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Immigration bills' foes turn up heat

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  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    March 15, 2011 2:57 a.m.

    I feel kind of like that Verizon Spokesman constantly asking our legislature and Gov. Herbert,"Can you hear me now? Can you hear me now?" I'm quite positive that most of us do. Having a legislature that has forgotten who elected them to office is mind numbing.
    Instead they set aside their conservative roots in an effort to pander to groups they were not elected to represent. They trample on principle and rule of law by hiding behind misrepresented terms such as "compassion", "comprehensive", "balanced" and "fair".

    They were NOT elected by special interest groups. They most definitely were NOT elected by illegal aliens. They WERE elected by the PEOPLE of this great state. If they choose not to hear US and instead continue along this path they have chosen to take, they better realize that after the votes are cast at the ballot box they WILL hear us and for them it will be too late.

  • RichardB Murray, UT
    March 15, 2011 4:06 a.m.

    HB166 makes no sense. If the governor signs it, and if the Federal government turns over immigration to Utah, it clearly has not been thought out.

    A person needs a drivers privilege card for a guest worker pass. They have to have a job lined up, one that is not wanted by Americans, or can't be done by one, and their pay has to be equal to others in the area doing the same job. 20% of the people here illegally work in agriculture, ranching, etc. The rest are doing jobs like construction, housekeeping etc. In order for an employer to hire a person under this program, they have to make sure that no citizens will do the job. Will our state enforce their own law, or face multiple lawsuits? This could be costly.

    And if the business owner has to hire a citizen first, if he's dishonest, he will just hire a person here illegally that never signed up. This could put everyone who signs up, out of work, unless they work in agriculture. And if they are out of work, their guest worker pass expires. This is a mess.

  • RichardB Murray, UT
    March 15, 2011 4:07 a.m.

    It looks more like the bill was meant to kill E-verify and keep the drivers privilege card program. Once it's killed, those parts are dead also. E-verify was one of Herberts points. #3

    We did not find a solution, we gave other states a way to kill enforcement bills.
    (I put this in another article before this one was up. It's more appropriate here.)

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    March 15, 2011 5:06 a.m.

    pulling money out of banks, even for two weeks, is stupid. The criminal element (other than just those violating immigration laws) in their community will know who has more cash lying around and will target them for home invasions and other forms of robbery.

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    March 15, 2011 6:33 a.m.

    re this article

    "The automated phone call going out to GOP state delegates states: "Over 70% of Utahns do not support amnesty for illegal aliens. Yet, our state Legislature did exactly that by narrowly passing House Bill 116."

    -----------

    How is having to pay a $2500 fine for crossing the border amnesty? These people didn't even violate a state law for crossing the border yet they are being made to pay a state fine. How is this amnesty?

    Amnesty is when a policeman gives any of us a warning ticket for a traffic violation. How many Utahn's have refused a warning ticket? Thats how many Utah's are really .. truely .. against amnesty.

  • RH2011 Payson, UT
    March 15, 2011 7:26 a.m.

    Does anyone have a clue how to handle this issue where everyone is happy? I seriously doubt it. People complain when nothing is done and people complain when something is done. I agree with the governor; some parts are very good and others are either poor or wrong. His career shouldn't be hung over his head over this. This is a starting point and can be updated and improved upon later; keeping the good and scraping the dumb and bad.

  • Emophiliac Vernal, UT
    March 15, 2011 7:38 a.m.

    Simply put, either Herbert will listen to the people or he will listen to the Chamber of Commerce and La Raza. In the end, he will either be with us or against us - the average Utahn. We've got 100,000 legal Utahns out of work, and we need a program to bring in more illegals? Doesn't make any sense, unless you're trying to find cheaper labor for your business. But, businesses also pay for unemployment. So, is it just a few businesses trying to get other businesses to help pay for their use of cheap labor? Why would the other businesses go along with that? Maybe they need to talk to the Chamber as well.

  • Doug10 Roosevelt, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:01 a.m.

    I agree it is not fair for the governor to hang his career on this particular bill, however I am also against amnesty for the illegals. These people have proven they are not afraid to break the law, and what happens next time when they don't agree with the law?

    I think there are many other qualified individuals waiting to come to USA legally who will not have the opportunity now even though they are more educated and qualified yet they chose to obey the law. If given an opportunity I would choose them to be my new neighbor.

  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:04 a.m.

    There is no doubt in my mind that Herbert will infact sign this lousy HB 116....

    Its time to start caucusing these RINO's like Herbert out of office and do it now.....

    Here are the other RINO's who voted yes to this bill that need to get thrown out with Herbert, Mark Shirtleff and Bramble:

    Anderson Draxler Moss Seelig
    Arent Edwards Noel Vickers
    Bird Fisher, Janice Perry Watkins
    Biskupski Froerer Peterson, J Webb
    Brown, D Hemingway Peterson, V Wheatley
    Brown, M Hendrickson Pitcher Wiley
    Butterfield Hutchings Poulson Wright
    Christensen Kiser Powell Lockhart
    Cosgrove Litvack Richardson
    Dee McIff Sagers
    Dougall Menlove Sanpei

  • tenx Santa Clara, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:11 a.m.

    I agree with emophiliac 7:38 and I guess if Tony Y and the advocacy groups of illegal immigration are for it then I will have to vote against it. Mr. Govenor please veto it! Viva LEGAL immigration.

  • Say No to BO Mapleton, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:34 a.m.

    Technically, this is NOT an amnesty bill. It proposes bringing MORE people into the labor pool during a recession. It makes no sense, except to pander to Latino activists and the Chamber.
    In reality, MORE willing workers means lower wages and fewer benefits. A tight labor market raises wages; flooding the market with low-skilled workers willing to undercut our own citizens keeps the hourly wage low.
    Like Obama, Utah politicians don't get it. Washington is issuing a million green cards a year, in spite of 10%+ unemployment.
    This is Herbert's version of the same nonsense.

  • tenx Santa Clara, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:41 a.m.

    @cjb 6:33. How is it amnesty? Just ask the millions standing in line at Embassy's around the world who are trying to immigrate LEGALLY.

  • Jazz Bass Man Wellsville, Utah
    March 15, 2011 8:48 a.m.

    When the overwhelming majority of Utahns are dead against amnesty for illegals, we definitely need to have our voices heard by the governor not to sign this garbage bill HB116, or we will be voting him out, just as we did to Chris Cannon and Bob Bennett. This is the time for the people make their stand against government representatives that thumb their nose to the people and cave in to special interests like LA RAZA or the corrupt big business interests (chamber of commerce).

  • RichardB Murray, UT
    March 15, 2011 8:51 a.m.

    cjb, people broke the law coming here and working, it is amnesty to allow them to stay and keep on working.

    No amount of money should put them in front of those who have waited to come here legally. America refuses to do amnesty, the Hispanic groups will accept nothing but amnesty. We need to accept the fact that enforcement is the only option, as the 1986 amnesty brought us to this point. Another amnesty will not solve the problem, but make it worse.

    We need to stop the behavior, and the only way to do that is with the deterrent of enforcement. If the Feds are not going to stop it, and the states don't try, it's going to come down to the people, and that's not what we want (Greece, Italy)

    They are our jobs, we want them back. 12 million people, no remorse, no sorry for breaking laws, no compassion to those who ID's were stolen? Why does it have to be one sided all the time?

  • Proud to be American West Jordan, UT
    March 15, 2011 9:02 a.m.

    Like I have been posting for months now, Utahns are against illegal immigration. Many of them are just now getting into the debate, and I can promise you the people of Utah will not allow a bill like this to go into effect without being heard.

    The Governor is done if he signs this bill. He cannot ignore the wishes of the people without having a consequence.

    As I have said before and I will say it again..... get illegals out of our state. Quit wasting time with these ridiculous debates, and uphold our laws like you swore an oath to do Governor! Illegal means illegal.

  • Speak English - USA West Jordan, UT
    March 15, 2011 9:06 a.m.

    To RH2011: The Governor was not voted in to office to "make everyone happy". He swore an oath to uphold our laws, and was elected by the people. The vast majority of Utahns want illegals out of our state and are dead set against amnesty. So while the Governor is in a tough spot when it comes to keeping a small group of people happy, it IS his job to make tough decisions and support the wishes of the people.

    It is time to get illegals out of our state, and disallow any more from coming in to Utah. Utahns have spoken, and it is time for the elected leaders to carry out the wishes of the people that voted them into office.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 9:16 a.m.

    I can't believe there are so many on here that think this is amnesty. What is amnesty is allowing these people to live here without documentation which is what all of you have been causing to happen because you won't allow legislation to pass, unless it brutally and inhumanely forces people into an impoverished country.

    Go ahead, be responsible for the death, crime, and poverty a mass deportation would cause.

    Meanwhile, step up robo-calls, slander, and make 'delegates' (who says they represent the people? They're all party-liners) push against our politicians who are making a stand and trying to move in a different direction than California and Arizona.

    Do you not realize that recent polls show 71% of Utahns are in favor of this bill? It is you guys that are in the minority. Stop trying to force your hand on what the people of Utah want.

  • snowman Provo, UT
    March 15, 2011 9:44 a.m.

    The illegals need to leave.

  • Fitness Freak Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 10:43 a.m.

    "RichardB" You're 100% correct. I have a real strong feeling that the "guest worker" bill was passed SIMPLY to preserve the "drivers privilage cards". The amnesty lobbyists WANTED those to stay in place so the illegal trespassers could continue to operate vehicles.
    The "guest worker" bill has so many loopholes, along with the fact that its illegal on its face (federal govt. issue)that its pretty much useless anyway.

    Why would one of our current "guest workers" bother to sign up for it? Whats the upside for them? Pretty much nobody bothers them anyway!

    Utahs lawmakers seem to think that illegal trespassers are more important than actual voters!

    We may need to just keep voting out "the same old" every two years until we get legislators who vote for the interests of ACTUAL Utah citizens!

    Problem is: I think we've only got between 4-6 yrs. until we are in the same predicament Kalifornia is!

    BTW - I also have signed the petition to the Guv. (for whatever good it does!)

  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:05 p.m.

    "Go ahead, be responsible for the death, crime, and poverty a mass deportation would cause."

    So by that logic every time ICE deports an illegal they should be held responsible for what happens to that person in their country of origin?

    Never mind that the illegal committed document fraud (a felony) in order to obtain employment and never mind that they are probably using a stolen identity, destroying someones financial future. Estimates are that upwards of 70% of illegals have committed these crimes. That equates to millions of illegal criminals.

    Do you suggest that illegals who have committed these crimes should not be held to at least the same level of prosecution as U.S. Citizens? Do you suggest that illegals who have committed these crimes should not be deported?

    I'm sorry but to ignore the criminality rampant in the illegal community only goes to perpetuate lawlessness and if not held in check will only breed more and more lawlessness.
    The only answer to this problem is to enforce the law. Remove the incentive that breeds the illegal activity and you, for the most part, will end it.

  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:06 p.m.

    I posted incorrectly those who voted "YEA" to HB 116 in a earlier post....

    Hopefully the DNEWS will allow me to correct myself:

    The following are your House of Representatives who did infact vote YEA to HB 116:

    Anderson-Taylorsville
    Arent-SLC Millcreek
    Barrus-Centerville
    Briscoe-SLC Harv/Yale
    Bird-West Jordan
    Biskupski-SLC Sugarhouse
    D. Brown-Sandy
    Butterfield-Logan
    Christensen-Santa Clara
    Cosgrove-Murray
    Daw-Orem
    Dee-Ogden
    Draxler-Logan
    Duckworth-Magna
    Edwards-North Salt Lake
    Fisher-West Valley City
    Fisher-Fruit Heights
    Galvez-West Haven
    Handy-Layton
    Harper-West Jordan
    Hemingway-Olympus Cove SLC
    Hendrickson-West Valley
    Hutchings-Kearns
    Kiser-Sandy
    Litvack-Downtown SLC
    Lockhart-Provo
    McIff-Richfield
    Menlove-Garland
    Moss-Spanish Fork
    Painter-Nephi
    Perry-Perry, Utah
    Peterson-Ogden
    Peterson-Orem
    Poulson-Cottonwood Heights
    Powell-Heber City
    Richardson-Pleasant Grove
    Sagers-Tooele
    Seelig-Rose Park
    Vickers-Cedar City
    Wheatley-Murray
    Webb-Logan
    Wright-Holden
    Wiley-West Valley City

    In Additon: the following voted like Obama in voting Present or Not Voting:
    Brown-Coalville, Dougall-American Fork, Froerer-Huntsville, Morley-Spanish Fork

    Vote these people out of office!

  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:17 p.m.

    Here is a list of the Senators from Utah who voted YEA to HB 126

    Adams Greiner McAdams Stowell
    Bramble Hillyard Niederhauser Urquhart
    Buttars Hinkins Okerlund Valentine
    Christensen Jenkins Robles Van Tassell
    Davis Jones Romero Waddoups
    Dayton Liljenquist Stephenson, H.
    Goodfellow Mayne Stevenson, J.


    NAYS 0


    ABSENT 3

    Knudson Madsen Morgan

    Throw every encumbant out of OFFICE who runs for Utah Senate! Clean Senate on these traitors to the people of Utah!

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:25 p.m.

    If illegal immigrants can spend $1000 to $2000 to get a waiver to ignore immigration laws, what other laws can be overlooked for a fee?

    If I give the government $1000 a year, can I ignore the speed limit on the freeways?

    How about $500 to ignore red lights, can I do that too?

    Can I spend $15000 to set up a marijuana growing operation at my house?

    In the middle ages this was called "sale of indulgences".

  • cjb Bountiful, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:41 p.m.

    The governor has now signed the immigration bills into law . What ever one thinks of the legislation, given the threats he has received, one has to admire his courage.

  • The Jimmer Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 12:49 p.m.

    I'm a Republican state delegate and I'll vote for Herbert again only if he signs HB 116.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 15, 2011 1:04 p.m.

    Herbert quickly signed this bill!

    I am a previous delegate and will run again this year on a promise to vote against both Herbert and Hatch.

    If they are not part of the solution (enforcement!) then they are part of the problem. Any form of amnesty is not an acceptable solution.

    Illegal immigration is the most serious problem facing our country today, and despite agreeing with their position on many other issues, disagreement on this one is paramount.

    ABH&H-2012!
    Anyone bu Hatch & Herbert in 2012!

  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    March 15, 2011 1:08 p.m.

    "Do you not realize that recent polls show 71% of Utahns are in favor of this bill? It is you guys that are in the minority."

    Did you know that the poll you are citing was released before HB116 was introduced?
    Did you also know that 30% of that 71% only somewhat supported the idea of a guest worker program (meaning that they had some reservations about the idea).

    I find it highly unlikely now that the facts of this bill have been made known that you would find a majority of Utahns supporting it.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    March 15, 2011 1:40 p.m.

    Hunt,

    No matter how you spin the poll results, it shows there is direction in favor of what was passed. And of course the poll was taken before the bill was passed. "duh, winning!" What good is a poll to legislators after a vote on a bill?

    As for your previous post in response to mine, no, I do not advocate criminal illegal immigrants, and therefore support the parallel bill HB497 which says if they commit criminal acts they will be deported by ICE.

    My problem with deportation is Mass Deportation. Deporting 12-20 Million people at once would be absolute chaos, and I will not support that kind of inhumanity. Deporting criminals and others with criminal intent is a whole different issue.

    As for all of you who blame illegals for breaking the law, stealing taxes, etc. ad nauseum, how many of you don't pay sales and use taxes on the things you buy online? Illinois estimates $153 Million in lost revenue from this problem. Anyway, it doesn't matter now as the Guv just signed it into law.

    Time to show the Feds that the States are the boss!

  • Casca Orleans, IN
    March 15, 2011 3:40 p.m.

    The hundreds of thousands leaving the frontier State of Arizona, will be arriving on your doorstep. This will bloat your welfare system, emergency health care, free education for their children and of course cramming into your prisons. It will not end with just Arizona as many other States are realizing the financial mess their in from economic illegal aliens,and will joining others heading quietly for the State of Utah. If you haven't seen the terrible fiscal chaos, the adjoining State of the Sanctuary State of California is in, just go and investigate about the 24 billion dollar deficit.

  • DaleC Magna, UT
    March 16, 2011 6:46 a.m.

    Why so much anger and violence about a group of innocent, gentle people who were just minding their own business until some people started attacking them? This whole movement is straight from the devil and if we stub our collective toe over this, it will serve us right!

  • TDS Clearfield, UT
    March 16, 2011 4:09 p.m.

    @ Emophiliac - the argument "you're either with us or against us," is false. It ignores all the other possibilities or opportunities of decision making. It is like saying a person is either "bad" or "good," when in reality we are a composit of both.

    You may not agree with Governer Herbert on that issue, but you probably agree with him on other issues but you have just chosen to overemphasize the one and forget the others. As humans we have all sorts of reasons to emphasis our differences, but we also need to remember our similarities - for it is there that we can relate to one another.

    Making absolute black and white statements about others, is a dangerous position to take, especially considering that by doing so we are exposing ourselves to the same scrutiny.

  • snowbird Ogden, UT
    March 21, 2011 5:05 p.m.

    send the illegals home,send the govener home to.hes suppose to represent us not the illegals

  • snowbird Ogden, UT
    March 21, 2011 5:15 p.m.

    the deseret news is a morman owened bissnes that supports illegal mexicans that work for the lds comunist party that i left because its false corrupt