The Framers of our Constitution were correct - only people mature and altruistic
enough should be accorded full citizenship - including the right to own guns.
Only property owners showed sufficient maturity to be full citizens.And they would be mature enough to not sell guns to criminals, and keep them
locked in a safe place.
@ BrentBot: So only people who own property should be allowed to own guns? And
this is going to solve gun crimes?Okaaaay.....
Re BrentBotMany of the founders owned slaves.----------Guns are not the problem. In societies where guns are
not available, this same thing happens and the perpertrators use knives. (this
just happened in China and continually happens there). The problem is that
parents are neglecting to properly raise their children.We're
we to get rid of guns this problem will not go away. Criminals would then use
knives and also gasoline bombs which would kill even more people.
Any attempt to effectively implement mental health rules will be opposed by the
ACLU, partly because social science is not able to clearly identify those at
risk and act accordingly. Guns? Big problem. Mentally ill? Bigger problem. Add
the two and you have Newtown, CT.
Re:cjbTrue. Bad things can happen with or without guns. But the
kids in China survived. They are not dead. We have a bad combination in this
country of ubiquitous guns and disturbed unstable people. The U.S. rate of
firearm death far exceeds every other industrialized country. More guns, less
regulation isn't going to solve the problem. Even if the teacher had a gun
she didn't have the element of surprise the gunman had. Even highly
trained law enforcement officers can kill/hurt innocent bystanders when trying
to take down an assailant in the same situation.
I remember a few years back there was a big push here in Utah to ban all
firearms from schools and churches. There was also a legal fight to ban firearms
from the University of Utah campus.Here's my simple question in
regard to this. If we ban all firearms from all schools, colleges campuses and
churches, how will this law be enforced? Simply banning something
doesn't make the problem go away. Look at drugs like cocaine. It's
illegal but does that mean its not a problem?As for mental health,
I'm glad to see this topic has been brought up. However, mental health is a
more complicated issue than even firearms. How do we know someone is
mentally ill and capable of committing murder? Few mentally ill people do such
things, but how do we tell the difference between those that might hurt others
as opposed to those who would not? Lot's of important issues to
"Only property owners showed sufficient maturity to be full
citizens."...and if you inherited property, you also inherited
I think putting God back in schools and homes would help. Maybe more Bible time
in the home and fewer violent video games? Here is another idea, do like
Israel does and arm the teachers. When last did you hear of a
multiple-victim shooting taking place on a firearm range, in a police station or
at a gun show. You haven’t. A deranged shooter will always opt for a
"gun free" zone. In Israel, teachers and parents who serve
as school aids are armed with semi-automatic firearms whenever they are on
school grounds. Since they adopted this policy in the 1970s, attacks by gunmen
at Israeli schools have become non-existent.In 2004 Thailand adopted a
similar approach to ensure the safety of its schoolchildren.
Which guns and how they were used and why so many died may help to determine
whether or not society can learn anything about the role of guns in such
terrible mass murders. So far, it's still pretty confusing.
This tragic young man's mother was the owner of the guns and they
didn't protect her. Access to her guns allowed this terrible crime to
happen.Guns kill. It is what they were designed to do.
Each time a mentally disturbed criminal decides to commit suicide by shooting
up a school, mall, theater or other soft target, we hear the same "feel
good" argument: Ban guns! Yet there is not a single documented situation
where passing a gun ban law has resulted in a lower crime rate. If the principal
had been a registered permit holder along with at least a few of the other
teachers, there is at least a chance that the scope of this massacre could have
been lessened. People who work protecting our children should be required to
equip themselves with the means to do so.
Re: "Were we to get rid of guns this problem will not go away. Criminals
would then use knives . . . ."No, criminals would still use
guns.There is zero possibility of ridding the country of guns in the
hands of bad guys. It simply will not, CANNOT happen.Liberal and
"progressive" politicians can only disarm law-abiding citizens. This
case, and too many others like it, show what the result of that would be.Evidence was the school principal died in an heroic attempt to confront
the crazed gunman. She had the guts, but was denied the tools by a deranged
liberal campaign over the last 100 years, or so, to assure that in situations
like this, bad guys can confidently assume they'll be carrying the only
readily available weapons.The result in this case, and most others
like it could have been much different if willing teachers and staff were
permitted to carry arms.In fact, it's quite likely there'd
have been no incidents at all if the cowardly perpetrators thought they'd
encounter armed opposition.
Bee Careful and Purcuradorfical: Is that how we now want our schools to be:
Every adult armed to the hilt just in case there happens to be an incident such
as this one occur. And there would never be the scenario of a perpetrator
grabbing a kid and saying, Put down your gun or this child dies. Wonder what a
teacher would do in that sitution. It wouldn't take long for all the
teachers. Just as you say that every time an incident like this brings out the
antigun crowd, so to does it bring out the arm everyone because that will make
it better crowd. There is no evidence for either.
Lt. Paul Lance is a State officer. He stated that there is 'very good
evidence' that would link the murderer to a motive.Another
unidentified officer (perhaps federal) tries to say the opposite.A
Book of Mormon prophet,Amulek, upon seeing the murder of little children at the
hands of wicked men exclaimed "how can we witness this awful scene".
Alma 14:10He was consoled however by Alma who said that the Lord
receiveth the children up unto himself, in glory; and he doth suffer that they
may do this thing, or that the people may do this thing unto them, according to
the hardness of their hearts, that the judgments which he shall exercise upon
them in his wrath may be just; and the blood of the innocent shall stand as a
witness against them, ..and cry mightily against them at the last day.
The logistics of gun battles in war time always show a much larger number of
injured ratio to the number of killed.That is why upon hearing of
the 26 death without a injured count, I did not believe the report.Now, that this article reveals that the children were first gunned down and
then while they were on the ground the murderer or murderers walked up to their
small injured bodies and pumped multiple shots into them to insure that they
were dead.That is also something that I found hard to believe, that
that kind of people exist on this planet. Therefore, I doubted the whole thing
at first.Secret works of darkness and murder do exist in this world.
The collectivist secret police in England have experimented for years with mind
controlling drugs and have been able to have their robot-like people do the
unthinkable while in this hypnotic state where their consciences have been
guns do not have minds, hands or legs. they can not even load or fire without
the aid of a human being. A firearm can not read to know where they can and can
not be taken. Example of the shooting in Oregon ealier this week. The person
carrying the weapon read a sign no guns permitted in the Mall. It was mentioned
that the school shooter was gothic. That seems to be a common thread not always.
I would like to know what this and other killers do to get to this point. Do
they sit and play video games, watch certain types of movies, are drugs
involved. The persons home life, etc. Seems like as the family has declined and
mothers having to work, or more interested in a career than raising their kids.
Plus the people who care more about maintaining a women's right to an
abortion. Lets not forget the deadbeat dads as well. how does all these things
effect an unstable mind of some kid. ITS MORE THAN JUST THE GUN THAT. Where is
all the out cry for banning beer and drugs that lead to the killing of innocent.
Re: " Is that how we now want our schools to be . . . ?"Yep.And if this school HAD permitted willing teachers to take
appropriate training and arm themselves, not only would this incident have had a
happier outcome, there's a good likelihood it would never have occurred.
Evil, cowardly murderers would find somewhere else to work their evil.Somewhere that guarantees, even advertises ready access to unarmed,
defenseless victims.Deniers rage, but, down deep, we all know what
our founders knew -- a kinder, gentler America, like freedom, must be won and
protected by force of arms.
Really, that's how you want your child's school to be. How about we
just make it a prison atmosphere, where there is no way to get in or out. Seems
it would be much easier than arming our teachers.By the way, you
cannot prove by any stretch of the imagination that there would be a
"happier outcome" to this type of situation. You even admit that these
people would find another place to do their deeds. So, unless we all arm
ourselves like the wild west, people will find ways to do this.Here's another scenario for you however: A teacher is armed with a
weapon, or multiple teachers. A, you have no idea how they are going to react
in this type of situation, whether they are trained or not. B, when the police
show up, just exactly how are they going to know who is the "bad
guy"?We can argue this forever, and I'm not even against
guns. Own them myself. But there are major flaws in your logic!
Adam Lanza was a "law abiding citizen" until he used guns to slaughter
26 people, 20 of them children. So where does one draw the line on "law
abiding"? After senseless murder? Ban guns!
Wow..."Deniers rage, but, down deep, we all know what our
founders knew -- a kinder, gentler America, like freedom, must be won and
protected by force of arms.Truly one of the most frightening things
I have read on these boards. You sir/madame, are a menace.
Re I Aggie This happens all the time in China, more often than here,
and the victims don't always survive, a lot of the time they die too,
which happens is up to the person weilding the knife or the gun.Before guns there were murders, so if we get rid of guns the problem will
persist. Criminals who want to kill will then use either knives as they do in
China or bombs as they do in the middle east or perhaps even make use of molotov
cocktails which would be worse than guns or knives or even bombs.The
solution is in raising kids properly. Any other solution ... isn't.
Gun laws will NOT stop the bad guys from getting guns.They have
gotten guns in Britain, and in Norway, and any where else in the world.All gun laws do is disarm law abiding citizens.Tells us
extreme left how do we guard our God given rights and freedoms?And
to claim there is no needs or the need will never happen, is totally naive.To claim we could never fight the government, and then limit what we
can arm ourselves with is self-fulfilling defeatism.(it also ignores the fact it
that "we" would just not only be just the citizens)All
dictatorships, totalitarian and fascist, and communist governments start by
disarming the citizens by using any good intent, or just plain force.So what is truly the lefts motivations here?
No matter how much we assume we have the answers there is always some evil that
blasts through our perceptions. At a time like this, I hope that we all say an
extra prayer, and seek solace in prayer and meditation. It is a personal thing.
There are no words that will soothe these wounded souls. We can replay the
events and get hung up on "should have been"s and "what if"s but
in the end it is bitter reminder that our best collective intentions, trust in
others, ideaologies, philosophies, and efforts failed to stop this attrocity.
All I can add is my own personal witness that God loves each fallen
child. He is just and in His infinite wisdom and grace will see that nothing
that was deprived will last forever. There will be a reunion someday. All broken
hearts shall be healed. And those that mourn will find comfort. But that is my
faith. Sadly I cannot give it to anyone other than myself. I pray that those
seeking answers can know at even a more personal level than I do, that the
Master of all Creation cherishes them and all will someday be right.