big 12 South
merger fall within the exact same "high research" category as BYU, yet
the PAC 10 was ready to welcome the Big 12 South teams with open arms (except
for Baylor, hmmm)3. It's not even debateable that BYU's overall
athletics prowess far exceeds Utah'sThe truth is BYU
wasn't invited to join the PAC 12 because of its strict no Sunday play
policy and the religious bigotry of a few members.Interestingly, BYU
still plays in the same conference as most of the PAC 12 schools in several
sports including Indoor Track & Field and Men's Volleyball; and BYU and
California have a healthy rivalry in Rugby.
So, how'd that first Sunday game go for U?
@Mount Olympus"Oh yeah, and watching the Superbowl next week is
ok, because Pitta is playing."That will be great! No need for
utah "fans" to watch since alex smith will not be playing.
I love the ute "fan" angst over this article! Very funny!That said Rock didn't "condemn" utah for playing on Sunday or
even chastise them for doing so. But he is rightly pointing out that in this
community the majority of indiduals that live here are members of the lDS church
and they prefer not to have games on Sunday based on church teachings. It does
affect attendance, it does affect viewership, it does affect the following for
the program. chris hill knows it, he admitted it, kryskowiak knows it, everyone
knows it even the utah "fans' on here whining about how it
shouldn't be an issue. Guess what? It IS an issue.Now I
don't care if they play on Sunday or not, but I absolutely love watching
the tortured reactions to it by guys like howie, wedgie, naval, etc. Love it! Love it! Love it!LOL!By the way how was
attendance last night? Real attendance, not announced attendance.
This is not all about "you" John, speaking of holier that thou" and
BYU. It is advice and counsel from our Creator to keep the Sabbath Day Holy from
the Creator Himself.
@DuckhunterThat will be great! No need for utah "fans" to
watch since alex smith will not be playing.-----------------Yes but Paul Kruger and Ma'ake Kemoeatu will. As a Ravens fan you
should have known that.
Playing on Sunday IS an issue for many Ute fans, including this long-time season
ticket holder. As it turns out, I didn't miss much except for
the treacherous drive down icy, snow-packed I-80.As much as my
fellow Utah fans try to ignore the obvious, the Runnin' Utes died when
Majerus left. The Utes were good in 2005 with the team Majerus left behind and
decent in 2008 with Neville, but other than that, the Utes have been dreadful
for almost a decade.The only reason "reported" attendance
remains in the 7,000 to 8,000 range is because Utah continues to report season
ticket holders as attending, even though most us only go to an ocassional game.
The only reason we continue to renew our season tickets is on the hope that the
Utes will someday have a decent team again - that hope, however, is beginning to
fade, and many of us are losing patience. And, no, we're not impressed with
Utah's supposed "improvement" this season. Winning a couple more
games against Willamette and having a few moral victories isn't fooling
@uteologyI'm not a Ravens fan.
navel vet"Where had it been reported that Cal and Stanford kept
[BYU} out due to Sunday play. Did you frantically and emotionally make that
up?"We all know that's not the kind of thing that's
going to come out of an official press release from either school or from the
PAC 12, but it's common knowledge that Cal and Stanford didn't want
ANY religiously affiliated schools invited to the PAC 12, including Baylor.That's why Colorado was so hastily invited to join the PAC on the
eve of the PAC 10 / Big 12 South merger, to shut Baylor out of the picturen. No
Sunday play for BYU was just another non-starter for a conference that
celebrates "inclusion" as long as you think like they do.Interestingly, although a couple of university presidents/chancellors opposed
inviting BYU, almost all PAC 12 AD's supported inviting BYU because of its
strong athletic programs.
skywalker: "We all know that's not the kind of thing that's going
to come out of an official press release from either school or from the PAC 12,
but it's common knowledge that Cal and Stanford didn't want ANY
religiously affiliated schools invited to the PAC 12, including Baylor.""Common knowledge?" Ah, yes, the conspiracy. BYU...always the
victim."That's why Colorado was so hastily invited to join
the PAC on the eve of the PAC 10 / Big 12 South merger, to shut Baylor out of
the picturen. No Sunday play for BYU was just another non-starter for a
conference that celebrates "inclusion" as long as you think like they
do."What a story. Did you think this up all by yourself? Based
on the criteria set by the Presidents and Chancellors of the Pac-10 I will agree
that the no Sunday play was a non-starter. It wasn't even a topic of
discussion and, accordingly, BYU was not on their radar.phantomblade: "BYU has superior undergraduate Academics to Utah and many
other schools in the PAC 12." A debatable point but what is not debatable
is that BYU's post-graduate portfolio is paper thin. Research? Fail!
Big deal. I wish the Utes well in their conference. Let them play whenever they
want. Different sorts of people go to and cheer for the U and the Y. Vive la
Will this have an impact on recruiting? As the Utes continue to rebuild, the
Sunday-play policy may be a factor in bringing the best LDS athletes to SLC.
Loveridge was a huge get last year but I wonder how many other elite athletes
from Utah (or other non-Utah LDS) will come to the hill, even after the Utes
start winning again.
Howard, let me give you some insight. Brad Rock was joking when he talked about
the Utes, "selling their soul to the devil." I didn't read one
thing in his article that was judgmental. Much of his article was hilarious as
he understands Utah culture so well. He's pretty equal opportunity about
making good natured jabs at BYU. His article is very relevant because there are
so many Utah fans who are members of the LDS church and who feel conflicted
because they want to keep the Sabbath Day holy and watch the team they love as
they have always been able to do. I think your suggestion that Ute fans who are
in this camp cheer for their team every other day is a great idea.
skywalker:"We all know that's not the kind of thing
that's going to come out of an official press release from either school or
from the PAC 12, but it's common knowledge..."If it
didn't come out as an official press release, how COULD it become
"common knowledge"? Don't mistake "common knowledge" for
"frantic and emotional cougar folklore". Your fanbase made that story
up in order to explain away how unwanted you were, without having to accept that
you just weren't good enough to meet the Pac-10's criteria: Academic,
Athletic, and Cultural fits.Fail.
To my fellow LDS fans: off the high horse, please. U of U is secular. Nobody is
forcing you to attend a Sunday game, and if a Mormon athlete doesn't want
to play on Sunday, he can go to BYU (if he can).To BYU haters:
amazing to me that some of you just can't stand to see anyone stand on
principle.To PAC12 haters: you sound pretty bigoted to me. I find
Republicans to be intolerant of a lot of things, especially liberals and poor
people (the 47%). Granted that BYU's religious affiliation was a stopper
for PAC12 admittance, but probably not the only one. Get off that high horse.
Maybe BYU can get into the Big XII - they're mostly conservative Republican
states. Oops, forgot that the Bible Belt tends to hate Mormons. Oh well. Guess
we'll just have to go eat worms.
@Naval VetAcademics...USNWR....BYU #68......Utah #127 ute-FAILAthletics....BYU has 8-10 Top 25 programs each year......Utah 1.Utah has never bettered BYU in the Directors Cup. ute-FAILAll-Americans...BYU quadruples Utah, year after year, after year.
ute-FAILBYU, like Baylor will never be invited to the Pac because
they are Faith Based Institutions....Period!Utah was selected as the
12th member, after Colorado was prematurely invited, as to wedge out Baylor,
which then caused the Okie-Texas-6 deal to fall apart.In other
words, the Pac-10 lost out on Texas/Oklahoma because of their bias against
Bluto:Utah was vetted for Pac-10 membership well before even the
IDEA of raiding the Big 12. And even if the Pac-10 HAD have been successful in
luring Texas, Tx. Tech, and Oklahoma, Utah would STILL have been part of that
16-team confederation. FAIL!Academics: Academic
Ranking of WORLD Universities: Utah #82...the Y is somewhere between
#303-401Times Higher Education WORLD University Rankings: Utah #83...the
Y is somewhere between #501-600FAIL!"...the Pac-10
lost out on Texas/Oklahoma because of their bias against religious
institutions."That had nothing to do with it. You made that up.
How frantic and emotional of you. Texas balked at joining the Pac-10 because
they wanted a larger share of the revenue, and Scott insisted the Pac-12/16
would be an equal revenue sharing conference. Oklahoma and Tx. Tech balked
because Texas did. The Pac-10's decision to to expand, and who they opted
to invite was not a "religious" decision, as much as your sour-graped
fanbase would like to pretend otherwise. It was a "Football" decision.
End of story. Fail!
Sunday play ? How dare they. Maybe all the good LDS folks whom are at Disneyland
on SUNDAY can leave a bit early and watch the Utes play USC? Steve Young and all
the other LDS faithful had no problem with Sunday play in the NFL. It's
called living in the real world. Steve used to have some quiet scripture time on
Sundays in the morning which is available to any LDS member who must work on