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Pollster: Utahns want immigration solution, just not sure what it is

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  • jim l West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 7:00 p.m.

    Its an easy solution. Throw those that hire them (illegals) into jail and the illegals will move onto greener pastures. They might even go home.

  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 7:24 p.m.

    This poll proves one thing:

    That Dan Jones asks confusing questions......how else can you explain the swing in polls?

    Dan asks: Do you support or oppose an immigration bill requiring enforcement by local police?

    Well of course your going to get a controversial outcome?

    Why not ask : do you support Illegal Immigration?

    and then lets see where the concensus lies....How about it Dan Jones...the democrat who never saw a liberal agenda he didn't like....

  • Mary E Petty Sandy, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 7:52 p.m.

    Laws change.(Child Labor Laws) They come and go. (Native American Treaties) What is good and right in one generation, turns out to be bad in another. (Slavery) And then there are those unintended bad consequences when we have tried so hard to do the right thing. (Welfare Entitlements)

    Such is the case with current Federal Immigration law. It is broken, busted, and full of unintended bad consequences.

    Utah has the right and obligation to take the bull by the horns and rein in this bad law by implementing good State law that is reasonable, practical and humane; one that will document workers, even those who are currently working and subsisting in the dark underbelly side of society.

    We have a tradition in Utah for innovation, creativity, wisdom, humanity,and being our brother's keeper through replacing the bad with good. I know we can do this in 2011 and come up with a good immigration solution.

    I personally favor the principles in the Utah Compact and am encouraging my Senator and Legislator to implement good worker law that promotes economic prosperity, freedom and public safety for all who work and live in Utah, citizen or not.

  • John C. C. Payson, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 8:03 p.m.

    Who was short-sighted enough to make guest workers illegal in the first place?

  • JDL Magna, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 8:39 p.m.

    The Compact is flawed, It suggests that immigration is a solely a Federal Matter but if you study the 1836 US Supreme Court case NY vs Miln and read the opinions of Justice Henry Baldwin, and others you will see that immigration is a State Issue and not a Federal issue.

  • durwood kirby South Jordan, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 9:21 p.m.

    Perhaps a new state gun would solve the problem. Or a day to honor Ronald Reagan. Or, a pronouncement that our government is a republic.

  • CWEB Orem, UT
    Feb. 21, 2011 10:58 p.m.

    Reasons it is so tough:

    1. Federal Gov has created the issue.
    A. Won't take action on border (easy to fix)
    B. Won't develop a simple immigration program to meet our nation's needs.
    c. Handed out ITIN tax numbers for years-- thus,encouraging many illegals to come and work.
    D. Won't simplify a solution for illegals to fix their illegal status.

    2. States/citizens have benefitted from the presense of illegal immigrants.

    3. Most Americans are sympathetic to the needs of the poor and those actually willing to work.

    4. Outdated use of Social Security numbers for Identification--this should be stopped immediately.

    5. Our nation NEEDS migrant workers to fill many jobs/positions that Americans WILL not do. When was the last time you saw a white kid who would pick strawberries or landscape a yard? Most white kids now think they should make $25/hr out of high school. (Parents fault) What white person, normally, wants to change sheets in a hotel? Not many. If YOU are honest, you'll admit there is a need, and the Federal Government won't change fast enough to meet those needs.

  • SLars Provo, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 12:32 a.m.

    Sandstrom's bill, revoking the drivers privilege cards, revoking in state tuition, and pass Herrods E-verify bill. Along with the rest of Utah signing up to secure communities, and we start enforcing laws, without undo harm.

    No one has a right to give away American jobs in this country. Their coming for our jobs (Robles) show they have no intention of assimilating and becoming citizens. The jobs are gone, it's time for the guest workers to go home.

  • attentive Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 1:32 a.m.

    What is the point of making and having laws in any country if they aren't going to be enforced? Law makers (politicians) aren't going to bat for us; they're trying to stay in office and collect the big paychecks so they can live above what the rest of us know as reality. Elected officials are elected on their promises and they are not keeping them nor making good on the promises and laws that are already supposed to be in place. Whether state of federal, the laws are all being ignored or changed to fit whatever the politicians believe will get them re-elected.

  • anti-liar Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 2:12 a.m.

    The state has no right to legislate, we're told -- unless it's the Mero-Robles bill. Then it's okay.

    Sure.

  • anti-liar Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 2:16 a.m.

    The polls mean nothing to me -- the questions are couched with the intent to confuse and to improve the likelihood of certain outcome.

    But doubtless the astonishing level of corruption in this state, and the thick, relentless fog of propaganda lies that are spread by people who know they are on the opposite side of the law and Constitution, is causing considerable confusion.

  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 2:18 a.m.

    @Mary E Petty

    I know you've been asked this before but I have yet to see a direct response to this question.

    Other than the lack of enforcement of current immigration laws, what part of those laws, in your view, are broken?

    I tire of hearing this vague "broken" claim with no substance to back it up.

  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 2:37 a.m.

    @CWEB

    Wow, a bit racist towards whites are we?

    I know plenty of "white kids" who do landscaping, even some who have started there own landscaping businesses. You may have seen them. Their the ones pushing the lawn mower at their neighbors house. Your arguments are ridiculous, white people won't change sheets? Are you kidding me? Maybe in bizzaro world. Your argument about illegals doing jobs that Americans won't do is tired and has been proven wrong again and again. Check the construction industry where Americans are unemployed at a level much higher than the national average while employers hire and pay illegals under the table wages that equate to what a normal worker would make minus income tax, social security, unemployment insurance, benefits, etc, etc.

    Pray tell where exactly U.S. Citizens have benefited from illegal immigration? I would love to see the study. That must be why Arizona is so up in arms about the subject. Not because it has been a drag on their state in about every way possible. No, because in bizzaro world states try to remove anything that might benefit them.

  • Ironweed Chattanooga, TN
    Feb. 22, 2011 5:55 a.m.

    Enforcement is the solution.

  • RRB SLC, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 5:58 a.m.

    We want an enforcement solution, amnesty is not a solution, it just keeps putting a real solution off to the future. We tried it once and it did not stop the problem, it just made it worse.

    It's finally coming out that most people here illegally don't want citizenship. Most in the legal Hispanic community have known that for years, but no one dared speak out, because those favoring illegal immigration used citizenship as a discussion point. It is about taking jobs. Undercutting America's entry level workers and building up a big fat nest egg at home.

    CWEB, our country has a solution for those here illegally, it's called legal immigration. There is no reason our country should change our laws to accommodate those who break them. If a person wants to be a citizen, they will wait. If they want a job, go home and apply for a work visa when they become available.

  • mohokat Ogden, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 6:52 a.m.

    Enforce exiting law. It is not broken it is unenforced.

  • curious george Orem, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 7:30 a.m.

    This issue is not that difficult. "Enforce existing laws"! If the laws are unjust in the eyes of the people of this country then we change them. That's why we have elected officials. The only percieved injustice in the laws for illegal immigration as they stand are by those who are here illegally and by those that benifit from them being here. If we the people removed corrupt politicians, stop spending money at buisnesses that have illegals on the work force and spend no more money on media that support illegal immigration the desire for illegal immigrants to come here would be greatly reduced.

  • Emophiliac Vernal, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 7:46 a.m.

    Certainly Utah has no right to make immigration law. It does, however, have the right to control employment within its borders. Get Herrod's eVerify law passed. Make it stick and make it apply to all businesses. Hire an illegal and either pay a big fine or lose your business license. It may be that simple - if an illegal can't get a job, then maybe they'll go home on their own. If they won't leave and break the law, put them in jail and then deport them. If businesses want foreign workers, make them use existing Federal programs. Duh.

  • tenx Santa Clara, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 7:56 a.m.

    The solution is......."Enforcement"!

  • Dan Walters La Quinta, CA
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:01 a.m.

    I live in Southern California and would like to share with the people in Utah what Illegal immigration has done to this state. We are overwhelmed with Illegal Immigrants. Our schools are severely overcrowded and the quality of education has dropped dramatically. Crime committed by Illegals including carjackings,identity theft, hit and run, drug trafficking, murder and assault has increased tremendously. People who are working in the construction trades,the service sector,manufacturing and transportation and others have seen their wages plummet and businesses who employ U.S. citizens suffer while those who employ Illegals prosper. Illegal Immigration is eroding the tax base here in California. Illegal Immigrants pay little or no taxes and create enormous social financial liabilities for our state. Illegal Immigrants drive down wages and therefor lower tax remittances overall. Illegal Immigration is costing the California taxpayer BILLIONS every year in lost revenue! I hope and pray that Utah doesn't become like California because we are in hopeless economic and rapid social decline. Be careful.

  • Madden Herriman, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:10 a.m.

    I'm surprised at this one:
    "Seventy-one percent support creating a state-issued work permit for undocumented immigrants to allow them to stay here if they have a job and agree to a criminal background check."

    How was this actually phrased in the survey?

    If an illegal immigrant has a job, isn't s/he taking money under the table (tax fraud) or committing identity theft already?

  • Brother Chuck Schroeder A Tropical Paradise USA, FL
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:20 a.m.

    Utahns want immigration solution, just not sure what it is, yet these constitutionalist Rush Limbaugh wannabee's rednecks can't figure out that they still say President Lincoln once walked three miles to pay back a penny. That makes him the last president to do anything about the debt. The debt that illegal immigration puts us all in. HEY Utah, unless and until we face up to the severe violations of our laws and do everything possible to put a stop to them, we will never solve this problem or the cost problem. According to an estimate of the Pew Hispanic Center, in 2005 there were an estimated 75,000 to 100,000 illegal aliens living in Utah. In 2004 alone the taxpayers of Utah spent $184.4 million per year on illegal aliens and their children in public schools. The projected annual fiscal costs to Utah taxpayers for emergency medical care, education and incarceration resulting if an amnesty is adopted for illegal residents in 2010 was $417,000,000. Water is already a scarce resource in this desert state, and the increased demand generated by population growth is exacerbating the problem. REPORT, then let ICE deport. Hows that?.

  • jmfay denver, co
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:27 a.m.

    E verify doesnt work for independent contract work which is exempt under the I 9 presently so please get your lawmaker to amend his bill to include all work. This is your construction, landscaping, etc work and if you dont have illegals doing any of this work; CO will be happy to send you ours.

    Real ID comes in May and when you need a passport to get on a plane, a federal building etc like NM and WA; well you can deal with that pain of a neck since the feds like to know who is who.

  • danaslc Kearns, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:28 a.m.

    If Utah panders to illegals one more year and that's all it will take, we will have Chaos on our hands. California is broke, Las Vegas is broke, Arizona is tightening their belts on illegal immigration. Illegals love sanctuary cities. The illegals are already moving her and expecting welfare and jobs. How are we as a state going to be able to adjust to a bigger population of them. Fix it now or it will just get uglier next year. Politicians of Utah needs to be realistic. They don't live among us do they?

  • jmfay denver, co
    Feb. 22, 2011 8:51 a.m.

    Danasic:

    We are all going broke due to illegals but UT, NM and WA are worse off due to their own faults of encouraging illegals to come.

    Time you got rid of some of your lawmakers like CO will do in 2012 as we have lawmakers here the same ones by the way, who want in state tuition but wont pass e verify.

  • Proud to be American West Jordan, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 9:02 a.m.

    I cannot honestly believe there is another pro-illegal immigrant article in the paper today. Unbelievable!

    The Utah Compact is a good document that talks to the legal immigrants in Utah. I agree with the basic concepts of the document, but am 100% against illegal immigration.

    Why are lawmakers trying to skirt around existing laws? I continue to read about how passing a work permit for illegals will help our economy. So are you telling me that we should ignore current law and allow illegals a free pass because somehow you believe it will benefit us economically? No way.

    Enforce the laws that are in place, get illegals out of our state!

  • legalimmigrant Springville, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 9:10 a.m.

    To Mary Pity: we are still waiting to hear from you, what in our immigration law is "broken" or is a "bad law"? You are probably like many other people who just repeat what the pro-illegal propaganda says: that the law is broken, that we are racists, bigots, intolerants, etc, etc. Please get your facts straight. I am a proud legal immigrant, and I have always felt welcomed in Utah. We do not welcome ILLEGAL immigrants. Do you understand the difference?

  • Littlebit Salt Lake City, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 9:12 a.m.

    "Utahs want immigration solution, just not sure what it is" ---- are you kidding me??? Try looking at the above posts. We want the law enforced!!!! Deseret News, you are losing all credibility on this issue. Your lopsided pro-illegal reporting is obvious!

  • Razzle2 Bluffdale, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 9:36 a.m.

    The poll questions are confusing because the word "immigrants" did not always clarify between "legal" and "illegal".
    I support the Utah Compact because it has compassion for LEGAL immigrants and our own citizens. Racial profiling is not a solution if our own citizens are to be free. Black and white, all or nothing laws tie the hands of law enforecement.

    Plus, the reciprocity laws of other countries are stiffling International business for the US and charities and missions. The US needs to be more open to legal immigration so we can get back to business.

  • JBrady Murray, Ut
    Feb. 22, 2011 10:00 a.m.

    Razzle2, with over 1 million people each year admitted legally (not including work and school visas), how much more open can we be?

  • Hugo Stiglitz Ogden, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 10:58 a.m.

    So much talk about enforcing the law, I had no idea how many law abiding citizens we had here in the US of A, yet the crime rate in this country dictates a huge amount of hypocrisy. In other words if its a law that will rid the country of someone that is diffrent with a diffrent language and skin color we are all for it 100%. If its drug use, drunk driving, fraud, traffic violations, cheating on your taxes, not paying child support etc etc.... well those are bad but we dont judge.

  • tenx Santa Clara, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 10:58 a.m.

    @Dan Walters 8:01. Good comment. Everyone I talk to from California says the same thing. Due to the politicians there allowing the whole state to be a sanctuary state they have only one solution and that is bankruptcy. Even now the state is giving IOU's for refunds. What's next, a California currency? The big question now is whether BO will attempt to bail them out which means our tax money going there to do it. Their politicians are to blame. Let's support our Reps who are trying to avoid the same thing happening here.

  • legalimmigrant Springville, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 11:31 a.m.

    Hugo, this is not about racism. This is about treating people the same. Why on earth should illegals be treated differently from legal immigrants? We paid our dues, waited in line, and followed the rules to get our green cards. Why should we reward people who try to cheat the system? They willingly break our laws - they cross the border or overstay their visas, commit identity theft, take jobs without DHS authorization, and the list goes on and on. They should face the consequences of their actions, not get a reward.

  • OneMadGuy Salt Lake, UT
    Feb. 22, 2011 12:10 p.m.

    Pretty simple (and said before). If there aren't jobs the illegals will go home / not come.

    We need laws that force employers to verify the citizenship of their workers and strong penalties for the ones caught breaking the law.

    Then the illegals will self deport.

  • dueling banjos salt lake city, ut
    Feb. 22, 2011 1:59 p.m.

    the big problem is the rich get richer and this was a grand plan for that ...chicken meat factories ..when it was the boom even here in utah...nobody complained only the citizens who couldnt compete on the bids. Then we blame these people to dare to dream...don't believe me on was the only english speaker other than the boss as we built house after house...didnt the creator mention charity but this state is racist anyways...always has always will...i say think Missouri as thats gonna be a tuff state and i look forward to a new house then cuz i take good care of as you all migrate

  • Neanderthal SLC, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 3:38 p.m.

    The poll must have been conducted in an Hispanic communities.

    The simple point of fact is that all illegals want is to be here and have a job. That's a worthy goal except...

    1. We have no jobs at this time for them. We have 15 million unemployed Americans who are sucking up billions in unemployment just sitting around the house in their easy chairs watching Bay Watch, Jersey Shores, or reading the online DNews. These people need to get to work. And they can't if we have illegals grabbing up their jobs. Not only that but illegals drive wages down to what one might expect of a job in Mexico... pennies an hour.

    2. If illegals are allowed to stay here either with some kind of work permit or for other reasons, it will only invite others of their brothers and sisters to sneak across the borders to enjoy the same treatment. Illegals must be deported to stop this merry-go-round. America is for Americans, not for the rest of the world no matter how needy they may appear.

  • Miss Piggie SLC, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 4:15 p.m.

    @John C. C.: "Who was short-sighted enough to make guest workers illegal in the first place?"

    Guest workers make themselves illegal... by overstaying their work visas. They forget to go home when their visas expire. Making them illegal.

    -------------

    @VST: "Additionally, even the absence of a direct conflict between state and Federal law, a conflict exists if the state law is an obstacle to the accomplishment and execution of the full purposes and objectives of Congress."

    That's nice... But there's no conflict between federal law and the recent Arizona law or Utah's Sanstrom bill because this law/bill merely aims to enforce federal law, not challenge it. And, the will of the President on immigration (i.e., curry immigrant votes) is not the will of the Congress... which is set forth in law.

    --------------

    @CWEB "5. Our nation NEEDS migrant workers to fill many jobs/positions that Americans WILL not do."

    There's no job on the face of this earth that Americans won't do... if the wage is high enough. And why are Americans not willing to take some jobs? Because wages are too low... Because immigrants come in and drive wages down.

  • Mr. Bean SLC, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 4:57 p.m.

    Thanks Dan Walters @ 8:01 a.m., for laying out what immigration can do to a state. It makes sense looking at what is currently happening in Mexico, from whence most immigrant come. It appears that California's huge debt problem is substantially exacerbated by the influx of immigrants from south of the border.

    ---------------

    @Madden: "How was this actually phrased in the survey?"

    Doesn't matter so much how it was phrased in the survey. It merely matters to whom the survey questions were posed. I suspect that the survey questions were asked mostly to Hispanics.

    ---------------

    @Proud to be American: "Why are lawmakers trying to skirt around existing laws?"

    Why? Because they are trying to curry the vote of the immigrant.

    --------------

    @JBrady: "...with over 1 million people each year admitted legally (not including work and school visas), how much more open can we be?"

    Go to YouTube and view 'Immigration Gumballs' to see what uncontrolled immigration will do to this country.

  • Miss Piggie SLC, Utah
    Feb. 22, 2011 9:10 p.m.

    @VST | 6:50 p.m.:

    "But the Court has ruled to have ALL immigration law be directly controlled by the Congress and enforced by the Federal officers (not the states) for execution of the "...full purposes and objectives of Congress..."

    All immigration law IS controlled by Congress.

    Illegals are not 'immigrants." They are, for want of a better word, interlopers... law breakers from another country. Are interlopers covered by Federal law? I don't think so. I could easily imagine that illegal immigrants covered under federal law would be limited to those who entered legally but overstayed their authorizing visas. Just sayin'.

    Further, the Arizona law and Utah bill merely address the conduct of illegals in their respective states. Things such as driver licensing and instate tuition. Which, let's hope, they have a right to do.

    And still further, Section 287(g) of the Immigration and Nationality Act law authorizes the Fed to enter into agreements with state and local law enforcement, permitting officers to perform immigration law enforcement functions. Under the law ICE provides training and authorization to identify, process, and when appropriate, detain immigration offenders they encounter during their regular, daily law-enforcement activity.

  • JBrady Murray, Ut
    Feb. 23, 2011 3:51 a.m.

    287(g)was passed two years ago. Our attorney general wrote a letter telling the Federal government under what circumstances Utah would work with them.

    The letter killed 287(g) in this state, except for Washington and Weber counties.

    287(g) has been greatly scaled back by Obama, allowing many people discovered by local enforcement to stay.

    We have a Federal government that is not protecting it's citizens jobs. That's why states are forced to deal with the problem. By a large majority, Utahns want enforcement.

  • RRB SLC, UT
    Feb. 23, 2011 8:17 a.m.

    VST, robbing a bank is a violation of Federal banking laws, what is your point?

    Worker programs are called visas, we have had them for decades. They are based on need, not demand. These guest worker bills will only give amnesty to lawbreakers who came here for our higher paying jobs. If they want to work in this country, they need to go home and come back on a worker visa when they are available.

  • Bowman Lompoc, CA
    Feb. 23, 2011 12:51 p.m.

    John,
    Don't know why this is so hard for you to understand:

    Legal immigrant = good, makes positive contribution
    Illegal alien = bad, foreign thief/criminal

    That's what the people of Utah, and in fact most Americans are saying. Why cannot you acknowledge it?

  • jimhale Eugene, OR
    Feb. 28, 2011 1:59 p.m.

    The reason the immigration laws are broken is that they only allow a trickle of legal immigration from our southern neighbor, Mexico, when we need - not a flood - but a good solid stream.

    People come here - at the risk of life and limb and/or after making outrageous payments to coyotes - simply because of the disparity between our two economies is so extreme.

    The difference in per capita income (Gross Domestic Product) between the US and Mexico is greater than that between any two nations sharing a land border in the entire world - with only two exceptions: North vrs South Korea and Isreal vrs the Palestinians.

    People in Mexico want to come here for the same reasons our forefathers chose to do so. They would get in line to come....if the line were big enough to present a decent chance of success.

    They come here illegally and live like fugitives instead.

    They are our neighbors....from just down the Continent ...of this single promised land.

    Take a few minutes and read what Jesus said about neighbors.

    (e.g. The Good Samaritan.)

    Jesus was hated for what he said about neighbors...and enemies.

    Are you a good neighbor?