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BYU football: Source says BYU, Big East still talking

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  • No Conference Will Take Us SEATTLE, WA
    Nov. 27, 2012 4:50 p.m.

    I would rather go back to the MWC before joining the mess known as the Big East.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 4:52 p.m.

    Having home and homes every year with Tulane and ECU?

    In all honestly, this might be the best option even given to byu. The big 12 isn't calling. Neither is the Pac 12.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 4:53 p.m.

    When will all of this ever end? I hope soon. The Big East offers nothing for BYU. End of story.

    I'm sure Boise and San Diego are having Big East buyer's remorse.

    I wonder if the original PAC10 are talking behind closed doors now?

  • Down under Pullman, WA
    Nov. 27, 2012 5:06 p.m.

    I say stay where you are as an independant and wait until the right opportunity comes along. There is no hurry. BYU will land on its feet. They are having a bit of a down year but are still a hot commodity. They have one of the best fans bases in the country and it will continue to grow.

  • MapleDon Springville, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 5:18 p.m.

    If BYU would be such a benefit to any of the major conferences, then why aren't there offers?

    The fact is BYU is the ugly girl at the dance, but isn't wise enough to recognize it, let alone admit it.

    The WCC fits BYU perfectly for other sports. For football, after blowing their opportunity with the Big12 (difficult administration), they'll need to remain content as an independent until a mid-major league comes calling.

    No major conference is going to invite them. Period.

  • WhatsInItForMe Orem, Utah
    Nov. 27, 2012 5:47 p.m.

    Someone want to explain how the Big Least (with now losing 2-3 more teams) is fast becoming CUSA-lite, that BYU would have ANY interest in joining that conference, especially with the MWC getting the same deal for a big bowl as the Big East is getting? That'd be pretty dumb. Independence is much better than that. Tougher to schedule, but better, even in a down scheduling year.

    I think we'll see the Big Four conferences (Big Ten, SEC, Big XII, and Pac-12) end up with 14-16 teams each and the Big East and ACC leftovers combining and the MWC retaining Boise St & SDSU. Basically leaving only two mid-major conferences with much of a chance for that one big-time bowl birth. (Thought the BCS was gone, didn't you? Just renamed with a 4-team playoff.)

    Whether BYU ends up in one of the Big Four conferences is up in the air. Doubt they'll stoop to the mid-major level again.

  • WhatsInItForMe Orem, Utah
    Nov. 27, 2012 5:50 p.m.

    @ MapleDon,

    And if the Pac-12 gets enticed by its bigger brother conferences to expand, who do they pick? Are teams like SDSU, Fresno St, Hawaii, Boise St, San Jose St, New Mexico, etc., better looking than ugly-duckling BYU? Be real!

  • TroyTown Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:05 p.m.

    Gotta laugh at how every mention of BYU being invited to another conference immediately generates jealous, whiney comments from the hill trolls.

    The Big East offers NOTHING - eight former C-USA teams, two former MWC teams (one really just a WAC team passing through), and an Independent.

    Why would BYU even consider joining the Big East, when the Cougars already have a 10+ year scheduling agreement with Boise State, and BYU could schedule any of the rest of the teams in the conference anytime the Cougars wanted to?

    The Big East's sweetheart "bcs" deal ends next season; then the big boys will send the Big East packing from their little club, tossed aside like last week's garbage.

  • Lightening Lad Austin , TX
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:27 p.m.

    BYU needs to be camped out at B-12 headquarters in Ft Worth, rather than looking at the Big East which needs BYU more than BYU needs them. At some point the B-12 will expand by two, I was very disheartened when I heard the commish of the conference state: he had never spoken with anyone from BYU and had no clues as to what their plans may be. There are 5 conferences that matter, the Big East and MWC are not among them

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:30 p.m.

    Talking about what? What does the Big East bring to the table?

  • runnerguy50 Virginia Beach, Va
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:30 p.m.

    If BYU were to join the BE it would show there is a major leadership problem at BYU. The BE is falling apart as we speak. The BE is a joke for football on the east coast.

  • 54-10 Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:36 p.m.

    Big East has nothing to offer. If BYU wants better access to the BCS, it should go back to the MWC and negotiate a better revenue deal similar to the deal that Texas got where Texas was allowed to keep it's Longhorn Network.

    Alternatively, BYU will have to win its way in and they have proven that they are incapable of doing that.

  • RU Serious Washington, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:39 p.m.

    Sundays will always be a problem. Many major conferences won't look at let alone ask BYU because of this. Stand strong.

  • MapleDon Springville, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 6:58 p.m.

    @WhatsInItForMe

    I'm still laughing at your comment. You just go ahead and keep hoping for that PAC12 invitation to BYU. They would take SUU before BYU. The administrators (not the coaches and ADs) will never allow BYU in. If you'd done just a little research, you would have known that. But you go ahead and keep hoping and waiting. And that beard of yours will be long and grey before it ever happens.

  • U 90 Corona, CA
    Nov. 27, 2012 7:32 p.m.

    If pressure mounts on the PAC 12 to move to 16 teams I believe byu will get invited if the pac can't entice some of the big 12 schools to join.. Outside of byu, a few B12 schools and maybe Boise state their aren't too many expansion options for the PAC. Personally I hope byu joins Utah in the south division

  • LovemesomeCougars LAYTON, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 7:48 p.m.

    Love Independence!!!

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 7:54 p.m.

    byu should join the PAC

  • WhatsInItForMe Orem, Utah
    Nov. 27, 2012 7:58 p.m.

    @ MapleDon,

    I don't want BYU in the Pac-12. Just saying there's little else for them to choose from as Texas will never go West.

    I expect BYU to either remain independent or get invited to the Big XII or Big Ten. But, I won't hold my breath for either of those.

  • DEW Cougars Sandy, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 9:22 p.m.

    why keep talking with big least? stay put

  • wer South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 27, 2012 9:29 p.m.

    With all the misnamed conferences (Big "10", Big "12", etc.) it's time to start the correction process with this conference in the New England area that is desperate to stay relevant.

    New name: "Big Least".

    BYU: stay away from this soon to be gone group.

  • gdog3finally West Jordan, Utah
    Nov. 27, 2012 10:15 p.m.

    I am not sure if I was BYU, that I wouldn't want to go back to the MWC if TV and other concessions were made. Even more so if the conference got stability and Boise State to return.

    Where is the Big East headed? Didn't they lose their BCS affiliation? I am not sure that matters with the landscape of college football in the future, but why not stay out west. Maybe BYU wants that 'exposure' thing on the east coast. It's just a long way to travel for road games, especially in basketball more games per week and more overall).

  • KSUBYU Las Vegas, NV
    Nov. 27, 2012 11:31 p.m.

    I love BYU but lets get real. They have not beaten a good team in the last two years. When you have to rely on USU as your big win its a shame. The schedule in the next few years will be great but if the talent and coaching does not improve no conference including the MWC will be calling.

  • The Dixie Kid Saint George, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:05 a.m.

    No way BYU joins Big East after Tulane and ECU joined. Its Big 12 or nothing now.

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:38 a.m.

    Just because conversations are taking place, doesn't mean that BYU is interested in Big East. Big East is obviously talking to anyone they can, trying to hold their conference together. Losing Rutgers and adding E Carolina and Tulane make the conference less desirable than it was 6 months ago when BYU said no.

    However, I wouldn't be surprised to see BYU add a scheduling aggreement with the Big East like Notre Dame and ACC. The Big East can't afford to lose BSU and SDSU. A scheduling agreement would help BYU and it could keep BSU and SDSU happy.

  • SportsChemistry ENGLEWOOD, CO
    Nov. 28, 2012 8:14 a.m.

    With Louisville being taken up by the ACC, the only real options for Big XII expansion are Cincinnati and BYU. They aren't going to stay at 10 forever, especially the B1G going up to 14 member schools and the SEC with that number already. The invite will come eventually (or the Big XII will get robbed by other conferences.)

  • eastcoastcoug Danbury, CT
    Nov. 28, 2012 8:27 a.m.

    Best thing for BYU to do is win games. Seems we are always worried about status but haven't done the first step of winning the big ones. That's how you get invited...

  • oldcougar Orem, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:14 a.m.

    Wow, story was over for me a few words in.

  • WON84 PLANO, TX
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:21 a.m.

    Lightening Lad - Correction, there are four, not five important conferences. The ACC is headed the way of the Big East.

    U 90 - I think you're right and I don't see Texas ever agreeing to join the Pac 12 where they'd have to give up a $15M/year contract with ESPN for the Longhorn Network. Given the Big 12 now shares revenue equally and seems like a likely landing spot for FSU and Clemson when the ACC crumbles, the Pac 12's expansion options may be extremely limited should superconferences form.

  • Still Blue after all these years Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:28 a.m.

    First, moving to either the Big East or MWC makes as much sense as playing Riley Nelson, so you never know with BYU. Second, assuming the Big XII will be one of the so called Big 4 conferences, and most think they will, they are looking east not west. Everyone seems to think FSU, Clemson, VA Tech and perhaps Miami are on their list. Cinncy could be there. The ACC would have to hold together, which they are trying hard to do, for the Big XII to have interest in BYU. But then there would be a big 5 conferences. Additionally, most of the writers in TX and OK seem to think BYU's Admin blew it a year or so ago with their demands and that the Big XII AD's and presidents were really bothered by their percived arrogance. That still leaves the Pac 12. They don't want BYU, but as others have pointed out - where do they go? The only school west of Texas left that worth anything is BYU so to not ask BYU would prove their religious prejuduce rather than silly academic statements. Or they stay at 12 teams while all others are at 16 teams.

  • Thinkman Provo, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:29 a.m.

    Your daddy's Big East is no more.

    Today's Big East is your daddy's Conference USA.

    BYU, stay put! Do not go to the Big East. Stay independent unless the Big 12 or some other BCS conference comes calling (if ever).

  • rafinsure Elk Grove/U.S.A., 00
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:31 a.m.

    Joining the Big East would be a step backwards for the Cougars. It would be like rejoining the Mountain West. BYUTv described it like the United States rejoining Great Britain. The only thing better than independence is joining a major conference like the Big 10, Big 12, or PAC 12. Getting an invitation to join any of the latter conferences won't happen for a variety of reasons. Perhaps BYU can associate itself with the Big East the same way Notre Dame has with the ACC. Starting 2014 Notre Dame will stay independent for football, but will be guaranteed five ACC games and all the other sports will join the ACC. BYU could benefit from this arrangement for football during late October and November when it is more difficult to schedule decent opponents. I prefer BYU staying with the WCC for most of their other sports though because it allows me to see them play on occasion since I live in northern California.:)

  • Ironman SANTA CLARA, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:43 a.m.

    Another unnamed "source". This is pure speculation and conjecture.

    This article is published to titillate and tease the Cougar fans and foes alike who don't understand BYU's mission and the role of its athletic teams.

    BYU will remain independent.

  • Ironman SANTA CLARA, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 9:51 a.m.

    @ Chris B.

    What is Utah's record in the PAC-12?

    7-11

    Go buy yourself a Slurpee, pal.

  • Johnny Triumph American Fork, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 10:16 a.m.

    They may be talking but it would take a crazy good deal for BYU to make a move. Ride out the ESPN contract and then renew and wait, the bigger conferences will come calling once they decide to move to 16 teams. The PAC especially will have to consider BYU then and will bow to the Sunday play needs.

  • Utah Fan2 Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:03 a.m.

    "Source says BYU, Big East still talking"

    Yes, the conversation is going something like this:

    BE: Have you changed your mind about joining the BE?

    BYU: Not yet, but we're evaluating all options.
    (but yours is seeming less and less attractive everyday)

    Until the Big East signs a new television contract and BYU can see in writing what they'd be getting in exchange for their Independent contract with ESPN, the Cougars would be fools to even consider joining the Big East.

  • alternate Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:08 a.m.

    The best commentor so far said all BYU has to do is win. If they win their games then they will be top 20 or even 10 material and the new payoff system is within reach.

    The BYU naysayers are right to a degree. They will never be in the PAC, not because of their football talent or lack of, but because of Sunday. Sunday is also why they are not already in the Big12 or the PAC for that matter.

    Comparing the situations of Utah and BYU both still come down to winning. Neither will get into a playoff game without winning. The PAC holds no magic for Utah if they continue to go 4/5 or 3/6 in conference games. If BYU wins, the path is set. Their brand is well-known now. Had they gone 12-0 or 11-1, they would have been in a BCS game this year. Ditto for Utah, 12-0 or 11-1 puts them in the Rose Bowl or better. One naysayer said BYU is incapable of winning. A correct statement at this point. But he should have included his own school also. Both schools fit the mold for the past 2 years.

  • hamrdown OREM, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:12 a.m.

    @KSUBYU, you do not seem to understand that the conference realignment is not about wins/losses over the past few years and who BYU has/has not beaten. This is all about TV revenue! Not about bowl games, rivalries, win/loss records, whether your dad wears a belt or not - it is simply about TV revenue and the TV markets. Utah and Colorado were invited to the PAC because they wanted the TV markets. That is why the SEC, Big 10, Big East, and ACC are expanding is expanding - it is all about TV markets which bring in the TV revenue - period!

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:14 a.m.

    "The PAC especially will have to consider BYU then and will bow to the Sunday play needs."
    Sunday play was never the issue. The common "problem" when negotiating with the PAC12, Big12, and Big East has been television rights.

  • DodgerDoug Salem, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:15 a.m.

    @MapleDon

    How is the PAC 10.2 treating you? The U will always be a fringe bowl team struggling to win 6-7 games each year. And let's talk about basketball.... they will never again sniff the post season. Enjoy losing, but hey, you're in the PAC 10.2

  • junkgeek Agua Dulce, TX
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:27 a.m.

    Lavell Edwards Stadium would make a good new MTC.

  • Down under Pullman, WA
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:29 a.m.

    Mapel Don,
    From your expert opinion I assume that you sit on the PAC 10.2 board and have the inside scoop. Thanks for expert insight.
    I agree that Sunday play is a problem for BYU but I admire any institution that wil stand by its principles regardless of what the secular worls will say. it is NOT all about money.

  • anti BCS Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:36 a.m.

    SoonerUte

    "Sunday play was never the issue. The common "problem" when negotiating with the PAC12, Big12, and Big East has been television rights."

    As far as the Big East and Big 12, you're mostly correct, although Sunday play was somewhat of an issue for the Big 12.

    As for the PAC 12, you couldn't be more wrong.

    The PAC 12 ADs were in favor of inviting BYU, but some of the PAC 12 presidents were adamantly opposed to inviting ANY religiously-based school, whether that was Baylor or BYU. The reason Colorado was invited just before the Big 12 South-PAC 10 merger was finalized, was to exclude Baylor. When the merger fell apart, the PAC 10 went to their fall-back plan, which was Utah.

    "Research University" status was given to the public as the main reason for inviting Utah instead of BYU, but that was only their official "excuse" since at least one Big 12 South school has the exact same Reseach University classification as BYU.

    Bottom line is the quality of athletic programs at Colorado, Utah and BYU was never even a consideration.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:37 a.m.

    Sunday play is a non-issue. Fact is, the super conferences are for football, that's why you're seeing more and more "football only" members of conferences. Should the PAC feel the need to expand to 16, as many think they will, this will likely be the loophole that keeps them relevant in football, while also retaining certain ideas as a conference. It's very plausible that they invite BYU, Boise, SDSU as football only members. Football is never played on Sunday, so there's no problem there.

    To those saying an invite depends on winning, didn't Rutgers and Maryland just join the Big Ten? Yeah, it's all about television.

  • PAC man Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:40 a.m.

    junkgeek

    "Lavell Edwards Stadium would make a good new MTC."

    We were thinking RES would be a better choice since it's closer to church headquarters and the airport and will become a sea of empty red chairs anyway as soon as the Utes suffer a couple more losing seasons; see the HC.

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 12:06 p.m.

    hamrdown,

    Keep on believing that the PAC wanted Utah for the TV market if you want. If that was a factor in their reasoning they were sorely misguided. BYU has always dominated the Salt Lake TV market. Maybe that will change in the future but smart money says BYU will continue to dominate the advertising dollars. (See theMtn.)

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 12:46 p.m.

    "I wonder if the original PAC10 are talking behind closed doors now?"

    Yes, sam, they're laughing at the fact that poor old Utah this year was still able to beat a then-ranked team (which never resurfaced), but byu couldn't. It is so amusing to see byu's fans talk and act like they have maintained relevance on the national scene. Hah!

  • Levin Hightstown, NJ
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:07 p.m.

    @Whoa,Nellie, the Pac-12 decision was probably less about advertising dollars now than subscriber fees. The Pac-12 didn't need two Utah teams to get on a lower cable tier (i.e. more fee income). Out of the two teams that could get Pac-12 games on SLC TVs, UofU was the better fit for the conference. They made a fine choice picking a state university, with a medical school, world-renowned graduate programs, recent BCS success, and, yes, fewer accommodations than BYU.

    Now, if they need to expand for the sake of getting quality football teams to compete with other "super conferences", it's really hard for me to see them not taking BYU.

  • NightOwlAmerica SALEM, OR
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:19 p.m.

    OHBU said:

    "Sunday play is a non-issue. Fact is, the super conferences are for football, that's why you're seeing more and more "football only" members of conferences. Should the PAC feel the need to expand to 16, as many think they will, this will likely be the loophole that keeps them relevant in football, while also retaining certain ideas as a conference. It's very plausible that they invite BYU, Boise, SDSU as football only members. Football is never played on Sunday, so there's no problem there......"

    Uh you might want to look at this seasons scheduling, and even a few years back. There were games played on Sunday. Not a lot, but games were played on Sunday.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:25 p.m.

    JohnInSLC

    "they're laughing at the fact that poor old Utah this year was still able to beat a then-ranked team"

    Nope, they're crying in their sauce wondering how BYU came so close to beating #1-ranked Notre Dame in South Bend, when mighty pre-season #1 USC looked so pitiful in failing to score with seven chances inside 10 at home.

    BYU at Notre Dame 14-17
    Notre Dame at USC 22-13

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:32 p.m.

    re: NightOwlAmerica

    Wow, you got me. There were two games played on Sunday, out of over 720. I'm sure this means it will be a problem. Let me amend my statement so you can sleep again.

    In football, Sunday play is not an issue, since only about 0.3% of games are played on Sunday.

    In other words, my entire point still stands, if BYU is invited as a football-only member, then the only details that need to be ironed out are TV related.

  • ItrustNo1 La Grange, TN
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:44 p.m.

    It amazes me how Utah fans, whose fan base consists of an area about 30 miles wide around their University, thinks being in the Pac 12, which by all accounts is the weakest conference among the Big 12, Big 10, ACC, SEC, and Pac 12, makes them suddenly something special. Maybe if Utah could win a few Football, Basketball and/or Baseball games in this very average conference they could expand the tiny fan base they have. If it weren't for Oregon, Stanford and USC, no one would even talk about the Pac 12. I would think it wiser if Utah fans would stay still until there teams started to win once in a while. Saying yes to a Pac 12 offer to join their conference does not make Utah or any other University great until they win something of substance.....like a few games. I know the next move for you Utah fans will be to bash BYU....Well, I am not a fan of either school so knock yourself out. I am just observing the obvious. BYU has a fan base that fills stadiums everywhere they go.. why do you think ESPN gave them their own contract?

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:53 p.m.

    anti BCS - we'll just disagree. I don't buy the "religious persecution" theory. It doesn't hold up now that we know more about BYU's bargaining style. They walk in the door with a stake in the ground of "we need to retain television rights". That's a hassle, and there are plenty of other teams that don't have the hassle.

    Look at TCU joining the Big 12. What is the major difference between TCU and BYU (other than TCU's dominance over BYU on the football field)? TCU was willing to turn over their television rights to the league, and BYU was not.

    Now, it's easy to understand what REALLY happened when BYU talked with Larry Scott. Larry Scott had several teams to choose from. Utah and Colordao didn't demand television rights. BYU and Texas had those demands, and they got passed over.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 1:54 p.m.

    upinthenight

    How many regular season PAC 12 football games have been played on Sunday in the last 10 years?

    Anybody trying to argue that no-Sunday play for a football-only member would be an issue is simply grasping at straws.

    BYU has been competing in men's volleyball in the MPSF (which play games on Sunday) against UCLA, USC, Stanford and other California schools since the 90's with no problems whatsoever.

    Since the NFL plays on Sunday, there's not even a remote possibility that the PAC 12 would ever consider playing a regular Sunday schedule of conference footbal games.

  • NightOwlAmerica SALEM, OR
    Nov. 28, 2012 2:11 p.m.

    Just stating the obvious OHBU.

    You specifically said "Football is never played on Sunday, so there's no problem there......"

    I simply responded to that comment. Take it any way you want.

    In addition, with the NFL looking at scheduling more games down the road during the week. Don't be surprised to see the NCAA play more games on Sundays.

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 2:57 p.m.

    upinthenight

    You're only fooling yourself if you think the PAC 12 would ever be dumb enough to try to compete head-to-head with the NFL on a regular basis.

    2 games out of 720 is proof that you're still grasping at straws.

    ------

    SoonerUte

    "I don't buy the "religious persecution" theory."

    Whether you buy it or not, the religious bigotry of some of the member institutions in the PAC 12 in not wanting to be associated with any religiously-based school is a matter of record; it's the reason the PAC 12 anxiously invited Colorado before the PAC 12/Big 12 South merger was finalized, to lock Baylor out of the deal.

  • News For U Sandy, Utah
    Nov. 28, 2012 3:23 p.m.

    @ ItrustNo1

    "It amazes me how Utah fans, whose fan base consists of an area about 30 miles wide around their University, thinks being in the Pac 12, which by all accounts is the weakest conference among the Big 12, Big 10, ACC, SEC, and Pac 12, makes them suddenly something special".

    Well this week according to ESPN (BYU's sugar daddy) the Pac-12 and the Big 12 were tied as the second best conference in college football behind the SEC. Do you really believe the ACC and the Big Ten are better conferences this year than the Pac-12? Typical Y'ner desperately trying to find something to belittle Utah and the Pac-12.

  • #utesnation Centerville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 3:58 p.m.

    @solomon Levi

    So I see you're still bragging about your LOSSES huh? If the U is so bad why can't the cougies beat'em? 3 peat, 8 of 11 baby!!

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 4:01 p.m.

    "wondering how BYU came so close to beating #1-ranked Notre Dame in South Bend, when mighty pre-season #1 USC looked so pitiful in failing to score with seven chances inside 10 at home.
    BYU at Notre Dame 14-17
    Notre Dame at USC 22-13"

    No, Levi, they're now laughing at your breathtaking logic taken to its final conclusion: Since Notre Dame only beat BYU by 3 then San Jose State (who beat the Y by 7) should be in the NC game!

    If one could put that reasoning to music, it would sound like "Rise And Shout, The Cougars Are Out"!

  • Turtles Run Missouri City, TX
    Nov. 28, 2012 4:14 p.m.

    Even though BYU and U of H are in down years I would love to see these two teams hook up on an ongoing basis. The programs are both high mid-tier teams that play solid football Plus cougar versus cougar is too hard to resist.

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 4:28 p.m.

    Leaving independence for the Big East would be a lot like leaving an iceberg to get on a sinking ocean liner.

    Louisville just left the Big East for the ACC today. I'd be surprised to see BYU jump into that kind of conference. They might as well just join C-USA.

    It will be VERY interesting if the Big 12 ends up getting Florida State and Clemson. The PAC 12 probably doesn't want to sit still at that point. Who do they get? Ultimately, I would like to see BYU in the PAC 12. If just to make Utah fans absolutely crazy.

  • alternate Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 4:52 p.m.

    I have to smile about the Sunday not being an issue comments. If it was a football only deal, then yes, but conferences and BYU want the complete package. And, the complete package means Sunday play for almost all non football sports. There was a big issue brewing during the women's soccer tournament. Had BYU made the finals, the NCAA would ahve grudingly agreed to move the game to Monday night. North Carolina solved that problem, much to the relief of NCAA officials

    This year in men's bball, Utah will need to play 3 or 4 Sunday games, 2 at Huntsman. Relly ugly stuff for their LDS players and families.

    Trust me, this is a big, big issue. It has already been said, but take away religion and Sunday play and BYU would already be in the PAC or Big12.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 5:04 p.m.

    JohninSLC

    I think they were looking at the 'pre-nuptials' before they consider expansion again.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 5:08 p.m.

    What do research instituions in the PAC want with BYU? There are now several great research instutions in the West whose teams ranked higher than the Y this year. For starters, look no farther than Logan and USU, a land-grant university and the Chair of NASA in the West, or San Jose State.

    Even if the Y went 11-1 this year (which they didn't) they are not on the short-list of any percieved PAC expansion. Likewise, no Big 10 or Big 12 is calling this year either.

    Furthermore, it should be apparant by now that BYU cannot stay independent. You need more than a seven-win season to keep ESPN's attention as their golden boy, especially when 5 of those wins were against the likes of Idaho, Weber, New Mexico State, and Hawaii.
    Flirting with an imploding conference on the East Coast is a waste of time. Even without BSU and SDSU, the MWC is looking much better than the remnants of what was the Big East.

    BYU has two choices: (1) return to the Mountain West (and intice BSU and SDSU to do the same) or (2) powerbroker a new conference.

    End of Story.

  • dumprake Washington, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 5:23 p.m.

    NO BIG EAST! Stay put, I love independence, it's where BYU should have always been. Independence for BYU means more money, more venues, more excitement, and I would love it if we never played Utah or Utah State again. The hate, anger and vitriolic ooze that spews from those two schools will not be missed. We play Notre Dame and they are very decent people, good sports, and none of the cr@p we get from Utah and Utah State. We play Boise State, San Jose State, Georgia Tech, etc, etc, etc--and none of the awful negativeness that comes from playing Utah and Utah State. For me this is reason enough to stay independent and enjoy football again, without all the negatives of the instate hate fest.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 5:54 p.m.

    The Big East has NOTHING to offer. This is a sinking ship. I would much rather play USU, Air Force, San Jose, UNLV, Nevada and Fresno every year than Tulane and the leftovers from Conference USA.

    The Big East is looking much weaker than the MWC at this point...and that is even WITHOUT BSU and SDSU.

    No, what BYU needs to do is return to the MWC...and intice BSU and SDSU to do the same. Then use whatever remains of our clout to keep our own television coverage on BYU TV and our ESPN deals...at least until the ESPN deals expire. Travelling across the country for all sports just to play weaker teams than those already committed to the Mountain West is a bad idea.

  • MUSSing with U Baltimore, MD
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:01 p.m.

    JohnInSLC

    Laughing at the inconsistent "logic" of Utah fans. Only a year ago, you were bragging about how close the Utes came to beating USC on the road.

    And how Utah beating BYU proved that Utah was better, while at the same time claiming that Utah was still better than Colorado even though Colorado beat the Utes after completely dominating them in the first half.

    btw, why are Utah fans so obsessed with every rumor about BYU moving to a conference? Are you really that insecure?

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:07 p.m.

    @dumprake

    I can agree about Utah. But Utah State??? All my Aggie friends are highly respectful about the instate rivalry.

    Maybe you and I have just talked to diffrent people, but most Aggie fans I know are very decent about athletics. I even went to the last Aggie game this year to see the coronation of U State as the WAC title holders.

    All decent people.

    On another note, there is no way we should stay independent. It is KILLING our athletics...and not just football. We are not Notre Dame and, unless we start winning a lot more high-stakes games, ESPN will drop us like an old hat. Ratings are already way down. Scheduling was never the problem, but two more years of this independence stuff and we won't be able to recruit worth snot for any sport. And, no, there are no rivalries for our other sports in their current subpar conferences.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:17 p.m.

    @Down Under

    This is beyond wishful thinking.

    BYU had a down year because recruiting has gone way down since declaring indepedent status...and it is getting worse. Do not expect next year to be any better than it was this year. Next year we have to play USU in Logan. There are no more easy wins scheduled and we will need a much better record than 7 wins against teams like Idaho, New Mexico State, Hawaii, and Weber State if we want to keep ESPN even remotely interested.

    All signs are pointing to: "This is as good as it gets being independent." This is not a "down year." This is all we can do as an independent, plain and simple, and it is not good enough.

    One losing season as an independent and we not only lose ESPN, but any baraginng chip we have to get back into decent mid-major conference. Right now, the MWC would welcome us back with open arms. It is not going to be the same if next year we go 5-7. Right now we could likely powerbroker a deal with the MWC to air games on BYU TV.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:27 p.m.

    @U 90

    It is this mentality that is killing BYU. The PAC is an athletic conference of "RESEARCH INSTITUIONS." BYU could go 11-1 as an independent and still not make the short-list.

    If the PAC ever decides to expand (note the BIG IF), it will look to other scientific research institutions first before they would even consider looking at BYU. Considering that both U State (the western Chair of NASA and one of the leading research instituions for the Air Force) and San Jose State (major research instition in Silicon Valley) both had much better teams than BYU this year, I wouldn't hold your breath for any PAC 12 invite.

    The Big 10 and the BIG 12 are much better fits, but unfortuately they are not calling. Moreover, they are not going to call until BYU posts much better seasons and numbers than they did this year.

    Time is running out for BYU. They cannot stay independent long-term.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:35 p.m.

    BYU's only saving grace this year was the win against USU. That is it.

    As impressive as that win turned out to be (who knew USU was really THAT good), it is still not enough to keep contracts with TV deals and ESPN coverage. From BYU fan to BYU fan, this WILL dry up. We WILL not be able to sustain independancy.

    Recruiting is WAY down the last two years...I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it is very likely next year will be worse that this year.

    The Moutain West is looking very solid. We need to salvage whatever clout we have left in college football and broker a deal to intice BSU and SDSU to come back with us. Then, powerbroker a coup to get a new management structure and better TV contracts for the entire conference while, as a compensation, allowing us to air our games on BYU TV.

    This independency is killing all of our athletics, not just football. And, no, don't expect next season to be any better than this season. We have just as tough (if not harder schedule) but half the talent leaving is not being replaced.

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:46 p.m.

    @alternate

    The difference you are avoiding between the two is this: what happens if you don't win?

    A am a cougarfan so hear me out because your rational is a bit delusional. If the Utes don't win in the PAC, they still get a share of bowl revnue and TV contracts. Their boys and games are still broadcast on the PAC network. If the Utes have a terrible year, which they did, no worries really. They dust off, take thier conference money and resources and try to do better next year.

    If BYU does not win, what happens? First, ESPN will drop them like a hat (already being done). There is no televised coverage for games other than BYU TV -- (i.e., I guess players and recruits should hope for Mormon NFL franchise owners). At the end of the day, there is no share of winnings or bowl revenue. There is nothing, zip, nadda. There is no revenue to rebuild your program other than internally through donors and ticket sales (which have also dried up).

    WE ARE NOT READY FOR LONG-TERM INDEPENDENCE!!!

  • SameJersey Kaysville, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 6:59 p.m.

    All this talk about BIG 10 and BIG 12 is just a tad premature don't you think?

    It does not matter if you are an independent or affiliated with the MWC. What matters is that you WIN GAMES... and big ones too.

    I don't care if the PAC, BIG 10, or BIG 12 look to expand. BYU IS NOT GETTING INVITED IN A YEAR THEY ARE 7-5 AND THEIR TOKEN WIN IS AGAINST (ALBEIT AMAZING) UTAH STATE!!!

    Had BYU upset ND in South Bend, then these talks would be justified. The same goes for U State. Despite their top 20 rank and WAC title, had they beaten Wisconsin, these talks would be justified, but they didn't.

    It is premature folks. BYU can't expect an invite from any of the major four conferences in a year they lost by 20 points to San Jose State and a beyond dismal Utah team.

    Moreover, only a fool would think independency is even an option at this point. ESPN is not going to keep favoring a Utah school who gets shut out by Oregon State in their own home.

    The Big East is imploding. The MWC looks solid even without BSU and SDSU.

  • Max Charlotte, NC
    Nov. 28, 2012 7:25 p.m.

    If Clemson and FSU go to the BIG 12 (or 10 or whatever) I would love to see BYU in the ACC. Of course it isn't going to happen but it would be a lot of fun.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    Nov. 28, 2012 7:47 p.m.

    Once again, many of you are missing the point. Winning is not the primary driver behind conference realignment--TV money is. Winning can help with that, but it's secondary. Unlike many schools, BYU has the built-in advantage of being religiously affiliated. This means there are fans spread out across the country who will tune in to watch (I know not all Mormons are fans, but they have a large national following nonetheless). Look at Notre Dame--they've been bad since 1993, up until this year. Has NBC even flinched about handing over millions to televise their games, and only their games? No. BYU is not Notre Dame, and won't command the same attention. But, BYU pulls in a disproportionately large crowd for a Thursday or Friday night game, or a Saturday nightcapper. That's all ESPN cares about. Conferences are trying to woo tv execs. Maryland and Rutgers just joined the Big Ten. If on-field performance mattered, it would have been West Virginia or Virginia Tech.

  • There You Go Again Saint George, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 7:56 p.m.

    This whole "they're talking...they're not talking" drama is continuing to look/sound like the "shoe watch" segment Tom Barberi used as part of his KALL radio program many years ago.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 8:10 p.m.

    great move...go to the conference that everyone is leaving. The Y might just as well stay independent as long as they have a football program...which might not be too much longer.

  • NightOwlAmerica SALEM, OR
    Nov. 28, 2012 8:26 p.m.

    Solomon Levi said:

    "upinthenight

    You're only fooling yourself if you think the PAC 12 would ever be dumb enough to try to compete head-to-head with the NFL on a regular basis.

    2 games out of 720 is proof that you're still grasping at straws."

    Hold on there buckaroo. You are the one that specifically said the college football is not played on Sundays. All I did was point out that they have. Does not matter how many games. Geez get over it.

    In addition, conference commissioners of all BCS conferences and others have indeed point out the potential of playing more games, feature games on Sundays. Because the NFL is branching out to other nights of the week down the road.

  • NightOwlAmerica SALEM, OR
    Nov. 28, 2012 8:34 p.m.

    ItrustNo1 said:

    "If it weren't for Oregon, Stanford and USC, no one would even talk about the Pac 12.

    BYU has a fan base that fills stadiums everywhere they go.. why do you think ESPN gave them their own contract?"

    Really? Just what decade and sports are you talking about in relation to the PAC 12? During the college world series they talked about the PAC 12. Arizona won the title.

    Many teams fill stadiums with fans on the road. Have you seen the ratings of BYU on ESPN this year? Bet Idaho and New Mexico St put up great number huh?

  • manutd San Diego, CA
    Nov. 28, 2012 10:35 p.m.

    Having the chair of nasa at usu does not make them a strong academic research institution. Its a good school but lets not get carried away. Same with san jose state. Academically byu is much stronger. We also didnt get blown out by san jose st or oregon st for that matter. In both games we had potential game winning/tying drives at the end of the games that fell apart with turnovers and poor play calling. Same with the boise game, notre dame, and utah. Despite pur rotten season we are a few plays away from a respectable season.

    I think byu will do better next year despite the tougher schedule. Stay independent for now unless something respectable comes along. Meaning pac12/big12, not big east or mwc.

    As far as invites from the bigger conferences igoes it is about money, tv contracts, exposure, etc. not academia.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Nov. 28, 2012 11:12 p.m.

    upinthenight

    "You are the one that specifically said the college football is not played on Sundays."

    Sorry buckaroo, Levi never said any such thing.

    ----------

    "Have you seen the ratings of BYU on ESPN this year?"

    Have you?

    All I know is this from an article published Nov 13, 2012.

    "In the second year of a seven-year TV deal with ESPN, is the worldwide leader in sports unhappy because the Cougars haven’t delivered on the field?"

    "Nothing could be further from the truth," said Ilan Ben-Hanan, ESPN’s vice president of programming and acquisitions. "We are thrilled with our partnership with BYU. And I don’t use that word lightly. We are genuinely thrilled."

    -------

    Stick to knitting or something you know more about, because you obviously don't understand ANYTHING about college football television marketing.

  • emotionalfriend sandy, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 2:16 a.m.

    SameJersey, it's not all about winning football games, it's about tv money. If it was about winning games, do you think Maryland and Rutgers would have received an invitation to the Big 10? Rutgers and Maryland opens up large tv markets for the Big Ten: New York City, Washington DC, and Baltimore.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 7:40 a.m.

    I have a feeling the whole BCS is moving towards 4-5 super conferences. BYU is going to get left out in the cold. No conference want a new member telling what days they will, and will not play games on.

  • Jealous U Alpine, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 8:38 a.m.

    Spokane Ute

    Unless the super conferences exclude Independents from the playoffs (which will never happen as long as Notre Dame is Independent), BYU doesn't have to worry about "being left out in the cold."

    There are so many bowls out there that a bowl eligible BYU would never have to worry about not being invited to a bowl, and "bcs access" bowls will still be available.

    Unless the super conference want to see half their teams finish with losing records and no bowls, they need opponents from the "other 5" to give the bottom dwellers like Utah a chance to qualify for a bowl.

  • No Conference Will Take Us SEATTLE, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 10:15 a.m.

    SportsFan
    Orem, UT

    ----------

    "Have you seen the ratings of BYU on ESPN this year?"

    Have you?

    All I know is this from an article published Nov 13, 2012.

    "In the second year of a seven-year TV deal with ESPN, is the worldwide leader in sports unhappy because the Cougars haven’t delivered on the field?"

    "Nothing could be further from the truth," said Ilan Ben-Hanan, ESPN’s vice president of programming and acquisitions. "We are thrilled with our partnership with BYU. And I don’t use that word lightly. We are genuinely thrilled."

    -------

    Stick to knitting or something you know more about, because you obviously don't understand ANYTHING about college football television marketing.

    >>>>>

    Sigh.

    Naturally ESPN is going to say that. Their money is on the line. And the other poster is right. BYU ratings were not all that great the past two years. Utah even had a higher bowl game rating than BYU did last season. I wish fellow BYU fans would stop pretending to know things they know nothing about.

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 29, 2012 10:49 a.m.

    no conference championships for U

    Naturally a BYU-hater like yourself is going to bury his head in the sand and pretend that ESPN is lying when the vice president of ESPN programming and acquisitions says, "We are thrilled with our partnership with BYU. And I don’t use that word lightly. We are genuinely thrilled."

    I wish that Utah trolls would stop pretending to know things they know nothing about.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 11:20 a.m.

    @JealousU

    Unless you belong to a conference, your bowl possibilies are quite limited: Kraft Fight Hunger Bowl; a bowl that a conference couldn't fill because they didn't have enough bowl eligiable teams (Military, Ticket City, New Mexico Bowl, etc.); or a BCS bowl. Under the current fcrmat, BYU will never be able to play in the Alamo, Holiday or Sun Bowl. That's just the way it is. That's the advantage of playing in a conference, especially a BCS conference.

    @Utenymous

    Utah Troll? Too funny. No, just a Utah fan discussing the BCS and conference system. The positives, the negatives, etc; on a open forum.

  • deductive reasoning Arlington, VA
    Nov. 29, 2012 11:42 a.m.

    Spokane Ute

    The corrolary to your "limited bowl options" for an Independent, is that BYU will be forced to raise its program to a higher level in order to qualify for the playoffs or a bcs access bowl, instead of being satisfied with 8-5 seasons and Sun Bowl wins over other mediocre, middle-of-the-conference teams.

    Frankly, I'd much rather go to a bowl game in San Diego, San Francisco or Las Vegas, than El Paso.

  • ND95CA Lincoln Park, IL
    Nov. 29, 2012 11:52 a.m.

    Spokane Ute

    "Utah Troll? Too funny. No, just a Utah fan discussing the BCS and conference system."

    Really?

    Why do you spend so much time whining about BYU fans "discussing" sports on Utah articles?

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 12:59 p.m.

    ND95CA

    Because they do? Big difference between discussing, and hating.

    Deductive Reasoning

    I would rather see my team play better competition than play in a prefered city, but that's just me. I never travel to bowl games......too poor! A playoff format is way out in the future. BYU would have to go 11-1 or undefeated to go to a BCS bowl; tall task! Another perk of playing in a BCS conference, you can go 8-4 and still play in a BCS bowl. If Utah would have beaten Colorado and Oregon last year, they would have played in the Rose Bowl with a 9-4 record. "If" being the key word.

  • Snack PAC Olympus Cove, Utah
    Nov. 29, 2012 1:36 p.m.

    Spokane Ute

    Mathematically, the 68th team in the NCAA tournament COULD win the NCAA championship.

    Realistically, just like Utah beating Oregon to get to the Rose Bowl last season, that's NEVER going to happen.

    A team that couldn't even beat lowly 10-loss Colorado at home last season, had absolutely NO CHANCE of beating Oregon.

    Your bcs "perk" is only a fantasy.

    Instead of thinking up fantasy scenarios about how the Utes could backdoor their way into the Rose Bowl, you should spend more time figuring out how Utah is going to beat their first PAC 12 team with a winning record.

  • JonnyDanger HOUSTON, TX
    Nov. 29, 2012 1:39 p.m.

    Louisville going to the ACC set a new precedent: Until now, conferences were very vocal about non-football issues in re-alignment, even though everyone knew that football and the $$ it generates was driving the bus. But the ACC added Louisville for their sports only-there is no way Louisville fits into that conference academically!

    Would that open the door for Boise, who has a stellar football program, but marginal other sports and academics to join a big conference? Perhaps that would be enough to sway the liberal-leaning administrators in the PAC to invite BYU. I don't know.

    For my money, I vote we wait it out in Independence. This is a good gig, good for the fans outside of Utah, getting better for the fans in Utah, and scheduling should get even easier with teams needing solid non-con schedules for the 4-team playoff. Stay where you are until someone presents an offer you can't refuse.

  • starthillnotnelson Kamas/United States, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 2:54 p.m.

    There is so much conference realignment going around, I can't keep track of anyone anymore. Here is my proposal: Make a new conference. I don't think anyone will like this scenario in the future: only 6 conferences, all with 16 teams. Everyone else will be independent. Next thing we know Division 1 will be split into 3 parts: FCS, FBS, and the Independents. (I actually read an article about this. This might not be real, but if it is, football is doomed.

  • CanuckFan Vancouver, BC
    Nov. 29, 2012 4:15 p.m.

    Although the legacy "fit" is not there, the long-term fit is really with a "PAC-16". The overriding factor is MONEY, followed by the others (geography/transportation, Sunday play, academic ranking, research/graduate level depth, religion, quality of team/program etc.). Money wins out every time in sports. The PAC will need to get to 16 teams and the alternatives are somewhat dim when you try to come up with 4 teams. When weighing all those factors mentioned BYU is clearly in the "top 4".

    In the mean time, the strategy was 3 steps:(1) exit MWC/TV contract, (2) build revenue and brand value through ESPN and independene, (3) set yourself up (patiently) for future negotiations to join or rejoin a conference. Use existing value/contracts to negotiate.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 4:29 p.m.

    @ Canuck fan

    Good post and totally agree; pick up BYU, SDSU, Boise State and Fresno St/Airforce and call it a day. I think we are heading to 4-5 super conferences anyway. Could you imagine the travel cost of heading back east twice a month? It makes no sense, but football drives the bus. Interesting stat: Kentucky Football makes twice the revenue as Kentucky basketball.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 4:34 p.m.

    I love how spokaneute actually believes that him, and otehr utah "fans", pointing out negatives or problems with BYU and their situation on BYU articles is justis just "discussing" the topic at hand whereas a BYU fan pointing out a negative about utah or its situation is "hate". LOL!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 29, 2012 5:00 p.m.

    Did somebody say something?

    LOL!

  • WACPaddingOurSchedule pocatello, ID
    Nov. 29, 2012 6:58 p.m.

    Snack PAC
    Olympus Cove, Utah
    Spokane Ute

    Your bcs "perk" is only a fantasy.

    Instead of thinking up fantasy scenarios about how the Utes could backdoor their way into the Rose Bowl, you should spend more time figuring out how Utah is going to beat their first PAC 12 team with a winning record.

    ____________________

    And you should spend more time figuring out how BYU is going to beat a ranked team at the time they play them.

    Zing!

    BYUs schedule next year is a fantasy. And it will become reality when as usual, BYU can't compete.

  • WACPaddingOurSchedule pocatello, ID
    Nov. 29, 2012 6:59 p.m.

    Duckhunter
    Highland, UT
    I love how spokaneute actually believes that him, and otehr utah "fans", pointing out negatives or problems with BYU and their situation on BYU articles is justis just "discussing" the topic at hand whereas a BYU fan pointing out a negative about utah or its situation is "hate". LOL!

    ________________________

    How many avatars do you have here again?

  • Jealous U Alpine, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 10:29 p.m.

    WACpaddled

    "And you should spend more time figuring out how BYU is going to beat a ranked team at the time they play them."

    LOL at your silly qualifier!

    Any fan who's not totally clueless knows that the ONLY ranking that counts is the final ranking, which means, unless currently ranked #20/#22 Utah State suffers a monumental meltdown in their bowl game, BYU beat a ranked team THIS SEASON, which is more than that bowl-less pretender on the hill can say.

  • MLH SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Nov. 30, 2012 12:05 a.m.

    sammy

    The commissioner answers to the Presidents of the schools. No-way BYU ever gets in, trust me it's not all football and athletics. And the orginal PAC10 is now the PAC12 Utah and Colorado are involved in all the conversations. You are excactlly right when you say it's time for this to all end, BYU is right where it should be right now. Hope the BIG12 calls that's where you belong not with the PAC12. If you get nto a conference though there will no longer be 6 gimme wins. As we have found out the hard way, it will be the same way for your cougs.

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    Nov. 30, 2012 8:37 a.m.

    MLH

    Serious question:

    IF the PAC 12 decides or is compelled to expand to 16 teams, who is the PAC 12 going to invite?

    NOBODY in the Big 12 is available because they signed away their television rights for the next TEN years, a poison pill that not even Larry Scott's magic could overcome. Even if they leave the Big 12, the Big 12 would still own their television rights. So you can forget listing Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas State, and TCU among your list of possible candidates.

    Just like the ACC finally accepted reality and caved on their once rigid "standards" by inviting Louisville, the PAC 12 could easily find itself in the position of being forced to lower its "standards" in order to expand to 16 teams.

    Without being able to poach the Big 12, the only realistic teams west of the Mississippi River would be BYU, Boise State, San Diego State, and/or teams from the MWC.

    So, which four teams would the PAC 12 choose?

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Nov. 30, 2012 8:48 a.m.

    MLH

    "If you get into a conference though there will no longer be 6 gimme wins."

    As far as the Utes are concerned, there's no such thing as a "gimme" win - see 10-loss Colorado and 10-loss UNLV.

  • CordonBleu Park City, UT
    Nov. 30, 2012 9:10 a.m.

    skywalker

    From a purely marketing perspective, which is what drives television contracts, and the reason the Big Ten invited Maryland and Rutgers:

    BYU would be a slam dunk
    Boise State, UNLV, and Air Force would all be strong contenders

    It's doubtful USC, UCLA, California and Stanford would want to dilute their brands by adding teams from California. The San Diego market is already controlled by USC and UCLA and the Bay Area is controlled by California and Stanford.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 30, 2012 10:11 a.m.

    CordonBleau

    I agree with your teams, but I think SDSU would have to be considered also. There's always Fresno State, and maybe Nevada too.