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Utah

Gov. Herbert says he signed HB477 to buy time to revise 'bad law'

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  • JP Chandler, AZ
    March 9, 2011 12:15 p.m.

    And I thought that we had the worst legislators in the country down here in Arizona. Thank you Utah, for making Arizona look good.

  • Miss Piggie Nuevo Leon, Mexico
    March 9, 2011 12:18 p.m.

    "But the governor says his action has created time for an open dialogue that he believes will produce a better bill."

    Baloney! His action is so that the issue will be dropped from the front page of the news paper and fade from public interest.

    Secrecy in government is the fist step toward a tyrannical autocratic government. It has been said that watching the legislative process is like watching sausage being made. I suppose if we knew what goes into sausage we wouldn't want it... Same with some laws. Someone needs to watch the entire process. The bill that Herbert signed will put a damper on that process. Not good.

  • Sank You, Doctor Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:19 p.m.

    Gov Herbert -

    Really? Couldn't you think of some other excuse for signing it or just say that you too do not want your texts and e-mails open for public view?

    Do you think we are dumb? Give us more time to talk about it...if you were serious about that, you would have vetoed it and told the legislature to start over with serious discussions - not just ram it through. We see through you, Gov Herbert. Time will tell if this is the straw that makes you an ex-gov.

    I am not voting for you.

  • Jared Gainesville, FL
    March 9, 2011 12:20 p.m.

    But a veto would have been even better for "allow[ing] more time to discuss further changes." You shouldn't pass laws first and then figure out what they'll actually do later. Figure it out first, then pass, then make changes if necessary. It's pretty simple.

  • JustinSLC Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:23 p.m.

    This bill was rammed through the Legislature without any real discussion or debate. Now, thanks to Governor Herbert's signature, it's the law of the state of Utah. The proper course of action for the governor was to veto the bill, then discuss the issue over the summer and fall, and reintroduce the legislation in the next session. Unfortunately, there are no brakes on the system in Utah anymore. There are no checks to the majority rule.

  • EJM Herriman, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:24 p.m.

    So why couldn't he have vetoed it and said "Let's do the special session anyway?" By signing off on it he can try to save face with the Republicans in the state legislature and somehow explain away why he didn't veto it. As a result, he made everyone made during this process. True leadership isn't afraid to say no. True leadership gets out in front on issues that no one else wants to deal with. Time for not only a new state legislature but a new governor. Sorry.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:28 p.m.

    Just keep explaining yourself Herbert.

    It dosen't change the fact that this bill never should have gone through...

    and only reinforces that this was the wrong choice that you made...

    and reinforces the question of why people voted for you.

  • cns St George, Utah
    March 9, 2011 12:35 p.m.

    Herbert's explanation makes no sense to me.
    If he disagreed with the bill he should have either vetoed it outright or pocket vetoed.
    It's good that there will be further consideration of the bill this spring but if the further consideration does not produce a "better" bill then the bill that was passed and signed will go into effect.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:44 p.m.

    *'E-mail raises new questions about influence of Herbert campaign contributions' - By John Daley and Lisa Riley Roche - DSNews - 09/28/10
    Line:
    'SALT LAKE CITY Gov. Gary Herbert "should remember" that the construction company boss on his meeting schedule is a $50,000 first-time donor who wants to talk "about transportation construction and issues within the state."

    So, Herbert has to also defend the campaign contributions he got BEFORE the same donors get awarded a $1.7 billion dollar I-15 project...

    and then, 6 MONTHS later HB477 would have factually prevented the release of his same emails.

    Shame on Herbert.

    And shame on those who vote for him.

  • CTRMAN Grantsville, Utah
    March 9, 2011 12:44 p.m.

    What about the freedom of information act? come on gov do your job and dont do your job based on winning more votes. serve the citizens of this state like you swore to do. My taxes along with others taxes pay your wages and keep this state running so we have a right to see what you guys are doing because we pay for the phones and the paper. Do your job and stop brown nosing for votes.

  • Furry1993 Somewhere in Utah, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:51 p.m.

    Don't blame me for this. I didn't vote for Herbert.

  • CHS 85 Sandy, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:54 p.m.

    I guess this bill couldn't wait until next year so that it could be thoroughly researched and all compromises met. What's the big rush??? Who is trying to hide the next scandal?

  • Lane Myer Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:57 p.m.

    Is there any Utahn who is not a legislator, who likes this bill and if so, why?

  • Capt. Smash Bountiful, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:58 p.m.

    Utah, Utah this makes this state look like some sort of hard nose 3rd world country. Come on people we can do better than these corrupt leaders. please.

  • Thucydides Herriman, UT
    March 9, 2011 12:59 p.m.

    passing a law so that it can be changed? what I am missing here? I must be as stupid as the governor thinks I am.

    Utah, why are we putting up with this?

  • Resolute Voice Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:07 p.m.

    No further inquiries will be required. The bill has been signed. There will be no changes, no debate, no disclosure. Mr. Herbert has assured us all of one thing, government is not ours to scrutinize or question. Not even the Democrats voiced concern over this bill. How does freedom die? With thunderous applause by our legislature as they congrtulate each other on a job well done.

  • majmajor Layton, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:10 p.m.

    Just like the Federal Healthcare legistation, bad laws are passed and extended into the future. This is one of the big issues with having a one-party system; there is no effective counter-balance to stupid laws.

    This law is also a sign of a "bunker mentality" and political cowardice. "Oh no, the scary media is going to tell on me!" What makes the legislature think that they are special and deserve some kind of protection from the voters?

    This is yet another example that both parties are crazy and need each other to keep from doing something stupid.

  • Darrel Eagle Mountain, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:11 p.m.

    It seems like this should be a ballot initiative. If the government is trying MY access to records, they shouldn't be the ones deciding that. That is similar to a child unilaterally deciding his parents aren't allowed in his room, and then enforcing that.

  • MenaceToSociety Draper, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:12 p.m.

    Sign the bill, then claim to work on fixing it? That is completely backwards. Veto it, then fix it.

    This sounds shady. Good way for legislators to use their offices to enrich themselves and their friends with tax payer money without tax payers being able to find out about it.

  • FreeThinker Magna, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:14 p.m.

    This explanation makes absolutely no sense to me. In order to take more time to hash things out, would not a veto have been more effective? Thank you for taking time to explain your reasoning, Governor Herbert, but I come away feeling like Oliver, and wanting to ask, "Please sir, I want some more." The more being a more substantial explanation.

  • Duke Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:45 p.m.

    Where's all the patriots now? eh?

  • RBN Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:48 p.m.

    Is anybody surprised about Herbert's logic? Can you say "puppet governor"?

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 9, 2011 1:51 p.m.

    majmajor | 1:10 p.m.

    Just like with the Federal Healthcare legislation... If you don't like it that much... Elect NEW legislators and change it!

    I agree this is not the RIGHT way to do things (rushing the vote, you gotta pass it to find out what's in it, etc)... but ELECTIONS are the mechanism designed into our Representative form of government to change things you don't like. It's the mechanism you use if you feel the people in office aren't listening to you.

  • dalefarr South Jordan, Utah
    March 9, 2011 1:54 p.m.

    There is no open dialogue or coming to the table unless it occurs before a bill is passed into law. What we have now are peasant citizens and media members pleading for mercy from the almighty legislature.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    March 9, 2011 2:03 p.m.

    Herbert signed it because no matter what he does - he has an "R" next to his name which means automatically means he will get elected.

    That's what happens in a state full of sheeple.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 2:07 p.m.

    'Where's all the patriots now? eh?' - Duke | 1:45 p.m. March 9, 2011

    I'm glad you brought that up.

    I give you, the Patriot Act. Signed into law, in 10/26/01 by George W. Bush (Another Republican) it allows search of private property WITHOUT warrent, or court approval.

    'The Patriot Act increases the government's surveillance powers in four areas:
    # 2 Secret searches. It expands the government's ability to search private property without notice to the owner. (Section 213)' - ACLU

    The claims that Republicans want to 'protect your freedoms'...

    rings false when they 1) Create laws to allow unlawful searches to your private property...

    and then 2) Create state laws to PREVENT email and text message transparency for themselves.

  • EgbertThrockmorton Layton, UT
    March 9, 2011 2:24 p.m.

    Explanation? No, Governor, you need to grovel and BEG our forgiveness for this foolish action. We know what this is really all about, we aren't that stupid.

  • FarnsworthPMacGillicuddy Layton, UT
    March 9, 2011 2:30 p.m.

    An explanation would be nice. All we got was another excuse for lack of transparency. We do know what this is really all about. It's about keeping the electorate from finding out how things are actually done here in Utah. No wonder we are the fraud capital of the United States. We need Huntsman back here, the inmates are running the asylum, and raping the treasury.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    March 9, 2011 2:42 p.m.

    Hey wait a seond - Pagan bring up a great point.

    The Republicans pass "The Patriot Act" allowing the Government to pry into citizens private conversations.

    And now Republicans pass HB477 barring the citizens access into Government private converstions.

    We can all see clearly now who's right and who's wrong.

  • majmajor Layton, UT
    March 9, 2011 3:02 p.m.

    2 bits | 1:51 p.m. March 9, 2011
    Cottonwood Heights, UT

    No. You are wrong. I was deployed during the last mass meetings and Utah didn't allow me to attend mine from outside the U.S. If we don't like the actions of the elected officials it is our right and duty to remind them that they are acting as stupid as the other party.

    The actions of the Dems to push the Federal Healthcare Law, was as stupid as the Reps actions for HB477. "Sign and fix." It hurts to think that our state elected officals are as stupid as the Federal Dems.

    The greatness of the Federal Constitution isn't about always being "right." It is to frame the debate and ensure that a debate occurs over competing interests.

    What are you really objecting to?

  • jp3 Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 3:18 p.m.

    New slogan for Utah license plate: "Utah: Getting Closer to North Korea Every Day!"

  • mkSdd3 Ogden, UT
    March 9, 2011 3:41 p.m.

    Everyone in Utah must look like a complete fool to the Governor because to stuff coming out of his mouth about this bill is just nonsense. If you want the bill to be reworked you would veto the bill, not sign it.

    Those who created this bill and those that forced it through as well as the Governor himself need to be taught that it is government for the people not in spite of the people. They all must be voted out now.

  • Milo P Otis West Jordan, UT
    March 9, 2011 3:52 p.m.

    I have always believed in the "Tooth Fairy." I'm the frog that eventually died as the heat was applied to the pot of water. Yes, the Governor should have veto'd it and washed his hands of it. Period. Don't want to use the Obama phrase of "Change" but unfortunately CHANGE is what we need. Vote 'em all out this next term. The topic of term limits is for another day, but I believe in having term limits.

  • Janell Ventura, Ca
    March 9, 2011 4:06 p.m.

    I can't believe the gov. came up with such backward logic (first pass the thing, then we'll work on it).

    It's completely ridiculous.

    Such arrogance, especially after he saw the people demonstrating against it. The legislature is also to blame, for hiding this bill from the people until it was time to vote on it. Can someone find out who sponsored and voted for this bill???

  • 2 bits Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 9, 2011 4:09 p.m.

    LDS Liberal 2:42 p.m.

    Partisan finger-pointing is fun... but I wouldn't be so quick to pretend that Patriot_Act is a one-sided Republican thing.

    ---

    #1-Remember... Barak Obama signed the act back into law in 2010... and the Democrat Super-Majority controlled Congress extended it and made it back into law when it expired.

    So it's not so much a ONE PARTY issue as you think.

    #2-Also realize that the majority of Democrats in Congress voted FOR it when it first came up back in 2001. Then when all they had to do was NOTHING... they voted it back into law again in 2010!

    ---

    You and Pagan like to play this "Blame it on the Repug" game... but it doesn't work when you use such lame examples (or examples you don't know the real history on).

    DEMOCRATS... are the reason the Patriot Act is LAW TODAY!

    ---

    I acknowledge Republicans also play a HUGE roll in the Patriot_Act being law today... But you gotta acknowledge the DEMOCRAT'S roll voting it into law... if you're going to be a blamer. Democrats don't have clean hands on the Patriot_Act.

  • Instereo Eureka, UT
    March 9, 2011 4:22 p.m.

    The governor didn't expect the public outcry against this bill. Whow, he didn't expect the public outcry against vouchers but the people's voice was heard during the referendum. So how is the people's voice going to be heard this time? The governor should have vetoed this bill and let the legislature overide his veto but now it's law and whatever changes are made still won't reflect what the people think. Why because there seems to be a disconnect between what the people want and what the legislature votes in.

    I wish there was some way to get the people to remember stuff like this during the election so their voice could be heard and they'd elect someone that truly represents them instead of someone that represents delegates and happens to have an R beside their name.

  • Peggy South Weber, UT
    March 9, 2011 4:33 p.m.

    @Furry1993: Nobody voted for Herbert. He snuck in the back door when President Obama stole our Governor to make him ambassador to China. He was a nobody before that and should become a nobody again with the next election.

  • Claudie4 Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 4:45 p.m.

    Welcome to Communist Utah!

  • Trueman Draper, Utah
    March 9, 2011 4:52 p.m.

    I sent my email to the Governors to complaint and for him to reconsider not signing HB477 and the automated response I recieved from the Govenors office was "Governor Huntsman appreciates your comments and wants to thank you for your email."

    Governor Huntsman? I suspect my email is still floating in hyperspace and good ole boy Governor Herbert never got my email, probably because he doesn't care. I will never vote for him again.

  • Lets think Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 9, 2011 6:16 p.m.

    If you are angry about Gov. Herbert's signature attend the
    "Shine the Light on Government" Rally
    Utah Capitol, March 10 - 6:00 PM
    Bring a flashlight & meet at the fountain.

  • Jimmer77 Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 6:29 p.m.

    The bigger the government, the more corrupt it is.

    REDUCE government - reduce the tax load.

  • JWB Kaysville, UT
    March 9, 2011 7:39 p.m.

    I was very concerned over the slam-dunk the House and Senate process of the GRAMA legislation. For a part of the open process of government, I was appalled at how quick the leadership and members of both the Senate and House kept their constituents in the dark and was the complete opposite of open and frank discussion with our elected officials and their supposedly review of their own process plus the extensive executive government. I just think of the whole process of the UDOT awarding the Utah county I-15 project and the potential for the GRAMA law to help defuse conflict that the state had been open with their bidding process. GRAMA is for our protection, for elected officials, to keep our government a viable body for the people. I have lived in many countries that dont have an open process and that is not for the good of the people nor the government. I was hoping the Governor would use his voice and not be persuaded to avert an open process such as this past slam-dunk activity.

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    March 9, 2011 7:45 p.m.

    Isn't this exactly what the Republicans have been squawking about with what the call "Obamacare?"

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    March 9, 2011 7:49 p.m.

    Resolute Voice | 1:07 p.m. March 9, 2011
    Salt Lake City, UT
    No further inquiries will be required. The bill has been signed. There will be no changes, no debate, no disclosure. Mr. Herbert has assured us all of one thing, government is not ours to scrutinize or question. Not even the Democrats voiced concern over this bill. How does freedom die? With thunderous applause by our legislature as they congrtulate each other on a job well done.
    =============================
    Oh yes, we did! But our voices are very small in Utah. I'm rejoicing right now in hopes that the blind may suddenly begin to see the light.

  • ms Draper, UT
    March 9, 2011 8:21 p.m.

    I appreciate the strategic position the Governor took on this bill by signing it after having it recalled and amended and now to be studied. But I would have preferred if the bill had never been dreamed up in the first place as I say that all of those that voted for it should be ousted just on the principle of transparency in government. Especially in a State whose residents because of their faith have a highly principled opinion of ethical behavior and the knowledge between right and wrong and this was wrong and the State representatives who voted for it should know that and I am sure they do know that and I hope that they will now do the proper and correct thing and withdraw the bill in its entirety and give the public the transparency that they deserve and are owed by their representatives and senators. This entire escapde has been atrocious and offensive to the citizens of Utah who depend upon our elected officials to protect, defend and serve us. Please make us proud to call you our elected officials once again by abolishing of this bill permanently and not just by revising it.

  • acetylsalicylicacid Somewhere, utah
    March 9, 2011 9:35 p.m.

    Gov. Herbert you just lost my vote at the next election. My representatives lost their votes from me too. That the Utah legislative branch wanted to limit access to records because some lawsuits put an undue burden on the staffs who provide GRAMA records, is about as dumb an excuse as anyone could come up with. I'll pay an extra .01% in tax to take care of those requests in order to keep government open and lawmakers honest. For the first time I am a little ashamed to be a Republican.

  • The Patriot Salt Lake City, UT
    March 9, 2011 10:17 p.m.

    Wow! This is very cool. I just read through all the comments (scanned some of them, but I think I got the gist), and every single one dislikes this bill.

    Amazing, posters that are left, right, and middle and every single one of them disagrees with this bill.

    This is sincerely a good thing.

    We, the extremely diverse, and opinionated, posters on the D-news comment board, have found common ground on an issue!

    Really, this is a very good thing. Maybe we can see we have more in common then we think. Maybe we can find common ground, the things that bind us together and work towards achieving those things, rather then always focusing on that which divides us. I bet if we actually looked at things we would discover we have far more in common then not. In fact I know we do.

    Remember: united we stand, divided we fall.

    I think there are forces out there that would like to see us divided.

    We do have more in common then otherwise. Lets remember that as we discuss the things we disagree on.

  • Richard Saunders Provo, UT
    March 9, 2011 10:55 p.m.

    @ The Patriot 10:17
    You took the words right out of my mouth! I consider myself 'conservative' but labels mean nothing when we can all unite and say that this bill stinks! "We have to pass it so we have time to fix it?" Man, there have been times when I thought the government was broken, but it sounds like it is worse than I thought. Shame on you Utah legislature! As a registered Republican, I might just actually go to my caucus meeting because I have some questions I want answers to!

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    March 10, 2011 6:31 a.m.

    Excuses. Take a strong stand and push back instead of roll over. Oh well, the consequences of one party rule. Utah is getting what they asked for.

  • CHS 85 Sandy, UT
    March 10, 2011 8:08 a.m.

    A true leader would have vetoed the bill, stared down the legislature, and dared them to override it.

  • mkSdd3 Ogden, UT
    March 10, 2011 9:21 a.m.

    This bill is not the result of one party rule. It is a result of a rouge government, and I think we are all resigned to do something about this.

    Our representatives just made a huge mistake. Mistakes do happen from time to time. Now we must make sure they fix the mistake and that they learned from it so they will not do it again. Speak up loud and clear people. Let your voices be heard. If we want transparent government, we must not let this bill stand.

    For those few Democrats in our legislature, here is your chance to lead out. You have the support of a vast majority of the citizens of Utah behind you. Start the push to have this bill rescinded.

    For those few Republicans that were against this bill, Stand up now and lead the charge to get this piece of legislation off the books.

  • Not So Fast Salt Lake City, UT
    March 10, 2011 9:21 a.m.

    I had to dig to find this story Deseret News! How is this not front page material?

  • Not So Fast Salt Lake City, UT
    March 10, 2011 9:23 a.m.

    Will all you angry comment makers be at Thursday's 6 pm protest?

  • slcgal Salt Lake City, UT
    March 10, 2011 9:48 a.m.

    Will the Deseret News ask for all the documents and information relating to the conception,progress through committee(s), sponsors,legislators, Governor, constituent, public comments re: HB477. Can we see? Can we learn? Last chance...

  • slcgal Salt Lake City, UT
    March 10, 2011 10:00 a.m.

    Reply to EgbertThrockmorton: People were angry at Corroon during the governor's campaign when they thought he was using dirty tactics when exposing irregularities of the Herbert administration. Thanks to Peggy for your comment reminding us how we're going to have to withstand Herbert-logic...

  • DDurrant provo, ut
    March 10, 2011 12:03 p.m.

    Citizen taxes pay for all the activities and salaries of gov't officials, but we are not allowed to know what you do?!! Only in Utah have the people given up their right to be americans. This BULL would not fly anywhere else!

    We live in a hole literally! Lake Bonneville dried up and Salt Lake remains. Noting that our families live in this hole: Who brings or allows nuclear waste into a hole where their family lives? Who allows the development of chemical and biological weapons in a hole where their family lives? (Dugway, Spanish Fork, etc !!).

    With increased nuclear dumping so close to Salt Lake and Europe waiting to dump here too. I see the need to hide things. Everything I hear these days seems to make us, THE PEOPLE WHO PAY YOUR BILLS, less significant!

    Doesn't my 100K+ in tithing donations over the years get me some protection? How about my taxes? My good deeds? No? Not even in Utah?! Honestly?!! Can it be true? 90% of our politicians are LDS? Then who is selling us out?!!!

    Where will the toxins go if we have a big earthquake?

    THE PEOPLE !!! not the money!!!!

  • JDMAC Salt Lake City, UT
    March 12, 2011 8:47 p.m.

    Hope Govenor Herbert can get this BAD idea stopped or at leat significantly changed.

    Who cam came up with the idea? Was it Qaddafi?