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Amy Donaldson: Hall's pain a reflection of self-betrayal

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  • Amy? Come on!!
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:32 p.m.

    Give it a rest Amy, how serious are you taking these comments? In the heat of emotion and anger anything can happen. Max Hall is not every BYU fan, it's Max Hall. Did you listen to the entire rant? I thought not. He explained that unless you have been in his shoes, you wouldn't understand his view, so clearly, you don't understand.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:33 p.m.

    good article

  • SpectatorJoe
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:33 p.m.

    Well spoken madam

  • Thanks Amy
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:34 p.m.

    By the way, where did you get your Psychology degree?

  • Wow...
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:36 p.m.

    This article is awesome and truly reflects what was going through Max Hall's mind in those heated moments after the game. In a few years, very few people will remember what kind of QB this kid was but no one will forget his harsh words in a moment of anger. So sad.

  • Journalism?
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:36 p.m.

    Is this journalism? or simply a rant by a secret Ute fan? To be honest this "article" sounds like much of the on-line ranting and not something from a so-called professional journalist.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:37 p.m.

    Well said.

  • Right on ...
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:37 p.m.

    Very well written and to the point. Now if only Max reads it AND comprehends. Unfortunately, I doubt either will happen.

  • Black Mark
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:38 p.m.

    This is a major black mark on Max Hall. He should have given Utah respect and praised their coaches. Instead he talked of his hate for anything that wears red. Not very classy for the winningnest QB in BYU history.

  • Oh please!
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:40 p.m.

    wow! you guys are really over thinking what he had to say. get over it and move on.

  • gbcott
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:41 p.m.

    fair, accurate and appropriate. I sincerely hope Max is being counseled along these lines by those close to him. He's made a terrible error so far.

  • some thoughts
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:42 p.m.

    I think it is time both coaches talk to their teams and universities about sportsmanship on and off the field. The unsportmanslike conduct penalties are just as disappointing and more dangerous than words spoken. If it is true that only a small percentage of fans misbehave, the large percentage of good fans should not stand for crude behavior and police themselves and the stands. This rivalry has descended to all that is amiss in sports and our culture. We all should be a bit ashamed.

  • True Fan
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:43 p.m.

    Behind you all the way Max. I agree with everything you said. I hate Utah. I graduated from The U in 1980. I hated the anti BYU fans then and I still hate them today. I will enjoy this win for a year and hope BYU wins again next year

  • BYU Fan
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:43 p.m.

    Kudos, Amy - you've done a masterful job expressing the feeling of many of us. I've loved watching Max Hall the last three years, but I was disappointed in his comments. Football is just a game - its not a Civil War.

  • Psychological Analysis
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:46 p.m.

    Has anyone ever heard of the term in professional psychology "projection"? You article would make a very interesting example of this phenomenon. Think about it.

  • Digbads
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:47 p.m.

    I really can feel Hall's pain. I've seen so much hate and vitriol spewed out towards him on message boards and on sports talk shows.

    I am very glad that he won the game. He is a great quarterback and I really wish him all the best.

    I'm glad the Ute fans have something more to cry about, and I really truly wish that they would never ever ever attend a game at LES. Stay away. Any BYU fan or student that gives or sells their tickets to a Ute fan, is a knucklehead.

  • As a fan of Max
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:51 p.m.

    I am starting to hate this column you wrote.

  • GentleBen
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:52 p.m.

    Great article. It's unfortunate what happened to Hall's family last year. Does that justify whatever Max wants to do? Can he forget who he represents and what his family now must bear as a result of his actions? At least beer washes off with a little water. Now Hall and his family have to figure a way to "wash" this off all of them. I'm sure there will be the obligatory apology, but will that really help?

  • Problem
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:53 p.m.

    You represent who you really are in the heat of the moment. I love how people always say "I got caught up in the moment and that's not really me". Ummm...unfortunately it usually is exactly who you are!

  • Beer Incident
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:55 p.m.

    It seems like the media is taking Max's word for it that The Great Beer Incident actually occurred. Anyone can say anything, but it does not mean it is actually true.

    From a logistics standpoint, it is highly unlikely The Great Beer Incident actually occurred. Beer is not sold in Rice-Eccles Stadium. Beer is smuggled in. However, bags have been checked since the terrorist attacks of 2001. Security routinely confiscates everything from Red Vines to M&M's. Therefore, any beer smuggled in has to be smuggled in inconpicuously in pockets of clothing. That severely limits the amount of beer smuggled in. Now, if someone were to smuggle in a couple beers, and not get thrown out when they break one out (which happens regularly around my section), what are the chances a beer will actually make it through a game, unconsumed, and poured on a BYU fan's head? Highly unlikely. If I smuggle in a couple beers, those beers become a very valuable commodity, and they're getting consumed, not wasted on a Cougar.

    Please, media, push him on this. Let's hear names of the victims. Did they file a complaint with police?

  • DeadcatfromTexas
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:57 p.m.

    Too many quotes. Can't your own original thoughts convey your message Amy? How's about a quote from the BYU coach about Hall's comments?

  • Thanks, Amy
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:58 p.m.

    As a mom, teacher, and a big football fan, I appreciate this article. It is a keeper for me to use with my children and students. Thanks for the great quotes, too.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 8:59 p.m.

    This is the most ridiculous article I think I've ever read. Max Hall got caught up in the moment and said things he shouldn't have said, but needed to be said. If you check out a real article on this web site you will see what set him off. Go check out some real journalism!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:00 p.m.

    Completely agree. Max Hall showed how immature he really is and how classless he is by not having good sportsmanship. I'm fine with saying the things he did amongst his team, but to come out and say those things to the media was brainless on his part. He should be embarassed for how poorly he represented himself, his team, and his religion. One can only conclude that if he hates anything and everything "UTE" related, he must hate those LDS church leaders his school also represents that also graduated from the University of Utah.

  • Less than an hour after release
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:00 p.m.

    Max Hall has issued his apology and explained that his comments were really directed to the fans that treated his family poorly last year.

    So... Ute fans you can either accept his apology, or be in the group of fans to whom Max meant to direct his comments.

    Just let it go... the game is over. Max has played his last game against the Utes. The rivalry will go on... Hopefully in a more respectable fashion.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:01 p.m.

    After all that's been written about Hall's comments and the ensuing debacle that has resulted as others have insisted on responding, this is one of the few sensible, grounded sentiments I've come across. Thank you. Now let's let it go and move on from our need to out-insult each other and "prove" who is on the better side.

  • Jen
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:01 p.m.

    Excellent article!!!!

  • Give me a break...
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:01 p.m.

    Lighten up Amy. I, for one, will always remember Max Hall as a BYU Great that lead his team to three 10-win seasons and not what he said at the end of a heated rivalry game.

  • EdM
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:03 p.m.

    One of the best things she has ever written and it said all the things that SOMEONE should have said. Thanks. As for the people posting who are knocking her comments....you guys miss the whole point of her words and of the quotes she uses.

  • J Jensen
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:05 p.m.

    Max should have used the chance to recognize his players and got caught up in the moment. But the biggest issue here is what happens regularly in RES. Utah fans are an embarrassment to both the University and the State of UTAH. I am from California and watched the 2006 BYU / UTAH gain in RES. We intentionally wore neutral colors and didn't cheer. After the second quarter Utah fans figured out we weren't cheering for Utah and started to verbally attack us, by the fourth quarter my wife was verbally attacked and we considered leaving. My experience mirrors Hall's family and several others I know. I sincerely hope some who are "rational" Utah fans can read these comments and join the rest of us in acting human during games

  • What can we Learn
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:12 p.m.

    Hopefully Utah will have better security.

  • Forgive
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:15 p.m.

    and forget. Isn't that what you are preaching here in this article? Why don't you all do the same? Forgive a man who, himself, had a very hard time forgiving others. Instead, the vengeful think it's their duty to instill a bit of salt in a wound that is as wide as an inch.

    Get over yourselves, and get on with life.

    Didn't we learn the adage when we were little? "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me."

  • UteFan
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:15 p.m.

    Was there even a game? Max Hall's comments seem to be all the media can talk about. They have forgotten there was a game. I want to know about the game, not Max Hall. Do you report news or create controversy? Give it a rest Utah media. Try and be more like the national media and grow up.

  • Past Player
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:18 p.m.

    Probably the most ridiculous article I have ever read. This is sports not a woman's social. Hate is part of the game. Don't write about what you don't know. Once you have played in a game between utah and byu then you know alot worse things are being said on the field than "hate". Yes we do hate BYU and they hate us. Who cares. Stop crying and prepare for next year.

  • What in the World???
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:19 p.m.

    This whole thing is so laughable. It's hilarious to me how much press this thing has gotten. I'm glad that everyone has so much time on their hands that they can sit and analyze this to death! Was it in poor taste? Yes. Heat of the moment? Yes. Would I want my kid to say those things? Nope. But, when my kid messes up (even publicly) I hope I can cut him some slack, let him apologize and move on. Last time I checked, Max wasn't the spokesman for either the church or the school. He's a student-athlete that messed up. He apologized. Max, you were never my favorite, but it's water under the bridge. I'm sure the Utes won't forget, but that's the consequence of the rant. Yawn...

  • This article
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:26 p.m.

    is a cheap shot. Now let's analyze nasty ute fans.

  • In Infamny
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:27 p.m.

    Max will live.

  • Excellent
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:30 p.m.

    Thanks Amy...I loved the article. Now watch out because the hate from byu fans, who will attack you on every issue other than your leadership and wisdom, is coming in this blog. Already I have read some of those comments above. You have spoken the truth and have added wisdom from intelligent leaders throughout the world and history. I am a more enlightened person after reading your article and find it "Spot on". You did an excellent job. I hope more will see the value and intelligence in this article.

    Well Done!

  • Former Jock
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:50 p.m.

    Amy when is the last time you put on pads? This is like all of these preppy journalists trying to explain the combat situation in Iraq or Afghanistan from their comfy chairs in the news room. You want another analogy? How bout the professors teaching a discipline class to wanabe teachers at the universities even though they never taught in the classroom. Amy, it was in the heat of the battle and Max apologied.

  • Oregon Ute
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:52 p.m.

    Amy, what a great article. You get it. Keep up the good work.

  • Me Next
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:54 p.m.

    Besides wanting to know where you got your psychology degree, I'm wondering how many hours you sat down face to face with Max to gain such a comprehensive knowledge of the inner-workings of his heart.

  • THEeyepatch
    Nov. 29, 2009 9:55 p.m.

    I don't know what he was so mad about, the highlight of his career was beating Utah last night. Not playing in a BCS bowl game, not playing for a National Championship or even in the discussion. Throwing beer at a players family is a cowardly act and I hope they were caught and arrested. Hey, Maxx cheer up! Remember, the highlight of your career was beating Utah on Saturday, November 28th 2009. And people... leave the Church out of this, it has nothing to do with an imperfect person that let his emotions get the better of him after a FOOTBALL GAME.

  • RE: Excellent @ 9:30
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:02 p.m.

    I find it extremely narrow-minded that you classify other peoples comments as "hate" simply because they don't agree with you.

  • Max's apology
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:02 p.m.

    Max apologized earlier today for what he said. He's getting over it, everyone else should too (you too Amy).

  • Enough already..
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:03 p.m.

    C'mon...a college student, okay athlete, spouts off about a rival school / team! So what! I guess that is his opinion and his feelings. You can agree or disagree but what good does it do to criticize the way he feels?

    Let it go. He said, what he said and then he apologized. Move on already....and this type of psychological analysis from this article is hardly beneficial to anybody.

  • Yoda's advice...
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:04 p.m.

    "Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering." -Yoda

    Worry not, Max will grow up. He's just a senior in college...

  • Too much talk
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:07 p.m.

    Wah wah wah wah wah wah
    Get over everything ever said or ever done and we'll all be good. Good? Good.

  • Alfred E. Newman
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:12 p.m.

    What a stupid article.

  • slgs5
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:16 p.m.

    REALLY? Really? Do you really believe this dribble that you wrote. Emotion has no place in sports, and by saying no place in life? You care that much, that a college football player said he hated the team he played against? He felt it was personal, and for that he is wrong? He voiced his opinion, and for that he is wrong? Did it really hurt someones feelings? I am dying to know which Ute fans went home feeling all sad and depressed because that mean quarterback who just beat us does not like us. Or the BYU fans who all high and might try to ignore that they deep down feel the same way. But how dare HE make such a comment. What a poor sport he MUST be. Sad that a comment like this stirs the pot so much, that a article like this even had to be written. Enjoy.

  • Come on AMY. Seriously?
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:34 p.m.

    wow utah!!! its not like we didn't see this coming.. you guys got beet deal with it!! ya utah fans are "classless" max is right. Utah fans should start worrying about the game instead of who's cheering for who! MAX i'm with you, maybe i don't hate everything about the UofU but i don't like their their football team. And i know i would hate them if they threw bevereges at my family and taunted them. We need to put ourselves in MAX's shoes. i just hope this will be water under the bridge soon.
    Amy you should stop writing about sports. I bet if one of Utah's players had said something like this you would of agreed with it. but since its MR.Hall you have to make a big ol deal about it.
    Great game MAX !!!GO COUGARS!!!

  • Interesting
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:37 p.m.

    This was actually a pretty good article - thanks for writing it.

  • Hate comes from Utes and Cougars
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:37 p.m.

    Even the best people make mistakes and lose their tempers after an intense, emotional rivalry game.
    Amy would have done better to direct her attention to the nasty Ute fans last year, the unsportsmanlike play,and the (at least)one B.Y.U. fan who acted so despicably instead of psycho analyzing someone she doesn't know.The principles were honest but highhandedly and judgmentally directed at one person.

  • Well Said.
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:41 p.m.

    Nicely done, Amy. Trying to bring some sanity to an insane world. Good luck with that one.

  • byUte fan in AZ
    Nov. 29, 2009 10:53 p.m.

    I couldn't a said it better Amy! Not even close! I hope they all [red and blue] read it and take it to heart.

  • re UteFan
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:01 p.m.

    You comment on how Max's (admittedly dumb) remarks were bigger than the game, etc.

    Then you ask, WHY oh why, Amy can't we be more like National media.

    Have you read about the USC vs. UCLA game? That entire game story was lost after a timeout, A TD, and a near brawl.

    National media covered it just about EXACTLY the same way Amy did.

    Amy, I barely know you, but you seem to accurately report the "feelings"; the underlying conflict of sports in many of your stories. For That, I say Thank You.

    And to all other comments on these "public" boards. Try not to make too big a fool of yourselves. AND do not post anything that you would have trouble saying to that (often HUGE) person if they were right in front of you.

    Internet sites and Boards like this one have turned cowards into the super courageous with the anonymity that they support.

    Mr. Hall if you, or your family, is reading the trash that is usually posted; you need to either a) Have MUCH, much, thicker skin or b) discontinue reading these comments.

  • Re; Hey Amy
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:04 p.m.

    I don't recall any Utah player ever saying that BYU as an organization or BYU's football program or BYU's fans were classless. Stop trying to defend Uncle Max and his mad rant and simply admit that it was a classless display.

  • I agree
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:38 p.m.

    Well said Amy.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:47 p.m.

    Poor Max. What an asterisk to his whole season. All those wins.

    And THIS is what he will be remembered for.

  • Too bad, Max
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:54 p.m.

    Sure there have been Ute players in the past that have said they hate BYU in a generic rivalry sense. But I have never heard anything along the lines of "I hate the entire BYU school, their fan base, the organization, their program. I hate everything."

    Yeah, Max definitely took it to the extreme, and that will be his legacy for the rest of his life. Not his play on the field, and not the wins against Utah. He will forever be known as the average QB that spewed his mouth.

  • re:ome thoughts | 8:42 p.m. Nov.
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:54 p.m.

    I couldn't agree more.

    "I think it is time both coaches talk to their teams and universities about sportsmanship on and off the field. The unsportmanslike conduct penalties are just as disappointing and more dangerous than words spoken. If it is true that only a small percentage of fans misbehave, the large percentage of good fans should not stand for crude behavior and police themselves and the stands. This rivalry has descended to all that is amiss in sports and our culture. We all should be a bit ashamed."

    I'd be very, very please if yesterday's incidents resulted in both coaches, both ADs and both Presidents getting together to change the tone of this stupid rivalry.

    I LOVE my brother, and have never competed harder against anyone in my whole life. I didn't have to hate him to compete.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 29, 2009 11:59 p.m.

    Good article!

  • Former player and coach
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:04 a.m.

    I played football in college, and coached for 15 years.

    There is no need for nor benefit from hate.

    We taught out players to talk with their play. We taught them to walk away from taunting, to walk away from punches, to play the game. We won championships.

  • WA-Ute
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:06 a.m.

    We had a football party at my house with fans that wore blue and fans that wore red. We had a great time although I was disappointed in the outcome. Since we don't get Utah TV channels, I was unware of Max Hall's rant until I read the on-line papers today. It is unfortunate that this is so big in Utah. Here in Washington I don't think my friendly rivals are classless and they don't think I'm classless either. People in Utah (both red and blue) need to grow up. Can't wait for next year and a more mature Wynn. Go Utes!

  • Move on
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:13 a.m.

    cool story Amy

  • @ Former player and coach
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:19 a.m.

    cool story random and anonymous championship player and coach.....

  • Well said
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:37 a.m.

    Very good piece of writing, Amy. You summarized what many of us have been thinking as this episode has unfolded. What Max Hall said in the postgame revealed more about him than anything else. I feel badly for him and his world view and hope he will grow up and, as you so powerfully noted, learn from this experience. If not, he is anything but a credit to his experience in collegiate athletics and to BYU.

  • Rita
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:50 a.m.

    Well said, Amy, and spot on.

    Hall has shown his true colors. It's what a man does in the heat of passion that shows his core.

    And to "Anonymous" at 8:59...no, what he said DIDN'T need to be said.

    To "THEeyepatch" at 9:55...if The Church gets credit when its members act becomingly, it gets the blame when its members act unbecomingly - especially when they're from an institution that indoctrinates them about their actions and monitors their behavior so that they are a light set up on a hill. The knife cuts both ways.

  • WOW
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:29 a.m.

    Nice article. I am still waiting for the articles about self-loathing ex-utes Morgan Scalley and Steve Tate who expressed hatred for BYU after rivalry games in the past. Might I add, both of them used a lot more colorful language than Mr. Hall did to make his point.

  • John Wight
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:44 a.m.

    One doesn't write this well about anger without having some experience with it, some failure with it, some success with it, and some development in forgiveness. One also doesn't go through college without making some mistakes, without saying a few regretful things, without mishandling some personal pain, all while having a glimmer of understanding that we can eventually learn to handle it all. While sports stories do not usually get specific about the life-long quest to manage emotions, the characters in this one, both fans and player, give us a chance to see how holding on to pain can betray us, and maybe even more important, help us to understand how not to judge too harshly when someone makes this mistake, lest we nurse our own slights with such judgment. Sports can be illustrative of so much of life, if we look for it.

  • Mark Madson
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:32 a.m.

    Very well written and intelligent article.

    I truly hope this was just a personal outburst from one challenged individual rather than a display of what is taught in BYU athletics.

  • Selfish:
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:54 a.m.

    is the only way to describe his comments. BYU has been good to Max. Free education; national exposure, etc. And, unfortunately, the world may now judge BYU by his absurd, overly broad comments. I love my cougs but I hope that they will take some action.

  • Utefan
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:56 a.m.

    Well written and embracing lots of truths...the quotes sprinkled throughout the article were deliciously appropriate not only to what you were writing but to each of our lives. Thanks for reminding us and giving the reader something to think about long after Max's tantrum is forgotten.

  • Boise Coug
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:14 a.m.

    Max Hall embarrased himself and BYU with his comments. Absolute lack of self control and I hope Mendenhall has the integrity to speak out about it. It is such a shame that this win did so much to silence critics of Hall only to have him quickly give himself a black eye moments after recovering from previous self-inflicted wounds due to his poor play in big games. I am seriously shocked that he has such an obvious lack of self control after leading this team for 3 years now. And his obligatory apology was full of yeah-buts. As a huge Cougar fan I am embarrassed by Max Hall today when moments before his rant I was so proud of him. It really is a shame.

  • Anonymous!
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:26 a.m.



    Max is a good man, He knows all this stuff... he had just had enough like a lot of us had!

  • gdog3
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:35 a.m.

    Amazing writing Amy. You forgot to quote Yoda though. "Fear leads to anger, and anger leads to hate"

    Max looked fearful of throwing picks on Saturday. BYU won in spite of Max.

  • gdog3
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:41 a.m.

    Hey Utah! Hey BYU! Did you catch the end of the USC vs. UCLA game last week? Go look at the last three minutes on 'youtube' if you want to see what mirrors the ugliness of what our little holy war is becoming.

    The bush league incident that took place during the waining moments at the Rose Bowl reminded me of something red and blue (think last year). Okay I will give it to you with some other examples of poor sportsmanship below. But first let me ask the question behind this whole jihad we experience each November. Is the rivalry healthier than ever or just a sick form of human degradation? Maybe it's somewhere in between. Isn't there a need to re-examine the rivalry regardless?

    Last year it was 'The Haka' incident on the opposing teams field (Rice Eccles). One year it was the Utah cheerleader beating up a taunting cougar. On Saturday it was the Max Hall fiasco. What next? Whatever it is, the media can't wait. This USC vs. UCLA game and more specifically its' ending is another example of what is becoming increasingly wrong with sports.

  • gdog3
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:41 a.m.

    What is this? Crips and Bloods at the Rose Bowl? I submit it to be a sad reflection on what our society has become overall here in the United States.

  • addedupon
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:14 a.m.

    Max didn't believe he deserved to win that game and tried for 60 minutes to lose. But his teammates wouldn't allow it as George yanked in a dangerous pass in traffic! So Hall punished himself with his post game mess.

  • Marks
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:17 a.m.

    I'm hopeful Max's remarks and subsequent apology, along with the furor around them, will wake up sleepy administrations and the U and the Y about the classless acts by out of control fans on both sides, and will encourage open disucssion about how to create a safer environment at both stadiums during the rivalry game.

  • Justification
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:41 a.m.

    Love how BYU fans are defending a shining example of Christ-like love.

  • Teguc83
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:18 a.m.

    I really, REALLY enjoyed your article. I read in a comment that stated: "now if Max Hall will only read and comprehend it". To me it doesen't matter becasue the article proved so valuable to me. There are so many times I speak in am moment of hatred or frustration, that I soon regret it. I can use this experience to improve myself, my relationship with my family and associations with others. Thanks so much for helping me be a better person. Now if I will only read and comprehend this article, and might I add, implement it into my life!

  • Lori Johnson
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:24 a.m.

    Great article. My feelings exactly. It was dissappointing to hear Max Hall say such unnecessarily rude comments about the opposing team.

  • Reality check
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:33 a.m.

    It is not well chronicled what happened to The Hall family last year at RES, so until you have all the facts don't pass judgement on how he should feel and what he should say. Maybe he shouldn't have painted the whole University with a broad brush, but until the University is willing to do something about their own fans nothing will change.

  • James
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:59 a.m.

    This is ill-advised on so many sides. BYU, unlike other schools, even religious ones, is judged on HOW they play the game, not just the score. Each penalty, poor coaching moment, or side comment to the press is treated as news and a judgment on LDS culture. This is promoted by BYU and its coaches. And this Sunday School critique of what sports people are supposed to be like doesn't really help. In a broad way this article is just as much of the problem as a young football player expected to put up with months and years of anti-Mormonism as well as critical fans. It's almost a no win situation. The expectations are huge... and when all is over, someone, a female writer, takes a Sunday School approach thus encouraging the same attitude that drives BYU football players nuts... and they explode to the press. Maybe BYU shouldn't have a football team. I'm a fan, but I'm sometimes embarrassed at the whole thing. Expectations are too high. Football, sportsmanship and religion are often at odds in the modern world. This article doesn't help.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:03 a.m.

    well said i guess(coming from a true Y fan) maybe a little exagurated. come on max keep your head on. we need you!

  • citizen16
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:08 a.m.

    Whatever. It's okay to have emotions and show them sometimes. This whole controversy reminds me why I feel like I'm in a foreign country when I visit Utah. BYU still won.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:09 a.m.

    Everyone chill out. Let the kid vent. He's leaving and it will soon be forgotten. He has his life to manage and who needs the yip-yapping from the peanut gallery.

  • Cynic Jim
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:18 a.m.

    "his comments will cause a lot of people to believe athletics are not a good place to learn integrity, dedication, commitment and hard work."

    Maybe that's a good thing. I see riots in Mexico, Europe, England, and So. America. Over a game! And you are complaining about someone mouthing off. I graduated in the 60s from the U and my take on the U's fans is less than complimentary!

    Of course, it's not just sports, but a classless society that takes bad behavior in stride in order not to get beat up or shot.

    Where is the fun in a game that take personal and political overtones? Bah!

  • Kirt Mangum
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:22 a.m.

    This is the best and most appropriate counsel that could have been given. I hope that Max will read and take to heart the message you shared. Even in the heat of the moment, and I have played some ball, you can never unsay nor can you take back the words you said. I hope these words don't become Max's legacy at BYU. He was so much more.

  • Very Good!
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:29 a.m.

    Thanks for taking the time to address an epidemic in our society...that of anger and hate. I didn't see this article as so much a bash on Max Hall (he did it to himself), but an opportunity to discuss what hate can do to a person...

    I love the quotes! Thanks for sharing them with us. I, for one, am a better person for reading this article today. I will make a commitment to not let anger and hate ruin my day, week, year, or life...

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:29 a.m.

    Hall could have been more diplomatic, but this IS the grudge match that we Ute and Cougar fans egg on each year. As a Ute fan and student, I don't think Hall has anything to apologize for, though I am slightly skeptical of his evolving tale of the indignities unleashed on his family at Rice Eccles. Nonetheless, this was a big game for both teams, and for Hall personally. I don't see anything wrong with him venting a little pent-up frustration at the other side when all was said and done. It's as if he hurt our feelings ... well, we say the same things about BYU's fans, players, student body, etc.--just not when the cameras are rolling. We're becoming a people of babies.

  • Wow
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:37 a.m.

    Wow everyone. Just let it go. He said he was sorry and we all make mistakes, so just forgive and forget. I think all of you are making more of a sin by judging Max and what he has done. We all make mistakes.

  • Defending Hall?
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:39 a.m.

    For those fans who are bashing Amy's article, please tell me one thing she said that is not true.

    It seems that many of you can not handle the truth. It also seems that you value a truly classless act by an immature QB more than you value truth since you will attack the messenger and not the act at which it was directed.

    Good article, Amy. It gives us something to think about . . . if we are willing to be open-minded enough to do so.

  • Re: WOW
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:42 a.m.

    I thought BYU held themselves to a higher standard. Guess I was incorrect.

  • BYUFAN...
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:44 a.m.

    Loved the article! I don't see this as a rant against BYU or Max Hall, but a reminder of what hate can do to us. I can't believe some of the thoughtless remarks being flung at Amy! Incredible. It seems there are many who are in the same boat as Max, who 'hate' unconditionally and are so blinded by it that they can't see the logic in what is being said here. This proves how poignant this article is...

    I love sports. Played football, basketball, and track in high school and basketball in college. I've even played church ball! I understand the passion associated with it. I love competition and am sometimes overly competitive. But I've learned over the years that sportsmanship is all that really matters. That's when the victory is truly sweet. When you can congratulate your opponent, letting them know they tried hard and did well, but just came up short. Mutual respect for each others ability and no bridges are burned. It's a great lesson to learn in life.

  • Dh
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:45 a.m.

    This article sounds like the epitomy of self righteousness. Try this quote "Judge not that ye be not judged" Oops, guess I just went against that one. Maybe I should "mind my own business"!

  • DR
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:47 a.m.

    It's just a football game! Max get some integrity, or you will be just like everything you hate.

  • Yes this is journalism
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:49 a.m.

    Nice viewpoint Amy. Well thought out and substantiated by the quotes you found. This should be cut out and taped to the wall on every high school and college football team locker room. Sports doesn't have to include anger and malice. It should be fun and challenging. I'm a BYU fan and a journalist and Max Hall was wrong to let loose about his feelings. If he had kept his mouth shut we'd all be thinking more highly of him instead of wondering why he let the heat of the game spew forth across newspapers and message boards. And his apology rings a little hollow. That said, forgive and move on. It's just a game.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:53 a.m.

    For all you that are saying that RES doesn't have good security they do, YOU just didn't do anything about it,

    1) They don't allow any outside food or drink except sealed bottled water. so there is no beer in the stadium.

    2) There is a number you can call or text to report any disruptive behavior, all you have to do is text where you are at and someone will be over.

    3) You could have gone and found a security guard, they are all over the place, and had them come over and solve you problem


    So you can just quit complaining about RES cause there was plenty of thing that YOU could have done.

  • Rivalry 101
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:55 a.m.

    Play it close to the vest Max. Don't show 'em they hurt you.

  • YBU Fans
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:10 a.m.

    It is easy to see who is a YBU fan and a Ute fan while reading all of this article's comments. YBU fans defend Max Hall and state that this article is pointless while the Ute fan agrees with it. I still could not believe that Max Hall made the whole game about himself and satisfying his pride, ego and revenge entrenched soul instead of giving props to his team. I'm sorry but Andrew George made a great catch but because of Hall's selfish comments, George's limelight will be short lived. This rivalry game will get more recognition from Hall's comments than anything else that happened on the field. Sad, sad, sad!

  • trueblue
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:13 a.m.

    What Max did, I think was wrong but,To deny that the types of things he metioned happened to him and his family go on at RES stadium is foolish. I don't think any honest Utah fan can tell you there is no beer drank at RES. Fans get carried away at both stadiums. It is a common ocurrence at RES for fans to get drunk and thrown out of the stadium. It is important to remember when we talk about these things to remember we are talking about a small percentage of the fan base. Keep things in perspective people. When BYU fans stormed the field after saturday's victory, I thought it was a little much. Utah is not that good and neither is BYU. It was a sloppy game marred by penaltys on both sides. BYU will have a diffecult time beating anybody realy good in a bowl game and the way Utah looked Saturday, they will too. I have been blogging all year long saying the same things, "Grow up People" This is just a game.

  • bud
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:16 a.m.

    what was said, was wrong, but what happend last year was also wrong? Iblame the coaching staff on both teams for not putting there players on a suspension.also the fans should be more of a sportsman than the way they acted?If this ever happens again the police should lock up the people responsable, and bare them from ever attending any game,. EVER. in the state of utah.

  • I'm behind you Max
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:16 a.m.

    Max, there are plenty of us out there that feel as you do, you just happen to say it out loud. I know you regret some of what you said but I would venture to say we ALL have lost our temper and said something that may not have been completely accurate. If we argue that then we are not being honest. Don't let the man get you down. Go Max, go BYU and zip it media and ute fans.

  • yo
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:19 a.m.

    move on sports writers...there is hockey, basketballl and volleyball and high school sports...let give them some press and get out of your offices..

  • re:justification
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:26 a.m.

    We actually are practicing what Christ taught everyone to do: judge not, love, and forgive.

  • Utefan4life
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:27 a.m.

    I thought he put it well. Most (not all) ute fans are classless. They are jealous of byu because byu is a better school in both academics and athletics. The students from byu go on to do much greater things on a whole than the u of u in both as working and athletic professionals. Amy, I'm sorry but the correct response here should have been. "Max Hall had the guts to tell the media how it is without this politically correct garbage." If someone is classless, sometimes the best thing is for them to know it.

    Amy, youre just postponing the painful realization that the utes are classless. The first step to change is admitting. Good luck amy, and thank you max hall. Not a huge max hall fan, but his stock rose with that comment.

  • Ex Cosmo
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:29 a.m.

    I have to admit, for a long time, I felt the same way that Max Hall did. However, in the years that I left Zoobieland and have expanded my horizons, I realize how ineffective such feelings truly were. I often said things about the U that were in frustration, anger, and what I felt was "righteous" indignation. Now, I see it was ignorance and intolerance guiding my views. I can't say as I will ever wear the red and white of my former nemesis. I will say that I do regret some of my attitudes and actions while representing the Blue and White.

    It is nice to not feel bad about cheering for the U 9 or 10 times a year. Of course I only cheer for them when they aren't playing the Y or a school that would hurt the Y by the U's winning. However, I can honestly say that being removed from the atmosphere for 15+ years significantly impacted my perspective. Max will grow up, mature, and look back with a bit of remorse like I do. However, I am glad to hear that he has a strong spirit.

  • Hold On To It Maxie
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:30 a.m.

    I was less angry a year after my divorce than the little guy seems to be after this incident.

    Tip to all college quarterbacks: don't read Internet message boards.

  • TheHailstorm
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:31 a.m.

    From Today's Press:

    University of Utah athletic department officials, including head football coach Kyle Whittingham, have declined to respond to BYU quarterback Max Hall's post game tirade on Saturday. Sports information director Liz Abel said it was a BYU institutional matter. She also said Whittingham has declined to comment on reports that his wife, Jamie, suffered a cut lip in a fan-related incident after the game.

  • Well said
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:32 a.m.

    Excellent article by Amy Donaldson, and extra points for the Pembleton quote. The snarky coments on this article make Amy’s point for her. People aren’t talking about Hall’s game winning pass, they’re talking about his post game rant. Unfortunately, that’s what he’ll be remembered for. Besides, some of the best Max Hall jokes I heard last year came from BYU fans.

  • Sanity
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:33 a.m.

    Move on... There is nothing to see here... Move along... these are not the droids you are looking for...


    GO COUGARS... SCOREBOARD

  • Living in Boise
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:36 a.m.

    Boy, you people in Utah are mean and vicious. It's a football game for Pete's sake! Just another reason I am glad I live in Idaho.

  • DRLL
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:40 a.m.

    Funny how the all time winningest quarterback at BYU demonstrates that he may be the biggest loser to ever don a BYU uniform. What a pathetic individual.

  • Sammy
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:41 a.m.

    Great job Amy.

    Max Hall and Lenny Gomes. What a great couple they make.

    Coaches McBride and Edwards helped make this a fun rivalry without all the hate. Way to help ruin that legacy.

    I know it's redundant but Tim Tebow represents us better then you max.

    Also, way to steal the spotlight from all your teammates. I haven't read anything good about them since you opened your mouth.

    It's funny that you are lecturing anyone about CLASS!

    Let's see if BYU can represent the Conference in a Bowl game better than this.

  • Justin Clayton
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:42 a.m.

    He didn't say he hated everything, he said he hated everything about their program and university. This was not a verbal release of his pent up depression. It's convenient how you cut that quote up to your liking. Real mature.

  • Irony
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:42 a.m.

    It is sad to me that so many BYU fans think that this behavior only takes place at RES. Wake up people- I have had both garbage and soda thrown on me more than once down in Provo. I have also heard more profanity directed at me there from BYU fans than in any other arena in the country, and I've been to a lot of them. The biggest difference here is that Max Hall represents not only the football team, but also represents BYU and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. As such, he IS held to a higher standard and should be. The apology he issues was contrived and political; I seriously doubt he has any actual remorse for his comments. Both sides need to stop this type of behavior, but please don't delude yourselves into thinking it only happens in Salt Lake.

  • sevenufans
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:43 a.m.

    Excellent article, Amy. Max Hall is a very good football player, but unfortunately he has some work to do before he can be considered a good person. I feel sorry for him.

  • No blue colored glasses here
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:45 a.m.

    Any Y fan that wasn't absolutely appalled by Max Hall's comments needs to check themselves. He simply sunk to the depths of classlessness himself. I for one (a lifelong Y fan) am extremely disappointed that our players (yeah, I'm talking to you too, Austin Collie) can't just win gracefully and give us fans a chance to enjoy a win instead of being disgraced by stupid comments and/or being forced to defend their stupidity (which, obviously, I refuse to do, but am seeing a lot of here). Comments like Max Hall and Austin Collie are just making it harder to be a Y fan.

  • Mike Johnson Fallon NV
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:50 a.m.

    Great article, Amy.

    It is true that a day of reflection and coming down from the high of winning a hard fought game brought in a more precise explanation from Hall, a great QB and one I have admired for a few years now.

  • Boo Hoo
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:52 a.m.

    Max, 2 years ago COUGAR FANS through garbage on my sister-in-law at LES when her husband went out to get refreshments. No cougar fan around her said anything or defended her....that is not a great representation of BYU and being as believer in Christ.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:54 a.m.

    Typical media - you cry for this stuff, then someone says something then you blast the guy. You don't know so buzz off.

  • Hey Amy
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:55 a.m.

    You said, "Max Hall won. It wasn't the perfect game for either team, but it was important for them in many ways. And he was blessed with a win."

    He "was blessed with a win"? Did Austin Collie help you write this?

  • fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:56 a.m.

    It is very difficult to forgive someone who does harm to a member of your family. I agree it is the best thing to do but it is still very difficult.

  • Amy: Morgan Scalley story?
    Nov. 30, 2009 8:58 a.m.

    I've been searching the archives and can't find your article that similarly condemns former utah player Morgan Scalley when he said to the press surrounded by his teammates all dressed in football attire that he hated BYU, hated everything about them, and had hated them from birth. Really, hated them from birth? What, did the hosptial issue him diapers with BYU's logo on the inside? (Hospital staff: Oh, we can tell this newborn HATES BYU. Here, use these diapers).

    Anyway, I haven't been able to find your article condemning his little hate speech but I'm sure it's there somewhere. Please reprint it for us? Thanks.

  • Wynn's aplolgy
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:02 a.m.

    Where is Jordan Wynn's apology for blowing a tremendous defensive effort with terrible QB play? Or Whittinghams apology for benching Cain and running Louks out of town...while we watch Wynn deliver 54% completion % in the 5 games he played....two of which were against New Mexico and SDSU.

  • Tone it down everyone
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:02 a.m.

    If things continue to escalate someone is going to get hurt. I think both schools should look at not playing each other until the players and fans can start behaving like civilized human beings. It's both sides that have the problem. I love football and I think this is a disgrace.

  • robio
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:04 a.m.

    Abraham Lincoln was never a slave yet he had compassion and helped abolish slavery. Amy not putting on pads does not mean she can't understand a person's mental state. This is what they call psychology.

  • SJ
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:07 a.m.

    WOW! How pathetic! Pathetic comments by Max; pathetic article; pathetic comments from fans. The so-called rivalry really makes me sick and is heading out of control.

    Too bad these schools aren't in seperate conferences. Taking a year or two off from playing each other might make us re-think things a little.

  • Janet
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:10 a.m.

    BYU is a church school with a high moral and ethical code of conduct. Max Hall represents it. Some guy put out a "Men on a Mission" calendar, and BYU revoked his degree, presumably because the institution was embarrassed at his behavior. As a devout LDS member, I am much more embarrassed by Max Hall's behavior. He spewed hatred, then issued a (no doubt forced) apology that sounded like a rationalization. The University of Utah is a secular school that happens to have strong LDS representation, but it does not claim to represent the church. In reality, there are spiritual giants at both schools, and spiritual midgets at both schools. From what I have read in the DN, many Utahns believe that all is fair in ... war, and football is war. I appreciate the author of this article. She is right on, though the sexists here refuse to see that. Football is not war; it's a game -- just a game. How many times in the Book of Mormon does contention precede disaster? Outside of "contending" on the field of play (play!) there is no place for contention -- period.

  • Media HIPOCRISY
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:12 a.m.

    Oh how EASY it is to set back and judge Max Hall and condemn him for his comments and attitude. However put your self in his position a year ago and things start to become a bit blurry and confused. Your family get assaulted. Yes your wife, your parents etc... have to endure criminal assault that should have resulted in a criminal investigation and charges filed but... nothing happens. Yes it was all just washed away in favor of this "stupid" rivalry that the media "LOVES" to bask in. I say this ... this rivalry is NOT a rivalry at all but has crossed the line into a week long HATE FEST and it is UGLY. The media loves it and they do everything they can to capture any sound bite possible to stir up the HATE into a roaring inferno. Then comes the fall out and now the media decides they are the responsible ones now that get to remind Max to tone it down and act in a civil manner. HA!!!! What a bunch of hypocrisy!!! Perhaps it would do the media good to do some self examination FIRST before judging MAX.

  • Sanctimony
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:13 a.m.

    And then there were the critics. Apparently [they] listened to what [he] had to say about [them]. Get a life! I absolutely can't believe the all of the pious sanctimony going on here. What a bunch of cry babies against a kid trying to do his best, but all of a sudden he gets indictive criticism for beeing, oh how horrible, human!

  • Observer
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:20 a.m.

    Some media types have nothing better to do then blow up a story - there are bigger and more sinificant problems that need to be dealt with. Why not go after the real criminals. I don't Max is a threat to society - he's doing some venting which is probably good - plus pointing out a problem in sports that needs to be addressed. Please folks lets analyze and fix the root cause problem - not just a symptom.

  • Cassidy
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:21 a.m.

    I can't really blame Max for feeling this way, I'd feel the same way if the only remaining game in my career was a hapless bowl game.

  • Ashamed
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:22 a.m.

    Your bias is clear. All of your quotes are great but we are talking about a moral issue, a matter of right and wrong. It is too bad that Max did not address his comments better but he obviously had been hurt. The U won last year and they had to attack BYU's quarterback,s family! Now you and Utah fans are critical because Max expressed his feelings? I know how crude Ute fans can be and they are rude. So are some BYU fans. Why can we not take what the man said with grace and compassion. Some of the stupid comments I have read here prove what Max said about Utah fans is true. I don't like your take on this episode and think you should have done more research on the problem rather than finding all you quotes.
    Does the University of Utah have the guts to issue apology to Max?

  • Dennis
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:31 a.m.

    It is time to give this a rest. For what it is worth maybe the Administrative Personel at UTAH and BYU will wake up and pronounce that Assault and Battery is not acceptable. That fans participating in this type of behavior will be removed from the stadium. So give Max a break and look at the problem.

  • MadMax
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:40 a.m.

    Terrific column Amy. This fine player was not only mad at last year's situation in RES, he also became temporarily insane and "mad" with his comments. I remember being 24 and saying stupid things, too, albeit not on such a huge stage. Hopefully, good can come from this situation and life lessons learned about curbing our tongues in the heat of the moment.

  • Good article
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:42 a.m.

    With regard to this comment/sentiment: "Last time I checked, Max Hall wasn't a spokesman for BYU"--sorry, buddy. That's the job you sign up for when you take the school's money and the job of most prominent player in the biggest sport. When you don't live up to it, it's far worse than throwing an interception that loses a game.

    Those of you who are willing to "cut him some slack" are doing a fine thing on a personal level, but let's see him do what needs to be done: stand up in front of the media and take it back, rather than phone in an apology.

  • Advocate for Change
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:43 a.m.

    I'm quite certain Mrs. Donaldson is a Utah alumnus, so her article naturally reflects that bias. But I sense a more absurd trend developing with the whole Max Hall thing, namely, that those who are enraged by his irresponsible comments are determined to "make him pay" even more than he deserves to. And I'm talking about fans on both sides of the rivalry who want more than a sincere apology: they want blood vengeance.
    I was impressed by Bronco Mendenhall's pointing out that Max's apology was initiated and written entirely on his own, without pressure or help to produce a "politically correct" solution. It saw it on the news and it seemed sincere to me. But there will undoubtedly be those who think it a sham and will continue to stir the pot and demand his head on a platter. This is the part that troubles me - no matter what people do to correct a mistake, it is never enough for some.
    I for one am in favor of doing away with the U vs. BYU "rivalry" for this reason. I say pull the plug so that people will finally get a real life.

  • MM
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:44 a.m.

    Great article. I am a life-long Cougar and was very disappointed in Max's response Saturday. I hope he reads this. Even his "apology and clarification" did not represent well what he could learn if he read and implented what you have written here.

  • Great Article Amy....sad thing..
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:44 a.m.

    Amy, you hit it right on the head with your perspective on the Hall situation. The facts are that (1) Max did say these things for all the world to hear and (2) BYU media services issued an apology on his behalf. The public is left to speculate whether his apology is sincere or whether BYU (i.e. Coach Mendenhall or other BYU top brass) mandated that an apology be made.

    The sad thing is that just like former Utah coach Wayne Howard, who over 20 years ago made the statement that he "Hated BYU" of which the media has replayed the video clip each year before the game to characterize the intentness of the rivalry; for the next 20 years the media will replay Max Hall's tirade each year...and that's what Max will be remembered for. The overtime and the great pass to George for the TD will be long forgotten. Too bad. Sad legacy for a great record-breaking quarterback.

  • Sanctimony
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:44 a.m.

    “And then there were the critics. Apparently [they] listened to what [he] had to say about [them]." What a bunch of pious, sanctimonious crybabies! The kid does his best, but lets just torch him for being, what, human! This has just got to stop already! Are we all so perfectly self righteous that we have to call the kid out like this! This moral superiority hogwash is making me sick!

  • What about Kyle's wife?
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:51 a.m.

    Before the BYU fans get all righteous about their conduct and badmouth Utah's, we should remember that Kyle Wittingham's wife was hit in the head by a BYU fan and his son was sucker punched by a BYU fan this last Saturday. I saw her interview on TV when she talked about it. How do you BYU fans deal with things like that? Do you justify it somehow or do you just look the other way and pretend it didn't happen?

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:54 a.m.

    max hall will never play a down in the nfl

  • Cougar Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:55 a.m.

    I don't disagree with what Amy said about anger, and the quotes used were lessons of truth. However, I do take issue with the fall to your knees in gratitude that these are your adversities. Does anyone have any idea what adversities Max Hall deals with...has anyone walked in shoes...I don't think so. He shouldn't have said what he said, it was poor taste. I won't justify it nor will I condemn Max Hall. If you say it out loud in the press or you just think it in your heart-pretty sure the personal damage is the same. Judging Max Hall now, or hating him because of this really makes us just as bad as him doesn't it?

  • Coach Mendenhall...class
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:56 a.m.

    Max Hall should look to his coach for an example. While some don't like the way the Coach interviews, he's a class act in his conduct on and off the field. If Max had used Coach Mendenhall as an example, Max could have said something like "It was a hard fought game and indicative of this great rivalry" and left it at that. The situation would be totally different that what it is now - because of Max's words. Max would be remembered for a great win. But now, he'll only be remembered for calling the Kettle Blue.

  • MIssing the Point
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:57 a.m.

    Amy, it is a great article. People in the spotlight have a higher responsibility. I think that there are many here that always justify their own lives and mistakes by blaming others.

    It's called self control. Max has had a hard time demonstrating that both on and off the field. It is his persona. The sad thing is that he is part of a team that should be an example of a faith and a positive way of living. He is the spokesman for the team and I can guarantee that his views are not the same as the views of the whole team.

    Whether the fans and players like it or not, they represent more than themselves

    I too question the beer issue. Anyone can say that as an excuse. Two years ago on a family trip we received tickets to the Utah BYU game. As we were leaving the LES after a Cougar win, our family got drenched with a drink from passing Cougar fans as they yelled obscenities just because I was wearing a jacket that had red in it. We were cheering for the Y. We laughed that one off.

  • to Beer Incident
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:57 a.m.

    Honestly with all that hate he is harboring it just makes sense that his story is true. Also his family was escorted by the police after being harrassed and humiliated so there is plenty of proof. It is ridiculous that you "dont believe" the beer story, it is normal to hate someone who harasses your family. Its not normal to hate anything they affiliate with, but the individual. And to those of you who call him another BYU whiner, youre pulling a max here.. hate the school for one player? can you say hypocrite?

  • Neal Rappleye
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:58 a.m.

    "Max had a moment to praise his teammates, to thank his coaches, his family and those fans who believed in him, even when statistical evidence didn't support him.

    Instead, he used his moment to belittle players who are, in reality, not that different from him." - From the article.

    Actually, the MEDIA (i.e. your group of people) was asking him HOW HE FELT ABOUT UTAH, he was simply answering their question. He even asked if they really wanted to here it. It's not like he went spouting off for no reason. At other points in the press confrence he did praise his teamates, coaches, fans, etc.

    People, really have you ever been upset or frustrated and then said some things? I mean,really? I don't think this is anyone's place to judge. And I would say the exact same thing if it was a Utah player who said this.

    By the way, those of you who think that only BYU fans are jumping to Max's defense, read through ALL the comments and you will see that plenty of Utah fans also think this is being blown WAY out of porportion.

  • UTE Fan in MS
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:58 a.m.

    Great article, just too bad, for Max's sake that you had to write it. I love this rivalry between UTAH and the Y, but if it causes good people to do dumb things, is it worth it?
    Let's all be glad we have great football to watch, be proud when we win and humble when we loose. Using your status as a winning QB to vent your anger isn't suppose to be part of life, let alone a football game. Let's all just put this one behind us and enjoy the game for many years to come. Especially now that both schools are playing at a level that we have never had before.

  • What apology?
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:00 a.m.

    Did Max really issue that apology or was it forced by his leaders? We'll never know I guess, but for sure Tom Holmoe and Bronco Mendenhall weren't too pleased about Hall's tirade. Hopefully young Hall will learn a great lesson from this. I'd like to hear the words come straight from Hall in an TV interview so we can see his sincerity.

  • jim, cedar city
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:05 a.m.

    I thought it was a good article. Loved the quotes. What I would appreciate more would be a one on one interview with Max Hall. But not now. Down the road, after all this settles down. To get to know the real Max Hall. What makes him tick. Why he chose BYU to transfer to. Why did he let the Utes get under his skin, after all the "Y" won two of three under his leadership. I would have praised the defence for keeping things close so the offence had a chance to win the thing in O.T. Oh well, the heat of the battle. Most of us have been there and said things we later regretted.

  • Great article...
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:05 a.m.

    Thank you, Amy, for a great insightful article. It's unfortunate that this is how Max Hall will be remembered. There's no denying his ability as an athlete, but ones true character comes out in the heat of the moment. His apology will be accepted, despite how poorly worded and put together it was. He's sorry that what he said, "came across how it did". But how ELSE would it have been interpreted?

    Whether or not his family was personally attacked last year, he chose to deal with it in a very poor way. Both teams have over zealous fans, but in the end it's the actual players who reflect their teams the most. He chose to express his feelings in a very public way, and will now face the consequences of his decision.

    This rivalry will always exist, and people will always watch and support their teams. However, it's my personal hope that both teams will choose to deal with their feelings in a most respectful, more "classy" way in years to come.

  • Hey Amy
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:08 a.m.

    Good lecture. You are so wise and all knowing. If only the rest of us could live up to your standards. It's good to see so many self righteous people who can stand in judgment of a young man who has experienced a lot of pain over the past year. Max may have made a generalization in his press conference, but the indignant and self righteous responses by Utah fans prove he wasn’t far off on his original comments.

  • U fans' treatment
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:21 a.m.

    of Hall's family is the real story. Why aren't U fans and the University doing something about that!? Wasn't it just last year than a drunken Ute fan punched a pregnant woman in the face (because she was wearing BYU colors), and he then RAN AWAY? Why aren't U fans condemning the conduct that gave rise to Hall's comments? While I condemn the overly broad generalization of Hall's comments, I applaud them as they apply to the trashy Ute fans who throw beer, spit, punch pregnant women, throw snowballs at the players, etc. That conduct goes beyond rivalry and decency.

  • It is football
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:22 a.m.

    Clearly Amy has never strapped on a helmet and tried to knock the living tar out of someone else. I "hated" my friends playing and cheering for my rival high school's football team for a week and a few days after the "big game" each year. I would also have jumped in front of a truck to save any one of their lives.

    It's football folks! Please don't let the PC police ruin thIS last vestige of Americana. Of course Max Hall "hates" Utah and the Utes "hate" Max Hall. Throw a party this week with both teams and they will be whooping it up like brothers in a matter of minutes.

    The problem comes when jerk BYU fans start thinking their football team is somehow tied to God's plan, and jerk Utah fans start thinking a football stadium is a place to act out on their boorish religious bigotry.

    Amy, spend your time pontificating about jerk fans. Lay off the student athletes. They are young, testosterone-driven men who are playing a highly emotional and violent game, and loving every minute of it. THEY DON'T REALLY HATE ANYONE--IT'S FOOTBALL!

  • essay
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:24 a.m.

    Big deal. So Hall isn't perfect. Is it really worth a column to dissect that?

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:31 a.m.

    The best thing this author has ever written! The lesson is for all, not just Max Hall. One has to wonder why the blinders of prejudice against right vs wrong are put on by the people who have all the negative comments-Oh, wait, Perhaps they are simply proving the point made by the author......Yep, I believe that's it!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:33 a.m.

    An extremely well written article!!! Amy, I will search out future article you write.

  • To Ashamed...
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:33 a.m.

    The issue doesn't have anything to do with whether the U of U has guts. As of right now, Max's allegations are nothing but hearsay, in a legal sense. And, the U of U didn't have anything to do with what Max says happened to his family. It was independently done by some very crass Utah fans. But, BYU has just as many crass fans as witnessed by what happened to Kyle Wittingham's wife and son.

  • die hard
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:33 a.m.

    Having quit going to the U's games some years ago due to their CLASSLESS fans I would say that Max was justified in his speech. As far as AMY's article goes, U grad maybe?
    A reality is that the U should give his family a written apology and probably him to. Next Kyle should publicly apologize on his radio show. And how about the U fans that were throwing all their garbage on the field and the band playing after the game on sat and while they were trying to give the grads their blankets???
    CLASSLESS still seems like the rioght word.....

  • John Parodi
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:35 a.m.

    Max Hall just entered the Hall of Shame! His lightweight remarks,obviously made in the heat of anger showed him to be a self-righteous,terrible winner as well as a poor loser.
    The beer incident was classless, but he should go to other stadiums where that kind of behavior is de rigeur. BTW, he only offered a half-apology; like half-truths they are subject to the same doubt as it relates to their sincerity.

  • passive - AGGRESSIVE
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:38 a.m.

    Amy,

    You really got some good darts to throw at your picture of Max Hall.

    Don't take any responsibility for your fellow Ute fans throwing things at his family.

    Max shouldn't have said those things to the media. If he had feelings like that, then he should keep them to himself.
    Yet, there is one thing that will truly get a man angry. That is when his family is being taken advantage of or when they are being abused.

    I don't think you should go and judge anyone on this unless you were there when his family was spit upon.
    You have a chance to help make this better or worse.
    Which one have you chose? The wrong one...

  • WVC
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:44 a.m.

    MAX HALL HAS MADE AN APOLOGY TO THE UTES FAN AND THE UNIVERSITY, LETS MOVE ON. WHAT WE ARE FORGETTING IS THE NOT SO GREAT GAME THAT WAS PLAYED, AND THAT THE "U" LOST. UTE FANS CAN TAKE THEIR LOST OUT ON MAX AND THE COMMENT HE MADE, BUT THAT DOES NOT CHANGE THE FACT THAT THEY LOST, UNTIL NEXT YEAR THE SCORE WILL STILL BE BYU 27 - UTES 23.
    LIFE IS GOOD.

  • Concerned Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:47 a.m.

    Yes, Max might have chosen his initial words more carefully. But please notice that his "apology" is also a "clarification." According to Max, his family was assaulted and spit upon. Anyone who's spent time around large groups of University of Utah fans knows that many of them are verbally, and even physically, abusive towards opposing fans -- particularly if they happen to be from BYU. It is well past time that President Young and Coach Whittingham act to change the atmosphere at Rice Eccles.

  • GridironSam
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:51 a.m.

    It has been said by many that it is time for the coaches to talk to their respective fan bases about sportsmanship and proper behavior. I think the coaches have already spoken--their leadership is manifested through how their respective players behaved after the game.

  • AZ Coug
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:51 a.m.

    Good article for reminding us what collegiate athletics should be about. Intense competition with sportsmanship. I want to share this article with numerous high school coaches, a few junior high coaches, little league, and pop warner coaches as well.

    As for me, I love the rivalry and love to cheer against the Utes. 10-10 over the last 20 years-it does not get more even than that. I will refrain throwing my caffeine free diet coke on any Ute athletic supporter.

    It does crack me up to remember inb 1993 when my neighbor at BYU tackled the Ute flag bearer after the Utes first 34-31 victory. He got his butt kicked afterward, but man-that was funny, I don't care who you are.

    But as I teach my kids about sportsmanship now, I would like them to refrain from 1-running a banner around an opponents stadium after a victory and 2-from tackling the said banner waver. 3- I would also say win and lose with class, but don't ever tear down a goalpost or let a victor tear down yours.

  • ojw
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:53 a.m.

    "Just because you are a good football player, that doesn't give you the right to act like a jerk."
    -Lavell Edwards

  • Tigers Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:53 a.m.

    During his interview with Greg Wrubell, Bronco Mendenhall said he was happy with Hall's handling of the situation. That's enough for me.

  • Max's Mistake
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:57 a.m.

    Clearly, Max Hall made a mistake in his comments. It was a bad mistake and reflected a high level of pent up anger. It is, of course, easy to analyze that from the comfort of distance and detachment. I, for one, always think and act better two days after the passion is gone. In the heat of the moment, immediately after a hard fought battle (and, yes, it was a battle) a young man made a mistake. He did not act according to dispassionate reason and according to the wisdom of the ages. He has expressed and, most likely, feels sincere regret. Can we now forgive him and examine our own behavior?

  • reality
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:57 a.m.

    If Kyle or Mr Hill had any CLASS they would send a public appology to Max and his family.
    Max shouldn't have to apoligize for anything.
    The truth is it's own defense!

  • Give me a break!
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:58 a.m.

    OK, he shouldn't have said it, but so what??? It's a rivalry and both sides talk smack every year. Big deal. Making a mountain out of a molehill. Is there nothing more important happening in the world? Get over it!

  • Loyal Ute Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:59 a.m.

    First off, I've heard lots of Ute fans dispute Max's story about his family. I, for one, believe it. It attended last year's game, and rushed the field after it. A Ute fan ran in front of me with a cup of beer and threw it in a BYU player's face. I don't know where he got the beer and I don't care, but I was embarrassed by his behavior. It reflects on me as a fan. There are lots of Ute fans who need to show a little more class.

    A note to J Jensen and others, Ute fans aren't the only ones who harass visiting fans. Try attending a game at Wyoming, UNLV, or other schools. In fact, I was invited to and attended the BYU/New Mexico game last season (first game ever for me in LES). When fans around me found out I was a Ute Fan, I never heard the end of it, and I was actually cheering for THEIR TEAM! I find it totally hypocritical that BYU fans complain about Ute fans when I've seen them act the same way.

  • Thank-you Amy
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:03 a.m.

    What a great article. Makes me believe Max has a way to go to get over his anger. He apologized but if you've wanted something for a year how does that change so fast after you said what you said? I think it was more what the AD & Coach Mendenhall said that got Max to apologize. I hope somewhere he truly in his heart learns to apologize to himself and accept some responsibility for his actions. I find it strange that he thinks all the praise is fine but criticize him and he goes off the deep end. Too bad BYU and Coach Mendenhall didn't do right by Max and help him to check his ego @ the door. His team, his school and the fans could not enjoy their victory due to him and all his selfish egotistical glory!! Bench him. Let him know what the TRUE meaning of HONOR, SPIRIT and TRADITION stands for. If this was a second-stringer would the AD & Coach Mendenhall do this little rug sweeping act?? Hang banners in the stadium, spout off about your values & leadership but you proved it's meaningless, especially when it's the golden child MAX HALL

  • To ALL
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:04 a.m.

    Here is a question for all ...

    if your family is assaulted how would you react?

  • Brenden
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:15 a.m.

    Now if only we could get the local talk radio and other coverage outlets to quit fanning the flames by encouraging fans to call in and trash talk. The ruder the call, the more aggressive the opinions, the more vitriolic the tenor, the better they seem to like it. The 'winners' get their comments played over and over. I hear it every year, and it gets progressively worse. Sad. There is a current notion that a game cannot be 'fun' beyond a certain level; you have to 'hate' the 'enemy'--those were the actual words used in radio discussion about it years ago on KFAN. It is bigger than the coaches, players, institutions and fans. It is becoming our national psyche, fed from the ground up, cultivated in myriad 'entertainments'. You start to see the results in High Schools--sometimes earlier than that--but it bears abundantly when it reaches intercollegiate rivalries. And how do we collectively respond to it? With a news highlight, a flippant 'I hate it when that happens', maybe a suspension & some moral indignation. But the talk shows stoke it again when the next season begins, and the rats fall in behind the pipers.

  • B-Jo Laing
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:16 a.m.

    I greatly appreciated this thought provoking article. It was said tactfully and honestly. While many may have thought what MH said, in other sporting events and challenges, they did what he didn't, kept mum.

    Thank you for the thoughts on how anger can corrupt a soul.

  • GREAT GREAT ARTICLE
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:22 a.m.

    Amy I think you hit the nail on the head. Max's hatred had more to do about his own shortcomings at BYU than anything else.

    Well spoken!

    Aggie Fan

  • U Band was Classless?
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:24 a.m.

    Agreed. They played "I am a [classless] Utah man" every other minute in the second half. Thankfully, the BYU band tried to shut them down by playing over them. Why wasn't there any responsible leadership over the [classless] band!?

  • Cougsown1
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:24 a.m.

    It goes both ways was Max Hall right by saying it?? probably not but it goes both ways both teams say things along those lines.

  • Steve
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:27 a.m.

    It would be perfectly acceptable for Max to unload on the Utes if he was elite quarterback, and if the Y would have laid a 50-10 beat down on the U. Winning on the Y’s home turf and barley squeaking out a win is an embarrassment to a U team that is in the rebuilding process.

  • Cougar Cindy
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:27 a.m.

    Great article, Amy. Needed to be said. The boys who think it's no big deal forget that the world itself was created by words. This rivalry is heated and overheated by words. Words matter, more than sports, in fact (shock!). That's why, folks, we have sportsmanship rules, right? Words literally can take over the game.

    So, Amy, ignore the bloggers who are offended by your taking Max's mistake seriously. He will regret his words all his life. They will be brought up and remembered more than his very good record--he is not one of the few greats, but definitely among the better QB's the Y has had. I have consistently supported him, as I know he has tried to control his loose tongue, and done so with fairly good success. But after this I feel a bit relieved to look ahead to the QB's coming down the pipeline. It's time to focus on something other than Utah and cool this rivalry a bit.

    Thanks again Amy.

  • Suspend Him
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:27 a.m.

    I've seen college players suspended for less; please suspend him.

  • Purple person
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:37 a.m.

    I graduated from Utah in '04, and am considering BYU's MBA program. I have been a Cougar fan, and a Ute fan. I would condemn Matt Hall's comments if he were a Ute QB trashing BYU. It's unsportsmanlike. The fact is that the "beer" incident could have occurred at any game around the country, not just at Utah. Utah fans in general are probably tame compared to those of some schools in other parts of the country. I don't condone the actions of the particular fans who allegedly threw beer on Max's family at RES. But fans don't have the responsibility to represent a school as players do. I don't think Max Hall represented BYU, or what it stands for, very well with his comments. I am a Ute fan, but with sympathies for BYU, as I would like to see an MWC team win it all and overthrow the BCS. I'll be cheering for TCU this season, as should any Y or U fan.

  • This article just shows
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:37 a.m.

    how sensitive and hypocritical Ute fans are. They turn a blind eye to their own reprehensible behavior, but when someone calls them on it, they cry for days.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:39 a.m.

    1. Anger is a secondary emotion.

    2. I'm so glad that none of the stupid things I said in my 20's were broadcast on national tv.

  • Postgame interviews...
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:41 a.m.

    "Hate" is a word/emotion that we try to keep out of our home; but that being said I am really starting to wonder what the MEDIA expects to get from a player/coach when they PRESS issues like this (in a post game interview no less).

    As a fan, I wouldn't miss the "POST GAME" interviews one BIT. These guys have had an EARFULL of trash talk all week/game and we want to stick a microphone in their face to get a quote.

    WOW. Thousands of fans, hundreds of media jumping all over these UNPAID athletes; and we have an expectation for them to play and speak "perfectly".

    As fans, media, and human beings we should GET OVER ourselves and take a hard look in the mirror and ask what did we really expect.

  • Ute Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:47 a.m.

    I really enjoyed this article...good truths that we can all learn from...not just BYU or Utah fans...but everyone...good principles here.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:50 a.m.

    Amy you are over annalizing this. Your article was I think very criticle of one person, and not of the whole picture. People do bad things, and they deserve to be called classless. Stop being so politically correct. In my opinion political correctness is what is wrong with our country now a days.

  • Henri
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:51 a.m.

    Good and thoughtful article, Amy.

    Max's lack of wisdom in his comments will haunt him for a good, long while.

    I'm a BYU fan and I don't cheer for the U, but Max's comments were inappropriate, childish, and certainly won't heal the hatred between the two schools.

  • Justin
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:52 a.m.

    I'm a Ute fan and I don't hate Max Hall. I admit that when I first heard his comment, I took offense but this article reminded me that anger was my problem, not BYU's or Max Hall's problem. I haven't read the apology but accept it as sincere and don't hold a grudge. I'm not a fan of BYU but totally respect Ex Cosmos @ 8:29. That guy seems to have a healthy perspective.

  • great job
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:13 p.m.

    Love the article Amy. Sad to watch the vehement attacks by the supporters of Max Hall's Hate speech.

    They are trying so hard to deflect Hall's hateful and immature actions by saying he was justified in his behavior because of "hearsay" of an event that has not been proven to have taken place over a year ago.

    Seeing how Mendenhall promoted his firesides and "building men not football players" last year as an excuse for their failure at a "quest" it is no wonder they are upset to have the hypocrisy revealed so perfectly in the melt down of Max's in a press conference.

    Some are so blinded with their arrogance that they are even suggesting that the U of U and Coach Kyle should apologize to Max for what he "hearsays" about U fans that "caused" Max to say those things. I can now add "no accountability" to the behavior of BYU fans.

  • BYU DISGRACE MAX HALL
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:18 p.m.

    The MWC needs to suspend him for his final game for violation of the league's sportsmanship policy. Obviously, noone else will.

  • American Citizen
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:22 p.m.

    Well written Amy. It's refreshing to see a little wisdom in this junior high rivalry.

    Anyone who dosn't think there is beer in the U of U stadium is in La La land. How about some serious fines?

  • Hate begat hate
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:28 p.m.

    Yes, Max Hall should not hate those who hated him first. But don't forget where the hatred originated in all of your preaching.

  • L D Gammon
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:30 p.m.

    I think the BYU Admin. Should address what happened to Coach Whitt's wife and Son.

  • Ute Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:37 p.m.

    Max I accept your apology and I also apologize that any of our fans did things to make you feel this way. Good luck in your bowl game and in life. Lets all stop the hate qand remember this is only a game.

  • CDN
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:40 p.m.

    I like this article. In fact, I love it. I love everything about it. I love the quotes, I love the commentary, I love everything. So, it feels good to read your article. (Thanks, Amy - well said!)

  • max's momentt
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:45 p.m.

    Not having shown at any time, the types of qualities that make for good NFL quarterbacks, Max took his last grab at fame...He lost control in the heat of the moment...this is not new for him and has been the criticism fans and foes alike have levied against him his entire career. His lack of emotional self control has been the difference in games when it really mattered. I have never believed and will never believe apologies that begin with, and are littered with "if". He did say things intentionally and it did hurt his team and his team mates and he knew it...so say it and leave out the "if"!

  • re:Janet
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:47 p.m.

    So let me get this straight Janet - What you are saying is .. it is perfectly OK for the Utah fans to assault Max Hall's wife and mother both verbally and physically because after all the U is a secular school and there are no standards of expected behavior? What an absolutely WRONG and dangerous comment!!! Max has EVERY right to defend his family just as your husband would if you or your mother were assaulted after a BYU/Utah game. This has NOTHING to do with the church but has EVERYTHING to do with common, human decency! Max's apology was right on and very articulate. To stupidly suggest that because Max is LDS and plays for an LDS school he has no right to express his outrage toward the low-life Utah fans who assaulted his family is in and of itself and outrage. By the way, where was the statement of apology last year from the U of U? Amy's comments were mostly mis-guided and wrong.

  • eb
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:48 p.m.

    Some 40 + years ago A friend and I attended at BYU/Utah game in SLC. Many Utah fans are the same then as today. We were harassed, burned with cigarettes and many other things. Max statements are real. When in Provo did Utah fans get beer pored on them or have their team get all types of things thrown on them. These so called Utah that do this things leave a very bad impression with others.

  • Well written..
    Nov. 30, 2009 12:59 p.m.

    and not just for Max, but all who spew venom.. including many on this board

  • Provo Aggie
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:04 p.m.

    This was a great article. Max Hall already looked like an idiot this year when he made derogatory comments about Utah State. Perhaps the BYU Administration should not let him talk to the press if he can't think of anything positive to say.

  • re:max's moment
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:05 p.m.

    Let me ask you a question - would you defend your wife and mom after they were physically and verbally assaulted or would you say nothing? Any real "man" would defend his family. You obviously don't qualify.

  • BYUgraduate
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:06 p.m.

    Great article Amy! It's a refresher one for all. Hall should read this to refresh his character.

  • 20 years ago.....
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:06 p.m.

    I went to the USU game versus byu in Provo. I cheered HARD for USU, but didn't throw or do anything else....

    MY WIFE was pelted the entire 4 quarter with M & M's and Skittles.....

    The only thing different in Provo is the items they use in their attack!!!

    Great Article and RIGHT ON THE MONEY!!!!

  • UtahRed
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:10 p.m.

    Max Hall did not harm Utah football or its fans. What he did do is disgrace his school's football program, and his church. Yes, there are obnoxious Utah fans. There are equally obnoxious BYU fans. If you don't believe that you need to look in the mirror. Why wasn't this incident about Hall's family being sprayed with beer brought up after last year's game? That is regretable if it's true, but what about the BYU fan who punched Coach Whit's wife and split her lip. That is not only regrettable, but it's also assault. The hyprocricy of BYU fans is what makes them hated around the country, not just by Utah fans. Didn't Jesus say something about hyprocisy? Those BYU fans who agree with Hall should turn in their temple recommends. There is nothing Christlike about hate and hyprocisy and you are supposed to believe in Christ and practice his tenants to get into the temple. I think the day will come when a lot of "good" LDS will find themselves left out in the heat (if you know what I mean). That goes for Utah fans as well.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:10 p.m.

    Had a Ute football player had said what Hall said nothing would have been done about it. Hall does have the right to express his opinion.

  • Max hall hates me.
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:10 p.m.

    Brigham Young founded the U. does that mean he hates him? Gordon B Hinkly attended the university of Utah, and the same with president Monson. From his post game interview i see that max hall hates byu and the Mormon church. Max hall hates me too. Go UTES

  • Max Hall was right
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:11 p.m.

    This is pretty simple - Max is right and Amy is dead wrong. Any husband and son worth two cents would defend his wife and mom after they were assaulted. This has NOTHING to do with football and everything to do with protecting ones family. The ONLY shame here has to go to the low - life's who assaulted Hall's family and the U of U for issuing NO APOLOGY afterwards.

  • Gandhi
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:12 p.m.

    Amy's pain a reflection of self-righteousness.

  • Henry Drummond
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:13 p.m.

    The fault dear Brutus is not in our stars but in ourselves

    --Julius Caesar --

    Don't we all feel better now?

  • Both Sides
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:14 p.m.

    Those writing about Whittingham's wife and son's experience Saturday, check the police report--it all began with Whit's son grabbing a guy's blackberry because he was taking pictures of stunned Ute players, and throwing it in the stands.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:18 p.m.

    Boring. It's football, and no one is (hopefully) looking to Max Hall to be the example of sports as an appropriate medium to teach integrity. His comments don't merit this type of drawn-out psychological analysis. It's just a game.

  • Whatever
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:19 p.m.

    I love how everyone has become an expert on what is going on inside Max Hall's head. Next thing you know a government research grant will be given to both Universities to study his comments. Give me a break. He was angry, emotional and was holding it in until prodded by the media to express his feelings. You mean to tell me if your family had to endure the treatment that his family went through that you wouldn't carry animosity for the school those fans represent? I can't fault him his feelings and it was probably therapeutic to win and release the venom. But give him a break. Did you bother analyzing his apology? Oh no because an apology in this day and age is meaningless because all of you critics have an issue with forgiveness as well.

  • Ambose...#2
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:29 p.m.

    "Contempt is the emotion we feel for an opponent whose arguments are too formidable to refute."

    I believe UTAH may have an argument here...

  • UTES
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:29 p.m.

    Perfect examples of classlessness! Actions speak louder than words! Clean up your act UTES!

  • Higher Standards
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:31 p.m.

    Unfortunately Max Hall plays for a school that promotes a higher standard of conduct with it's students and athletes. So comments that seem to contradict this higher standard are difficult to reconcile for most of us. Ya sure other players in sports make comments of the same but they are not held to the same standard as Max Hall and BYU. Fair? No.

    Maybe the LDS church needs to reconsider the benefits of running a full university. With the level on institute programs offered at other fine universities in UTAH it might be time to turn BYU into a perpetual education fund school to help educate the world and forget about the issues inherent in running a major university. It might even same money in the long run and it would definitely better follow the mission of the church.

  • Red Herring
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:33 p.m.

    Amy's article is spot on.

    As deplorable as the offense to Hall's family was last year, that is not the basis for Mr. Hall's rant.

    His real pain was driven by last year's blowout and the ensuing harsh criticism and taunting from his oponents, many BYU fans, and the media. (And the fact that the same criticism continued after this year's blowouts.) Admittedly this is all very tough stuff for a twenty-something to have to digest but that's the root cause.

    The family incident was merely a convenient (and, yes, deplorable) facade for the true source of the pain.

    Amy recognizes and articulates that very well. BYU fans who are trying to justify his rant are off track.

  • Steve Cullimore
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:39 p.m.

    Amy - Very articulate, well written opinion! As an out-of-state BYU fan, I enjoyed the outcome of the game and cringed at Hall's unclassy comments brought on by unclassy actions by fans wearing both colors (and perpetuated by some unclassy responses to this article).

    Pity that this kind of uproar is not unique in any way to the BYU/Utah rivalry - the lack of civility is sad, not unexpected, and odly amusing. Thank you all for the entertainment.

  • Objective
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:43 p.m.

    Very nice article, Amy. Max played a nice game; however, the focus is now unfortunately on his post-game comments. I suspect Steve Young, Ty Detmer and others had similar experiences, but chose not to go where Max went. A nice achievement on Max's part has been compromised. I am saddened that a very good football game was upstaged by this post-game nonsense.

  • Larry
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:44 p.m.

    Exceptional article. Thank you.

  • .Abby
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:47 p.m.

    I wonder what words of wisdom and hatred would have been uttered if they had LOST! Geeezzzzz

  • Ernest T. Bass
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:52 p.m.

    I knew this was going to happen.

  • Herb Gravy
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:53 p.m.

    Well. Said!

  • ChantDownBabylon
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:54 p.m.

    Just a thought...

    I hate the Lakers. I really, really hate them. Do I want to hurt them? No. Do I want them to get injured? No. Do I dislike everything about them? Almost (I like Gasol--don't ask me why!). Anyway, Max's "hate speech," has been on the lips of nearly every sports fan when a longtime sports rival is brought up. Compound that simple truth with the abuse dished out to his family last year and the hard-fought chippy ballgame and yeah, he hates them. But it isn't like he wants to deny them rights or ship them overseas.

    Was it a wise thing to say while the camera's running? Probably not, but sports fill us with passion and sometimes that passion bubbles over. It isn't dissmissible but easily forgivable.

    He apologized and probably feels pretty stupid and I readily forgive him.

    P.S. Go Spurs Go! Sorry Jazz fans. :)

  • Go Aggies!
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:54 p.m.

    It is too bad that this happened. I bet Max ment to use different words, but in the heat of the moment he fell apart.

    If Bronco believes in integrity and honor then he should bench Max for the bowl game.

    Any ways - the Cougars visit Logan this week and it is safe to say that the Aggie fans will continue to make fun of BYU and their "poster boy" Max.

  • LDS Ute Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:57 p.m.

    Whether he likes it or not Max Hall represents the LDS church. His predecessors represented BYU and our church with a lot of class. Ty Detmer was being verbally harassed at a Wyoming game when he was benched in the third quarter after building a huge lead. He turned around and started talking to the very rowdy fans about hunting. By the end of the game the Wyoming guys told him “good luck” in getting the Heisman and were Ty Detmer fans. Now that is class.

    Max would be well advised to whom he is calling classless, President Monson was presented with the “distinguished University of Utah Fan” this year (October 31st Church News). Elder Wirthlin a former Ute player was recognized as a lifetime Ute fan. My Mission President "Ray Price" played for the Utes and there is not a classier guy than him.

  • Robert Howard
    Nov. 30, 2009 1:57 p.m.

    "Crom, I have never prayed to you before. I have no tongue for it" --Conan the Barbarian--

  • Flounder
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:00 p.m.

    Perhaps Max should have considered the wisdom of Dean Vernon Wormer, "Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through college son" when determining how properly to respond to Ute fan

  • PP
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:06 p.m.


    Wow... | 8:36 p.m. Nov. 29, 2009
    This article is awesome and truly reflects what was going through Max Hall's mind in those heated moments after the game. In a few years, very few people will remember what kind of QB this kid was but no one will forget his harsh words in a moment of anger. So sad.
    ------
    Really - would you care to enlighten us about some of the things McMahon said? There were quite a few. After a few years what we remember are the stats and the wins.

  • Crimson Club
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:07 p.m.

    Who has time for hate in their lives? Not me. Between my medical practice, raising my 4 children and getting ready to go to Hawaii for Christmas, I don't have any time for hate in my life. I accept Max's apology and really enjoyed the game. Let's move on and forget about all of this nonsense. We have a great rivalry, let's not tarnish it.

  • MaxHatesU
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:08 p.m.

    Scoreboard cry baby Ute fans!

  • re: UtahRed | 1:10 p.m.
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:10 p.m.

    "Those BYU fans who agree with Hall should turn in their temple recommends."

    Thank for your great example of a Utah version of a "holier than thou" attitude

    You have absolutely no credibility when it comes to lectures on hypocrisy.
    Your post pefectly explains why I dont have anything to do with the U even though I went there.

  • re: UtahRed | 1:10 p.m.
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:11 p.m.

    "Max Hall did not harm Utah football or its fans."

    I agree: Utah fans have done that on their own.

  • WHY??
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:12 p.m.

    Why do competitive Sports contests bring out
    the WORST of Human Behavior??

    This whole "Rivalry" secnario is really IMMATURE,
    and Embarrasing to "Sports" itself, the teams involved, the Nation, and the Church!!

    I wonder what the Lord thinks about all this??

    We CAN DO BETTER!!!

  • TO: Both Sides
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:15 p.m.

    "Those writing about Whittingham's wife and son's experience Saturday, check the police report--it all began with Whit's son grabbing a guy's blackberry because he was taking pictures of stunned Ute players, and throwing it in the stands."

    Whittingham's son should be arrested and so should his wife. Both of their actions were criminal and they should spend time in jail.

    It's no wonder that Kyle Whittingham isn't saying anything about this incident since he has probably talked to his lawyer and doesn't want his wife and son prosecuted or their victims to press charges.

    This is further proof that the entire Ute football program and their families including their children are all classless and it starts with Whittingham whose family are clearly sore losers who can't deal with BYU fans taking pictures.

    Maybe if mommy didn't come to the defense of her criminal son but let him get beat up for trying to destroy a persons blackberry than she wouldn't have been hit in the altercation between her loser son and his victims.

  • Rivalries are bad mmmkay
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:16 p.m.

    Hahaha, the self righteous are having a field day with this one.

  • Max
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:20 p.m.

    You would never make it in politics, you're too honest. Utah fans have been the bottom of the barrel for many years and Max said it right.

  • WHY??
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:21 p.m.

    Why do competitive sports contests bring out the WORST in Human Behavior??

    This whole "Rivalry" thing is so IMMATURE and Embarrasssing. It casts a Bad Light on "Sports"
    itself, the teams involved, the Nation, and the Church.

    I wonder that the Lord thinks about all this??

    We CAN DO BETTER!!!

  • Football Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:31 p.m.

    That was the worst sports article I've ever read. This is football not some hippy love fest. This writer needs to stick to writing about the latest recipes and leave the football articles to those that know sports.

  • Cougar Cowboy
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:39 p.m.

    Hall's comments were inappropriate and, as a BYU fan, I wish he had not uttered them.

    This entire episode, however, is blown out of context by a media that provoked the response by asking--post game--how Hall felt about the U. What a stupid question.

    I cheered Utah's win over Alabama last year and when they are not playing BYU, I like to see them win.

    The rivalry, however, is out of hand. I am an out-of-state BYU season ticket holder and last season attended my first BYU/Utah game at RES.

    With the exception of the U of A, we have never been treated so poorly. I will not attend another game at RES.

    To the extent fans from opposing teams have similarly been treated poorly at LES, is an absolutely inexcusable situation.

    It is a game, after all, and no one should ever be intimidated, insulted, or otherwise treated rudely when attending an away game.

  • Just Wondering...
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:39 p.m.

    I was just wondering how much the comments will cost Max financially.....

  • Lee White
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:40 p.m.

    Granted that Max Hall's comments were not well thought out......but let's give him a break! He's been subjected to tons of criticism, on and off the field, and he is, after all, a 'STUDENT ATHLETE'!

    Let him grow into his notoriety, and GROW UP yourselves, those who would throw him to the wolves just to alleviate their frustration at losing!!

    What would you think/feel/say if your family had been treated the way his was, by a deliberate act of rudeness in a deliberately rude crowd?!!!

  • Brian Griffin
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:46 p.m.

    This rivalry can be seen every Sunday night on Fox.... You know; Flanders v Homer.

  • Tair20
    Nov. 30, 2009 2:55 p.m.

    This article is absolute garbage. Trying to guilt Max on his opinions and trying to interpret his "hidden" meaning is like trying to make apple sauce from oranges. As I read the article, it became obvious you know nothing about men and the nature of competitive sports.

    Big surprise here - a BYU football player hates the University or Utah (and vice verse). Trash talk is a major part of this rivalry and he got plenty of it ever since last year's game. With a big win like this to help silence the critics and redeem last year's loss, I think he's entitled to a little trash talk himself.

    Get off your bogus high horse and write something worth reading...

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:00 p.m.

    re: BYU Fan | 8:43 p.m. Nov. 29, 2009

    //Football is just a game - its not a Civil War.//

    Football is NOT a holy war!

    Civil War? Think again and/or watch Thursday on ESPN

  • vaase
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:05 p.m.

    Nonesense miss donaldsen, Hall spoke what hereally felt,and if you donot agree with it that is your bone for to pick on,not Hall, He does not have to answer to anyone, or regret it, if you want it you cantake over the regretment rubbish. He knows better then what your trying to make out of it.

    Put a cap on it!

  • Utah man am I
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:08 p.m.

    How does someone have the police report to whitts wife getting punched? Why would any man punch a woman in the face and be able to get away with it in any sense it is not right. Who cares if it was a cell phone. Max Hall should of taken his win and be done with it he didnt need to keep going on why he hates the u of u, who cares its his mistakes and he should live with it. I wont accept is apology because it was ment to all utes not just some. Good luck Utes in your bowl game wherever it is.

  • Re: Brian
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:14 p.m.

    The bell doesn't ring until 2:50...keep teaching!!!

  • vaase
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:18 p.m.

    Am I reading the right deseret newes? THis is sure pious to one side(utah) But it don't matter, Y is great anyway uoy look at it.

  • Not fun anymore
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:21 p.m.

    The rivalry is not fun anymore. Both sides are at fault.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:29 p.m.

    Nice of Mr. Hall to speak up now that he is leaving and does not have to back it up next year!

  • to both sides
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:29 p.m.

    so you are telling me its okay to hit a woman? Do you have any respect at all?

  • Anderson
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:30 p.m.

    Great article Amy.....

    Max Hall opens his mouth to remove all doubt!

    Why he is talking like he just conquered goliath is a mystery to me......had BYU Lost? He would be the GOAT!

    Hall played a better game last year than this year.....he flat out stunk! So glad he is gone....just wish he would take Bronco with him! Lets get back to doing what BYU does best....winning football games and leaving it on the field.....in 10 years I am one BYU fan who will not be appreciating/missing Hall! Good riddance....

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:31 p.m.

    Thanks for showing us how to exude class Maxine.


    Regards,

    The Utes

  • Graduation
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:32 p.m.

    Maxipad will soon graduate as BYU's biggest loser b/c he knows not how to win.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:34 p.m.

    Even if the LDS church receives my tithing their college certainly doesn't represent my views!!!!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:38 p.m.

    I WILL SAY NOTING DEROGATORY IN THIS LISTING (NO I WON'T TELL THE TRUTH AGAIN). I JUST WANT THE READERS TO KNOW THAT THERE IS MORE TO THE STORY THAT YOU WON'T ALLOW TO PASS THROUGH. PLEASE LET THIS ONE THROUGH SO THEY CAN KNOW. WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO "THE TRUTH SHALL MAKE YOU FREE".

  • Reality Check
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:45 p.m.

    Defend Max. Defend Blount. Defend Michael Jordan at the Hall of Fame...I guess sportsmanship, respect, civility are traits of the past. I lost my job because I am Mormon, My car was vandalized because I'm a U fan. My 12 year old son was clubbed from behind at a football game because he was wearing the wrong color--knocked him out cold. Time to grow up.

  • Great Article
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:48 p.m.

    Great Job Amy. Could not have said it any better.

  • BeAccurate
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:52 p.m.

    You are a journalist. Please take pride in your occupation and paint an accurate picture of what was really said. I’m a BYU fan and I felt his comments were not appropriate, but Max Hall did not say he hates everything. He said he hates everything about Utah. [He has since apologized for being overly broad in that regard. Even if limited to a few, I agree with you that forgiving those few and moving on is a much better approach. The vast majority of the athletes, coaches and fans associated with Utah are very good people]. Unfortunately, you took the “hates everything” line out of context and ran with it. It became the premise for your whole article. You threw in a, “I hope it is not true” comment but then proceeded with your article based on the assumption it was true. No forgiveness on your part. No attempt to accurately portray, not just what was said (you didn’t even get that right, as you quoted only the part that supported your premise), but the intent. I would hope you could show the level of maturity that Max Hall did by apologizing for your mistakes also.

  • Captain Obvious
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:54 p.m.

    re: Thanks Amy | 8:34 p.m. Nov. 29, 2009

    "By the way, where did you get your Psychology degree?"

    BYU.

  • Ernest T. Bass
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:57 p.m.

    I don't care what any of you think. Max Hall is still so righteous, so awesome and yet, so humble.

  • Terrible Article
    Nov. 30, 2009 3:59 p.m.

    Very judgmental article. The author certainly doesn't like Hall and has taken the opportunity to voice her disdain of him. I think it is psychological projection on her part. Although, as he said in his apology his displeasure should not have been directed at the entire university, he is justified in criticizing the fans.

    I will not attend another football or basketball game at the U. I have ALWAYS had vulgar comments, obscene gestures, bigoted remarks about my religion and even food or drink thrown at me. We even had a guy moon us on the way out of RES on one occasion. So the U does need to do something about the boorish behavior. It is atrocious.

  • MWC Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:05 p.m.

    Great article! It's hilarious that most human beings are embarrassed for what Max Hall said. It's always quite funny that the die hard BYU fans feel that they have to back him up. I loved your article, and no matter what others say, you really do have a great perspective on the rivalry. Thanks for writing the only uplifting thing this rivalry has seen so far.

  • Nikki Davis
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:10 p.m.

    I am sure that Max Hall did not mean what he said about Utah fans. Oh wait 99% of the time you mean what you said but you are scared of the backlash so you put out a nice little piece that says I am sorry for what I said eventhough you are not sorry at all. So no I do not beleive that he is sorry and I don't think that just because he is a senior in college that he is allowed to say that and get away with that. I mean don't get me wrong he is allowed to say what he wants but if you are going to call out all Utah fans that is a lot of people that did nothing wrong but I get it. There are many a families in Utah that hate BYU and families that hate Utah. That is just how you grow up in Utah you either Like BYU or Utah there is no middle and you can't like both teams. For example my family is a Utah family have been and always will be. So I hope hall has learned his lesson but I doubt it

  • Ute fan in Virginia
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:12 p.m.

    Did we all not hear about what happend to coach Wittingham's wife? A split lip from a BYU fan and I think that Coach handled it like Hall should have NO COMMENT

  • Marc
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:13 p.m.

    Give me a break. What a maudlin, gooshy article. There has alwyas been hatred between the two schools. Why does this surprise people. Most of the athletes involved would say the same things (without the cameras beeing there of course).

  • Instead of
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:17 p.m.

    Instead of focusing on Max's comments why don't you address the bigger underlying issue ? The root cause is the behavior of crass ... yes, classless ... Ute fans to opposing fans in RES and in other public places. Until Utah's admin addresses this huge problem and/or Utah's fans start policing their own fans, it will continue to be a problem. The University of Utah should stop turning a blind eye to the classless actions by some of their fans. If they're not willing to work on a solution, they are guilty by association.

  • UtahRed
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:20 p.m.

    To those who responded to me, it is the guilty who feel the most mistreated. Many BYU fans are at the same classless level, but of course you can't admit it. Like everyone else in Happy Valley, keep your blinders on and keep hating those who don't agree with your myopic, pathetic vision. Of course your ilk always has to blame someone else because you can't face your own misdeeds. Maybe the school down south should change its name to AHU (Always Hypocritical U-know).

  • Where's my comment?
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:25 p.m.

    Am I getting censored here? My comment is not here, hopefully someone just fell asleep at the button, but I would appreciate my comments being let through.

  • Dave E.
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:26 p.m.

    HYPOCRISY? How is this article or the the complaining individuals any different than Max? They make offensive and critical remarks because they were offended or insulted by Max's actions. First cast out the beam of thine own eye . . .

  • Debilitating
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:27 p.m.

    Yes, your oversensitivity is debilitating.

  • nope
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:46 p.m.

    i don't believe the story about the beer. not at all, not one bit. i won't believe that the "beer incident" happened until i see proof. what happened was max hall realized he said something stupid, so he used his next comment to back pedal and to try to justify the "i hate utah" words. too bad that maxi isn't good enough to be remembered as a great QB, so now all he will be remembered for is that he couldn't keep his mouth shut.

  • Captain America
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:53 p.m.

    A word to the wise: If you are a wife or a mother of a BYU player just stay away from RE stadium. That's right just don't go!! If you can't tolerate a little personally directed profanity against you and your family along with being doused with some harmless beer then by all means stay home. I mean good grief what do you expect? After all you are playing at the U!!!!!

  • YMTerraceDoc
    Nov. 30, 2009 4:58 p.m.

    If you don't have the fire in your gut you shouldn't be competing in any sport, especially football. Stop the critical analysis of Max, he is an excellent competitor. My experience while at the U of Utah saw rampant critism of BYU that was sometimes demeaning, but mostly fun and motivating. Especially, when the U held BYU for 4 downs on the 1 yard line. Now, while at BYU someones opinion is considered bad taste and horribly, career ending. Get off the righteous wagon and face the reality of life! Whenever you achieve beyond the ordinary, recieve awards, or accomplish greatness, there will always be those who want to bring you down to their mediocrity, when in reality they should be supportive.

  • Poor Maxie
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:08 p.m.

    Poor guy thought his family was mistreated after last year's game, just think of what the future holds. The dude will go down as the most disrespected zoobie ever. Anyone down for a road trip to Arizona?

  • self-betrayal ???
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:17 p.m.

    what in the wide world of sports is self-betrayal and what does that have to do with football? Perhaps Amy is writing a paper for her grad degree in psychology? Self-betrayal sounds like the title of some juicy romance novel. Pretty funny stuff. GO MAX!!!!!

  • I was there last year...
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:17 p.m.

    I was at the 2008 game in RES and I saw Hall's family, cause I was walking out behind them, get assaulted. In fact, I saw two incidents of abuse (and heard probably a dozen abusive insults) from people wearing Utah gear directed towards a small group of people wearing BYU gear. The insults were laced with the 'f' word and were ridiculing the LDS Church, temples and Joseph Smith.

  • LCSW
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:33 p.m.

    And Amy your licensed to practice therapy where???? Pain, self betrayal, etc. etc.... Stop with the psychobabble. He's a young, testosterone driven athlete (see NFL) who said a dumb thing in the heat of the moment. Probably REALLY dislikes the UofU. So what, I'm a Husker fan and back in the day, I HATED OU. It's a bit immature, even childish, but it's the human thing to dislike your opponent and even more human to say stupid things from time to time. Please stick to whatever it is you do and leave the therapy to the experts!

  • Attended Y, U Grad--Fan of both
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:40 p.m.

    Great article. Totally agree. Max has apologized (although it could have been a little more contrite). So lets move on. People can make mistakes in things they say, and "to forgive is divine". I'm sure that the haters won't want to let this one go though. We give the haters too much of the publicity, in my opinion.

    As a Ute fan, I must say that I'm ashamed of how some U fans behave. Your coaching staffs, teams, and student body are heavily LDS (as is the univesity president). You insult them when you pour beer on, verbally abuse, and mock the religion of LDS visitors. No matter how much you want this rivalry to define your hatred of Mormons--it makes no sense. So clean up your act!

    As a BYU fan, I'm ashamed that some of the Y fans behave stupidly too. You should know better than to assume that U fans are all represented by the actions of a few. You should know better than to hate other people because of what team they associate with, or even to hate those who spitefully abuse you. Try living up to your own ideals!

  • Thanks!
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:49 p.m.

    Thanks for a great article.

  • RD
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:51 p.m.

    This is one of the best articles I've read on the subject. Very informative and summarized my feelings very well. This was a very unfortunate incident after a wonderfully entertaining game.

  • AB
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:54 p.m.

    This author should be ashamed. She misquotes, omits, distorts, infers, presumes, judges, and condemns. The condescending pretense is disgusting and depressing.

    And she never seriously addresses the source of Hall's antipathy. "Perceived enemies" she calls them. Insulting. What about his mother and wife and family. In her compassion and wisdom, she fails to mention them. Oh wait, she called their abuse an "unpleasant experience." Incredible.

    Max hates those who physically and verbally abused his family, he hates those who allowed it to happen. Good for him.

    Thanks Max, for defending your family and religion from the modern-day mob.

    And for beating the Utes...again. 2-1. Good luck in the bowl game!!!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 5:57 p.m.

    I was a season ticket holder at the U until I was transferred out of state. While I have seen some less than good behavior from some isolated fans, I never saw it to the degree that byu fans claim. For some reason it seems that every byu fan has a friend or family member that was abused at RES. Knowing how people exaggerate as well as repeat another person's story as their own, I don't believe the stories. Also having grown up in Utah and visiting Provo as well as dating some byu students, I can say from first hand experience, that byu has it's own dirty laundry.

    Note to byu fans, as soon as you can completely clean up your fans and double standard living students, feel free to say all you want about the U. Until then stop being hypocrites. Btw, the U does not represent The Church, so no need to respond about U fan hierocracy.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:00 p.m.

    hypocrisy not hierocracy

  • Futbol
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:01 p.m.

    Ole, Ole, Ole, Ole Real Salt Lake... Come on guys, remember last week when BYU fans and Ute fans celebrated in the arms of each other as RSL won the championship? Leave behind the ugly American step sister with its backbiting and hatred and join in the love of the beautiful game! Futbol!

  • PLEASE Post This!!!!!
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:02 p.m.

    For all you morons (and I doubt now that the DesNews posting police will post my comment but I'll say it anyway), let me say that again, the moronic, utter buffoons ripping BYU's Max Hall to shreds, allow me the opportunity to say that your hypocrisy stinks to high heaven!

    The guy had been harassed, ridiculed, verbally abused and generally treated like garbage by both Utah AND (fair-weather) BYU "fans" alike and he doesn’t say ANYTHING about it in public for one whole year and then in the heat of the moment, after an emotional win, he says less than, what?, 50 words saying he "hates" Utah and everything about them, with NOT ONE SINGLE WORD BEING IN AND OF ITSELF, CRUDE OR VULGAR, and you guys proceed to rip him to shreds again with ABSOLUTELY Z-E-R-O SERIOUS CRITICISM OF THE IDIOTS WHO TREATED HIM LIKE GARBAGE.

    You have ALL made mistakes, and MANY of them MORE serious than a few minor words slipping, and you are in NO position to criticize Max.

    WHAT A P-A-T-H-E-T-I-C LEVEL OF CHARACTER AND MORALITY YOU ALL POSSESS!

    Dan Maloy



  • Observer
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:03 p.m.

    Rivalry is great but it unfortunatly brings out strong emotions as all of the forgoing comments display. I am sure that Max Hall is not the only cougar player who have strong feelings. Or many or most of the Utah players. Youth have strong emotions and exhibt them readily. Maturity will temper them on both sides.

  • Mike
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:24 p.m.

    I think this type of article is valuable in that each one of us have the opportunity to read it and ask ourselves how does this apply to me. Sure, give the kid a break, he made a mistake but shouldn't we and Max learn something from this situation about guarding our thoughts and allowing anger and frustration to consume us. Be careful not to excuse the lesson in your zeal to excuse the behaviour. Otherwise neither of you will be better off tomorrow.

  • WHATS REALLY SAD
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:25 p.m.

    Why the Utah LDS fans are so up in arms ! Being a cougar fan and experincing myself a game at RE STAD. How can you sit back and let your church be so ridiculed ? I took 3 hours of persecution ! Plus the ride home. Not one UTE fan came to my defense. Please dont deny its a hostile environment ! Are you ashamed of your religion ? I can handle hecheling. BUT no one should have to endure this ! MAYBE you should start asking your own fans to cool it ! MAX was wrong in what he said, but I totally understand his feelings !

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:39 p.m.

    all ye who are sinless.. let him cast the first stone.

  • ute
    Nov. 30, 2009 6:53 p.m.

    Thank goodness it's over, now the irrelevant Maxi Hall can just go away. Arrogant, untalented, Max can fade into oblivion. By the way Max, Kyle Whittingham's wife and daughter were attacked by BYU fans at the game. Guess that means your fans have no class and coach Whit should hate everything about your program. Except he has something you don't class.

  • RE: DAn Maloy
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:08 p.m.

    In a press conference more than an H-O-U-R after the game is not "the heat of the moment."

    M-A-X cemented his legacy that is for S-U-R-E. He is a J-O-C-K in every stereotypic sense of the word.

    And, by-the-way, You don't need (fair-weather) in parenthesis...just say byu fans and we'll all u-n-d-e-r-s-t-a-n-d!!!!

  • Rodney King
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:13 p.m.

    Why can't we all just get along? Lets put this silly game behind us and together recognize a true champion, Donny Osmond, winner of Dancing with the Stars. Did Donny whine about the poor treatment Marie received the year before,no! He sucked it up and went out and danced his way into history.

  • Stunned
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:19 p.m.

    Based on most Ute fan comments above, I would have to say Max was wrong, the Ute fans are not only classless but also whiners and cry babies.

    Most Ute fan comments can be summarized as: I REALLY care what Max thinks and says about Utah and their fans and he said something mean that I didn't like so he should be punished, reprimanded, sidelined, etc. Wah, Wah, Wah.

    You lost this year so get over it and move on.

  • It Will Only Get Worse
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:27 p.m.

    In the past the two teams were generally unevenly matched when they played. Now we have two good coaches that will have good teams and the games will often count for more than just bragging rights. Trash talk doesn't bother me especially but physical acts such as punching, shoving, throwing drinks, etc. has got to STOP.

    I believe both schools need to get a handle on it immediately otherwise it will get way out of hand and a wonderful rivalry will become dangerous.

  • John
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:29 p.m.

    An excellent and timely sermon.

  • Brian
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:31 p.m.

    This all could be a great lead in for a bowl game rematch!

  • Thanks...
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:34 p.m.

    For adding fuel to the fire. The media in general is evil, sometime classless infact below classless.

  • Person
    Nov. 30, 2009 7:53 p.m.

    What a great article, I love you on X96 Amy!
    This is a well written article, with wonderful voice. This is real journalism to me!

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:20 p.m.

    Wow!! I'm amazed at the readers who are belittling this excellent article. They must be part of the problem.

    It's too bad that sportsmanship has sunk to such a low level that some fans can't even recognize the truth when they see it. Rivalries don't give anyone license to forget their principles. Sports isn't immune from human decency.

  • AC
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:51 p.m.

    Excellent, you said exactly what I was feeling about this incident. Max Hall didn't say those things in the "heat of the moment" as some have suggested. They had been brewing inside of him for a full year, and he meant every word he said.

    I think Max will learn from this and become better as a result. We all falter at times, and therefore need to give Max a break as well.

  • daveinoc
    Nov. 30, 2009 9:53 p.m.

    The only thing worse than a sore loser is a sore winner. Nevertheless, the Rivalry is stronger than ever - just too bad Max couldn't be a gracious victor.

  • Tide Fan
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:02 p.m.

    What an AWESOME article. All his comments did, was prove how immature and unprofessional Max Hall is. He is obviously not ready for the Pros, as I have NEVER heard a QB after WINNING a game say they hate everything about the opposing team. Just goes to show little Max has much more to learn. Maybe he should stay in college a little longer.

  • Get Ree-al?
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:03 p.m.

    re: Futbol | 6:01 p.m. Nov. 30, 2009

    Bad example. Soccer is filled w/ hooligans (in the stands) & drama queens (on the field).

    Comparing Soccer to Football is like comparing a Hurricane to a rainstorm.

  • cks1450
    Nov. 30, 2009 10:25 p.m.

    Utah is the only place this article would ever get published in a newspaper.

  • Anonymous
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:15 p.m.

    Max tells the truth. Many Utah fans are classless. I have actually met some who have real class, but been exposed to many more who have none. I have tried to document some of my experiences on this site but have not been allowed, but I have had experiences far worse than his. I'm glad someone had the nerve to tell the truth. It was refreshing to find someone who dared to NOT be politically correct.

  • Seriously?
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:24 p.m.

    Amy, I'm afraid that when you say, "I don't know Max Hall" then proceed to diagnose Max's "self-portrayal", as though its fact, you discredit your entire claim. I love, by the way, how you reduced Max's experience last year at RES to just; beer being thrown on his family. As a journalist, you should know that other reports indicate that the beer incident was a small fraction of what happened to his family that night. I think Max should have turned the other cheek but I'm not going to crucify him for what he said. I'm also not going to give him a psychological evaluation. I wonder why when Scalley in 2004 said, "I hate those pricks with a passion, I have ever since I was born," isn't scrutinized. First of all if we take everything people say literally we should really get Scalley tested, after all he remembers his hateful feelings for the Cougars from day one of his existance. Everyone needs to take responsibility for their behavior. How come we haven't heard the University of Utah taking actions toward preventing future incidents?

  • AMY
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:34 p.m.

    You rock!!! you get it, ignore the ignorants who critizize your article, they don't get it, never will. Just because you are a woman does not mean you don't know football. Keep writing. I love it as did many others. Loved the quotes!!!
    "People do not seem to realize that their opinion of the world is also a confession of character" Ralph Waldo Emerson.
    " When we judge or critizize another person it says nothing about that person; it merely says something about our own need to be critical" Anon

  • RE: AMY 11:34 p.m.
    Nov. 30, 2009 11:45 p.m.

    quotes were good: Article was dumb and unnecessary.

  • joe cougar
    Dec. 1, 2009 12:07 a.m.

    As a former cougar player, I was saddened, disappointed, and embarrassed by Max Hall's comments. Coach Edwards always told us that football is a great teacher of life's lessons. When standing on the victor's podium, a true champion should show respect for his opponent and act like he's been there before.

  • Max is a smart kid
    Dec. 1, 2009 12:08 a.m.

    He had a moment of weakness where his troubles surfaced. Getting screamed at on a freeway is a long way from having those you love being the target of vile language and thoughts and vocalizations.

    Max, the human and not the football player, will learn from this. Many of us can as well but these comments make me think many are determined not to.

  • Good Article
    Dec. 1, 2009 4:26 a.m.

    Excellent article, very incitful. However, I can see some people just don't get it. This really affects all of us if we let anger get the best of us, and that applies to all of us a sometime. Most of the time anger is a reaction to something someone else does and that means we let someone else control our actions. It never makes you feel better, usually worse. It destroys friendships, peace in our homes, our reputation and so on. I guess some don't care about the reputation they get or the animosity they create.

  • Re: Re: Amy(bluedart)
    Dec. 1, 2009 6:22 a.m.

    I'm all for heckling the writers, but she didn't do anything wrong. Go back to your Y-huddle with "... Your Mom!"

  • nottyou
    Dec. 1, 2009 7:40 a.m.

    Old Joe Smith and Max Hall had a lot in common: "...and while they were persecuting me, reviling me, and speaking all manner of evil against me falsely for so saying, I was led to say in my heart: Why persecute me for telling the truth?" Joe and Max couldn't help but express what they felt to be the truth.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 8:33 a.m.

    WHO knew you could get beer into Rice Eccles stadium but not water or food! I've been to countless games there watching a family member play and, even in the player family ticket line, I wasn't allowed to bring water in a baby bottle for my child! But I have been to UNLV, Wyoming and some non-conference games where alcohol is served at the stadium, and oh my goodness, even got some thrown on us by some Wyoming fans. But you know what? I got over it! I hope Max's family never had to sit by any of those "classless" drink consumers! I love these post-game comments - it makes the Utah loss so much easier to take. Collie did it for is in 2007, and now this. Great job Max!

  • Thank you, Amy.
    Dec. 1, 2009 8:35 a.m.

    Excellent comments on the situation and on anger. Thanks for the reminders and encouragement. BYU '82

  • Yet, Another Quote!
    Dec. 1, 2009 8:47 a.m.

    "Nice girl, but about as sharp as a sack of wet mice."
    – Foghorn Leghorn

    Max Hall made it personal (period). Dissecting and psycho analyzing him as if he is defective is over the top.

    You lost. Get over it. And look in the mirror.

  • CALLING
    Dec. 1, 2009 8:49 a.m.

    CALLING everyone who is PERFECT...please STAND UP! Weird...nobody is moving. what a joke.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 9:14 a.m.

    Excellent article. You must be an Arbinger fan. Well done and insightful. We can all examine our hearts and benefit!

  • DUSTY
    Dec. 1, 2009 9:27 a.m.

    Give Max a break. He knows he's not going pro. This is as good as it gets for him. Let him say say what he wants, after all, we didn't walk in his shoes. I believe the bible says people can be as angry as they want and say whatever they want because we haven't walked in his shoes. Wait...is that right? Hmmmm.

  • Ute Fan
    Dec. 1, 2009 10:00 a.m.

    Unfortunately us Ute fans have had to put up with some really embarrassing fan debacles over the years. I agree that many Ute fans need to clean up their act and remember this is just a game. The bantering and elbow rubbing is really fun, but seriously? throwing beer on a players family, booing and jeering visiting team fans when we are up 30+ points, throwing someone's phone onto the field? Grow up, there is more than football in life. I know a lot of U fans and Y fans. We have always joked around with each other and cheered for our respective teams. Lets just keep it at that.

  • Re: Dan Maloy
    Dec. 1, 2009 10:29 a.m.

    Wow...it sounds like you are pretty worked up about this. You call everyone else a hypocrit but yourself, who is getting mad about what people are saying...who have gotten mad about what Max Hall said. hehehehe. Listen, a small sliver of Ute fans need to clean up their act, a small sliver of Y fans need to clean up their act. It's a great rivalry, lets not turn it into some life or death game

  • co
    Dec. 1, 2009 10:33 a.m.

    The media got just what they wanted -- a story to drag on and on. Who ever named BYU vs Utah a "Holy War" anyway? PK -- of the radio show -- admits he "egged" Max Hall on in the interview. The media, long ago, carefully crafted this so-called "hatred" between the two schools and have carefully nurtured and cultivated the hatred until it has excalated to all this nonsense.
    By the way ... to the person above who doesn't believe the beer throwing ... seriously? Have you ever attended a game at an opposing teams stadium in this conference? Wyoming fans throw fruit and poor beer on the basketball players in "their" place.
    It all needs to be stopped. It's a GAME. It's not a war. It should never be made so personal against a player or their family. It should all be determined on the field of play. Let the anger, hatred, and abuse go and enjoy the sport.

  • Is it worth it?????
    Dec. 1, 2009 10:34 a.m.

    This football game seems to be fueling alot of hate on both sides and at some point you have to ask if it is really worth it. The Y and U are good schools with good degree programs full of LDS and non LDS kids that seem to get along just fine. So what gives? Something has to give otherwise next year you might have an out right brawl in the parking lot with injuries or worse. Responsible coaches , athletic directors and even school presidents had been take hold of this thing before something really bad happens that everyone will regret.

  • TheHailstorm
    Dec. 1, 2009 11:36 a.m.

    Mighty high price to pay , win the game lose your character and respect, No draft, no respect won the game , lost the war. Good work Max , just the kind of person we knew you were, strong arm week, puny person.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 11:54 a.m.

    I have wasted far too much time on this article. None of the comments make an ounce of difference. The hatred and animosity will continue and BYU fans will continue to be accused of being "holier than thou" when in truth all they would like it to interact with others who are somewhat civil. Let's all get back to doing something constructive. You have had your great diversion so you didn't have to dwell on the loss.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 11:57 a.m.

    Re: Hailstorm
    Typical personal insult from a truly "puny person". You are just the kind of "fan" that provoked his justified anger.

  • Little Jimmy Brady
    Dec. 1, 2009 12:18 p.m.

    Max, cheer up! Remember, the highlight of your career was beating Utah on Saturday, November 28th 2009.



    Hey…lay off Hall will you? He was upset because he is like the only senior QB in BYU history to NOT win the conference championship. Have fun not playing on Sundays Hall.

    Thanks to the writers of both comments, I fully agree!

  • ...
    Dec. 1, 2009 1:46 p.m.

    Nephi 16:2
    ...wherefore, the guilty taketh the truth to be hard, for it cutteth them to the very center.

    Fact is Halls screwed up. If what he said wasn't supposed to be said there would be no rules against it in the MWC handbook?

  • Me, Myself and I
    Dec. 1, 2009 1:57 p.m.

    In response to all you who think what Max hall did a year after the alleged attack on his family was protecting or standing up for them get real. You don't wait a full year then run your gums and call it defense or protection. The bottom line is a so called "real man" would have taken care of it through proper means and moved on. Not keep it secret for a year and let it eat at him and fester into the rant we witnessed last Saturday. No one should be treated like his family was supposedly treated. I do know firsthand that these acts of low life fans are not limited to one side of the stadium. I've been verbally assaulted, threatened etc by BYU fans at LES for cheering for USC a few years back. I wasn't being loud or making a scene just cheering after a good play etc. If I wasn't 6'5 285lbs they probably would have dumped their drinks on me too. The bottom line is there are trashy fans no matter who your team is. They along with players who have no self control embarrass us all.

  • Well done
    Dec. 1, 2009 1:58 p.m.

    While a BYU fan I appreciated this article. It reminded me of a talk given by Presedent Thomas S. Monson this past October conference. The title of his talk was school thy feelings. I think you hit the nail on the head

  • Haley
    Dec. 1, 2009 2:25 p.m.

    Amazing article! Way to put things into words!

  • BYU fan
    Dec. 1, 2009 2:35 p.m.

    This article was about anger, not so much about BYU vs. UofU (she used Hall's story as an example of how anger affects people and situations). I thought it was well written and wonder if many of those that commented caught onto that fact.

  • TheHailstorm
    Dec. 1, 2009 3:00 p.m.

    JUST READ IN THE LAS VEGAS SUN WHERE VEGAS DOES NOT WANT BYU OR ANYTHING TO DO WITH THEM. GUESS REPUTATION AND BAD SPORTSMAN LIKE CONDUCT,NEWS TRAVELS FAST. AS THE REPUTATION OF LOSERS GROW, THE VEGAS BOWL DOES NOT LIKE BYU IN TOWN AT ALL AND DOESN'T WANT THEM IN TOWN !
    IMAGINE THAT ?

  • Re: Hailstorm
    Dec. 1, 2009 3:32 p.m.

    Looked in the las vegas sun...

    Couldn't find anything close to what you were talking about!

  • wait sports or philosophy?
    Dec. 1, 2009 3:57 p.m.

    i cant decifer this as a rising gospel or simply a sports article. WHoever commented on this first very good comments! whoever wrote this of all people since you no every philosophy in the book should no people get carried away when there mad. 2nd thing max hal had the decency to not embarrass ute fans and say what else happende to his family. Ute fans bought a sex doll and wrote max hall's mom on it and sat by her during the game and pretended to have sex with it. That i thinik is a lot more serious of an issue than a mad qb carried away in the moment of anger so go write a report about what ute fans should REALLY be proud about.

  • Why?
    Dec. 1, 2009 4:18 p.m.

    Article unnecessary. Mrs. Donaldson, do you have all the facts of his family's experience at RES? It doesn't sound like you do. Your story was directed towards Max Hall but he didn't need to hear it and I'm sure he doesn't read all of the hoopla on newspaper websites like the rest of us. He apologized period. End of discussion. Get over it. It was a preachy article that we ought to learn in Sunday school. Are Sunday School lessons now coming to the DesNews Sports Section? Amy is a very good writer but this article was over the top even if some of her insights are correct. How about those blow up dolls with his mother and wife's name on them last year at RES?! Yeah, I guess you didn't know all the details now, did you.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 4:31 p.m.

    hall had lots of charcter not telling the sex doll story, so even theough he got carried away he had the decency to not humiliate every ute fan in the world and say he did he would have ute fans would still have something to complain about. i think max was correct and agree ute fans get to carried away but so did he on a lesser scale. email me if u have strong opinnion that oppose mine i want to know what people with others think with my comments.

  • Well said!
    Dec. 1, 2009 4:44 p.m.

    Great column. Max Hall managed to win the game and lose the "war."

  • Sanctimonious, Amy?
    Dec. 1, 2009 6:59 p.m.

    I completely scorn the falsifying, the sanctimonious, the cheap and the shoddy.
    –Ralph Thomas Walker

  • BYU Fan, but...
    Dec. 1, 2009 8:00 p.m.

    ...not proud of Max Hall's comments. In his classless and hateful comments, he undid what BYU tries to teach through their program. Honor? Where is the honor in his hatred? Heat of the moment or not, those words would not have come out of his mouth were they not in his heart. He should learn to change his attitude so those thoughts are not even a part of him.

    On the other hand, I appreciate the many classy players on the team who played competitively, to win, but who still showed respect to the other players. THAT is what I think the BYU goal should be.

  • Anonymous
    Dec. 1, 2009 9:50 p.m.

    I don't know why I waste my time reading these articles. I am contributing to the ridiculous charade this whole thing has become.
    The entire experience can be summed up as follows:
    In the heat of competition, a competitive and good individual made some unchecked comments.
    That's it. Let it go. It was not that big of a deal, and certainly does not deserve a discussion on ethics and ideology.
    The somber tone this article assumes would seem to suggest that Hall were guilty of unthinkable hate crimes.

  • Amy get real!
    Dec. 1, 2009 9:53 p.m.

    Come on is this really earth shattering news that a player admitted he hates his rival? especially given the fact that his family has been continually assaulted by the classless ute fans. Okay so maybe he shouldn't of called out the entire university, but he has apoligized for that. So why the need to write a garbage article about it just to get your ratings up? Fact is atleast 90 percent of the players on both sides of the rivary probably feel the same way as Max does, they just aren't willing to come out and say it. So get over it already and stop making this out to be bigger then it really is!

  • Stained forever
    Dec. 1, 2009 10:30 p.m.

    Sad that a victory can be so empty. That one person can minimize a successful season and game to a self centered comment is dissapointing in the least. This one will be remembered not as an overtime victory, but the Max Hall shoots his mouth off game. The sour grapes game. The one that got away game. The chance to put frosting on the cake game, but ended up with mud on his face. The mud can be washed off, but will the words be chizzeled in the wall of shame at LES stadium forever? Max had the hammer and the chizzel in his hand and immortalized his name in UTAH/byu history. Can he ever cover up the shame that he worked so hard to put up on the wall?

  • Thanks Max!!
    Dec. 2, 2009 12:12 a.m.

    As a BSU fan I have seen first hand what the Ute fans are all about. When I went to the game at RES in 06 I had to deal with the annoying ute fans. They were very rude and obnoxious to me and my family they even said horrible things towards my 2 year old son that was wearing a Bronco jersey. That is until they all left the stadium by halftime because the Broncos were blowing them away.

    Truth is ive been to many different stadiums around the country and have dealt with many different fans and I have to say by far that Yewte fans are the most annoying, rude fans I have ever been around in my life. Utah does deserve to loose every game they play no matter the oppenet.

  • One who's heard enough
    Dec. 2, 2009 1:20 a.m.

    Enough. It doesn't matter anymore. Stuff your pithy quotes self-aggrandizing moral lessons back up your sleeves and move on.

    Here's a quote for you:

    "The wise speak only of what they know...A witless worm have you become. Therefore be silent, and keep our forked tongue behind your teeth."

  • let me get this straight
    Dec. 2, 2009 8:46 a.m.

    The D News pumps this all up by using inflamatory terms such as "holy war " and wont let it go when a kid (who was legitmaely wronged) apologizes (for an overstatement) - then the a writer has the gall to lecture us on tolerance and confronting hate (while other D News writers continue to keep it alive).

    I get the picture.

    Did you sell another paper?

  • Out of Context
    Dec. 2, 2009 9:18 a.m.

    Your article is beautifully written, but out of context. In watching the interview I did not feel the "hatred" you are describing. I saw a young man who still carried feelings of resentment for what had happened to this mother and family and who used a poor choice of words, and a degree of immaturity, in describing that feeling in the setting presented. If your mother is verbally and emotionally attacked in an obscene manner, you are not going to like that person, nor will you respect them, or the institution that, in your mind, seemingly freely allows that kind type of expression. Unfortunately, our “communication society” has become a laboratory of analysis exacerbating unguarded natural expressions into the oblivion nonsense that easily becomes overbearing.

  • RE: Thanks Max!!
    Dec. 2, 2009 9:59 a.m.

    Thank you as well, I have had the same experience!! I have also been to a lot of BYU games and sat with all kinds of fans from other teams but the worst experience I have EVER had at a football game was a BYU/Utah game and being threatened by their fans.

  • Drama Queen
    Dec. 2, 2009 10:16 a.m.

    Stained forever | 10:30 p.m. Dec. 1, 2009
    "The mud can be washed off, but will the words be chizzeled in the wall of shame at LES stadium forever? Max had the hammer and the chizzel in his hand and immortalized his name in UTAH/byu history. Can he ever cover up the shame that he worked so hard to put up on the wall? "


    Wow can you possibly be any more melodramatic?

    I suspect Max's comments will only be remembered when, once again, U fans at RES prove him correct in his evaluation.

  • re: Yet, Another Quote! | 8:47 a
    Dec. 2, 2009 10:28 a.m.


    "Nice girl, but about as sharp as a sack of wet mice."
    — Foghorn Leghorn


    Thanks That was absolutley the best/funniest thing to come out of this whole melodrama

  • Go Max.
    Dec. 2, 2009 11:28 a.m.

    I am glad that Max Hall stood up for himself. I didn't like the context, but the fact that Max was not afraid to show his true emotions brings out the human element of sports. People need to realize that these athletes are not machines but are humans beings with family, feelings, emotions, and pride. Karl Malone was another person who I admired for speaking his mind, even if I did not agree with him. If you are not willing to say something to someones face, then don't say it behind their back, or on a message board. Most of all, leave their families out of it.

  • Former Y Fan
    Dec. 2, 2009 1:12 p.m.

    Is this not the Lord's University? Did he not preach a gospel of LOVE?????? Very disappointing to hear such expressions of hate. If we are persecuted, should we not turn the other cheek? What is even more upsetting is the F-bomb that Max (who should be a representative of the only true University) dropped on national television for the whole world to see. NO mistake about it. One could definitely read his lips. Shame, shame on you Max, don't you know you "could" be a hero to the younger people. So much for that.......

  • Angela Dumke
    Dec. 2, 2009 2:37 p.m.

    Thank you Amy. I think we can all learn from Max Hall. I believe we have all been guilty of losing it at times. He unfortunately did it in front of the press. Thank you for expressing the problem so eloquently.

  • Hypocritical?
    Dec. 2, 2009 6:29 p.m.

    Is it just me or does it seem a little hypocritical of Ute fans to jump all over Hall for holding a grudge?

  • Me
    Dec. 3, 2009 6:36 a.m.

    This article is a little OVER THE TOP. Get over it Amy

  • Lessons to be learned
    Dec. 3, 2009 11:46 a.m.

    Max might not have uttered those words if he had just rembered:
    Did we give up when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor- John Blutarski
    What is best in life is to crush your enemy, drive them before you, and hear the lamentations of their women-Conan

  • re: Former Y Fan | 1:12 p.m.
    Dec. 3, 2009 12:28 p.m.

    "Is this not the Lord's University? Did he not preach a gospel of LOVE?????? Very disappointing to hear such expressions of hate. If we are persecuted, should we not turn the other cheek?"

    Oh please
    It is a football game not church.
    At what point does turning the other cheek turn into an masochistic excercise of self loathing. The "Jesus was crucified therfore if everyone hates me I must be perfect" attitude of many Mormons is far more offensive than the heartfelt anger of a young man angry over the abuse of his family. I relate to the latter far better than I do the former. I like Max.

  • Alex Smith hates BYU
    Dec. 4, 2009 9:48 a.m.

    Get over it people! Max Hall said some stupid things in the heat of the moment AND THEN APOLOGIZED FOR IT! This article is WAAYYY overdone! Did all you Utes fans (you know, the ones condemning Max and teaching him about forgiveness--which you should practice what you preach) know that ALEX SMITH, in 2004, said he "hated BYU" and then made religious references as well???!!!! GET OVER IT PEOPLE... so some of the BYU community doesn't like the UTAH community and vice versa--what's the big surprise?? C'mon, this is so LAME! Did any of you watch the UCLA @ USC football game this year?? Near the end of the game there looked to be a brawl on the field--a serious one... but I'm sure they all just wanted to say how much they loved the other team... uh huh, right. When Utah beat BYU in OT in Provo in '05 we had a row of Utes that were indeed classless and even chest-bumping my family though we stood they in shock at the loss... trust me there are classless fans on both sides!

  • Ute transplant
    Dec. 4, 2009 11:11 p.m.

    Seriously, the heat of what moment? "The heat of the moment" refers to an angry moment and for Max Hall, that should have been a year ago (if beer-gate can be verified). The "moment" Max Hall was in should have been extreme satisfaction. Let's set this up, 1. His last game against the Utes, 2. a win in overtime, 3. at home, 4. fans storming the field cheering for him and he does what with that situation? I think he revealed a really bad character flaw in making his comments. You protect this house on more than just 3rd down, Max. You protect this house by your actions on and off the field and I'm sorry but the bar is higher for a private church run institution and it should be. Hall should focus on the positive or he is always going to feel this way about someone or something. That's no way to go through life. In life there is winning and there is beating someone, one is positive, one is negative. Hopefully, Hall will focus on his wins now that his fb days are done, but I have serious reservations he will.