Spot on. Just implement the hiring, selling, renting policies and make these
people coming into our country the wrong way, do it the right way!
These guys are posturing. Both held high positions in their organizations and
lost them. Nothing they say will make a difference as actions speak
louder than words. If the state goes after the individuals and not after the
people on the list that are here illegally, then nothing is going calm the
situation down. I think people are tired of talk and no action.
hope they will make some time in jail .so the law of jail will keep them on
I am A legal immigrant that came to the USA in 1980 in New York.Not only I
wanted to become a US citizen but I made every effort to speak and read the
English language. When I became a Citizen I had to read and speak English not to
mention that I had to know about the History of the United Stares such as the 13
colonies the constitution etc.....Coming to this country Illegaly is a crime
period.don't make excuses for it and don't protect the people that are
here illegaly. we have a law obey by it
those who like to lean on the rule of law phrase, need to jail the state workers
who broke laws by making private info public. whistle blowing is not an excuse
in this one since they went public.the real solution to the
immigration problem is tossing out the old law, and making a realistic path for
legal immigration to happen. and welcoming our neighbors from the south, who
inhabited this part of the land before us white guys, instead of trying to fence
them somewhere. c'mon pols, change the bad law.
"...it's going to give Utah a bad name, and we don't want that."Similar warnings have been made to Arizona. And yet -- to Arizona's
everlasting credit -- it has chosen to concern itself not so much with
popularity, but instead with doing what is RIGHT. Does Arizona have a bad name
in your view, Alex? Sorry, Alex, but I side with Eli on this.
I am afraid it's going to get worse. We can't call the Feds, they won't listen,
we can't call the state, Shurtleff said he won't prosecute the people that are
on the list that are here illegally. Herbert said there are two databases where
the names of people here illegally are kept. So he admitted there were names on
the list that are illegal.If the State (Shurtleff) and the Feds are
being dishonest by not enforcing the law, how can they prosecute people who
broke the law also for doing the opposite? Both sides are dishonest and a crime
under our laws. It's hypocritical for Shurleff to enforce laws, when he has
broke them himself. Segura and Yapias can talk all they want, it
does no good. 78% of America wants our laws enforced, the longer we wait, the
worse the enforcement will be as the resentment and frustration builds.
Herbert must prosecute every illegal on the list or he must be recalled. Justice
now.In a land where justice is outlawed, the just must become
There is not debate about immigration laws, the debate is about illegal foreign
occupation of foreign nationals from Mexico. For hundreds of years Mexico has
constatntly invaded the US trying to take back and occupy the territory of the
United States. What the illegal foreign nationals from Mexico are
bringing is armed and illegal conflict across our border. Do we just sit in
front of the TV and watch our country get invaded and occupied or do we stand up
and defend our borders from Mexico one more time?None of these
illegal have immigrated so its not about immigration, they chose to invade and
force their way in to this country so its about occupation and economic and
criminal acts to loot and pilfer America.
It's unfair and dishonest to prosecute one side and not the other. We have been
told by our attorney general that those illegally on the list will not be
prosecuted. Therefore both sides should not be. Both committed misdemeanors and
felonies. (being in the country illegally and working is a felony). Contact your state leaders, the governor, state representatives, senators,
congressmen and tell them exactly how you feel. If they are not going to enforce
the immigration laws on the books, then be fair and not enforce the laws for
anyone. Even the whistle blowers that turn them in.
I work in construction. I have seen the devestating effect of illegal aliens
taking jobs away fron citizens, sometimes by intimidation and violence. I am
going to make my own list of any company that uses illegal alien labor and send
it to the govenor, police,ICE and the news media. I will demand action against
employers that aid and abet illegal lawbreakers. It is time for Americans to
unite and bypass politicians.
I'm curious as to what our politicians and immigrant reform activists do not get
about illegal. There should be no debate! Illegal is illegal. Without law we
have chaos and with chaos, no one is safe. The daily news headlines are filled
with the lawless chaos south of our borders. What the heck are they thinking?
These people want to debate this?
Cudos to those who took the risk to expose the Illegal Aliens Undocumented
Immigrants. They send the list in April to the Federal Government. Like the
previous 30 years, with the Support of the US Chamber of Commerce (cheap labor),
The ACLU (Treating Illegals with US Citizen Civil Rights), and Hispanic Law
Firms (sue in Federal Court to force schools to teach English as a Second
Language), nothing was done or being done. The Federal Government is NOT doing
its job. These people are bleeding us dry (10,200 Households previously
receiving Food Stamps before rule change - about 50,000 people, Illegals
receiving tax payer supported social services), one out of 15 kids in our school
systems receiving a tax payer supported education at the cost of $4000 to $11000
a year. Why are we tolerating 65,000 Illegal kids an education paid for with tax
dollars? No other country in the world permits that. Just go there and find out,
if you are in a foreign country and enroll your kid in a foreign school, it
costs you $8000 a year. Want lower taxes, charge Illegals.
I thought it was illegal to render aid to fugitives.Why is Tony Yapias not
Aldo is right......our freedom is at stake.....Illegal activity at any level is
ILLEGAL.Its not the illeglas fault so much as it is our leges who
have not sent the right message.....tighten up the laws and the illegal
situation will correct itself.Fine and imprison those who hire or
use illegal labor....
I think this list should be thrown in the trash as well, after the illegals on
it are sent home.
If these wistle blowers (and aren't there laws protecting wistle blowers?)can
find illegals then surely it isn't that hard to identify and send home illegals.
Our government has no excuse. And as for people claims of the list being like
the Nazzi lists, I haven't heard of any one on the list being treated bad. So
much for that excuse. I would like to know what SSN numbers are effected. Is it
mine? Why does the government know that these numbers are being used and
notheing is being done about that? Seems like maybe the wrong people are being
gone after and the real victims are kicked to the curb.
One scenario nobody is talking about. Let's say the Feds get their heads out
and start cracking down to the level necessary. Then these pro-Latino groups
will start complaining about it being unconstitutional, and they will be
actively against the Feds doing anything. Their bottom line is they want
amnesty, they want exceptions to the rule of law for their ethnic group. They
want the American way of life without being legal. No matter HOW they get it.
Certainly, being a "patriot" and breaking the law to show an injustice should
require some penalty. If there was no jeopardy involved, then there is nothing
heroic about it. The 2 or more people who compiled this list should lose their
jobs and maybe be required to pay a fine. Probation could even be a good
answer, since I doubt they will commit this crime again in the future.As to the people on the list, we should politely let them know that they are
no longer welcome in our country, if they do not have documentation. After a
week, follow up and deport those who are still here. They obviously can't take
I have lived in California for over 60 years. I have observed a lot of changes
in that time. Some good and some bad. Through my careful observations over the
years I strongly believe the most destructive event affecting the quality of
life in this state has been the amnesty of 1986 and surge in Illegal immigration
that followed. I have watched, following the 1986 amnesty, the crime increase
dramatically and much of it violent and gang related. I have seen wages drop for
many sectors of the economy due to unskilled illegal and immigrant labor. I have
seen the education and the medical system crushed by the influx of illegal
immigrants. And now I am witnessing the economic collapse of a once great state
much of it caused by the Illegal Immigrant social cost burden. We tried here in
California to stop the invasion, remember prop.187,but a treasonous Gray Davis
and an activist court robbed us of our will. Since then it has all been
downhill. Utah don't let this happen you. What California is experiencing is
ugly and tragic. Illegal Immigration will cost you your peace, your finances and
your quality of life.
Salt Lake City is a closet sanctuary city. Salt Lake City's police chief turns a
blind eye towards illegal's for more flowery things like press conferences. Salt
Lake City is the "new" model city for ALL looking to be in the state illegally.
I resent that the Latino leaders have co-opted this issue as solely
theirs. Illegal means illegal and their shameless pandering and false sanctimony
rings hollow. This article basically places the immigration failures on the
liberal progressive Democrats who in state after state, city after city have
failed to protect America. If anyone doubts that look at the legislatures in
those states and who runs them.If we as citizens want change we have
to start, not stop at the ballot box. Get rid of all of them. It is time to use
a favorite Democrat tool against them, litigation. It is time to stand and be
heard. We need to make life tough for every elected official who has proven to
be a coward. Brand our elected officials with a scarlet letter of shame every
time they appear. It is time for the electorate to get toxic on our
Neither of these two have any credibility left in their own former
organizations. Who cares what they say? The list wouldn't exist in the first
place if anyone charged with enforcing the law did their job. The real outrage
is that no one in the state starting at the top has any will to do something
about the problem, they have their own agenda that they think excuses them from
doing their jobs. We replaced Cannon and Bennett, time to finish the job.
The powers that be are trying to keep a lid on the illegal immigration issue
before it explodes. It won't work. The majority of American citizens want
something done about this, but the politicians on both sides, and the LDS church
who's calling the shots in Utah, plan on doing nothing except giving amnesty.
Obama, whom I voted for, is trying to scare states with his lawsuit. Herbert, by
coming down hard on the whistle blowers, is trying to scare citizens from doing
anything on their own. All of this is only making American citizens angry, and
realizing that their elected officials work for the powerful, the rich, and
their own self interest. American citizens are tired of subsidizing the
education, health care, food, and social services for those who have no right to
be here. In their eyes, their US citizenship means something. In the eyes of
elected officials, it obviously means nothing.
Just how is an endorsement from a former group member and an activist considered
news?Well, I think it's because that's the message DN wants to deliver.At best it belongs on the opinion page.Just another effort to whitewash
our generation's irrepressible conflict.
This is NOT an 'immigration' issue. It is a criminal matter. These bums are
criminals, not 'immigrants'. Catch them, prosecute them and take them to Texas
and put them on a slow boat to southernmost Mexico. A week of seasick boatride
might slow up their trying to come back again.
the illegals in Salt Lake feel safe because the LDS church remains silent always
deferring to the "big" picture of salvation. Ok, that sounds nice, BUT, illegal
is still the operative word here. The laws of the land should be obeyed and
thus, the LDS church's position should be to NOT harbor those that are illegally
here. I also believe that we have catered to the latino community by having all
spanish branches....why? There is no encouragement to learn the English
language. Why should they? They have places to go where English is NOT
required. You want to live here, become an American, learn to speak
English...learn the gospel in English. Assimilate. As to this list...let's
determine how many are illegal and deport them and their entire families and
confiscate everything they acquired while here illegally and then send a bill to
their country of origin for repayment. But first, let's seal our borders now!
It is always a good idea for invaders to call for "civility" while occupying
another country, breaking its laws, and pilfering its resources. It would be
impolite for the citizens of the invaded country to object too loudly. They
would then seem rude. That would be wrong.
sg,And the mormons are also causing the same problem in California,
Texas, Arizona, and every other state?Wow dude, a lot of us don't
care too much for mormon doctrine, but seriously, blaming illegal immigration on
the Mormons - weak
Help Arrest Governor Gary Herbert by joining this groupon Facebook - "Arrest
Gary Herbert" - The State of Utah employs people who do not have the LEGAL right
to hold a job in the United States of America, let alone being employed by the
State itself. Let's get 1 Million Utahns to join this group and then by poular
mandate put the Governor on a chain gang for allowing it.
The law is the law. So are our votes. We will clean house with those "leaders"
who lack the courage to do the job the people who are here legally and pay their
taxes want enforced.
There should be a law of perpetual deportation! If illegal get out of The
United States! Go home and stand in line with everyone else. Do it the right
way!Salt Lake city is a sanctuary city ! The LDS church
perpetuates the problem by all theseSpanish Branches. Learn to speak
English learn the gospel in English or please go back to where you will be more
comfortable and please take your kids with you! I heartilly agree with SGI am really tired of footing the bill of all these freeloaders.
What is so hard about perpetual deporation? Don't split the families up just
deportthe whole family! Things are tough all over!!
@Dektol and anyone else who thinks this is a legal issue. If you people really
think this is a legal issue and that this "crime" should be dealt with and
punished than by that same logic all of you should probably be charged as
criminals just as much as any illegal immigrant. Have you ever gone over the
speed limit? Well that is a crime that could kill someone, so if crime is crime
then anyone who breaks a law needs to be punished. Dont just pick and choose
what laws we want to enforce and punish people for. I have a hard time not
believing this is not a race issue when people only want hispanics out of the
country, what about whites or Europeans that are in this country illegally, no
one complains about them, sure there are not as many but it should be just as
bad. I have never read one logical argument on these comment boards, only hate
filled statements. Hispanics have became scapegoats to Americas problems just
like Blacks, and Japanese once were.
I hate when people get all churchy, but I do have to point out that after the
second coming(if you believe in it) there will be no such thing as America and
America will no longer matter, or exist. So lets stop treating America like it
is the most important thing in the world, or the eternal scheme of things.
The facts are that must illegals in US entered here legally. They over stayed
their visas. The number of people protecting our border has been increased
sevenfold, deportations are up, deportations are up by 5% since Obama came to
office, ICE is auditing more businesses looking for illegals and Obama signed an
executive order requiring all contractors working on federal contracts to use
e-verify.We have the conservative darling Jan Brewer who
characterized the federal government as doing nothing to stop illegals. The fact
is, violent crime by illegals in Arizona is drown by 34% since 2004. Jan said
illegals were beheading people not one beheaded body has been found. Governor
Brewer said illegals were bringing in drugs. Records of arrests by the border
patrol, who conservatives tell us are doing nothing while the risk their lives
protecting our border, show this isn't true.We have Fox News, talk
radio, Jan Brewer and other fermenting hatred by misrepresenting facts.They waited until America elected our first black president has a midterm
election is coming up to spread these lies and to entice hatred.We
need civility. Its seems the power of hate and lies is winning out.
Governor Herbert better realize that he works for the "Legal" U.S. Citizens of
the State of Utah. Herbert DOESN'T work for the "ILLEGAL ALIENS". We got rid of
Bob Bennett...We "CAN" get rid of him !Wake Up politicians
!.....or.....We will vote you out.
President Gordon B. Hinckley The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter
Day Saints Ensign: May 2001 It is counterproductive to
be reactive on this issue regardless of the side you are on.This is
NOT an issue of illegal immigration, it is a transparent magnifier of the
corruptness of "GREEDY" labor organizations, government bureaucracies, "GREEDY"
corporations (businesses) 'who cater to these individuals for profit', "GREEDY"
media and politicians who are the beneficiaries of the “LAWLESS”
exploitations of these people. Why are we not having congressional
hearings to prosecute the perpetrators of disregarding the United States Code
and aiding and abetting these "upstanding" individuals (that was a contradiction
in terms, no offense) who have been counseled to remain in "THEIR" own countries
and work to make "THEIR" own countries prosperous rather than systemically
bankrupting individual states. And the United States of America as a whole. (IE:
sucking BILLIONS of dollars out of our economy to “SEND HOME”)
President Gordon B. HinckleyThe Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day
SaintsEnsign: November 2001 "Reaching Down To Lift Another"
"The LDS church perpetuates the problem by all theseSpanish Branches.
Learn to speak English learn the gospel in English or please go back to where
you will be more comfortable and please take your kids with you! "Wow. That is truly one of the most cringe-worthy things I have
Thanks to the new strict Immigration Law illegals are leaving Arizona,but
the damage what they have caused is massive. Broken state, ruined economy,many stolen vehicles, stolen identities, broken homes, drug problems.But
they don't go home, they are moving to other states, to your state as well.Don't let them ruin your state like they did to Arizona. (Im from Arizona.)Push your state rep to make a change. Google this:
NUMBERSUSA.Once you are registered, go to the "action buffet" to
send FREE faxes now. They are all typed up and ready to go, you just need
to click your mouse to send.Forward this to everyone you know.
I will believe that this is about the law, and not about hate, when all you flag
wavin' pseudo-patriots start publishing the names and social security numbers of
your neighbors who don't put their children in car seats. After all, it is the
Come on, DN. How can you post such vileness, but not responses to it??What ugliness I'm reading here!Don't you realize that Utah
will never pass a law like Arizona's? Ever. Those who are advocating it are WAY
to the right of the Church, and the politicians you've voted in.'Immigrant' does NOT equal 'Criminal'. Realize that the
immigrants, legal or not, are NOT going away, no matter how hateful you act
towards them. They are here to stay, and more will come. I suggest you get used
to them being here. We need a workable, humane, INTELLIGENT
solution. The people who are here, who are working hard, who want to become
Americans, need to be given Social Security #s so that they can start paying
into the system they are benefiting from. The racial prejudice and
hate needs to STOP.
Illegal is bad. Illegal immigrants broke the law. Go
back out the back door and come in the front door. The United
States welcomes law abiding and legal immigrants.
Bob Rooney | 12:25 p.m Conservatism ruined Arizona's economy. The most
detrimental immigration into Arizona was white conservative who got great
retirements working union jobs or for the government in California who moved to
Arizona to avoid giving anything back to the state were they prospered. These
same people have ruined Oregon and other states too.Bob crime by
illegals had dropped by 34% since 2004. Jan Brewer's credibility should
embarrass most Arizonans. If they had pride in their state.Mexicans
founded Arizona. If not for the missions of Mission Nuestra Seora de los
Dolores, Mission San Cayetano de Tumaccori, Mission Los Santos ngeles de
Guevavi, Mission San Pedro y San Pablo del Tubutama and Mission San Xavier del
Bac there would have been no Arizona for America to steal from Mexico."What ugliness I'm reading here!"Beauty requires
cultivation. Artist, architects and writers aspire to create beauty. It takes
them year to learn the skills to create beauty.It takes no talent
you make things ugly.
@ The Rock: What you said. Exactly.
Illegal DOES equal 'Criminal.'I fail to understand why this
important and salient point is routinely glossed over by those bleeding hearts
who are essentially saying that the sovereign borders of the United States and
Utah are now illusionary and not relevant. It is NOT anti Christian to expect
those who wish to come here to do so legally. It is not anti-Christian to be
outraged by illegal immigrants getting a free ride and using social safety nets
that they are not supposed to have. It is NOT hate to ask those who are here
illegally to go home and come back the right way. It is NOT hate to want
security. Where is the Christian compassion for a legal resident that has been
beaten, assaulted, raped, kidnapped, or murdered by an illegal who should not be
here? What do you say to someone who has been victimized by not only an illegal
immigrant but also a government that condones, sponsors, and allows such people
to even be here? I am all for diversity but not at the expense of sovereignty
and LEGAL residents. Illegals need to be held accountable ASAP regardless of
age, gender, race, or color.
These illegals are just that ...illegal!! Does anyone need a definition of
that? Deport them and the nut cakes that support them!
Re: Not_ScaredGees,and just think - if the Native Americans were not
there first, there wouldn't be a Mission Nuestra Seora de los Dolores, Mission
San Cayetano de Tumaccori, Mission Los Santos ngeles de Guevavi, Mission San
Pedro y San Pablo del Tubutama and Mission San Xavier del Bac. Now,
what was the question again?
It seems that some forget that this list was not just of illegal immigrants, it
contained names of people who were here legally and of others who are citizens.
The people who compiled this list did not care if someone might be put on the
list who wasn't here illegally. I personally know people who speak both English
and Spanish, who were born in the United States. One of my good friends was
born in New Mexico to parents who were born here to parents who became citizens
when this part was added to the United States back in 1847's war with Mexico.
Please let use reason and not just think everyone who has a Latin surname is
here illegally. I wouldn't object to being asked for my id whenever stopped by
an officer and my citizenship status determined, but to compile a list of Latin
surnames and call them all illegal is a little too much.
I think the people who compiled this list should get a raise, a promotion, and a
metal. NOT a pink slip.Herbert and Shirtleff should both be fired
and move to mexico. Those who came legally and want to be
Americans, learn ENGLISH and pay their way. MY WELCOME to you.
Ok, why is no one addressing this OBVIOUS and LOGICAL, simple solution: Let the
good and decent, hard-working people who want to stay here and become Americans,
be brought out of the shadows and into the light, and be given social security
#s (or something equivalent) so that they can start paying income taxes on their
wages. In this way, they can pay INto the system they are benefiting from.Is it just more fun to sit back and call them bums and criminals and
tell them to learn the Gospel in English???
Re: TruthbeknownCan you point me to a news report where someone has
come forward and indicated that their name is on the list, even though they are
legal? All I've heard so far is that Yapias called some people on the list and
they told him they were legal. Beyond that, I haven't heard anything.
Those calling for swift and firm application of immigration laws argue from a
strong rhetorical position, no doubt. "We have laws, they should be enforced."
But do they realize how tentative the premise of "law" is here? Who made these
laws? The people who were already here, who were already tasting the benefits of
freedom. It's not as if these laws proceed from some natural sense of justice.
Isn't one of the most fundamental American values the notion that any individual
willing to work hard can make a better life for his or herself? What is more
fundamentally American than that right, extended to ALL people? But, thanks to
immigration quotas, not every person has the opportunity to come here. You can't
just wake up and decide to become a legal American citizen. But for us and our
children, this is a given. In spite of the fact that we aren't the original
inhabitants. Our ancestors ILLEGALLY removed the American Indians to get this
land. I'm proud to be an American, but nothing about this issue is simple or
easy, in spite of what some people on this comment board want us to think.
THE LIST makes the government look bad. The people are onto them being aware of
and sustaining the illegals. Now, the government officials are just having
meeting after meeting trying to calm the legal, tax paying citizens down while
catering to the leeches of society. We the people are angry and we are not
calming down any more. We continue to be taxed and pushed around. We have had
it. Take action or we will take action on you.
Wow. That sounds like a threat, Mr. Bennett.
All the ILLEGALS can be CIVIL by going back to their own country and obeying the
How come LEGAL Hispanics aren't outraged by illegal Hispanics making a bad name
for them? ... maybe it is because the are Hispanics 1st and
Americans 2nd or 3rd or 4th !
sagacity | 4:18 p.m. July 17, 2010 Wow. That sounds like a threat, Mr.
Bennett. It's called V O T I N G.As long as we can still
do it and it actually counts, we need to do it.
@Andrew J. Marksen | 1:15 p.m.I hope you are at some point able to
find peace and forgive those individuals that have wronged you.
Give the whistle blower heroes a raise and a promotion. Now the public officials
can do their JOBS and round up the illegal aliens and send them out of here. If
the guv and attorney general don't do their jobs they are in political hot water
for pandering to the illegal community. The overwhelming majority of U.S.
citizens want this bologna stopped now. Close the border. Jan Brewer for
Yes, please be civil.Be polite and professional when arresting and
deporting every illegal on the list, and looking for more.And be
polite and professional when arresting those who may have broken laws in
preparing the list. Hopefully, a jury of their peers will refuse to convict.And be polite when demanding impeachment of Gov. Herbert, AG Shurtleff
and Chief Burbank if they fail to faithfully execute the duties of their
Another example of hatespeak. Not everyone does it but it is becoming far too
common to ignore."the leeches of society"RobertBennett |
This whole thing is so comical....heheheheh. Lord have mercy!
An example of someone assuming the worst of tens of millions of ethnic
minorities. Why assume the worst? Why not recognize that hispanics hold very
diverse opinions on literally every issue this country faces. I guess it's just
far too easy to generalize and tear down and far too much work to see others in
more humane terms.ST | 4:38 p.m."LEGAL Hispanics... are
Hispanics 1st and Americans 2nd or 3rd or 4th"
Article of Faith that says we believe in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the
law?. Did you hug a illegal today?. Just remember Utah, S.L. area officials
concerned about sudden spike in heroin overdoses Officers say strong batch of
drug may have been sold, and brought over by the illegal's. If you're taking a
normal dose (of heroin) and instead of 30 (percent) to 40 percent pure, you get
80 (percent) to 90 percent pure, it's an amazing shock on the body. The problem
of heroin in Utah is nothing new. Local and state law enforcers have held
several operations, and continue to do so, in the south end of the valley,
focusing on young adults from Utah County who travel to Sandy, Draper and West
Jordan for the sole purpose of buying heroin and cocaine. Even though the
recent rash of heroin overdoses will ease once the cycle of bad heroin is phased
out of the county, the problem of heroin addiction itself won't go away, more
illegal's will bring it here and sell it. God would not have his people cross a
boarder, steal people's identity, smuggle drugs into the country.
Drugs are not the same issue. The list isn't of suspected drug traffikers. Lists are great as long as you aren't on them. How about a list of all
the people on this forum and others that equate taxes to syealing? I bet most of
them cheat on thier taxes. let's make a list.
Anyone that gives Alex Segura (a voice of one) any credibility doesn't know much
about illegal immigration in Utah. When he sided with Rep Cannon after the 2006
election, he became a nobody. Even the Utah Minuteman ProjectThen
Tony Yapias has always been a media hound. He lives on donations from his
@Christy?That's what this is all about, Amnesty. After years of
bringing people here and cries for amnesty from the Hispanic groups, that is the
entire argument. Do we continue down this road of illegal
immigration, with cries of amnesty every 10 years by the Hispanic's or does
America take control over it's immigration and stop letting organizations
control it?There are people that found in 1986 that they could by
pass our fair quota system in immigration and build up a power base of one
ethnic group. 12-14% of our population has our presidents and governors ears,
while the rest of America is ignored. We can't afford 12-30 million
new people. The cost of court cases, judges, lawyers, investigators, chain
migration, social services, schooling, police and fire, social security for 12
million is 2.6 trillion. (Heritage foundation). And in another 15 years we will
have millions more here calling for amnesty. It's a pyramid scheme
that has to stop through interior enforcement, and finishing the wall.
Mr Brer Rabbit, you may be correct about Alex and his former organization though
his former organization is not actively engaged in solving anything. If you look at so many of these groups they are first and foremost fundraising
groups. The Minutemen started out as solid groups simply wanting enforcement at
the border. Within 12 months they signed fundraising contracts with major DC
lobbyists and shifted from trying to solve problems to simply raising money,
screaming as loud as they can.Local groups have not been about
raising money but sadly they take their marching orders from these professional
fundraising groups, like NumbersUSA and FAIR. They raise millions, pay their
employees handsomely and solve virtually no problems. In fact, many staunch
anti-immigrant leaders have noticed that they have even quietly opposed serious
efforts. Even Tom Tancredo noted that both groups quietly fought some of his
common sense solutions. As soon as the problem is fixed their gravy train
ends.Fact is, Alex Segura may have no credibility with his former
group but that is saying absolutely nothing. His former group has little
credibility.Debate real solutions, not hair brained, knee jerk
actions. This list does more harm than good.
I agree with these two gentlemen. The rhetoric has become quite hateful. People
are called "illegals," instead of "brother" or "friend." Or, folks who want the
law supported are called Nazi's or hate-mongers.The discussion needs
to be civil. And I personally don't think discussion should be tossed aside to
move to action. There's a reason why, in our country, people are allowed to
discuss their opinions and disagree...it's so rash decisions aren't made,
leading to undesirable consequences. But hateful rhetoric tends to lead to
hasty actions that limit the freedoms this country stands for.
An example of the mexican immigrant drug dealer fallacy, i.e. all mexicans are
bad because some drugs come from mexico. Also, notice how he does
not ask for any accountability for the consumers who create the demand for the
drugs. If there were no demand, they would be no market for them - first cast
the beam out of thine own eye Brother Chuck Schroeder |
7:20 p.m. - "...the problem of heroin addiction itself won't go away, more
illegal's will bring it here and sell it."
One point that should be made here is that hypocrisy in enforcing the laws will
not help the cause of those groups and people fighting illegal immigration.It also really calls into question anyone's intelligence who thinks
there is nothing wrong with making the personal information on this list public.
It's against the LAW! Apparently there were legal citizens whose names were on
this list. Care to share your information now? Even if were all illegal
immigrants, undocumented people should also be protected from this type of
criminal behavior.All you people who say otherwise are really not
helping your argument. First and most troubling, you support obeying only those
laws you agree with. Isn't that what you are accusing otherwise law abiding
undocumented persons of doing? Otherwise you are just jerks who like to stir up
controversy on the blogs. Take your pick, those are your only two choices.
Cowley needs to go.Segura is right on. His actions give some
credibility to the Minuteman organization. He is someone I would listen too, and
consider his views. If you want to be effective in civic dialogue,
don't say stupid stuff.
All this hoopla over a list, when we should be concerned with the fact that the
two top law enforcers in our state (Herbert and Shurtleff) are NOTenforcing our laws in regard to illegal immigration.That is what
we should be worrying about! Had they been doing their jobs, there would be no
need for a list.
when you see a snake, you don't call a committee on snakes, you kill the
snake.these politicians are stalling...and calling creating a lot of
There is a lot of inaccurate history being posted. Mexicans didn't settle
Arizona, the Spanish (meaning Spain) did. Mexico owned parts of the southwest
for about 25 years. Mexicans did not establish one colony or town in what is now
the USA during their ownership. The only presence Mexicans had in this area
were from robbers coming north. Whatever they plundered (including stealing
Indian women and children) were all taken back down into Mexico. In 1846, a year
before Brigham Young reached the Salt Lake Valley, he had Mormon Men enlist in
the US Army to fight in the Mexican-American War and helped secure what is now
our border with Mexico.
Issues of employment, health care, food stamps, etc... are issues that the
Mexicans need to take up with their own government when they get back.