I am not a Mormon or a Glenn Beck fan by any measure but yikes this guy is a
little extereme by anyones standards.
What a funny and angry man!
Those are pretty inflammatory words for someone who professes to be a follower
I would like this guy to tell me what mormons believe since he knows everything
Well, this was good for entertainment - kind of like you'd listen to a comedian.
Don't know how this guy gets anyone to believe him - he certainly doesn't know
very many facts about the LDS church or Glenn Beck.I don't know where Beck
is coming from with the Israel thing either, and he does sound more like a
preacher sometimes than a political commentator.However, I have NEVER
heard him preach Mormonism, only faith in God, and you choose what that
means.But it was good read for a laugh!
I am a Mormon, a Glenn Beck fan, and not a Harry Reid fan, but I am proud to
belong to a Church where both conservatives and liberals can stand side by side
in their adoration for Jesus Christ and his atonement, which is the core of our
doctrine. Anyone who says Mormons are not Christians is a narrow minded bigot
with an agenda, or an ignorant person who has bought into such nonsense.
I would encourage my fellow LDS to realize this. Anywhere you find someone who
dislikes the ______ (Jewish, Muslim) religion, they will take aims at Mormons
next. Do not be a stiff necked people and support hate mongers because you
personally don't like a particular religion. We need to practice what Jesus
taught and to love all people, no matter religious differences and reject people
such as Keller.Preaching hatred in the name of Jesus Christ will be
dealt with by The Holy One Of Israel himself and he employeth no other
servant.If these people gain power will they will come for you too
because they don'r believe that LDS are Christians.Pastor Martin
Niemöller:First they came for the communists,and I didn't
speak out because I wasn't a communist.Then they came for the trade
unionists,and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.Then they came for the Jews,and I didn't speak out because I
wasn't a Jew.Then they came for meand there was no one left to
speak out for me.
i'd rather burn in hell with the likes of mormons, ghandi, muslims, hindus,
budhists, and whatever else isn't under the mainstream stamp of christianity
than spend an eternity in heaven with evenagelical chest pounders like this guy.
at least i'd know where to go to get a good casserole.
never heard of the guy. must have alot of spare time and a huge following.
Freedom of religion....
Poor guy. Such a sad way to live your life.
Shame on Michael de Groote for giving this guy a forum. ... A terrible decision
to give this guy publicity.
Thant's one angry white dude there.
He's just clamoring for attention!
A Christian is anyone who proclaims to follow the teachings of Christ as
contained in the Bible. Mormons follow Christs teachings. They base their
religion on love, and helping their neighbors. Mormons also believe Jesus is the
Messiah prophesied in the Bible, the Son of God, and the savior of mankind from
their sins.That all sounds like a cult to this guy?The
problem is that evangelicals are trying to redefine what a Christian is. They
would like the term Christian to mean "some one who believes like me."
"He also called Islam "a religion of hate, violence and
death."" This Keller guy sounds like a real hoot and a
great example of Christianity...I'm all in! He sure has the hate thing down. I
guess if this is an example of true Christianity, substance abuse doesn't look
all that bad. I think the Bible says that all we have to do is confess the name
of Jesus and we're saved. What is all the fuss about?
I grew up with kids whose preachers were just like this guy. They always wanted
to tell me what I believed (insert the first crazy thing that pops into your
head). When I would tell them that I did NOT believe that, they would tell me:
"You do too. I know because my preacher told me and HE'S studied it."
I've always wondered what it was there guys were studying ... it
certainly wasn't my religion!
He kind of looks like Will Ferrells character in Zoolander, Mugatu. "I'm a
hot little potato right now! I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!"
Keller must feel a need for more attention. Poor little man.
And of course he sets himself up as the judge, what a laugh.
He looks like the former tennis star John McEnroe. He seems to act
like him too.
Maybe Beck and Huntsman are some kind of "new" Mormon. They can call
themselves the PLDS - Political LDS.
If this guy was to denigrate other religions (i.e. Judaism) the way he has
Mormonism he would be ostracized. There is a double standard against used
We don't gain a thing by fighting, publishing or rebutting this guy's vitriol.
Keller gets press by making the most extreme comments. I hope the DN doesn't
continue to give him space on their pages or servers.As for Glenn
Beck, I think he is more than capable of handling Keller.
Keller is an ex-con. If Glenn Beck is exploiting Israel, how much more is
Keller exploiting his particular brand of Christianity?
Is Keller's true Christian message that everyone but him is consigned to hell?
He needs deliverance from his misery.
Where does he get his inside info on Gandhi's eternal destination?
That is a problem many self-proclaimed evangelists or ministers have they are
angry people and denouncing anyone who does not believe "exactly" as
they do. The scriptures talk about wolves in sheep's clothing. In my opinion
his acerbic remarks are anti-christian. He most likely has never done any
serious studying of the LDS religion or has he read and prayed about the Book of
Mormon. Talk about false prophets, this guy is one of them.
I agree with this man on 1 thing and 1 thing only. His opinion of racist Beck is
not alot different than mine, but as for the mormon religion he is terribly
wrong in his beliefs and writings!
I would be very upset if this man ever complimented me. If I were Beck, I would
wear this idiots venom like a badge of honor.
This preacher thinks he is a Christian?
"quasi-spiritual movement that makes him tens of millions of dollars by
brainwashing the watered-down, compromised and Biblically illiterate Christian
community"Heh what is he arguing on the basis of... "takes
one to know one"?
This preacher is an ex-con who spent almost three years in prison for insider
trading. He preaches that Mormons are cultists, Muslims are pedophiles, and
that Ghandi is burning in hell. The only thing more laughable and appalling
about his hypocrisy and claim to being a Christian is the fact that there are
actually people who listen to what he says. What a sad commentary about the
state of intelligence in America.
We shouldn't give this guy press time. He's not rational in his hatred of Islam,
the LDS Church, or many other religions. He's been sacrilegious with LDS temple
garments - wearing them at the end of one of his shows, taunting Mormons in the
process. What a sad life he must lead, being so full of such hatred all the
Yeah I am so sure that a televangelist with these claims is the right guy to use
as an example. Even if the mormon church isn't 'god's one true church' I am 100%
positive that this guy's following isn't truth either. A televangelist with a
late night/early morning program, yeah must be the way to the truth. Wow what a
People who think like this guy are all around us. That doesn't mean giving them
a platform is always a bad thing. Sure some adore the spotlight and that is why
they do this stuff. But the real reason is to show just how twisted their
thinking is and how out of sync they are from Christ's teachings.
By the way, have any of you looked at his site? How in the world is he calling
Back a scam on the christian community?? All his website is after is money. All
he does this for is money. He is a scam artist who is trying to sell salvation.
Talk about a cult following, surely he is a cult leader. Or a snake oil sales
man. Or a smoke and mirrors type of guy. Whichever you prefer.
What's this guy's point.....besides the top of his head?
I'm reminded by something Elder Maxwell once said: "..let us expect that
many will regard us indifferently. Others will see us as quaint or misled. Let
us bear the pointing fingers which, ironically, belong to those finally who,
being bored, find the 'great and spacious building' to be a stale and cramped
third-class hotel."He likely believes the hatred he spews.
Ultimately, he will see things as they really are and as they really will be.
A strange article. And the point is? Its obvious from the views that this guy
holds that he is not playing with a 'full deck'. We should move on and ignore
Of course Beck also attacks other Christian groups himself (recall his telling
people to leave their church if they found "social justice" on their
websites)... and reformed Judaism... and Islam... and kinda called a Hindu holy
river "something that sounds more like a disease", but these attacks
by Keller are beyond what Beck does.
This guy would make a great Klansman ....
This guy should do improv. He is that comical.Beck gets his money from
sponsors who advertise on his show or networks who air his shows. I'll bet
this fanatic lives the life of a millionaire by convincing his "sheep"
to send him money in exchange for a "clear conscience" like so many
other televangelists. This guy is more a follower of satan that anyone he
is singling out. He should realize that when he points a finger at someone else,
the rest of his fingers are pointed back at himself.
I only aspire to go wherever Gandhi would go in the next life...Someone please tell me the difference between the hate taught by Keller and
the hate taught by the radical Imams who sent the men out to hijack four planes
on 9-11. Keller would have crucified Christ in his day, because he
would have threatened his beliefs.
Won't he be surprised...
Keller likes to follow the profit. I choose to follow the Prophet.
Bill Keller??? Never heard of him. Sounds like the kind of guy that if he ever
had an original thought it would die of loneliness...
atl134i agree. i'm not a huge fan of beck but i haven't heard him
tell america that he knew for a fact someone was burning in hell because they
weren't christian.it's interesting that bill keller picks on beck's
faith. if you were to take away beck's faith, i bet he and keller see eye to
eye on lots of things. i don't know of any sources or how to find this out
(this is just me thinking out loud and someone feel free to correct me if i'm
wrong) but i would think that beck's political views would be a huge bandwagon a
lot of evangelical christian's would jump on.from what was written
in the article, it just sounds like mr. keller is one of those christian types
who puts a monopoly on christianity. this is the type of "christian"
that opponents of christianity love to make poster boys out of.
I am no Beck fan, I think he preaches intolerance and contention. This Keller
guy takes it to the next level which is even scarier. If it were not so scary I
would say that Beck is getting some of what he dishes out.I see and
hear fellow LDS say absurd things about Islam or Jews etc and I shake my head.
This portion of LDS people need to realize that if others hate ______, they will
hate you too. Don't be part of the problem.Chose to remove
contention, judgement and a sense of superiority and you life will be better for
it.M. Russell Ballard, Quorum of the 12 Apostles:If we are
truly disciples of the Lord Jesus Christ, we will reach out with love and
understanding to all of our neighbors at all times.Teachings of
Gordon B. Hinckley , 661, 665 We must work harder to build mutual
respect, an attitude of forbearance, with tolerance one for another regardless
of the doctrines and philosophies which we may espouse. Concerning these you and
I may disagree. But we can do so with respect and civility
I bet you $20 this guy will be in the news for some kind of arrest in the
future. I'm guessing either a gay prostitution sting, money laundering, or
child porn.These TV preachers, who prey on dim-witted rural folks,
are almost always into those sorts of things.
I am a Mormon who grew up in another Christian church. I had many reasons for
changing my religion, but not the least of which was the great example that many
high profile Mormons in our society. It is hard for me to understand why people
want to attack those who are doing good be they Mormon, Baptists, Hindu or
Moslem, etc. I have my feelings about other faiths, but this I know, we are all
better off when good people do good things. I wouldn't care if a hundred
criminals became converted to become good Methodists and totally changed their
lives...the world would be a better place. I think it is best to focus on
those who make the world better and those who make it worse. We need more of
the former and less of the latter.
This is the guy who became a minister after serving three years in prison for
insider trading. Of course, a person can repent and reform--but that would have
the tendency to make them less judgmental and more tolerant.
Actually, Mr Keller, if you know for sure that Mormonism, Judeaism, and other
religious groups are in or from hell, then you must be there or from there,
also. It takes one to know one. Your narrowmindedness and retoric shows your
hate. So, doing what you are accusing others of doing shows your hipocracy.
Your retoric and agenda are a non-factor in the grand scheme of things. But one
thing is certain, you will be held accountable for the spiritual damage you are
doing. I pray that you will receive some sort of a wake-up call, as did Saul,
as explained in Acts in the New Testament. You are doing the exact same thing
he was doing, only his action was more physically demonstrated, but yours is
Life on its own must have this man's undies in a knot. Enjoyed
reading the article and will ask a special blessing for Keller - he needs them
and from the sound of it - desperately.
Now we all understand a bit more why a Mormon will never be elected to be
President of the United States.
Wait a minute, Brave Sir, I'm a dim-witted rural folk and I still can't
understand the guy. I think it is right that he probably is behind in his
boat payments. Some people just need attention.
Wait, Glenn Beck is a mormon?
Unfortunately, the fundamentalist Christians quote N.T. scripture which states
that Satan is 'Who' opposes Jesus's teaching, and thus, by extension, anyone who
chooses anything but a fundamentalist Christian religion is either a henchman of
Satan or, they say, Satan himself, in the "guise" of whomever they are
targeting. Sad but true. I have run into that kind of 'logic' before. Its
pretty convenient to be able to undermine any arguments against your chosen
faith by being able to say that the 'other' is by definition in the role of dark
forces in league with the devil himself.
So let me ask....Why do so many Utah Mormons want to be associated
and included with such vial evangelical Republicans?
I flat out don't care what fundamental Christian evangelists think of Mormonism,
which leaves me free to enjoy watching someone else try to shred Beck and expose
him as a fraud.
I consider myself to be well educated and well read, yet, Ive never heard of
this fellow until now. I'm sure he is doing this for mere altruistic reasons,
rather than financial.
Mr. Keller needs a new wig consultant before me sticks his head out from under
the rock when he subsists.
This guy is attacking Beck and his media empire in order to get more attention
directed at HIS church than he would be able to otherwise. The
reason he makes inflammatory statements is in order get attention and sell his
brand of doctrine in an ever increasing sea of "Christianity". Kind of like an out of work actor that comes out of the blue and claims
to be the victim of some type of abuse as a child. It gets the camera back on
them and they start making money again!
I am LDS, do not listen to Beck (never will), and amazed that someone who
professes to be Christian would be filled with such hate and ignorance. It is
people like this who give religion a bad name ... making claims without any
evidence to support his hate filled rhetoric.
'At the end of today's press release, Keller says, "All I have ever asked
is that Beck and members of his cult be honest and truthful about what they
believe."'I'm not sure if Keller is referring to Beck's
religion or his Fox New following. I laugh when I think of the Fox News
following as a cult- though I think they're pretty clear on what they believe.
I pretty much disagree with everything I hear coming from Glenn Beck as a
political commentator, however, as "Brother Beck", I'll always take
his side agains whack jobs like this.
I was getting mad until I saw his hair. Now I just feel sorry for him.
This Keller guy reminds of the Crusaders that captured Jerusalem in the first
Crusade, when they ordered to kill all of the Muslim population. When it was
difficult to tell the Muslims, Jews and Christians apart the Crusaders were told
to kill them all and let God in heaven be the judge.Im glad this
Keller guy doesnt have much authority over anything except a few people and a
large mouth, because he sounds like the type of guy that would make decisions
like were made during the first crusade. But dont worry Mr. Keller I am
very honest and open about the Cult I am a part of.
Never heard of him before and wonder why we're even talking about him. Doesn't
the fact that he wants on Beck's show say it all? Someone to be ignored.
The thing that will get me everytime, is this guy says he is a Christian, right?
And he knows all the answers, right? And the the LDS faith does not follow the
Bible, right? But he does,right? Doesn't the Bible clearly state, "Judge
not, lest ye be judged of.' Right? Just saying.........
Wow - this is miraculous news! Apparently, a guy named Reverend Bill Keller has
been handed down from on high the Totally Ultimate Frosted Toupee of
Christian-Naming Power...I had no idea that this had happened! Now, all
disagreement on who is a Christian may cease; we'll all just ask His Holy
Hairness the Rev. Keller who is & who ain't. That ought to settle
things.And as a Mormon myself, I've finally been set straight...I am
going to Hell.With Gandhi.And probably Mother Theresa
(are Catholics on the Good List, Reverend?)Seriously, if some people
spent as much time actually trying to be a Christian as they do trying to decide
who isn't one, this world would be a much better place.
This guy and Glenn Beck seem to be out of the same mold. No wonder he doesn't
What a sad, sick, silly little man. Do insider trading and extreme evangelical
have that much in common.
Well, The thing about this guy is that he seems to know everything,
but we are not mormons. We are of the Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter Day
Saints. That is right the Church of JESUS CHRIST. Religion is a great thing
and there are many out there, but at least they all are giving something to hope
for after this life. Keep what you believe, but also be willing to pay the
consequence in the end. Deep down in his heart, he knows what he is saying will
come back on him, but he is getting publicity and that is all he cares about
now. We will all get the chance to know the "truth of all things".
Haven't cared a whit about Glenn Beck--until now.
Wow, someone else who knows what you need to do for salvation.
@IDC: Hahaha!!! I love you!
gee Televangelist Bill Keller sounds like a wonderful man...nothing like a
Televangelist to add credibility to politics. Televangelist's are about as
credible as professional wrestlers...they are in it for the entertainment and
shock factor. These pentacostal,bible banging, minsters are worried sick about a
Mormon president and the impact that would have on their bottom line ($$$$). It's all about money and these Televangelist imposters who appeal to the
simple minded and ignorant will say anything and do anything to defend their
turf. The LDS church is growing faster than any Christian church in the US and
many of those converts are coming from the protestant ranks. Glen Beck is a BIG
threat to this character because Glenn is gaining alot of converts himself from
the protestant south who see him as not only a defender of the constitution but
also an evangelist of Christian values.
This Preachers ideas may sound radical to some of you, but it isn't new, and
this guy isn't alone in his way of thinking. Look up "Christian countercult
movement" or "discernment ministries". It is well organized and
has been going on for a while now. This guy is the same as all the other
ministries that are setup to attack other religions.
I agree with Andy 1:54. Why does the Deseret News give this guy a photo and
print? He is a nobody and a nothing! Please no further articles on him and what
he thinks! Glenn Beck will take care of him nicely. This is nothing but
hate-mongering. "There necessarily needs be opposition in all things."
The irony here is that this silly man's opinion of Islam lines up pretty well
with Beck's. Every Faith has its nuts. I would hope reasonable people will not
judge the LDS Church because of Beck's irrational priestcrafts just because he
happens to be a Church member right now. By the same token, let's not assume
all evangelical Christians are as wacky as this guy.
Mr. Keller (Not Reverand)Has a hate issue. Where did he get his authority to say
what he says. Just another mans opinion. He needs to focus on the prevention of
sin rather than bashing another church that doesn't share his view point. Life
is too short, too many other distractions to lend any credence to his hate
"Keller's press release says he 'takes the evangelical position that Mormon
doctrine is 100 percent inconsistent with Biblical Christianity and that a
Mormon is no more a Christian than a Muslim is.'"Having read
the King James Version of the New Testament from cover to cover 80+ times, I
respectfully disagree with Mr. Keller's assertion.So I guess we'll
just have to agree to disagree.
Great. Now, Beck gets to be a "Mormon" martyr. Keller's offense? He
conflates Beck with "Mormonism." Heaven help us.
Mr. Keller seems to choose which commandments he wants to obey. Thou shalt not
bare false witness... remember that one Mr. Keller? I'm not a Beck fan, but I
don't speak lies about him. Keller is the dangerous man. Maybe he's related to
Really why is this news? Lets see another evangelist claiming mormons arent
christian. This guy only has a online show, man you made it to the big times! I
bet the Savior is really proud for all your lies and hatred. I mean thats what
he preached right?
Keller is an extreme bigot who promotes a hateful and discriminatory agenda
which he claims is Christianity. Instead, he has hijacked Christianity and
foists his rhetoric upon those who are too ignorant and foolish to discern
between right from wrong. It's of interest that he wishes to be on the Glenn
Beck program. Perhaps all that fame and money that Beck has accumulated has its
appeal to Keller. It's likely that Keller wishes to rub shoulders with the devil
so he can have some of his success and notoriety.
Looks like a snl chararcter.Who cares. We cant let these attacks define us
by our stupid reactions folks. Its purely the advasary at his best.
I am a BYU graduate, but am not active in the LDS Church. It continues to drive
me crazy, however, when one group of "Christians" determines that
another group are not Christians. Perhaps the LDS Church brings some of it on
itself by its claim to be the "one true church". In the early days of
the Protestant Reformation, "heretics" were burned at the stake for
deviating from the Catholic Church. In the Balkans, Catholics and Orthodox
still occasionally shoot each other, as do Catholics and Protestants in Northern
Ireland. A friend just today told me that religion as a whole has a negative
effect on mankind. Certainly, those who claim to follow Christ ought to respect
others who do so differently. This kind of bigotry should have no place in our
This guys is just as much of a nut case as Glenn Beck. Unfortunately people who
hear Glenn, think all mormons are like him.
I sense a lot of anger... and very little love... in that guy's rhetoric based
rant.Not very Christ-like. I think Christ would encourage us to
love our neighbors as ourselves (INCLUDING Mormons)... whether they are right or
Who is this guy and why is such a big deal being made of it? There are so many
so-called evangelical stations now and so many so-called ministers that it's
hard to keep up with them. I had enough of the tv preachers and their scandals
in the 1980s.
So where in the Bible does it say that those who actually follow Christ are
going to hell?
Is this guy from 1840's Missouri... The more things change, the more they stay
the same. Can you say "Hawn's Mill"
Christians tend to be more tolerant of people with differing views than
adherents of any other religion. There are exceptions, Keller apparently being
Religion. Everybody's right, nobody has to prove anything, and we want it to
play an increasingly important role in the political arena. No wonder we're so
I don't understand. Are Mormoms a cult, why would he say that?Definition of 'cult' Random House Webster's College Dictionary 1. (n.) cult a particular system of religious worship, esp. with
reference to its rites and ceremonies.
How can anyone associate such judgment, hate, and derision with
"Christianity." If that's part of being "Christian" then
certainly the Mormons are not, by Keller's definition. His extreme, harsh, and
lonely station IS Hell.
I would put Glenn Beck and Bill Keller in the same race to see who can make the
most money. Both are radical with no other goal in mind than to make as much
money as possible before their popularity runs out as both are sure to do
sooner rather than later!!
I don't know about you guys, but anyone on TV asking for my money is definately
on the up and up. Do I get Kinoki foot pads or magic bracelets that make me run
farther if I send money to him? If so, I'm all in baby!
I, as a Mormon, happily admit that I believe in a "different Jesus"
than the one Bill Keller believes in.
Rev. Keller says Mormons are going to hell.Glenn Beck says Democrats are
going to hell.Pot, met kettle.
How can you say no to hair like that, it's magnificent. Let me get my checkbook.
All the DMN has to do is put the name Beck in the title of a news story and
it'll draw 100 or more comments in a couple of hours. Why are we supposed to
care about this guy so much?
I would ask if Mr. Keller has ever read LDS published teachings,or is he just
going by what others have said about our belief?Years ago, I met a
former Evangelica minister in Florida who said he left his ministry and Church,
because he was hired to write false and true-but-misleading information
(sophistry) about the Mormon Church. He said his conscience wouldn't let him do
it, so he quit the job and the faith that condoned the lies. Mr. Keller, and
others, should not seek the truth of the LDS belief from enemies of the Church;
after all, who would go to Allstate to learn about State Farm? Does that make
any sense at all? I'd guess that Mr. Keller, like many other
Evangelical ministers, is a good, honest, and decent man, who has simply been
mislead by false information and feels he is doing the world a service by
preaching against the "Cult" of Mormonism --just as Saul felt, as he
preached against the Christians, and even consented to their death, before he
was corrected by the Lord on the road to Damascus, and subsequently, became
Paul, the Apostle."Pray for your enemies."
SyracuseCoug | 5:16 p.m. May 17, 2011 Syracuse, Ut I don't know
about you guys, but anyone on TV asking for my money is definately on the up and
up. Do I get Kinoki foot pads or magic bracelets that make me run farther if I
send money to him? If so, I'm all in baby! ================== Are you talking about Keller, or Beck?Both are preaching hell,
fire and brimstone to the scared and gullible.
This might all suggest that Mormons have no place in the Republican Party at the
national level. Not that this guy is the poster child for all Evangelicals but
perhaps the most visible symptom of the schism that clearly exists between
Evangelicals and Mormons, though the schism is more so coming from the
And So, Mr Keller, just what do you believe? What kind of haate is your god?
LDS should know that when they court the extremes in their politics, their
fellow travelers in politics will extol them in religion. The evangelical right
is never going to accept LDS people, they will only use them. It's time for LDS
people to stand up and be different with their own unique brand of politics.
What a pathetic thing. Why do we have to have an attitude of hate towards those
that we don't agree with?
LDS Liberal | 5:17 p.m.When did Glen Beck say, "Democrats are
going to Hell"???Can you show us? Or are you just creating a
little make believe rhetoric to serve your agenda?
Let's see if I've got this straight. Christ told Joseph Smith
". . . that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong; and the
Personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in his
sight; that those professors were all corrupt; that: "they draw near to me
with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, they teach for doctrines the
commandments of men, having a form of godliness, but they deny the power
thereof."Bill Keller claims to be an authority on which church
is Christ's Church.I wonder what Christ thinks of Bill Keller's
authority to speak in the name of Christ?
Good grief. Another vitriolic, divisive, hate mongering loud mouth. Does this
guy make anyone else out there uncomfortable? I do not care what your belief
system is, you have a right to it, as long as it does not harmfully infringe on
the fundamental rights of others. Mormonism is a faith of choice, as is any
mainstream Christian denomination, as is Judaism, Islam, Zoroastrianism or
whatever. I tire of "religious" leaders who try to forward their
agendas by denigrating others. Shut up already!
This probley the most attention this person has ever had. this is the first time
I ever heard of him. And remember by their fruits you shall know them.
He could have a reason why he is targeting mormons since they consider
themselves "christian" yet are not christian by other christians.
Just another example of why Romney has no chance. The radical right controlled
by ignorant evangelicals would never support a Mormon. They'd rather send
someone completely incompetent, like Palin, than Romney.
re. wandrew "Perhaps the LDS Church brings some of it on itself by
its claim to be the 'one true church.' The early Christians also brought it upon
themselves by claiming to be the "one true church." The early
Christians, like the LDS were persecuted and lied about and mocked. Sounds like
the LDS are in good company. Or are there several "true churches?"
Is it that time to pull out all the stops, think you, Brother Keller? I can
appreciate your views, kind of, but might I suggest that is is probably time
that you quit telling Mormons what they don't know what they believe and
actually go out yourself and get to know a few of them. There are probably some
right down the street where you live, just around the corner from your office,
and helping in the disaster scenes you drive right past. When others have a
better religious solution, better religious answers, and exhibit better
Christlike behavior than you yourself are teaching, there is always the
possibility that it is your train that got off the track, not the other way
around. I realize the Mormons are speeding right past you, and that it isn't
fair, and that you want to slow them down, but really? Listen to yourself. Get
a grip man. From the sound of your rants, you have got bigger problems in your
personal life than just Mormons. I know a very good LDS psychologist you could
see. All the best man. Hang on.
Glenn Beck, Mormonism attacked by Bill Keller, minister who targeted Mitt
Romney. DO NOT KNOCK FLORIDA. It is a bit disheartening to see a political
candidate like Romney raise $10 million dollars in a day. His goal is to
ultimately raise $1 BILLION to try and become President. President Obama is also
planning on raising $1 BILLION. For what Romney raised in one day, we have the
pieces in place to turn this nation back to God and His Truth, while leading
millions of lost souls to faith in Jesus. Just $10 million to change the
spiritual course of our nation. God uses human instruments. Everyone expects
someone else to answer the call, and miss His blessings that flow from our
obedience. Please take a few minutes today and ask the Lord what HE is calling
you to do to insure this need is met. Over the past 12 years, men and women of
God have stepped up at the 11th hour to further His work at Liveprayer. If this
devotional is a blessing to you, maybe you have a friend or family member that
would like to start receiving this daily word. Bill Keller is a good man.
Why do Utah Republicans [many are Mormons] seek to closely associate themselves
with radicals like this on the far-right?
Keller's simply trying to promote himself (and make money) by being
Keller's comments are important because he has a very large following. His email
list, if I recall correctly, has more than two million names. Beck is, of
course, important for his influence and following. I recommend reading Keller's
full press release if you want to see his point of view in greater detail and in
context.By the way, I have never heard an anecdote about somebody
joining (or rejecting) the LDS Church because of Glenn Beck's shows. If anybody
has any story about joining or rejecting the church because of Beck, please feel
free to email me at the newspaper at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Sounds like he follows the radical Jerimiah Wright and Bill Ayers, just like
Obama. For sure a radical Christian.
Uncle Charles 6:14 p.m."They both don't understand the
doctrines of the restored gospel."Why not? Did God tell you
that hard-right conservatism is the Only True Political System?Uncle
Charles, I may strongly disagree with posters like Redshirt and Mike Richards,
but at least they attempt to make coherent arguments with something to back them
up. You, on the other hand, do nothing but call people names. It's easy to
tear down, but can you build up? Can you offer solutions instead of insults?
I'm guessing that if you respond to this, you'll just call me KGB
again. That'll show me...
I agree with Michael De Groote's decision to write, and the DN's decision to
publish, this story. It is clearly news with relevance in THIS particular
market. The article doesn't lend any credibility to Bill Keller's
statements, either. His statements included in the article are not accompanied
by any editorial comment regarding their validity, but rather, by commentary
regarding their likely intent.Readers are left to draw their own
inferences about the Mr. Keller's credibility (and sanity); and, if the vast
majority of the responses in this comment forum are any indication, few people
other than like-minded evangelicals (and I don't believe that all, or even most,
evangelicals share his extreme, vitriolic point of view) will take Mr. Keller
seriously or view his statements as anything more than an affront to true
Interesting article quoting Bill the extremist bigot and uninformed
"Christian" preacher. It is obvious he feels very strongly against
any religion but his and has created for himself a safe tunnel to take pot shots
at Mormons, Muslims, and anyone who doesn't believe as he does. He never does
say what he believes nor what a personal relationship with Jesus Christ means to
him. Poor guy.
What a shame that this hate monger has such a large following. People such as
him populate temple square at every General Conference. They rant and rave with
a satanic voices, screaming hate as the scalding desert winds, yet they give no
room to listen to, or hear the still small voice of Christ.Its so
sad that people blindly follow his hate. They think that because he is a
"minister of God" he must be right and know what he is talking about.
Our dear Savior warned about such wolves in sheep's clothing who want to devour
and destroy. Those who follow such hate must have a strange perception of our
Lord. We need to pray for those lost souls that they find Christ with His love
and caring. He loves all of us and wants us to come unto Him by loving one
another. By this shall men know that we are His disciples - that we have love
one to another.
Shame on any papers that even print this drivel from a warped soul.
He is just trying to get free pub for his next fundraising telecast. I am sure
he has more bills coming this month or maybe he needs that 6th house or that
fine piece of art he found in paris on one of his expensive vacations. These
dudes are funny!Stay Classy
I don't like this guy either. But neither do I think Glenn Beck represents every
Like Glenn Beck or hate him, he has many Christian ministers like Keller deeply
concerned. Not because Beck might be leading souls astray, although that is his
stated concern. Beck has the zeal of an evangelical with the doctrine of a
Mormon and he has people's attention. What Keller and many like him are
concerned about with Beck, and the LDS church in general, is that they are
starting to cut into their profit margin. Nobody with a monopoly on souls and
wallets likes competition.
Beck and Keller are like two peas in a pod.
@fresnogirlYou said: I grew up with kids whose preachers were just
like this guy. They always wanted to tell me what I believed (insert the first
crazy thing that pops into your head). When I would tell them that I did NOT
believe that, they would tell me: "You do too. I know because my preacher
told me and HE'S studied it." Excellent!When I run
into this situation I would say; "Hey, you're good. What am I thinking
now?"When they could not read my mind I would ask; "If you
can't read my mind then why do you think you know what I believe? Nobody can
speak for me but me."
As Mormons, we kind of need to follow the example of the Mormon Jesus and turn
the other cheek and say, like our Savior of old, "Father forgive him for he
knows not what he does". So much hate. He is the kind of person that
gives Christians a bad name. So sad.
I think the LDS faithful should be more offended that he ties Beck's absurd
views to church theology than anything.
This guy has earned himself a place right up there with the so-called
"Westboro Baptist Church" as a pseudo-religion that is filled with
hate and a lust for publicity.I am not a Mormon or a Beck fan and
this guy's rantings just disgust me.
This is what happens when you mix politics and religion to make money. Beck has forced his theological views and spread them via his outrageous
show.Now he must face the consequences.
I do not appreciate the way you Deseret reported this story. It's poor taste and
slanted and gives Killer another forum to smear Beck and Mormons. Why would you
give Keller this platform? It would have been balanced and objective to have
gotten some of the other TV pastors and ministers to rebutall against Keller
showing support for Beck and Mormons, you really dropped the ball and the real
Is Keller associated with the Media Matters Group?
RE: it is time: Could be that you are right. Sometimes the truth hurts.
Everybody should stay home and mind their own business, or perhaps rebutalls to
the rebutalls would smooth things out. But, much of the problem seems to be that
Beck has decided there is more money to be made in pitching religion than
selling political propaganda. Anyway, Beck is a smart business head and he will
find away to make money on it. Stay tuned for the next episode.
Bill Keller makes him sound like a cult leader. Who happens to make millions on
"christianity". Even better he does it on tv and can't be questioned
about his doctrine.Keller is a bit scarry.
Hypocrisy at its finest...
This is nothing new, Catholics consider Mormonism a non-Christian religion, see
Catholic Answers. While mainline conservative Christian Churches:
Lutheran,Baptists and Bible believing non-denominational churches,Pentecostal as
well, consider Mormonism a cult like Jehovahs Witnesses.Mormonism denies
all the essentials of the Christian faith.
I may be confused on this - it happens quite often - but isn't one tenet of
Christianity to love your neighbor and to welcome them into the fold with open
arms, rather than insulting and shunning them? Because this man seems to be
doing very little of the former, and an awful lot of the latter.
I'm sure glad I belong to a religion that NEVER teaches that people of other
faiths are already condemned to Hell simply because of their choice of religion.
My religion teaches me that EVERYBODY has the opportunity to get to Heaven and
only Jesus Christ will be the ultimate judge. Too bad this guy obviously thinks
HE is the judge. Someday he'll realize how wrong he has been.
Man, the hypocrisy is rank on this board. Imagine Mormons criticizing this guy
for saying he knows where people will end up in an afterlife. Really, Mormons?
Guess what. You guys do the exact same thing. So, really, don't get so worked up
when someone else does it. Also, Mormons are getting worked up about
this guy saying he knows which Church is Christian and which isn't? Which Church
is true and which aren't? Really, you guys need to relax, he is doing nothing
that you guys don't do constantly. And don't even try to claim that
this guy is criticizing other Churches and Mormons don't. Just on it's face
that's laughable. But specifically every time Mormons make the claim that the
LDS Church is the one "true" Church, they insult all other Churches.
The arrogance. I've heard, plenty of times, what Mormons think of the Catholic
Church, and their name they have for her. So maybe you guys might
want to come down off your high horses, and show some of that Christian value
you all claim so highly, and ease off the hate of this guy.
Definitely not a Glenn Beck fan here. If Ghandi is not going to heaven--I am
toast. Seriously-mark me down as extra crispy.
You can't help but just laugh off attention seeking people like this. 1. This guy obviously doesn't know too much about Mormons. 2.
Telling a Mormon they aren't Christian is like telling Peyton Manning he doesn't
play football because he's a basketball player. 3. Anyone who
professes to be Christian can claim holiness and Christianity about themselves
all they want to, but a true Christian would never say stuff like this about
anyone else, because Jesus Christ would never be this hate-filled and aggressive
towards anybody. Mormons follow Jesus Christ. 4. He wants Beck to be
honest about what his "cult" believes? I didn't know we were a cult
first of all, but I've been a Mormon for 18 years, are there really any secret
beliefs that I and the rest of the world are unaware of? Yea, didn't think so.
5. Reading about this guy was probably the funnest 5 minutes of my
@KGB: I responded to you last night and they were on there and then some
sensitive censor removed them.Oh well, suffice it to say that I
don't call names; that's what your uber-Progressive friends on here do.I support all of my positions with facts and substance. I also support my
comments with gospel principles.Nowhere do I find force through
government in the gospel and yet that's what all of you Lefty Mormons on here
propose. That plan was rejected.The real plan is choice.This minister doesn't have a clue about gospel principles but equals the
hating, vitriolic comments that are posted on here each and every day. Just read
Mav, esquire, Dukie, Christy, MormonDem, LDS Lib, Pagan and many others. With
the exception of Pagan, I think everyone else claims to be LDS and yet their
posts go contrary to the gospel teachings and are the same as the Rev who this
article is about.If you can prove to me that Christ is all about
force through government intervention and making people do good, please, share
chapter and verse as I've never read it in any scriptures.
Uncle Charles | 10:35 a.m.Your post would only get un-posted
IF...1. It was "UNTRUE"2. It was "OFFENSIVE" 3. Had too many characters, all caps, etc.So.... now we know that
your reply to KGB was one of the above (offensive, factually untrue, or over 200
characters).I wonder which one got your post removed. Probably not
too many characters... so that just leaves the other two.
Beck is every bit as strange as Keller is. Even moreso. Have you read his
comments about the rally he plans to hold in Isreal? Beck is completely losing
@2 bits: Thanks for the analysis but since they both were posted they must have
met the requirements. In other words, one of the censors actually READ it BEFORE
it was posted and felt it was okay.My guess is someone whined about
it so they removed it. I did have to laugh though at your
"untrue" assumption. If posts had to be factually true, then I don't
think any would make it on, do you? Everything is an opinion unless you want to
argue that 1 + 1 = 3.Taking offense is in the eye of the beholder.
See Elder Bednar's talk on those who seek to be offended so they can claim
victim status to feel better about themselves.Also, if you can prove
that any of my posts aren't true, then post away.I think the Dnews
is hiring part-time censors....maybe you could apply? Anything
else?mark: it was Christ who said the LDS church is the only true
and living church on the planet. I'll take His word over yours every day of the
Sounds like his ratings are hurting due to Glenn Beck or else why would he want
be on his show? I wonder if people who do this really believe the garbage they
are spewing? I want to know what it is he wants Beck to "fess up" to
believing. I think it's more about the 'almighty dollar' than the 'Almighty
God' this guy is fuming about.
There is an abundance of evil out there putting pressure on Christians of all
types - LDS, Catholic, Baptist, Methodist, etc - there are secularists who want
to remove all traces of faith and religion from the public square. I tell
Christians who would question my faith that with all this evil coming from the
outside, it is counter-productive for Christians to turn on each other because
we don't all pray the exact same way. I have issues with other denominations. I
don't beleive in praying to saints, like the Catholics do. I don't believe
church members should be allowed to vote on the doctrine they follow, like some
Presbyterians do. But I'm not going to write books about how wrong they are, or
stand outside their churches and confront them as they enter. I am busy working
out my own salvation. I frankly don't have time to "save" a whole
denomination from their beliefs, no matter how wrong I think they are.
He is just trying to compliment the Church of Jesus Christ...That,
or he has forgotten that the earliest (pre-creedal) Christian Church was called
a "cult."Back in the day...
It almost sounds like this guy is trying to really convince himself of
something. That sounds like a miserable way to live life. It is too short to
hate like this.
Poor Mr. Keller, his donations must be way down. Have never met who hated
Muslims, who didn't hate Mormons also.
@Mark, 9:59am. You're correct Mark, in that we mormons talk about other
religions amongst ourselves. But, who doesn't? The difference here is that
Keller goes on a public rampage. You'll never see the LDS Church doing that.
I've never seen anyone in any of our church meetings, openly and publically
talking down about other religions. For some reason though, other churches tend
to go out of their way to express their views on Mormonism. We have a community
christian church here in my community in Colorado that actually has a Sunday
School class that is dedicated to tearing down the LDS church. I never could
figure that out - why a church or a person (Keller), would consume so much
negative energy and aggression, in an attempt to destroy the LDS church. From
the beginning, people like Keller have been after us. But, like those in the
past, Keller will eventually go the way of all the earth, and the church will
still be here.
"mark: it was Christ who said the LDS church is the only true and living
church on the planet. I'll take His word over yours every day of the
week."Well there you go Uncle Charles, you asked if anyone
could prove that any of your posts are untrue to post away. Well right there,
your comment about Christ is not true. You are just making it up. Prove that you
aren't. By the way, I'm sure your comment got removed because it was
offensive, but you, instead of trying to recognize what was offensive about it,
try to blame the person that was offended. That's like the school
yard bully, or the wife beater. It's the other persons fault, right? They
shouldn't be upset about what you did, right? After all they asked for it. (and,
also, that's silly you saying you don't call names in your posts, when in the
exact same post you call names. "You lefty Mormons", indeed,
"your uber-progressive friends", don't try to pretend those aren't
being used derogatorily.)Okay, your turn, let's see you dance and
I've heard the same line that this guy gives my whole life. He is trying to
save me, I get it. I'm flattered. Unfortunately, the Holy Ghost is not taking
his cues from him, since the Holy Ghost has renewed my spiritual rebirth
repeatedly over the years as a fully believing member of the Church of Jesus
Christ of Latter-day Saints over the objections of Rev. Keller.
"You're correct Mark, in that we mormons talk about other religions amongst
ourselves. But, who doesn't? The difference here is that Keller goes on a public
rampage. You'll never see the LDS Church doing that."Keith, so
you are saying that it is okay as long as it is done quietly and not in public?
Thanks for your honest reply, but I think my point still stands, many Mormons
have had highly critical words about other religions. Especially in the last few
years many of the LDS members have been highly insulting to Islam. And like I
said, their pet name for the Catholic Church is a dandy. (And I would lay money
on the fact that I could find instances of that name being pronounced from the
pulpit at the highest levels in the past, as well as other comments about other
churches.) But I'll give credit to the LDS Church, lately they have
been very good at being officially accepting of other religions, officially.I wish the members would follow the example.
Sounds like the Mormon missionaries have been converting his flock. I guess this
guy missed the part in the Bible where Jesus told us to judge not the we be not
judged. Condemning souls to hell isn't his job, even though he may have self
elevated himself to that position. Rather than attacking other religions he
should be teaching the truthful parts of his own religion.
Ya wanna know where the "deep dark" secrets of Mormonism come from?
Wait for it...wait for it... From secret meetings with the Holy Ghost and the
Lord. It is called prayer, study, obedience, service, and temple attendance
(among other things). It is very simple. The Holy Ghost fills you with light
and unfolds the meanings of the scriptures and the words of the prophets to you.
When we then treat what we receive with reverence, care, and obey promptings,
we receive more of those "deep dark Mormon secrets". Funny how there
is nothing dark about them. Sometimes the deep things are right under our
noses. The Spirit brings joy, peace, knowledge, enlightenment, gratitude and
understanding that attend these super secret rendezvous with the Lord. The bottom line is that communion with the Holy Ghost and the Lord IS
the inner circle of the Mormon church. The church leads you there and has been
granted authority to do so. Having the Holy Ghost with you puts you "in
the know" of the Mormon church. That is what Rev. Keller has as yet not
Who hasn't this guy condemned? Probably the people who pay him money to preach.
He really condemned Ghandi? I thought the Bible said God is the
Judge. It won't be long before his guy will be exposed as having an affair or
stealing money from the Church coffers. He'll cry on camera, say he is sorry,
then walk off the stage laughing at the millions he's banked. This
guy is a fraud.
Stay classy Keller. If Ghandi's going to hell, then what earthly good are you,
since apparently you're in a position to judge him...
@Mark,1:37pm. For the most part, I believe that we're in agreement. The
disconnect we have is in the "motives" of those who speak ill of any
religion. I firmly believe that we are ALL ok to talk about other religions.
We need to evaluate and compare for ourselves, what we believe and don't
believe. I don't see that as being wrong. Regarding your mention of the
"label" that you say we put on the Catholic church, you're right to a
limited degree. The point here though, is that we don't go out in a premeditated
way and publicly slander the Catholic church. I am curious however, how you're
in a position to be painting such a broad brush, assuming it's a fact that most
all mormons speak ill of other religions. I for one, and I believe most mormons
are the same as I am, simply don't waste my time with such things. I don't feel
threatened by Keller, or anyone else. There's more important things to do with
my time. I'm not one to be "casting stones" at anyone. Thanks for the
I think it's unfair to be so ridiculed just because we are mormons. I feel bad
for people are so blinded by the fake information that is spread around by
people like him but I do think that if he would give us a chance to talk about
it and for him to at least try to understand where we come from instead of
releasing such rude attacks toward us. Still he is a child of God and I still
love him like a brother! :)
Most of Kellers statements are accurate. Except for stating that Mormons are
promoting a lie. I believe Mormons are different from other Christians becuase
Mormons have the purest form of the Christian Gospel. All other Christians just
have bits and pieces. Islam is indeed a 1,400 year old lie and Mormon doctrine
is indeed different from some biblical doctrines. Simply because Mormons have
been given the true doctrines directly through revelation. Most Mormons
probably will end up in Hell (terrestial kingdom...along with Keller) because
they don't follow their religion with exactness. Keller will sure be surprised
when he finds out that Christ is directly leading the Mormon faith!
I can understand why Keller Corp. is so afraid of the Mormon "cult".
The value of Mr. Keller's stock is dropping like a rock because of the efforts
of approximately 55,000 19 year old boys with horns leading astray corporate
contributors. If this keeps up, the good preacher may have to trade in his
Bentley for a Corolla.
If televangelism defines Christianity, I want no part of it. Mormons
are followers of the biblical Christ. We are glad this man does not represent us
in defining a "Christian" for us, but sorry for those Evangelicals
(who follow this guy) for how poorly this reflects on them, with his narrow
view, and limited understanding of the biblical Jesus. If this man is 100%
convinced that Mormons don't believe in the biblical Jesus, he either doesn't
know Mormons or doesn't know Jesus.
I've never heard other religions ridiculed by LDS. I've been to many
meetings, in many places. I know some formerly interpreted some Book of Mormon
statements as references to Catholics, but Prophets from the beginning have
indicated that this wasn't the case. The other statement that some
use to justify hating Mormons is the one given to Joseph in the grove, about the
philosophers creeds. The creeds caused many tortures, brought dark times,
prevented Bible reading and so on, but this wasn't the good Catholics. LDS
Prophets have taught that there would be many good people of many faiths in the
first resurrectionI'm pretty sure mark is an activist, many of them
are here to "destroy" Mormonism, and have vowed to "go after your
Church" and "drive them into the ground" until prop08 is
overturned. Although it was overturned, they are still here, and often pretend
to be LDS in their comments and have met with leading anti-Mormons, perhaps for
training and resources, one in their mutual desire to "destroy."
Helen Keller was phsyically blind, Bill Keller is spiritually blind. Helen
overcame it Bill still has a long long way to go. Personally I think he was the
type of person who would have stormed Carthage Jail, thinking that he was doing
God a favor!!!
Keith, I am not trying to paint with a broad brush, I said "many
Mormons" are critical. I did not say "all", or "most",
or "the majority", I said "many". I would have no
idea if most, or the majority, of Mormons are highly critical of other
religions. I do, though, know that many are. That is hardly painting with a
broad brush. But, again, my point still stands as far as the
teachings of the LDS church, and the hypocrisy of those that do not recognize
the similarities between LDS teachings and what this man is saying: The LDS Church claims to know that other Churches are not
"true", this man claims to know the LDS Church is not Christian; the
LDS Church claims to have an understanding of where people will be in an
afterlife, so does this man. Many of the comments directed at
this man seem to be of a decidedly unchristian nature. For the
record, I, personally, don't like his tone, then again, I don't like Beck's, and
I don't like a lot of Mormons' tones. 4th comment. Silly we
can't chat longer. Thanks for the discussion, Keith.
It's always nice when someone tries to tell you what you believe. It just makes
everyone feel so warm and fuzzy.
JM: I think he was the type of person who would have stormed Carthage Jail,
thinking that he was doing God a favor! Who killed JS ? A newspaper
article in the spring of 1844. [probably Mormon]A very strong and bitter
feeling was aroused against Joseph, among many of his brethren in and around
NauvooJoseph had recently presented the revelation of Celestial Marriage to the
high council for approval, and certain members were bitterly opposed to
itFrancis Higbe a justice of the peace, sat a table in one end of the room and
administered the oath to each individual separately, in the following manner,
The candidate would step forward to the table; take up a Bible.. Raise his right
handYou solemnly swear ,before God and all holy angels, and these your brethren
by whom you are surrounded, that you will give your life, your liberty, your
influence, your all, for the destruction of Joseph Smith and his party! The
person being sworn in say, I do. About 200 hundred persons [took] the oath. (Millennial Star, Vol.46 pp 497,499,501,502 and 519)
"Most of Kellers statements are accurate. Except for stating that Mormons
are promoting a lie."I think of it this way. If you aren't
Mormon then you have to believe at least some part of Mormonism is wrong.
However, lying means to intentionally deceive which is impossible to do when you
actually believe what you are saying. So I guess to make that statement accurate
from his vantage point would be to say "I believe Mormons are promoting
something that isn't true." Or in other words similar to a 5 year old who
sincerely thought the answer to 2 + 2 was 5. The kid is wrong, but if he
believes that's the answer he's not lying.
Isn't it sad that a Christian would tell others that they aren't Christian
enough? What's the barometer for being Christlike? I think Christ taught what
it was - "love thy neighbor as thyself" and even added an update:
"Love One Another as I have loved you." Pretty clear.
Alex 1 Ya wanna know where the "deep dark" secrets of Mormonism come
from? "deep dark Mormon secrets". these super secret rendezvous with
the Lord. Secret, sacreds or sacred secrets, sounds like Alex must be a
Temple Mormon or Freemason.
donn:"Alex must be a Temple Mormon or Freemason."Actually, I am both.
Uncle Charles 10:35 a.m.Matthew 10: 17-25Jesus' words,
Oops, make that Mark 10: 17-25.Again, Jesus' words, not mine.
Glenn Beck should be able to spot when ome person attacks another person for who
they are and the way they are because thats all Glenn Beck ever does
@mark: I don't dance, just ask my wife and kids. You proved nothing to me that
the Lord's quote was false. See Doctrine and Covenants 1:30 for the Lord's
words.There are Lefty Mormons and uber-Progressives on these pages.
It's just a statement of fact. Why run from it?He who seeks offense
finds it. See Elder Bednar's Gen Conf talk a few years ago. I don't
know any LDS members who have been insulting to Islam (you know it's a religion
and not a people, right?)What is the "pet name" for
Catholics? I'm unaware of it.@KGB: I'm not sure what your reference
is supposed to prove. Again, Christ didn't FORCE the rich man to do anything. He
had the choice to keep his riches or do as Christ commanded. This life is about
choice and obedience, not force.People like you believe you can use
the government to force people to do what YOU think they should do so YOU can
FEEL better.@Dnews: it would be nice if you removed the post @ 7:00
tonight since it was in error and replaced.
Not a Beck fan - not a hater either. But this guy us a television evangelist.
Nothing more really needs to be said.
He doesn't sound like a christian. Defamation of others is not christian.
Keller is not a tool of the devil on purpose although ignorance is one of the
Re: SyracuseCoug | 5:25 p.m. May 17, 2011Funny.Re: Dadof5sons
| 5:48 p.m. May 17, 2011Amen.Re: AZguy | 10:02 a.m. May 18,
2011If Ghandi is not going to heaven--I am toast Agreed.
Ghandi & the Dalai Lama are 2 excellent examples of how to liveRe: BradenJ | 10:34 a.m. May 18, 2011 2. Telling a Mormon they
aren't Christian is like telling Peyton Manning he doesn't play football because
he's a basketball player.A better analogy would be to say Peyton is
a real football player because he plays for the Colts & not the Patsre: Uncle Charles | 10:35 a.m. May 18, 2011 Oh well, suffice
it to say that I don't call names; that's what your uber-Progressive friends on
here do.So, Chuck. You dont count making blanket accusations as
Let him take shots a Glen Beck, that's ok, but should end there.
Uncle Charles 7:29 p.m.Well, the moderator rejected my first
attempt, so I'll try again.You asked for an example of
redistribution of wealth in the scriptures and I gave you one. You don't get to
change the rules because you don't like the result. Anyway, this was just me
attempting to speak your language, since I don't really believe that Mormonism
is the "only true Church" or has any special pipeline to
"God." You might as well be quoting J.R.R. Tolkien to me for all the
good it does. Sorry to disappoint you, but you don't have any special claim to
what is "moral" or "patriotic" just because of your
religion, and as multiple people have told you, all you seem to care about here
are insults and name-calling. Why don't you take responsibility for what you
say instead of hiding behind your membership in the Church? I'm
proud be a liberal and progressive. I feel that this world is worth fighting
for and that, with some hard work and diligence, that our best times are ahead
of us. What do you believe in?
That's the beauty of the freedom of speech: you find out what's really in
people's hearts through their mouth....
@ Charles..."Again, Christ didn't FORCE the rich man to do
anything."No, actually Christ just gave commandments. Christ
said to render unto Caesar what is Caesars, and to help the needy, and to not
seek the riches of this world. That all. I guess just suggestions, or
recommendations. You can choose too not obey the commandments,
that is true. But if you are going to set the precedent that commands should
not be used to establish laws, then you have to use that very same guide in all
aspects... like marriage. You can't have it both ways. You can't say that you
can't be forced to live a moral life (feeding the needy) but at the same time
force others to live your (and my) definition of what marriage is.As
a society, we have the right to establish what we as a society feels needs to be
done to support the community as a whole.. Taking care of the disadvantaged at a
societal level is one of those things a democratically elected government can
Mormon attacks on Christians: Brigham Young, The Christian world, so-called,
are heathens as to the knowledge of salvation of God(JoD 8:171)John Taylor, What
are Christians ignorant? Yes, as ignorant of the things of God as the brute
beast(JoD 6:25) Joseph Smith on Christians, all their professors were
Since Mr. Keller is an appointed authority on all religions, including
Christianity and the Occults, WOULD Mr. Keller be able to elaborate on the
definition of "Mainstream Christianity", and provide specific examples
on why some religious organizations are considered Christians and others are
excluded based upon Mr. Keller's expert opinion.I suspect that if
Mr. Keller can explain the validity of his position, that fair-minded reasonable
individuals would arrive at the same conclusion he has achieved. Is that too
much to ask of you Mr. Keller? I look forward to your words of enlightenment?
@KGB: your scripture doesn't say what you think it means. There is no
redistribution of wealth at all, let alone through the force of government.The rich man was commanded to SELL what he had, not have it taken away
through government force. Huge, HUGE difference. He had the choice to do it or
not. I've never not taken responsibility for what I say. I stand by
every single word of it. Hiding? Seriously? Thanks for the chuckles.When quoting the words of Christ, one stands with the Master and doesn't need
to apologize for anything and is always correct on the moral issues. Always.@Duckie: What precedent did I set in saying God's commandments shouldn't
be used for laws? Your post is incomprehensible because it is a strawman
argument.As a society we have the right to follow the COTUS. You
don't have the right to take from one person and give it to another person
through government force. If you THINK you have that right, then lay out where
it says you have the right to steal from one to give to another -- purely for
political capital and votes. Where?
@Chuckie... Being the spiritual guy that you are, then abviously you are well
aquanted with Matthew 22:21. Christ is pretty clear on the issue. Secondly, the church has said the following,"the levying of
federal income taxes is lawful and constitutional. Thus, Latter-day Saints are
committed to the payment of their legal share of the taxes as confirmed by the
12th Article of Faith: We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers,
and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law. [A of F
1:12]" Source Lds.orgSo if it is lawful and constitutional...
how can it also be stealing? Taxation is by definition that taking of money
from a person to be used at the governments will - rich or poor. Not that hard
to comprehend.The church goes on to say those who claim Church
membership making it appear as though their opposition to Federal tax laws is
Church sponsored...We ask priesthood leaders to be on guard against such
persons. They are not to be invited to speak in priesthood or sacrament
meetings, firesides, or other Church meetings in attempting to spread their
propaganda." Sorry you can't see the connection.
@Duckie: How out of context can you make an argument? Those quotes from the
church's website are in an answer about people not paying their taxes and many
end up going to jail because of it.The problem with your belief and
the scripture you assert is that you think the government can tax for any
purpose it wants. The COTUS says otherwise. And again, if you think that Christ
supports stealing from one to give to another you have failed to make your
case.Maybe you should go read the sermon by King Benjamin and his
take on taxes. Then keep reading for the next 10 chapters or so and see how
burdensome taxes can be on citizens.Of course there is a proper role
of government. See Pres Benson's take on it in the speech called The Proper Role
of Government. See his and Pres. McKay's talks in both 1966
Conferences regarding your form of Communism. They denounce it. So do modern
prophets. Provident living. Self-sufficient. Church welfare program is the model
for what should be going on in the world.I can't see the connection
because there isn't one.
@Mark - "LDS Church claims to have an understanding of where people will be
in an afterlife."Please, please, tell me where the LDS Church
thinks I'm going! Or you, or any individual. If you have a problem with our
doctrine, which says almost everyone will inherit a kingdom of glory, what do
you think of most religions, which teach a strict heaven/hell concept of the
afterlife, and claim much surer knowledge of that dividing line than any fellow
Mormon I've ever met?And, as Keller says, our doctrine is 100%
incongruous with Christianity? 100%? Really? Obviously I'm just a
"hypocrite" since I don't recognize the similarities between LDS
teachings and what Keller is saying.Thanks so much for your
obviously unbiased claims about my people, no matter how horribly critical and
inaccurate they may be, and without broadbrushing, of course!Also,
if people affiliate with religion to understand God's will, why would anyone
attend a church they didn't believe was "true?" Do you really think
Catholics and Baptists don't believe they're "true" and that Mormonism
is not true? Are Mormons the only ones not allowed to have that belief?
Evangelicals such as Keller at not Christian. They show it by their own words.
Chuck - the connection is Christ gave a wide range of commandments, of which
include paying our taxes to the state, helping the poor, and living moral lives.
We don't get to pick and choose which ones we obey, regardless if we agree with
them or not, or how we interpret at talk by President Benson. If we
claim the moral right to use the government to enforce moral standards - actions
between two consenting adults - surely the same precident could be used to
enforce other moral standardss - feeding the poor, clothing the naked, taking
care of the elderly. If we are to use the goverment for "Force"
people to live our standards - something based on religous law - then the
government can equally be used to force people to act morally in other aspects -
such as taking care of the poor.You can't have it both ways. Either
the government can or can not be used to reflect religous based morals. You
don't get to pick and choose. As a democratically elected government, we the
people decide which of those moral laws we choose to codify into our
government.It isn't that confusing.... really.
I clicked on Mr. Keller's website and the first thing that I noticed was the big
"Gold For Souls" button at the top. Here's the program in a nutshell,
rather than sell your gold for cash, you send your gold items to Mr. Keller and
he gives you a receipt for the value and you get to includes it as a deduction
on your taxes.
Seems a little insane for someone to call someone else "Satan" don't
you think? I'd only say that if Romney was a Satanist. Seeing that he's not, I
don't think calling him evil is an appropriate political strategy.
There is an old saying I don't agree with what you say but I will defend to the
death your right to say it.
@Chucks.... my "form of communism".That statement right
there just says tons.But you know what, I completely defend chucks
right to say and think what he will. That is absolutely what makes this country
great. From the very beginning of this country we had strong debate between
diverging opinions dating before even the Federalist and anti-Ferderalist
letters. In letters between Jefferson and Adams, they often comment how there
were many angry at both of them about their opinions of the day, in Philadelphia
huge crowds of protestors gathered to protest Adams. Chuck and I
both enjoy the freedoms to civilly disagree. I did vote for Obama last
election because I thought he was better than McCain. I may or may not vote for
him again next election depending on who he is running against. I would hate to
see either candidates religion, or who lived in their neighborhood be a deciding
factor. I will choose based on what they have done, not what name is on the
side of their church or who their bishop/pastor is.The great news is
we equally have the right to speak out and counter idiots like Keller.