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Globe columnist: An 'epochal' moment for Mormons in public life

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  • FDRfan Sugar City, ID
    Aug. 29, 2011 12:43 p.m.

    "The Church's mission is to preach the gospel of Jesus Christ, not to elect politicians," the policy states. "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is neutral in matters of party politics. This applies in all of the many nations in which it is established."

    Thank goodness someone puts this in the media. I did not see any wink winks in this statement. Hopefully the calls for Senator Reids excommunication will cease. If Mitt Romney gets elected I hope Senator Reid teaches his Sunday school class or better yet assigned as his home teacher. He could help Mitt Romney become a better President.

  • truthsandwich RANDOLPH, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 12:45 p.m.

    "Mormonism, it turns out, is a block on which the American idea has stood, even if many of us are only seeing this for the first time."

    It is unfortunate that there are still many who have yet to see this. I've read that 1 in 5 Americans won't vote for a Mormon, regardless of his or her character/leadership/political stance.

    As the the church's exposure continues to increase, I'm hopeful that many of the classic perpetuated misconceptions about Mormons will fade away.

  • davemnyc SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 12:55 p.m.

    Huntsman and Romney belong to a non-Christian religion. Every religious scholar outside of Utah will profess that the LDS Church is a cult that does not subscribe to Christian beliefs. Saying you believe in Jesus Christ does not make you a Christian church. This country will not elect a non-Christian president. When are people in Utah going to wake up to this fact. It's not going to happen. America's Catholics and the Southern Evangelicals will not allow a non-Christian to be elected President of the United States.

  • Tom in CA Vallejo, CA
    Aug. 29, 2011 1:03 p.m.

    FDRFan:

    Too bad Reid couldn't help Obama in the same way.

  • DeltaFoxtrot West Valley, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 1:27 p.m.

    @truthsandwich: Misconceptions? I think most of the public has a relatively neutral view of Mormons, the "live and let live" sort of attitude. Yeah, they're a little crazy and extreme in their beliefs... but so are Southern Baptists. I just hope none of them start digging deeper into LDS history and traditions. I've read some things that are downright scary.

  • defibman Syracuse, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 1:48 p.m.

    @DeltaFoxtrot...

    You need to keep of the Left-wing web sites. They will make things up as they go to suit their own needs. Their "facts" are so far out there that they would qualify as science fiction.

    @ Tom in CA. You got that right! It is just that some people cannot see truth when it is right in front of them. It takes some people along time to see that what they are doing is just plain wrong. Others will keep doing it no matter what, just to save face in their minds.

  • Johnny Triumph American Fork, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 3:19 p.m.

    A shame he asserts that Mormonism started as a dissident group rather than being viewed as that.

    "Mormonism may have begun as a dissident counterculture"

  • KM Cedar Hills, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 3:55 p.m.

    The "epochal" moment for Mormons was when the gospel of Jesus Christ was restored to the earth.

  • ute alumni Tengoku, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 4:16 p.m.

    trots,
    get over it. it doesn't take much to scare you

  • Bereal MADERA, CA
    Aug. 29, 2011 4:32 p.m.

    Another long time favorite of mine that I would add to the list is Senator Orrin Hatch from Utah. I always enjoy listening to him when he is interviewed by the media.

  • SimonSays Riverton, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 4:51 p.m.

    @ davemnyc 12:55pm.

    You have got to be joking ... Mormons aren't Christians? That silly argument is getting so old. Seriously, come up with something new.

  • FDRfan Sugar City, ID
    Aug. 29, 2011 5:02 p.m.

    Bereal | 4:32 p.m. Aug. 29, 2011
    MADERA, CA
    Another long time favorite of mine that I would add to the list is Senator Orrin Hatch from Utah. I always enjoy listening to him when he is interviewed by the media

    Orin Hatch said that Clarence Thomas was one of the most moral people that he had the privilege of knowing. But in a book authored by the person who "Trashed" Anita Hill says he discovered that Clarence Thomas did indeed frequent a porno store and checked out the videos that Anita Hill claimed he told her about. We need Mormon political figures to be more cynical than that.

  • Richie Saint George, UT
    Aug. 29, 2011 7:35 p.m.

    @davemnyc, please provide your address and phone number. We will be happy to send two bright young men to teach you the gospel.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    Aug. 29, 2011 7:52 p.m.

    "Every religious scholar outside of Utah will profess that the LDS Church is a cult that does not subscribe to Christian beliefs. Saying you believe in Jesus Christ does not make you a Christian church."

    *Every* religious scholar? Tall order you just stacked up for yourself, old bean.

    "This country will not elect a non-Christian president."

    It elected John and John Quincy Adams. And Thomas Jefferson. Crack a book sometime, willya?

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    Aug. 29, 2011 7:59 p.m.

    "Saying you believe in Jesus Christ does not make you a Christian church."
    ---davemnyc

    Perhaps you could enlighten us as to what makes a christian church then? If you submit your definition, perhaps I would have a better understanding of why you say what you do. Until then, why should anyone accept your authority on the matter?

  • Give Me A Break Pullman, WA
    Aug. 29, 2011 8:44 p.m.

    davemnyc:

    There are not very many Christians left in this world. Although there are several churches that claim ownership of that label, you can't find many Christians among their collective flock. There is far too much of this pointed finger of scorn going on. Get past that. You see, being Christian is not a title, it is a lifestyle. You may remember that Christ criticized the Jews for making a similar mistake when they thought they were chosen merely because of a name. In reality, it is a way of living.

    So I am OK if you want the label, but please walk the walk. You may yet be able to learn a thing or two from your Mormon neighbors. Don't be afraid to watch them, to learn from them. Most of them are more concerned with helping others. They read the Bible, just like you, but they are alive in Christ. Give them a break.

    In fact, since you obviously know little about them, read the Book of Mormon sometime. It will change your life.

    May God bless.

  • NorCalCougar MODESTO, CA
    Aug. 29, 2011 10:51 p.m.

    @davemnyc
    Perhaps you should begin to think for yourself instead of letting your paid clergyman think for you. You see, that's really the bottom line. The other Christian denominations are mostly afraid that if their flocks learn the truth about the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ, they will lose their livlihood. So, if you turly read and know the Bible, The Church and it's teachings should be a familiar voice to you. Please pray about this. And the next time the missionaries come to your door, invite them in and listen to what they have to say. Most of all, recognize the Spirit of the Lord that they bring.

  • sharrona layton, UT
    Aug. 30, 2011 8:16 a.m.

    TheProudDuck. "Every religious scholar outside of Utah will profess that the LDS Church is a cult that does not subscribe to Christian beliefs. Saying you believe in Jesus Christ does not make you a Christian church." Every religious scholar? Tall order you just stacked up for yourself, old bean.

    Catholics answers considers Mormonism a Non-Christians religion. also Bible believing Protestant and Orthodox churches consider Mormonism a cult. The PALE of Christianity excludes Mormonism as Christian.

    The Christian Scientist Church are not all scientists and they deny the resurrection of Christ they are not considered in the PALE of Christianity. A name can be mis-leading.

    Jesus says If you do not know who I(ego)am(eimi)you will die in your sins.(John 8:24 Greek N.T.)

  • Rikitikitavi Cardston, Alberta
    Aug. 30, 2011 8:28 a.m.

    I'm trying hard to find anything that Sen.H.Reid has to offer anybody. Seems like he has been on-side with BO from the get-go and look where that has got us. (Got Pelosi relieved of her duties in the House). Sen. Reid also was given a net loss of seven seats in the Senate by the voters. The trend is likely to continue giving Reid the prestigous position of Senate Minority leader.

  • LValfre CHICAGO, IL
    Aug. 30, 2011 8:32 a.m.

    @NorCalCougar,

    "Please pray about this. And the next time the missionaries come to your door, invite them in and listen to what they have to say."

    I listened to them and discussed a lot of things and asked a lot of questions. I was told to seek the truth. I did. And I have no more questions for them ... everytime I asked questions I didn't receive real answers like they either didn't know about certain things or were covering them up ... Probably a combination of both. I seeked the truth, I found it, I stopped LDS.

  • Rikitikitavi Cardston, Alberta
    Aug. 30, 2011 8:39 a.m.

    @FDRfan
    Tells me everything. Folks I know who know Harry Reid refuse to vote for him any longer. In fact Sen. Reid has lost the support of the HUGE majority of folks who are of the same religion.

  • LValfre CHICAGO, IL
    Aug. 30, 2011 9:02 a.m.

    @NorCalCougar,

    "The other Christian denominations are mostly afraid that if their flocks learn the truth about the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ, they will lose their livlihood"

    They keep denying my comments so I'll try this a little differently.

    1. LDS would fear the same thing. Religion's want to be the only true religion and don't want to lose anyone.

    2. Quite arrogant to state that if other denominations members learn about the LDS gospel they'll leave their denomination since yours is the only truth.

    3. Bunch of things I wish I could say but this will get denied so I'll leave it be.

  • Rikitikitavi Cardston, Alberta
    Aug. 30, 2011 9:37 a.m.

    @davemnyc
    I respectfully must advise you that increasingly large numbers of Catholics AND Evangelicals are seeing beyond the bigoted doctrinal differences to which you refer. Are we not taught to judge folks by their fruit(how they live and make Christ's teachings part of their lives). Increasingly you are in the minority as more and more honest in heart true Christians see others for how they emulate the teachings of our Lord, Jesus-Christ.

  • alwaysthinking Farmington, UT
    Aug. 30, 2011 9:41 a.m.

    @sharrona: Let's see, we believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. We believe we can be saved only through the atonement of Christ. We believe first in faith in Jesus Christ, repentance, baptism by immersion for the remission of sins, and the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul--We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, praiseworthy, or of good report we seek after these things.

    If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck ... It also sounds like someone I would trust whether or not YOU call them "Christian". There are plenty who call themselves Christians and do not follow the precepts above. I'll let God be the judge of that.

  • ksampow Farr West, Utah
    Aug. 30, 2011 10:28 a.m.

    Many comments above are inappropriate. One can not judge another as being Christian or not. If one professes belief in Christ and tries to act accordingly, that is Christian. Attacking the LDS church as a cult or as non-Christian because it does not follow doctrines espoused by certain groups is a form of religious bigotry. Virtually anyone who belongs to an organized religion sincerely believes that his/her religion is correct, and deos not reject candidates of other religions - unless that religion is LDS (Mormon). That is a clear manifestation of religious bigotry.

  • Joan Watson TWIN FALLS, ID
    Aug. 30, 2011 10:35 a.m.

    In our opinion Americans shot themselves in the foot when Mitt Romney did not become president in the last election. We hope a wiser and more prudent electorate will vote for him this coming election.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 30, 2011 11:32 a.m.

    @sharrona

    My Methodist pastor back in Maryland said Mormons were Christian and would not run into any problems as far as trying to get into heaven is concerned due to being Mormon.

  • dotp POTEAU, OK
    Aug. 30, 2011 3:07 p.m.

    I have to laugh at some of the things people say about "Mormons". As I understand it, we aren't Christians because we don't believe in the same Jesus Christ who is the literal Son of God and the Savior of the world and of all mankind as the other denominations do. I guess I missed when the "other" Jesus Christ was born. We supposedly don't believe in the same God who is our Heavenly Father as the other denominations do. Maybe we read a different Holy Bible than other churches do although WE read the King James version of the Holy Bible. Or is it because we read ALL of God's word and not just the portions that please us? It doesn't really matter to me WHAT church someone belongs to as long as they believe in God the Father, Jesus Christ His Son, and the Holy Ghost. All are at different places on the road to Heaven. Some are farther along than others. That's part of God's Plan. At least that's part of the Plan as I understand it. I am LDS and I LOVE my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Anything else is no one's business.

  • LValfre CHICAGO, IL
    Aug. 30, 2011 4:16 p.m.

    @dotp,

    Your comment supporting your choice to follow LDS was refreshing to me. I see so many talking about all their prophets and other 'weird' things they follow but to see one just talk about their love for Jesus Christ and how they don't care "WHAT church someone belongs to as long as they believe in God the Father, Jesus Christ His Son, and the Holy Ghost" is quite refreshing.

    You, my friend, make LDS an okay religion to me. It's the prophets who have steered me away over the years (especially past prophets).

  • alwaysthinking Farmington, UT
    Aug. 30, 2011 6:12 p.m.

    @dotp:

    Exactly right, I could not agree with you more . I don't worship the LDS church, or Joseph Smith, or President Monson. I worship the Lord Jesus Christ who died and atoned for my sins. I try to listen to the Holy Spirit and follow his inspiration in living my life each day. Thanks for your comments.

  • sharrona layton, UT
    Aug. 30, 2011 7:31 p.m.

    atl134, My Methodist pastor back in Maryland said Mormons were Christian.

    Methodist statement of faith. We believe in Jesus Christ, truly God and truly man(hypostatic union), in whom the divine and human natures are perfectly and inseparably united. He is the eternal Word made flesh, the Only begotten Son of the Father, born of the Virgin Mary by the power of the Holy Spirit.
    [uncreated creator of all else,ASEITY]
    By contrast, the Jesus of the LDS tradition is not co-eternal with the Father and "of one substance with the Father." Mormonism, The Father and the Son are not united in substance, but only in love, will, focus, and effort. In conclusion the LDS belief cannot be said to constitute a monotheistic theology; it more closely resembles a tritheistic or possibly a polytheistic faith.
    Therefore outside the PALE of Christianity.

  • Bill in Nebraska Maryville, MO
    Aug. 31, 2011 6:59 a.m.

    The thing is that when we follow the counsel of our prophets, seers and revelators during conference or at other times it helps to bring us closer to our Savior, Jesus Christ. For a time as many in Christianity believe, the heavens were closed to revelation, visions and etc. Today, that is not true. The heavens have been opened and today we have living prophets on the earth who are able to give us the word directly from our Savior himself. As some one once said, most creeds try to bring God and the Son (Jesus Christ) to the people where as the LDS Church tries to bring the people to Christ and the Father. I love my Savior. I have a testimony of his divine mission and his life here on earth. I know that through him and by him is the only way that I can return to him and the Father. There was no other person on this earth that lived or died that could do that for us. Prophets allow the Father and the Son to speak to the world. As Amos says, God will reveal his word only through his prophets.

  • Maryquilter Farmington, UT
    Aug. 31, 2011 9:48 a.m.

    Sharrona: If according to the Methodist doctrine you quoted, " Jesus is the only begotten Son of the Father" (which the LDS church agrees with), how could Jesus have been a son, begotten of himself? How would Jesus be a son of himself, the Father?? According to the Nicean Creed, God is not a physical being and is without body, parts, or passion; i.e. some ethereal blob out there; yet He created man in His own likeness and His own image? We are not without body, parts, or passions. We are like Jesus and He told us that when we see Him we see the Father. The whole time I grew up in the Baptist church I could never make any sense of the Trilogy. Hundreds of years after Christ was resurrected a bunch of people got together and made up the Nicean Creed. Who says they had it right after 300 years of apostacy and twisted truths after the original apostles died? I vote for what the Savior himself taught when He was upon the earth.

  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    Aug. 31, 2011 3:35 p.m.

    Sharrona, D&C ch. 20 says the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one God. That's monotheism. You can argue that you understand the oneness of the persons of the Godhead in a way that emphasizes their unity over their distinct personhood, but how is that not semantics?

    Maryquilter -- You're mixing up the Nicean Creed with the Westminster Confession. The Nicean doesn't say anything about "without body, parts or passions."

    Here we go again, with both Mormons and other Christians misunderstanding each others' actual teaching.

  • sharrona layton, UT
    Sept. 1, 2011 8:57 a.m.

    Dotp: the "other" Jesus . The birth of the Savior was as natural as are the births of our children; it was the result of natural action. He partook of flesh and blood was begotten of His Father, as we are of our fathers. (JoD 8:115).
    Christians believe the birth of Jesus was a unique miracle by the Holy Spirit/Ghost). ..., she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit .Mt 1:18.
    Protevangelium, And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and HER seed (sperma); it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel" (Genesis 3:15). But when the time had fully come, God sent his Son, Born of a Woman,.. (Gal 4:4)
    Maryquilter. God is without body parts.
    J S, Lectures on Faith, Q. What is the Father? A. He is a personage of glory and of power. (5:2.).
    Brigham Y (JOD v 1 p 49-50): "The Lord fills the immensity of space. What saith the Psalmist[139:7-10]? Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
    God[is]spirit(pneuma,) John 4:24

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Sept. 1, 2011 12:40 p.m.

    "D&C ch. 20 says the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are one God. That's monotheism"

    Wow! I do not think I have ever read a more laughable statement on theology in my life.

    There is nowhere to go from here in this discussion. Thousands of years of the greatest thinking on the planet have just been dismissed out of hand as so much "semantics".

    Stop the presses!