I bleed blue through and through. I suffered miserably on Saturday when we were
destroyed by Utah. I experience the highest highs when we win; hate to read the
sports section on Sunday when we lose. Whereas I used to have a miserable week
after a loss I've matured over the years and am now semi-functional and have a
cheerful disposition by mid week. That being said...If
BYU gets an offer to join the BigXII and the powers that be at the Y turn it
down...I may kiss BYU athletics goodbye forever.Words cannot express
how angry and disappointed I will be. I want to see BYU compete at the highest
level. The athletes deserve it. And by gosh the fans do too.Don't
Any interest the Big 12 had in adding the school from Provo went up in smoke
when the blue team got embarrassed on their home field in a big way Saturday.It seems the Big 12 is now looking elsewhere for expansion. Can you
If BYU is to join the Big XX, they need 6 concessions to be made.1)
No Sunday play2) Freedom of same day re-broadcast of all BYU games
on BYU-TV3) Freedom to broadcast any or all games not televised by
the contracted TV networks.4) Equal (or near equal) revenue sharing
for bowl earnings and TV contracts awarded to the conference (Texas can keep the
LHN revenue, and so can OU when their network is up and running).5)
Signed legal agreements of stability in the Big12- with hefty >$20 million
buyout penalties. Stability must be for at least 10 years.6) Those
with networks cannot broadcast high school football games without the unanimous
consent from the rest of the leagueI think these are all reasonable
requirements, but without them, the Big 12 is fools gold for anyone- except
IT appeares to me that most of the fires are being fueled by the media and
sports reporters who think they know more than those hired to do their job at
the Universitys. Then they get fans and athetlic authoritys believieng their so
called expertise and stir the pot until we have all the confusion that prevails
at this time.I will continue to support BYU whatever decision it
makes.Lehicoug--- If you bleed blue through and through it sounds like you may
have sprung a few leaks.
TCU is a proven program that has been to the BCS. The Big East is a lost cause
and travel will be easier for TCU.As I have stated before BYU fan, a
Texas school or schools are Big 12 bound and all the powers that be will make
sure of it. You really think Baylor was a top choice last time around? Mo,
Governor Richards of Texas made sure Baylor got in.
Perhaps the suits with crimson red chairs view the SECULAR activity and
insatiable money centered appetites that govern college football as the true
patch of briers and thistles whereas the land of milk and honey resides upon a
completely different message altogether?
For the past few years I've maintained that in the end, BYU will drop out of
NCAA competition, just like BYU-Idaho did. NCAA sports will become too messy,
too money hungry, too TV controlled, and far uglier than BYU wants to be party
too. This so-called "super conference" idiocy is evidence to me that
BYU is moving to shut it all down and be an institution of higher learning, not
a farm school for the NFL. And NCAA sports is getting to the point, I can hardly
stand to read about it, or watch it anymore. There are a gazillion timeouts in
football and basketball, and it ruins the game. The money is not worth it,
what's the point anyway?
TCU provides nothing in revenue for the Big 12. They don't bring in any
additional TV markets.This is truly nothing but speculation by the
media.It literally changes every 15 minutes.I have total
faith in the leaders of BYU.They will make the right decision.
Is BYU really in love with having its own TV network broadcast football games?
I thought that they went to that because they wanted fans to be able to see
games instead of missing them on the Mtn tv network.The Big12 has a
tv deal with espn and abc. May not be able to broadcast games on BYUTV, but who
cares?I've heard BYU doesn't want any bad blood between them and the
religious institutions in the WCC, by leaving the conference immediately after
joining it. Patience is a good thing to have, should have stayed 1 more year in
the MWC with TCU and Boise, then left for the big 12.
This article shows that Harmon would give his left arm (maybe even his right
arm) for BYU to go to the big12.
I've already stopped donating to BYU because of things I'm unhappy about. If
they get that invite and then turn it down. I PROMISE TO NEVER FOLLOW THEM
AGAIN. Not maybe or might. I mean NEVER.
Lifelong Republican:TCU really doesn't HAVE to bring in new TV sets.
The $1.1 billion contract is already signed. Adding a bigger TV market like
the Y or Air Force won't increase the value of the Big TeX's contract. ESPN
already said so. Therefore, the Big TeX just needs to add 1-3 teams.Personally, I think they should add up to 3 of the following 4 BCS-caliber
teams: Boise St, TCU, Houston, and West Virginia.
When BYU was re-buffed by the PAC...they went out of their way on saying how the
best thing was to be Independent. I think they should stay true to their
word....be it good or bad.
The BYU athletic mission statement is as follows:"Our mission
is to conduct the Athletics program in a manner that will develop
student-athletes of excellence in academics, athletics, faith, and character,
and to contribute to the mission of the LDS Church through the visibility of our
positive example and our accomplishments."Not one aspect of
that statement can be achieved more fully as a member of the BIG 12 than as an
independent.In fact, Big 12 membership may limit BYU's ability to
achieve its mission statement.The decisions made by the BOT on
conference affiliation will have little to do with the threat of BYU
"fans" to withhold their support for the program if the decision is to
pass on a BIG 12 invitation.
For BYU be worrying about the what the WCC will think seems crazy to me. That
should have been taken care of when they joined. If BYU didn't make it clear to
WCC officials when they joined that they would have to leave the conference to
join a BCS league if ever offered than they have the foresight of a bat.
BYU, West Virginia, and Louisville are the Big XII's best options for expanding
to 12. Promoting any of the mid-majors people keep talking about doesn't make
sense. That just waters the league's BCS status.As for TCU, why
would Texas and Texas Tech agree to add another team from the state of Texas
into their league? That's backyard competition for recruits. I don't see that
happening.Don't be surprised if the Big XII sets things up for
stability for the next 4 to 5 years with only 10 teams (BYU becoming the 10th).
Some of their schools' leaders have stated this week that they don't like a CC
game getting in the way of getting a team into the NC game. I agree with that
way of thinking.
No one is going to put up with BYU's demands, especially Sunday play and bend
over backwards to accommodate them when other schools such as TCU (the C is for
Christian) don't mind. While I think it is great people observe the Sabbath,
these Universities are public institutions, most of them, and don't want to or
need to accommodate BYU. Even TCU won't care. It is pretty amusing
to watch the comments of those who were beating their chest about how great
independence was and are now foaming at the mouth for a big boy conference
invite. Your true feeling really show and the whole proud to be independent was
just masking your heartache over being left behind. Just admit it, you want in.
Well, that didn't take long. All of the sudden BYU fans hate independence and
are threatening not buy tickets or donate to the school. They don't like the
WAC schedule against the likes of Idaho State. They don't like getting
dominated by schools with a real football focus like Utah.Let's face
it. The best position for BYU is a weaker mid-major conference where it can
beat up on small-school teams -- like the WAC in the '80s -- keeping fans happy.
The team in Provo should try and get into the WAC or back into the MWC where
it'll be comfortable.
Despite the recent results against Texas, I dont know if BYU can compete
regularly in the BIG 12. Once again, Utah might win by default.
Tom Holmoe is a smart guy, I don't think he or the admin would turn down an
invite to the Big 12. If they did I think it would make a lot of fans very
upset. In fact I think they would lose a lot of fans.
Who says that you have to have a conference championship game if you have 12
members? It is not so. Twelve might solidify it in the eyes of all
participants however. With only 10, if they lose one, then they're right back
into the mess they've been in. I say add at least 3.
Here's the way I see it:Leaving the MWC for independence was a good
move. This year is a great example of why independence is a good but not great
situation: Start the season 1-2, especially with how BYU has played so far in
those games, and interest in the Cougars takes a HUGE hit. We can finish as a
very respectable 10-2 team, but because of our schedule vs WAC teams, who will
care?The point of BYU Athletics is to shed more light on the LDS
Church....how can you do that if you waste away as a good-but-not-great
independent program? Eventually BYU would be a has-been athletic program.
Where's the good exposure in that?A 10-2 or even a 9-3 record in the
Big 12 will likely put us in a January 1 bowl game for ALL to see. As an
independent, a 10-2 record will put us in a pre-Christmas bowl game that few
non-Mormons will watch.Is there something that I'm missing here?
It's surely interesting to read the views of all the anti-BYU bloggers and those
who think they know which way the wind is blowing, although it's like reading a
good novel; nothing but opure fantasy and fiction. "Blow-Hards" is a
pretty good description of such, along with "fair-weather". A wise
man will withhold judgement until he knows the facts and the so-called facts
currently are just speculation, not facts-in-evidence (to use a legal term).
Those in the "know" aren't saying what they want or intend. As I wrote to a person this week, saying "This week the PAC 12 has
declined further expansion but by the time you get this letter the landscape of
conference alignment may have changed again," it is rumored at least that
indeed it has. Or has it?So while inuendo and speculation might
sell newspapers, I'd be careful about declaring what will or will not happen.
Just take a deep breath and exercise a bit of patience......something rarely
observed these days when it comes to intercollegeiate football and conference
alignment expressed opinions. We'll know soon enough how things shake out. For
now, save your breath!
BYU has no leverage except we are the only School who could come over for the
2012 season. Other than the no sunday play, they shouldn't demand ANYTHING from
the BIG 12! Who do they think they are? Not Notre Dame! As far as the
re-broadcast rights, who cares!! If they are invited and turn it down, I will
not support BYU Athletics in any way! To many other Sports I can follow
(Jazz,NFL,Red Sox) So do the right thing BYU, don't upset your Donors and fan
First off people, get over yourself. If you don't want to be a BYU fan, don't.
its that simple. I personally like Independence more than the Big 12. I like
the idea of going all over the country and playing teams that we have never
played before. Having said that, if super conferences do come around and we are
Indy, we will be religated to Div II. So if the invite does come I would accept
just because we might get left behind if we don't. If Independence could keep
us relevant, then I am all for Indy.
I've heard it said the BYU athletics is the 2nd greatest missionary program we
have. Some observers interpretted Holmoe's comments last year incorrectly. He
said we were making the move to independence for greater exposure. Some thought
exposure meant money. Exposure meant exposure.Here's the critical
points for BYU to move to the Big 12.Stability - The conference took
a major stride tonight with what they did with media rights.No
Sunday play - non-negotiable. The commandment hasn't changed.BYU
will want to broadcast games that are not carried on another network. This is
exposure. BYU wants their team to be seen. They've worked hard to get BYUtv in
60M homes. BYU will even offer to broadcast other conference games, like they
did for the WCC last year, that are not on another network.Re-broadcast rights are a nice to have but not a deal breaker.Offending the WCC - this is a tough issue. There's no easy way around it.
But we told them we would go upfront if offered.$18 M from Big 12,
$8 M for independence, $2 M from MWC. BYU cares far more about the other issues
than the money. They won't be bought.
"I've heard it said the BYU athletics is the 2nd greatest missionary
program we have."I have never heard that from President Monson
nor anyone in the First Presidency and I attend every Conference.I
find that equating actual Missionary work with football is giving a carnival
atmosphere to the message of Jesus Christ and the Gospel.Does it get
some attention? Yes, but it is still football. Stop making BYU football out
to be more than it is.
BYU has a strong brand outside of Utah. I understand that fair-weather local
fans struggled going to church and work this week to face their Ute neighbors,
colleagues but BYU is far bigger than the state of Utah and the ridiculously
labeled "Holy War". Kick back and drink some warm milk, it'll all be
over soon enough. Hope the Cougs get a couple wins soon and the Utes slide and
your daily grind will be tolerable.
If BYU passed on an opportunity to join the Big 12, I'd be VERY upset. I've been
a lifelong BYU fan, but I will quit on Cougar sports if this happened! There'd
be no reason to ever watch BYU sports again if we have no desire to compete at
the highest level. The independence route fails in comparison to a really
conference-- it's a guarantee we'd be left out of the super conference
picture.Secondly, only joining the Big 12 in football would be
stupid too. All other sports would suffer, especially basketball recruiting. Let
be honest, the WCC is nothing in comparison to the Big 12.
Wow. I am a lifelong BYU fan. If BYU stays independent I will still be a
lifelong BYU fan. If they go to the Big 12 I will still be a lifelong BYU fan.
Come on Cougar Fans, quit whining about whether BYU officials decide
to join or not join the Big 12. I am happy with BYU being independent right now.
Half of their games are strong games against great football programs and the
other half are against what should be categorized as "easy wins." I am
OK with that. There are only 2 or 3 teams in the nation who can handle an
SEC-type schedule week in and week out--and they are all in the SEC! If some of you are seriously looking to give up your good season tickets in
protest, then great. We didn't need you in the stadium anyway. The seats will
refill with new fans who will want to be there.
Another thing...As for the few Utah fans who just can't seem to
control themselves when it comes to making jabs at BYU: Congratulations, you
beat us badly, fair and square. The game is now over and we have other business
to attend to, as do your Utes. And good luck to the Utes regarding being able to
pull off another win like this where your opponents will generously give you the
ball 7 times. If it happens again this season, I would expect you to win by the
same big margin you beat us by last Saturday; however it isn't going to happen
and you are in for a bunch more USC type games from most of your competition.
You will win some and you will probably lose some too. I actually hope you win
them. But either way, let's see how the rest of the season stacks up for both
teams and compare notes in December. By then we will know better about the
character of the 2011 versions of both teams and whether BYU stays independent
or ends up joining the Big 12 or another conference.
And lastly....... ;-).......to Dick Harmon, I respect you as a
journalist and all the work you have done over the years following BYU. But, I
think you kind of stooped in this article. You interviewed one fan who
essentially said BYU better join the Big 12 or else. Or else what? He quits
going to games??? With an attitude like that, I would rather he not go and ruin
the game for me and my family. ( I really doubt he would never enter Lavell
Edwards Stadium again--come on! That is a ridiculous threat!) And the way the
quotes from this fan read, it makes him sound superior to the administrators and
board of directors of BYU. I bet he didn't mean to sound this way. (if he did,
well....so much for my benefit of the doubt). He is not privy to info that they
are. I trust them. Let's just sit back and watch and wait for what happens next.
Besides we still have 9 games to go. ANd I am just looking forward to tomorrow
night's game with UCF. Go Cougs!
I personally like the idea of BIG 12 participation and think it will happen.
That said, I have confidence the right decision will be made as BYU has a
mission to perform and it will not be foiled.I watched the BB game
last night on BYUtv and realized it was broadcast internationally. What a great
opportunity millions of people had to participate. The event was the first of
it's kind with no need for commercial sponsors. No other university in the world
could/would do what BYUtv did last night. It was a show of athletic greatness
with total sportsmanship. Everyone who participated was a winner from the
athletes, to the coaches, to the fans, to the charity, to BYU and it's
sponsoring institution. KUDOS!!! Independence has been huge even if
for a year. BYUtv is not a threat to the BIG12 but rather it will be (if we are
invited) a benefit to the conference at virtually no cost.
BYU hurts itself more by not winning when it matters than by anything else. If
we had taken care of business on the field like TCU, Boise St, and Utah, then
BCS conferences would be knocking on our door with more force. We have the fan
base. I disagree with those who say we have been too greedy. I think we haven't
been 'ambitious' enough - building BCS-calibre teams and then actively courting
relationships with BCS conferences.As for Nunya (and others who
think alike): I would focus on the kids who go there and the good of what the
school does for them and worry less about influencing politics. There is no
place I can think of that deserves our support more!!!
Why would BYU fans stop being fans of BYU if BYU turned down a Big 12 offer?
That's a ridiculously juvenile response to something about which they have no
control. The point of being a fan is to support your team no matter what. That
doesn't mean you can't criticize decisions or air grievances but at the end of
the day you remain loyal to your team. If BYU could go to the Big 12 and chooses
to remain an Independent, then that's the way it is.CougarFaninTX
got it right though. This is not about money. BYU won't deny that the extra
money would be nice but BYU's goals are not the same as most other universities'
goals. Independence makes sense for BYU but if the goals of BYU and the LDS
Church (which goals include developing well-educated people who are good members
of their communities and religions) can be furthered even more by joining the
Big 12, then that will be the course BYU will take.
As I've attempted to assert over the past couple of months, there are some in
the senior hierarchy of the LDS Church who have never liked the idea of BYU
being in a big league like the Big 12 or Pac 12 (too much negative impact on
nearby smaller programs like Utah State). There are even those that sadly wish
to drop athletics at BYU or at least limit them to what the WCC does since they
feel intercollegiate athletics conflict with the perceived mission of LDS church
universities and colleges. BYU might just have a decision to make, yes they
want a stable league, BUT they need to move upward if they want a program. Just
playing mostly C-USA, MWC, WAC and MAC programs year in and year out isn't going
to cut it for visibility. This is what they would limit themselves to if they
are in fact saying no to the Big 12. If that's the case they might as well drop
their program and get it over with.
I agreed what Sperry saying and BYU head dept would be a fool not run for it
with big 12!
It's clear than BYU fans don't buy the independent role. BYU should be
assertive in trying to join the conference and not be coy or above it all.
SLC BYU Fan:Please give your one dimensional posts a rest for a
while. Many people have asked you to expose who your sources are and who it is
that you continually say is opposed to BYU athletics. Perhaps it's true but
until you substantiate it, it's just hearsay.
I'm 40 years old now. I've loved BYU and it's athletic programs as long as I can
remember. To those who are ready to jump ship and stop watching/donating if BYU
doesn't join the Big 12(?), I'd say, "Goodbye". BYU DOESN'T need the
money, folks. The money is nice, but their main objective is exposure. I,
personally, like the independence. I like them joining with the WCC in other
sports, surrounded by other "like-minded" christian based
universities. I like how BYU is able to call it's own shots on what it does or
doesn't want to do and what direction it will take in the future. I live in the
heart of Texas. (Longhorn country.) The reason A&M wanted out is because
they were playing second fiddle to UT. What in the world do ya'll think will
happen if BYU joins the conference? UT dictates, everyone else does. End of the
story. I don't want to see my beloved college play second fiddle to anyone. BYU
is a unique institution. Independence allows them a unique opportunity to
display that. Stay the course. Don't lose your independence. BYU is bigger than
America, it's international. Go Cougars!
BYU would not do as well in the Big 12, as they would as an independent.BYU's recruiting improved by being able to pick up national recruits.
They could go to a kid in Georgia and say "we are on ESPN every week".
That ends if they join the Big 12. BYU would be in the Big 12, recruiting
players like when they were in the MWC. Buh-bye ESPN contract.BYU
would not do as well in the Big 12, as Utah in the Pac 12.Again,
recruiting. The move to the Pac 12 has improved Utah's recruiting already. As
mentioned, BYU's recruiting will take a step backwards.BYU fans say Utah
has it easy this year because they don't face Oregon and Stanford. Utah just
has to win the south, then hope for some good luck in the championship game.As the tenth member of the Big 12, BYU would play everybody. No more
catching OU and Texas on a down year. If one is down, the other is up. Then
comes OSU, Mizzou, Tech. This year, according to ESPN power rankings, BYU would
be behind Baylor and Iowa State.However, good games for the fans!
When the Marriot Center is half full this year, maybe the BYU administration
will finally get it. If the football team doesn't get their act together, there
is no question that independence will only have LES half full. At least in the
big 12 fans will fill the stadiums just to see the great teams who would be
finally coming to Provo. We don't really know for sure if the powers that be
are really committed to a great sports program. All I know is that if you are
not committed, even at BYU it won't happen. The evidence of that was last
Saturday. In the church, we are told to be in the world but not of it. Which is
it BYU? If you really want a top notch sports program, then get into the big 12
and show the interest. We are not Notre Dame, we have to work at it. I am not
buying basketball tickets to go watch BYU play Dixie State, BYU Hawaii and
Praire View A&M.
byu is far more talented than pretty much all Big 12 teams.
SLC BYU Fan: You made assertions about the GA's for which you have no proof.
Name your sources!!BYU is bigger than all of this and will survive.
Like many, I just want us to win games and EARN our way into the BCS in
January. I am far more pleased about what BYU has done for me, my siblings, my
children and their cousins, than what I could EVER get from football. I will
contribute whenever, whatever I can because I believe in the core mission of the
school and I couldn't be more proud of that!
Independence was a good idea at the time. The fact is that time is moving at a
breakneck pace right now and dawdling by the BYU administration will be fatal to
the program if the Suits don't man-up and go after a big conference affiliation.
Waiting around for the Big 12 to come begging us to join ain't going to happen
this time. This is make or break for my long-held season tickets.
My entertainment dollar will forever be spent somewhere else. I WILL NOT buy
ever again if this year's type schedule is more than a one year deal. Given the
current football landscape, I agree with the writer when he calls this
"football suicide" for BYU if they don't get into the Big 12.I bleed very blue but for me this is a make or break deal. If the
administration thinks that I - and many, many others - will come crawling back
to LES to see the Idaho State's of the football world play because it's the only
game in town, or that we'll all mellow out over time, then they have sadly
underestimated our resolve.
I like to watch BYU sports, not just football. I didn't graduate from BYU, but
we always followed them in our home as I grew up. I trust the leaders to make
the best decision, although I'm not sure what that is. I'm glad I don't have to
make the choice. I like independence. I hope we stay independent, but I
wouldn't mind seeing us play the likes of Texas, and Oklahoma week in and week
out either. I'm glad it's not my choice to make.As for those
so-called fans who claim they will defect if they don't get their way, maybe it
will be easier for me, and those like me who have come to the table a little
later than others, to get good tickets for the games.
Adding BYU made sense a month ago, because they were the easiest get...
independent, no pesky lawsuits to contend with, they could just join.Then two teams left the Big East.Now TCU makes more sense. It is
close geographically, has already declared its intention to leave the MWC, and
no guarantee the Big East will survive.Geography is the killer for
BYU. It is a two day road trip to their nearest Big 12 opponent. Visitor seats
will be filled by local BYU fans, or those very very few that would travel from
Utah by air.
@Moderate - Utah's recruiting has not improved since joining the Pac 12.
Moderator rules prevent me from posting a link but, please go to Scout dot com
where you will see that Utah's current recruiting class is ranked No. 65 in the
country. BYU's is currently at No. 34. So, while I agree that
BYU's recruiting has improved due to Utah's move to the Pac 12, Utah's has not.
That being said, I hope that BYU accepts the likely invitation to
the Big 12.
So Harmon quotes Sid Sperry, 56 of Provo, lifelong Cougar fan. No knock on Mr.
Sperry, but how is his opinion relevant? Did Harmon talk to a buddy of his and
then have that opinion appear to represent all Cougar fans? Journalism 101
teaches giving a fair and balanced story. Quoting one man from Provo hardly
does that. I'm sure there were other opinions from Cougar fans.
@Moderate - Unfortunately we need yet another fact check."Adding BYU made sense a month ago, because they were the easiest get...
independent, no pesky lawsuits to contend with, they could just join.Then two teams left the Big East.Now TCU makes more sense. It is
close geographically, has already declared its intention to leave the MWC, and
no guarantee the Big East will survive."Pittsburgh and Syracuse
are being held to a bylaw which states they will remain members of the Big East
for 27 months. In other words, it will be more than two years until the Big
East loses them and TCU has a commitment to the Big East. TCU might not have to
stay for 27 months but, there is penalty should they decide to depart.The Big 12 has also made it clear that they are not interested in expanding
within the current geographic footprint. Furthermore, TCU is a small school
with small facilities and a smaller fan base. If they are to be added it will
only be because BYU turned the Big 12 down.
If BYU does not get into the Big XII, football will be dead in Provo within 5
years. We will lose money, recruits and fans. My legacy membership will be
gone. The Big XII will accomodate us on the Sunday play issue and BYUtv is OK.
Its as good as we'll ever get. Holmoe - take it!
If BYU doesn't give into my (fan) demands then I will never watch BYU sports
again......So many posters here are like a little child crying because they
didn't get their way. Yeah like BYU is going to listen to whiny fans about their
opinions on this. BYU is going to look out for their interests which is
exposure. I am sure BYU has done a lot more than just stand by the sidelines.
They're just not going to tell everyone their every move, they never have and
they never will. When they decided to go independent it was the best option at
the time and many just can't get that to include the useless Ute fans who keep
forgeting they were the first ones to jump ship. Whatever move BYU makes, I will
be there supporting them. And yes, they will never play on Sunday, NEVER.
The Horned Frogs have made impressive national runs during this century.
Cougars . . . not so much.
BYU wants to win year in and year out, they will not do it in the Big 12, but
they will year in and year out against the likes of San Jose State, Idaho, Idaho
State, and New Mexico State. Stay Independent and play a lousy schedule, you'll
winn every year.....except when they get pounded by Utah:)
@Go Big Blue!!! - It doesn't matter. It matters how many people will fill
stadiums or turn on television sets to watch them. There aren't many and
they're already within the Big 12 geographic footprint. Their only hope is BYU
declining an invitation.
Wow, I want to BYU to win as badly as anyone and I hope the administration is
serious about taking advantage of the best opportunities out there. But take a
longer look, people. Even my Ute friends send their kids to BYU. Why is that??
I'm happy for what BYU has done for my kids and other people's kids.
I think people are making a big mistake to spend their money elsewhere when this
investment yields such good results for so many kids there in athletics. Go
spend it on the Jazz and see what it gets you...
If we get the invite? There will be no invite if we don't show intent. I have
heard from OK, Tex A&M, Syracuse, & Missouri of their intents to leave
their conferences. I have heard nothing from BYU. So, it didn't work out for OK
and MO. So what? It worked out for A&M and Syracuse. Eat humble pie and
make the call of your intent. Yes, we want to join the Big 12.
Dick Harmon is right on, "Who is one to believe? BYU isn't helping,
refusing to make a statement to the media, choosing to see Big 12 politics work
itself out for the present."Don't be the 1960's girl by the
phone. Go to the party and flirt. This window may close forever.
Chip Brown cited a 'source close to the situation' that said that TCU was a
prime candidate because 'BYU may have lost interest.' Fact - Chip
Brown does not have sources at BYU. This story is one thing only, an attempt by
Texas through their unofficial mouthpiece to get BYU to tip their hand and show
interest so that the Big 12 won't be embarrassed by offering an invite and
having it rejected. But they really don't need to worry, going to the Big12 is a
no-brainer for BYU.
An invite to the Big 12 would be the best possible opportunity to advance BYU
athletics to the next level. As it is, BYU loses ONE game and guess what- Armed
Forces Bowl, what's the motivation to go 11-1 or 6-6? Both will have the same
ending. In the Big 12 there would be no scheduling problems, great money and
exposure for recruiting, and best yet, BYU could lose a few games and STILL play
for a Big 12 championship and go to a BCS Bowl. I just can't see any reason why
any logical BYU administrator can think that this Independence experiment is
better for BYU in the long run, UNLESS the Big 12 wanted BYU to compromise their
church standards somehow, such as requiring them to play on Sunday. And as for
the WCC, any of those schools would jump into the Big 12 in a heartbeat if the
offer was extended, so BYU shouldn't stress too much about what they
"think" of them. People quit jobs and move onto better opportunities
all of the time. If BYU turned down the Big 12 just to stay indy, it would be
WON84 "The Big 12 has also made it clear that they are not interested in
expanding within the current geographic footprint."I do not see
that phrase anywhere in TODAY's story. It would help if you fact check against
what is happening now, rather than against what was posted on a Cougar fan board
several months ago.
I think VA_Ute is dead on. As a BYU fan, I can't imagine why BYU would ever not
be interested in a stabilized Big 12. It will provide security, high level
scheduling, BCS access, exposure, and funding. If they will agree to allow no
Sunday play and can show conference stability, what possible reasons could there
be for BYU to reject an offer? Like VA_Ute said, the last thing the Big 12
needs is further embarrassment. BYU needs to open up a little and sell
themselves as a highly valuable prospect for Big 12 expansion. They won't get
the exposure they so desperately want if they get left behind. People want to
see good competition. If that is not there, people will not tune in, no matter
what station it is on. Don't alianate your fans, BYU. Make the move if it is
Seriously, I don't think BYU passed on the Big-12, I think the Big-12 is just
exploring it's other options, and who knows, they might not be interested in BYU
anymore. These excuses from BYU sound awfully similar to when a recruit starts
losing interest and they pull their offer in an attempt to not look like they
lost that recruit. I think they might be losing their steam when it comes to
joining the Big-12, so they just need these excuses to save face a bit when we
all know they would love basically increasing their income 20 fold.
The story in the Tulsa World today says the Big 12 wants BYU and TCU both. They
got an interum commisioner and he is to get them up to speed to make them a long
term and viable conference.
deal done. will be announced soon. notre dame in the equation. y to add 18,000
additional seats to les. mark it down
If BYU doesn't pursue the BIG 12 with a passion then Tom Holmoe should be
fired!! This is a total no brainer.
If the PAC-12 invited BYU and they said no, I can understand why fans would be
upset. The BIG-12 is a different deal altogether. Its like having neighbors who
are constantly fighting. Windows are being broken, frying pans are flying, there
are bullet holes in the front door, and two crazed residents are gripping
hand-grenades with the pins already pulled out. Would you want to move in with
Put it this way - if BYU does get an invite to the BIG 12 and turns it down
then you can be 100% certain that NCAA athletics at the Y are on the way out -
probably within 5 years. If Glenn Tuckett and LaVell Edwards were still at the Y
BYU would be jumping at the chance to join up with a "REAL"
"LEGIT" conference. This silly little conference they belong to now
for other sports is a joke and ranks barely above a junior college status. The
basketball arenas are about 5ooo seats for the most part.
If the BIG 12 invites BYU, but requires Sunday play, do you Cougar fans still
expect Holmoe, Samuelson etc. to accept the invitation? And will you stop
supporting BYU when they do turn down the invitation because of Sunday play
requirements?flynnisthecoolest, get real BYU... will NOT be
dictating any terms to the BIG 12. They will politely ask for relief on the
Sunday play requirement
Until the powers that be at BYU or the Big 12 reveals anything factual, all
these speculation hurled around on these boards is just nonsense, empty
"...tales told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying
nothing." For those who are threatening to abandon BYU if they
don't join the Big 12, well, sorry you feel that way. Hope we can have you back
if and when Bronco and the team can start winning again. Even I myself can't
take another humiliation like we did last weekend. I'm very nervous about
tonight. Hope they can redeem themselves. Go Cougs! Let's play a whole game
for a change.
I'm certainly glad none of you speculators are my stock broker. Holy cats! Talk
about a lot huffing, puffing, and stupid threats of abandonment just over a
bunch of hearsay. Until, last month the Big 12 was always the preferred
conference for BYU; a much better conference than any other BCS alternative. The
PAC was probably the better option for Utah but the Big 12 has always seemed to
be preferable for BYU. Until the Big 12 installs some
earthquake-resistant stability to their foundation and repair the hurricane
shutters, the good ship Independence will convey the BYU athletic department
just fine. However, I hope whatever stabilizers the Big 12 uses get installed in
the next few days so the photos for the wedding announcements can be taken and
in the mail before the leaves all fall.
Yawn. Another speculative fact-free article based on someone else's fact-free
speculation.My fact-free speculation: If offered, BYU makes the
I miss the BYU farm team from Rexburg. Perhaps the church could invest in Utah
State's football team, make it a junior college program and funnel their better
players to BYU after a year or two. Maybe that would appease Go Big Blue.
Is BYU willing to sign away tier 1 and tier 2 television rights to the Big 12
for 6 years? That's what is on the table in the name of "stablity".
If BYU joined the Big 12, then after 2 years decided to go back independent, the
Big 12 would have the right to televise BYU games, even though they were no
longer in the conference.
Harmon's comments, We don't know the particulars and it is not over
yet, but if BYU was given these things below and still turns down the Big 12,
I will agree with Sperry.1. No Sunday Play ( BYU will never
compromise ) 2. Re Broadcast rites on BYUtv. 3. As has already been
reported a 6 year guarantee all teams stay in the Big 12= stability.4. The
Big 12 lets BYU honor whatever agreement they have with the WCC and ESPN. ( BYU
might have to wait 2 years) for all other sports.This is what Sperry
saidSperry said he doesn't believe BYU athletic director Tom Holmoe
or university president Cecil Samuelson would do that. "They are smart and
I think they will make the right decision."I agree with Sperry
on this Point. How many Big time Donors, and how many fan's not coming to
football and Basketball Games would it take for BYU administrators to take
notice. ?When Utah is playing USC and Oregon, BYU needs to be
playing Texas and Oklahoma Make it happen Tom or should I call you ( Moses) I
hate the briars and thistles."I will forever be a BYU fan.
This is all such a joke...fans boycotting. Harmon, why did you interview that
guy? He brought nothing to the story but instead discredited your views. BYU will remain independent. If they ever chose to join the Big12 it
would not be because of football but rather for all the other sports. The two
problems I see with WCC competition is lack of a few sports BYU participates in
and the size of basketball arenas. BYU's mission will be best achieved,
however, by staying independent in football and in the WCC. BYUtv will aid its
mission and would be yet another LHN in the Big12.@flynnisthecoolest
had it right, there are MANY more factors at work here than just competition.
And BYU has shown and will continue to show that they can schedule top
competition as an independent. That said, it would be cool to have UT and OU
visit every other year...
Lotsa stupidity from no nothing utah "fans" just projecting their
desires on this article. Alot of stupidty from shell shocked BYU
"fans" as well saying they'll abandon the program if they turn down
the BIG12. My guess is that the people that matter at BYU already know what is
going to happen. They already know what they would require to agree to join the
BIG12 and they already know if the BIG12 is going to invite them.I
personally will have some disappointment, and some excitement, either way. I am
really looking forward to independence but can also see the advantages to
belonging to a conference like the BIG12. The truth is the BIG12 is probably the
#2 league in football and either #2 or #3 in basketball depending on the year.
As a competitive league in the big 2 sports it is probably the best one all
around. I'm really not sure what I would prefer to see done but
unlike others projecting their personal desires I will simply wait and see what
happens. Of course it is fun to read the near panic in the possibility from such
utah "fan" luminaries as moderate, howie and jingle boy. LOL!
It's a game of musical chairs, where it used to be BYU and one chair, and now
it's BYU + 4-5 teams and 2 chairs. BYU is making ridiculous
demands. Say you won't play on Sunday, but other than that, be a lapdog like
Utah has been and it will pay off in the end. Sometimes you just
gotta get down and beg. BYU has too much pride to do that. They think they
actually have something to offer other than a desired number of teams. And for the BYU fans that eventually leave because BYU messes this up,
we at the U of U would be happy to bring you into the fold. :)
4. The Big 12 lets BYU honor whatever agreement they have with the WCC and
ESPN.I don't think the Big 12 would care if BYU non-football sports
stayed in the WCC. But what ESPN agreement must they keep? The Big 12's Tier 1
rights were sold to Fox. They're not going to have 9 teams on Fox and 1 team on
ESPN. If there is a buyout on the ESPN agreement, that would be on BYU's
dime.BYUtv would be like TLN, the tier 3 broadcast option.
I'll just wait to see what happens. For now I'm hoping the football team
doesn't lay another egg like last Saturday.
Yeah, sheriffcreg, Utah can always use more fair-weather fans.
Having faith in the Y's leaders will do nothing to extend an offer from the
BigXII minus three. That is out of the Y's control. The important
question that the BigXII minus III must decide is do they want to put up with
another media prima donna who has its own network and who now wants the
conference not require that it play any games on Sunday or have any championship
games on Sunday. The Y is a lot like a woman before the marriage
requiring a pre nuptial agreement that limits what she is willing to share and
when she will participate. It's obviously love at first sight for
both the Y and the BigXII minus III!! I personally the Big XII minus III would
be crazy to want to consider such a union, they already have Texas.
I'm not sure I understand why byu fans think they are so deserving of a Big12
invite. Boise St have PROVEN time and time again that they are BCS caliber.
Maybe the Big12 would rather take someone that has already demonstrated it is
capable of 'executing at a high level.'
Here's one Utah fan that hopes that BYU receives and accepts an invite to the
Big-12. Last weekend's smackdown notwithstanding, I think BYU has generally
proven that they can play with the big boys and belong in a big name conference.
Plus, it may start a new fun rivalry among BYU/Utah fans regarding whose BCS
conference is better.
Just try beating Utah and winning most of the rest of the time and whether you
are in the Big 12-3 or independent things will be fine. Of course, winning in
the Big 12 could be a problem. It is much better in football and basketball
than the PAC-12 and minus Texas with much smaller markets to attract TV revenue,
which is the primary reason the PAC-12 commissioner and league Presidents want
to keep the status quo. They can't compete on the field, but still get the big
bucks, so why expand?
Will you guys please quit with the non-intelligent argument that sunday play
will do the cougars in? Most of NCAA div 1 (FBS) football games are not on
Sunday. No bowl games are on Sunday of any importance at all. You will notice
that the BCS cream of the crop (championship game) is played without fail on
Monday..... It is more likely than not that the conferences that have an
interest in BYU are well aware of the no sunday concession they would need to
make to extend them to the conference and not suffer any kind of major forfeits
based on no team showing up with Blue and white.... It is likely that the BCS
invite would be football only as it is not an impossibility. Or, like the WAC
and MWC did the conference they joined would simply forego conference
competitions on Sunday. Please surrender to common sense so that we aren't left
questioning your overall intelligence. Can you do that?
Dick Harmon accusing Chip Brown of being a shill for UT football is the height
Jake2010 - The Big 12 won't take BYU for football only. And most other sports
are on Sundays. Do you think they want a forfeit of the conference basketball
tournament and blow that TV money.
People like Sid Sperry don't care about BYU - they care about the football team.
When's the last time Sid Sperry took in a concert at the HFAC?
BYU's athletic department has shown excellent wisdom and prudence since the
debacle of the MWC's initial TV contract.I desperately want to be
part of the Big12. I have two concerns. BYU and the LDS church as a whole have
shown a sometimes stunning diconnect with the members/alumni. I worry that they
believe we will happily follow like sheep no matter what they decide.My second concern is that the church and BYU have also shown an aversion to
transparency and accountability. Independence allows them to do whatever they
want and answer to no one (except maybe the NCAA). Joining the Big12 means that
sometimes BYU will not get it's way. It will also mean that faux pas (don't
know you you make that plural) and unpopular decisions will become public
instead of hidden.I understand that there are a few things that are
non-negotiable like Sunday play, but even a poor deal to be part of the Big12 is
better than independence.lets all hope and pray that the Board of
Trustees is wise enough to see that Big12 inclusion is a REALLY BIG DEAL.
The WCC won't be offended. They KNEW taking BYU was a gamble and that if BYU got
offered a BCS conference slot it'd be taken. Just the one year with the WCC
helps that conference.No issue there.I love the
independence thing because of the prospect of seeing so many differen BCS teams
in LES every year, instead of the same teams every year.However,
being in a BCS conference has its advantages. In weighing pros and cons between
independence and Big XII membership, I see it as an overall draw.So,
I'm okay either way, though would still love to see BYU stick with independence
and make it work. It's the possibility that it might not work (front-loaded
issue) that makes BCS membership appealing.And maybe steadier
JDL - You do realize that all of Dick Harmon's "sources" are also
It's funny how BYU's initial lack of interest in the Big 12 is now a debate
among BYU fans. When there was talk of adding BYU as the 10th team, I was
disappointed to read BYU president's announcement to the media that BYU was
happy where they were. I don't think he will change his mind and this is
something that is in the minds of Big 12 schools. No conference likes being
embarrassed by a potential candidate. Just ask the Pac 12 commissioner. He
learned (for a second time) that Texas does not need the Pac 12. With regards
to BYU, the Big 12 is not hurting to add BYU so where do some BYU fans get off
thinking they can make demands if they join? The Big 12 offers money, exposure
and an opportunity to play in a BCS league. I have gone to other
websites to gage where TCU fans stand on the possibility of joining the Big 12.
I have never seen such arrogance and stupidity. TCU has nothing to offer the
Big 12 and its anger toward UT may cause them to lose their place on the list of
candidates.BYU or TCU?
Adding to my recent post, if BYU is truly interested in joining the Big 12, it
would be wise to let this be known now. Timing is everything.
Some of the rumors that I have heard about BYU's interest or lack there of in a
potential Big 12 Invite is very concerning.... It would seem to me that we ought
to be tripping over ourselves to get this opportunity... It would seem to better
satisfy what we say our goals are: Better exposure for LDS Land, and a chance to
compete at the top levels of college sports.BYU needs to appoint a
committee yesterday to put together a complete presentation and tour for the Big
12, we need to break down our Athletic Financials for a potential review by the
Big 12 , and we need to make some assignments and create some accountability for
obtaining an invite.If we join the conference and it eventually goes
away, what have we lost??? We could recreate what we have today (Football
Independence and the WCC) in a months time.I am an alumni, a former
athlete, and a fan for nearly 50 years (Virgil Carter and Phil Odle years and
John Farchild and Dick Nemelca years)... Folks like me want this badly... If we
mess it up, it's probably time for me to find something else to do.
can i say anything but yes
Interesting to note, I am a Texas alumnus and I know that UT and almost every UT
fan I've met would love to see BYU in the Big 12.
The real concern by most BYU fans is this, if BYU is offered a spot in the Big
12 and turns it down, forget our chances of being included in the super
conferences when they come... which would basically make BYU football as
important as intramural flag football. It could be the beginning of the end. BYU
needs to quit thinking about hurting the WCC's feelings and start thinking more
of survival for the future. And if BYU ever wants to get a serious look
from the likes of prized mormon recruits like Jabari Parker, they need to be in
a conference like the Big 12, not the WCC.
junkgeek How would you know you don't like Dick Harmon Sid Sperry or
Sid Sperry Is 56 years old, > And he has been in the WAC and MWC
Wilderness for over 40 years, I like his passion for BYU football. BYU deserves
to be in the BIG 12, So fan's like myself that have supported BYU athletics
over the years can finally see all the hard work Pay Off.This is
what the Big 12 =1. Marriott Center sold out. Dave Rose deserves
Kansas and all the other Big 12 teams2. All of our Olympic sports
will thrive.3. Texas and Oklahoma are two of the very best teams in
all of football and will visit Prove.I could go on and on it is a no