And Chris Buttars is a hot air and gaffe machine, is a hot air and gaffe
machine, is a hot air and gaffe machine.
Now we need to hunt them to extinction. That is one animal we'd be better off
without. They are dangerous, they do significant damage, and they are
incompatible with humans, wildlife, and domestic animals. It was a completely
stupid move to ever "reinstate" them in the first place.
This is all about hand holding with beef growers who know darned well that
wolves are not attacking their cattle. They just want free and total run of all
BLM land. Land that I pay taxes for and cannot use because I don't run
Funny how Wyoming excluded from the list once again. Is it because they have
the correct wolf management program?
There was a time when the government paid a bounty on wolves. Apparently we
didn't learn from our past experience with animals.Am I supposed to
believe they won't kill sheep and elk?
@attentiveYou can use BLM land for camping, hiking and stuff like that.
Didn't you know that? How do you know wolves are not attacking
their cattle? Wolves do kill calves and can make quite a dent in the calf crop.
Even coyotes kill calves on occasion. Why would ranchers just make up stories
about wolves if they didn't harm their livelihood?
@Silence Dogood:Please provide proof of your statements.The historical record will show that the Wolves lived just fine with native
americans and other indigineous peoples... so the human incompatibility
statement is false.The record will also show that there is no
documented human death from a wolf attack...so you're off base again.The wolves only hunt to eat and didn't move to where the beef is...the beef is
delivered to their doorstep...seems the humans are the problem.There
are more wild animals - deer, elk, etc. - killed annually in the Western US by
human hunters (who kill the biggest and strongest for a wall mount) than by
wolves (who kill the weak and diseased making the herd stronger).Even more killed by cars and trucks.More damage is done to the
environment by you and your buddy's ATVs, trucks, and be the cattle themselves
than the wolves could possibly manage in 100 lifetimes...so again reality is
conveniently distorted to fit your agenda.If the amount of damage
done and degree of ecological incompatability are the determining factors in the
decision about intentional extiction...open range cattlemen should have been
hunted out long ago.
I didn't know we even had any wolves in Utah. Where are they? I think they're
cool! I also want them controlled, but if we don't have any, why are we worried?
If they do come, unless they are here already, I think the Uinta Wilderness Area
would be the correct spot for them. Can anyone give me some information on Utah
I think you guys are all nuts, there was a reason the pioneers got rid of them,
they are "killing machines". In a perfect world, where humans could
manage the wolf population, wolves would only kill the sick and the old.
However, too many environmentalists that would end up being eaten if they
brought their logic up with a wolf, think that we should never kill wolves and
that they'll live in harmony with all the other animals in the forest.Wrong!The Yellowstone elk heard has dropped 70% in the last
fifteen years. There were 2000 fewer elk last year than the year before. Did you
guys know that hunting is not allowed in Yellowstone? so who could have done
this? partially grizzly bears, but the majority of it is being done by wolves
brought into the park in 1995.Wolves are a great predator and are
needed in the balance of nature, but what we need to remember is that we're part
of nature also and we need to manage the wolf populations.
I can't wait until I get the opportunity to kill a wolf.
By the same token, human beings are becoming endangered species. We are not
allowed to drill for oil, we have to hold our breaths to keep from polluting our
air with carbon dioxide, and so on.
Cross off one more stereo type about this administration that a certain crowd
has been propagating. For being branded Anti-Gun, Anti-Hunting, Anti-Defense,
the administration has not been keeping with many want to believe is their
agenda. Guns are allowed in more places now, they just added wolfs back to the
hunting list as prescribed by - gasp - the states, and we can clearly see this
administration is not anti national defense.So lets get back to
arguing about the issues where there is real differences - debt, healthcare and
the like, and stop the over generalizations that have been proven time and again
to be incorrect.
Re: runwasatch | 3:23 p.m. May 4, 2011 The historical records prove
that there was once a bounty placed on wolves by the government that regarded
them as pests. History seems to have a habit of repeating itself.
I was snowmobiling in the Uintas and thought I heard some wolves, almost
positive because coyotes have more of a winey wimpy howl, but this was a deep
In the history of the United States there have been 3 people killed by wolves. A
father and son were killed in N Dakota in 1888 and Candice Berner was killed
while jogging in Alaska in 2010.An animal that has killed only 3
people in 300 years is hardly a blood thirsty killer. In the last 20 years I
found 3 people who were attacked and killed during deer attacks in the US.
That's right folks more people are attacked and killed by cute little fuzzy deer
than those vicious killing machines the wolves. And for you hunters
out there, every single study ever done in the history of mankind has shown that
deer and elk herds are more healthy when wolves are in the area. Look it up.
People want wolves killed for one reason only: to protect livestock.
But I refuse to believe that the only solution to protecting the rancher's
bottom line from wolves is wolf extermination.
Re StrizzleUte:Here is a quote from the USA today about recent elk
population declines that proves your theory is bogus. "In an
analysis in the current edition of the ecology journal Oikos, for example,
Vucetich and park service colleagues examined weather, hunting and wolves as
factors in the elk decline. Yellowstone has had seven years of drought and a
severe winter in 1997 that killed many elk.They found that weather
and hunting are mostly to blame.Biologist Mark Boyce of Canada's
University of Alberta and colleagues reach similar conclusions in an upcoming
paper in the journal EcologicalModeling. Montana increased the "hunter
harvest" quota on elk that leave Yellowstone grounds, issuing a
higher-than-ever 2,882 hunting permits in 2000. A decline in the elk herd was
thus guaranteed, Boyce says, even if wolves were not present."You should read the whole article so you can have a clue as to the affects
that wolves have on Yellowstone's elk herds.
RE:ByronbcaI read your article, For starters, check the date of
things you read, alot can change in 6 years. I got my information from the
national park website dated Jan2011. Park service along with help from the USGS
USFS and the Montana F&G have determined that."Predation by
wolves and grizzly bears is cited as the major reason for the decline in elk
numbers. Wolves in northern Yellowstone prey primarily on elk. Also, predation
on newborn elk calves by grizzly bears may limit the elk populations ability to
recover from these losses."They do also cite the drought of the
early 2000's as being a factor, and being an elk hunter and seeing the effect of
that drought on elk in Southern Utah, I believe it. But with no drought in the
last 6 years, how do you explain a drop of 6000 elk?Estimating that
there were 13,000 elk in 2000, 3000 tags seems about right with proper bull cow
ratios. Also that doesn't take into count the number of elk in the Montana
Unit.Wolves have no predators except humans. If we want them, we
have to manage them.
I agree 100% that wolves should be managed, managed not exterminated. They have
a right to live just like any other of god's creatures. If we can't find a way
to live beside them then we have failed as stewards of the land.In
answer to your question here's another quote from your NPS story: "the wolf
population on the northern range inside Yellowstone National Park has dropped
from 94 wolves in 2007 to 37 wolves in 2010. Biologists suspect predator numbers
may be responding somewhat to the decline in the elk population."Mother Nature is inconsistent, large elk herds aren't necessarily healthy elk
herds. We should be more concerned with healthy ecosystems than more huntable
ecosystems, especially in national parks. As this study shows as elk populations
decrease in one area so will wolf populations. It should be noted
that both the articles we are quoting deal almost exclusively to the Upper Lamar
Valley of Yellowstone and do not reflect what's going on throughout the entire
An appropriate action for a change. Much of the original prey of the wolves has
gone extinct so management is the proper course of action just as they do with
the mustangs, buffalo, deer, and elk. Small prey has disappeared so now the
wolves are forced to hunt larger animals that don't replenish as quickly as
birds, pheasants, geese, rabbits or badgers, etc. that once roamed this valley.
It had to be done or face them on our streets and in our
All I can say is it's about time! whooo whooo!
Re:StrizzleUTEI am pretty sure I hunt elk in a lot of the same areas
you do. We both know the Elk population decline in those areas didnt have a lot
to do with the drought. It was the horrible utah Divison of Wildlife managment
stupid managment ideas, it still hasent recovered from that mass slaughter in I
believe it was 2001.
History proves wolves are overall safe to be around? I didnt know earth first
and the sierra club published history books....?
Rifleman, silence dogood - I am surprised how many people are against wolves.
You two are acting like these animals are out to get you or something. Yes they
kill deer and elk, but so do humans. Humans kill by far more prey animals than
wolves ever could. So it is their fault for being on our land before we got
here? I think that part of living in the mountains is having WILD areas and
wilderness that is untamed. I wish they would also bring back the grizzly bear,
but too many scared people won't let that happen. How many people have been
killed by wolves in the last 200 years?? I can take a wild guess that more
people have drowned in lakes and reserviors than have been killed by wolves. So
to say they are dangerous is kind of a strange comment. I think with the correct
management they can co-exist with humans. That is, if we aren't ignorant enough
***too ignorant to try
Duckhunter - yeah I bet that makes you feel like a tough guy to go out and kill
a wolf with a gun. Big bad hunters think that killing an animal just for the fun
of it is tough. It is quite the opposite. If you hunt for meat, great. If you
hunt just to kill, it makes you a coward. We have raised up quite a crop of
misguided individuals here in Utah who think killing is fun. Sad story that we
have people like duckhunter out killing things for fun.
Re:ByronbcaGood to see that we are on the same page as far as
management is concerned, and you are correct, the decline in wolf population is
because of the scarcity of elk. there was a study done by the USGS i think in 97
that determined that one wolf eats 17 elk per year in north Yellowstone. with 37
wolves that's 629 elk this year taken by wolves ( no exact, but probably close
with what information i have). that leaves around 4000 elk left in North
Yellowstone for 2012. They need to be managed so that wolves do no go hungry,
and the elk population can still grow. To solve both problems, 37 wolves in one
area needs to be cut in half at least or to a point where the elk herds numbers
level off or increase. The reason more elk are needed is more than just a
hunting reason. The tax dollars gathered from elk tags benefit wildlife in the
form of management. Because wolves need to be managed, the elk herd needs to
grow so that money is available to manage the wolf populations
Re:Dforth79Yes i do probably hunt the same areas that you hunt. And
yes i do agree with you, the DWR had a lot more to do with the elk numbers in
the early 2000's than the drought. They still don't know how to manage them
given how many cow tags they issue. Don't even let me get started on the deer...
Weather however has a strange effect on elk herds. From what I have seen, elk
actually seem to do better in drought years than wet years and I say this after
seeing the # of calves lost to deep snow last year, and probably this year.
Shoot or trap them all. I would love a chance to get some of them. One
drainage(area) Northwest of Dubois WY had a population of over 4500 elk in 2000
according to Wyoming Division of wildlife. The same area is now down to under
1500 elk because of Wolves and Grizzlies. They are killing off the elk calves
each spring at an alarming rate. The deer population is down in the same area.
Dumbest thing the wildlife division ever did was to bring wolves back.
Why stop here. Bring back dinosars. Then they can eat us humans. Come on, we
need all past animals back here living again.
Stewardship of the land means management. Everything is an eco-system.I hate to hunt, but I love our hunters. They are willing to keep our nature
management in check without receiving payment. They may even pay for the right
to do so, which helps fund the management.You can't just let Nature
run wild and expect everything to be OK. Over population of deer kill more elk
than wolves or hunters. Selective hunting (guns) of wolves under the
direction of state wildlife management is more humane than the pioneer way of
unselective hunting of traps and poison or worse just letting everything run
amuck with mismanaged wilderness areas.
Aggielove - Just what point was I wrong about? Look it up, wolves have killed
such a small number of people in the last 300 years it is not even worth
mentioning. More people die a year hiking than get killed by wolves. If you are
scared of the big bad wolf you have other issues that need to be addressed. Your
dinosaur comment proves that you are so far out of the conversation it may be
hard to bring you back. Tj mentions how the wolves decimate the elk
and deer populations... funny how the herds did just fine alongside wolves
before people came along. The wolves co-existed with the herds and helped thin
out the weak and old animals. But it is the wolves fault that humans come along
and kill tens of thousands of animals a year by hunting and on the roads? Oh
wait thats right we are humans we have the right to kill and decimate anything
we choose and it is fine right? Ignore the facts you two, and I guess everything
will be fine. Again, to go kill for the fun of it is cowardly.
Re: Brahmabull | 9:12 a.m. May 5, 2011 We weren't against the
re-introduction of wolves because we were afraid they'd kill humans. We just
don't like what they do to deer and elk herds.Bottom line is that
they been removed from the endangered list here in Utah, and that's just fine
Lets see, so NO wolves in Utah Officially and those huge amount need to be
hunted and controlled.By the way DNews I thought Name calling and
trolling was prohibited, but Aggielover can throw petty jabs.His jealousy
of the wolves competing to kill wildlife is childish at best.The
only wildlife you see in the mountains anymore are aggielovers sheep anyway.
A week or two ago, KPCW, our local radio station in Park City reported that a
local man had gone outside to get something from his car late one night. He saw
a large wolf with a black Scottie in his mouth. The Scottie was still alive.
He got in his car and started driving toward it in hopes that the wolf would
drop the Scottie. The wolf ran, disappearing into a wooded area north of town.
Wolves don't just hunt elk.
Terrra nova makes a good point. Wolves don't just hunt elk. In fact, big game
is the smallest portion of the Canadian wolf's diet in Canada. The wolves prey
on rodents and other small animals for most of their daily needs. They follow
the caribou herds only to get them through the winter. Spring calving season is
a buffet, of course. Then it's back to the den for and for 6-7 months out of the
year wolves mostly make a living by eating small animals.The whole
point of this is that wolves do need to be managed. The valley floor that was
once home to small animals of every sort is now home to little children, cats,
small dogs, etc. Remember that wolves hunt small animals for more than half of
the year and that the valley floor was their traditional home when they lived
here. Sound biology says that if predator populations get so large that wolves
can't find enough food in the mountains then wolves, like coyotes do, will hunt
the valley floor. I'd imagine they get scared of humans, but I don't think your
pet will be so lucky.