But look on the bright side, as soon as texas can "mainstreem' these children
they will have the opportunity to join a nice gang and try drugs and alcohol.
How nice to hear the voice of reason from someone who should know better.
Wouldn't it be nice to see the Texas Authorities charged with child abuse...
Leave it to Texas. Or rather, Walther. Who was it that made her signer of
warrants, judge, jury, and executioner? I don't normally agree with attacking
one person, but she is now the one on trial, guilty until proven innocent. What
happened to her heart? These are babies!
Texas is doing the best they can with that number of children. The FLDS are the
ones that should be blamed for putting Texas in this postion. Had Texas not
found evidence of abuse they would have let them be.
"Had Texas not found evidence of abuse they would have let them be."Where exactly is that "evidence"?
I do believe the evidence is confidential, but think 16-year-olds with 3-4
kids by 50-year-old sleazeballs would be a pretty good indicator that sexual
abuse is going on.
And the nursing infants. Were they sexually abused?
I haven't seen a single report of any 16 year old girls with 3-4 kids. The
reports have only been that they have seen some girls who APPEAR to be
teenagers, who are pregnant. I guess in Proud Texan fashion you just made up
the rest, fill in the blanks, it gives you a reason to do whatever you want to
these people, all in the name of justice.
Assuming there was abuse (innocent until proven guilty). Why rip the kids from
the only home and environment they have ever known? If they have been abused,
why abuse them further? Where are you going to find better (or even equal)homes
for 437 children?Also, it's interesting that a middle school in
Maine has just started dispensing perscription contraceptives to their students.
That's 11-15 year olds. Where is the outrage there?
to ???:texas did not find evidence of abuse. but they have also not
"let them be".
I love Peter's quote regarding that she hopes Texas CPS is simply clueless
regarding child welfare. I guess the FLDS mothers are way better at it.
Consider that the girls are being raised to fulfill their destiny (as determined
by the prophet) and the boys are raised to contribute to the wealth of the
community until such age that they have proven themselves worthy of marriage
(plural) or out they go. So much for motherly love. I applaud Texas for
attempting to get a handle on the problem. As far as SWAT teams, remember Waco?
Even polygamist groups in Utah have been violent. Remember Ervil
Lebaron and his murderous followers when they killed two people from competing
groups right here in SLC? I don't trust happy faces and long dresses.
TO Voice of reason and GReports and evidence in juvenile matters are
sealed. A judge has found probable cause for the children to remain in states
custody, and I think the judge had more facts then the press has released to
anyone here. I can't believe you guys find it so hard to believe that the FLDS
may have abused these kids.
Is being seized by CPS traumatic? Yup! I bet it's traumatic for kids and parents
both for different reasons. Is it more disorienting than getting moved around
and assigned new daddies at will? What about the risk of getting kicked out and
shunned? Ummm, hard to say. Maybe the kids are such little shape-shifting
wizards that they will adapt brilliantly and take this all as just another
upheaval where they have to figure out who to obey now. I am hoping
and praying the kids do not wind up fitting in really well with other sociopaths
in foster care.I am hoping and praying that at least a few of the
kids find new doors opening and learn that the outside world, while certainly
not short of horrors, also has strengths and beauties and opportunites for them.
I am hoping and praying that MAYBE some of them get to see normal human
relationships where people love and look out for each other without all the
freaky overtones at YFZ.I am also hopign and praying that at least
some of the parents do a whole lot of praying and considering and get a wakeup
call, a reality check too!
Where to start? The risk of getting shunned? I want to know where you live so I
can join you because everywhere that I have been in this WORLD, being shunned is
an everyday fear of everyone. And how many kids in the "world" get "new" daddies
or mommies on a regular basis because their parents fight all the time or sleep
around and cheat on eachother? Which is the less of two evils? And this "hope"
for the chance to see "normal" human relationships???? Would that be a
homosexual relationship? or inter-racial? or Hugh Hefner relationship? or the
multi-family/ extended family dwellings? or would that be the boyfriend went
crazy on the girlfriend and killed her relationship? I am trying to figure out
what you mean by the "normal" relationship???? EVERY religion has its downsides
and people that dont agree with the way it is lived, too bad. There is no
evidence that makes these people less worthy. There are areas for improvement, I
am sure...just like the rest of us!
I read this article and some of these comments and it frustrates me that people
do not get what is really going on here. These are kids. Would we leave kids in
a "Crack-drug" house just because that was what they had lived in their whole
life? No, we are supposed to protect children and their innocence. Instead of
giving your "opinion" on what you think CPS and Texas are doing wrong, help be a
solution. If you are a professional in helping children that come out of these
cults, offer your services. Help us help these kids and these mothers. Let me
assure you, we have not ever had to deal with anything like this in San Angelo.
I pray that all these kids recover and heal from the trauma that has surrounded
them for all their lives and for what they are going through right now. I'm
sure this comment will frustrate some people and that's okay. Because if it
frustrates you, you will think about it more and maybe if we all work together
for the sake of these kids, we might can make a change. Thank you for
If I was on a jury, and had no preconcieved notions, there is no way I would
place any of those kids in foster care. The whole court case focussed soley on
whether the parents believed underage marriage wrong or not, and that flds
people were incapable of making decisions because of what they had been taught
their whole lives. Not once was coercion by threat or foce even mentioned! Not
once was a specific case of underage marriage presented. Those things would
have only proved individual cases of abuse. The only way to treat all 400+ kids
that they apparently can't even count, as one single case, was to declare the
beliefs "abusive". The judge, with a straight face, declared all 400+ children
in "immenent danger" for abuse because of the parents beliefs (not actions -
they did not discuss actions at all!), and because of what the kids were taught
(not how - the only testinony on how was that the mother never yelled at her
kids) concluding WHAT one teaches therir kids makes those kids incapable of
decision making, and what one believes makes those kids in "immenent danger" of
OH Molly, the hypocrisy!You condone kids being ripped permanently from
their dads to be "GIVEN" to another man, on "pofit" Warren's order, yet whine
about Texas trying to get to the bottom of this child sexual abuse mess. Truly
Amazing, how a human brain can rationalize.
I read tonight that they released two of the girls that they THOUGHT were teens
to go back to the ranch because CPS finally concluded that they weren't minors
after all. This supports what the FLDS people were saying in interviews, that
despite drivers licenses, SS cards and birth certificates, CPS would not accept
that women who looked young were in fact in their twenties. It will be
interesting to learn the extent of any actual abuse compared to the scope of
what was done to these folks.
Yeah, taking children out of an environment of systematic sexual abuse could
really damage them. OH PLEASE!
This is the most revolting abuse of children, babies, families, and civil rights
I have ever witnessed. "Judge" Walther has no heart. She is stone
cold. She'll face her Nuremberg, though, and she WASN'T just doing her job.
She was being, and is being, s soul-less, unbelievably callous woman. No one
with a half a heart could treat these poor families and babies and children like
this. THERE WAS NO ABUSE FOUND! IT WAS A PHONEY ALLEGATION OF
ABUSE!!! TEXAS, AND ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE OF AMERICA - DO SOMETHING TO HELP THESE
PEOPLE - write to your politicians, tell your friends and neighbours you will
not tolerate this abomination of humanity!ACT!!!!!!!
BEWARE the catch phrase:"In the best interests of the child."That's the phrase they'll use when they want to condone an act that is
tantamount to murdering YOUR family.
No real Texan would have separated mothers and children like that. Let those
mothers know that through the grace of God, with each one of us praying, and
acting through spiritual guidance, their children will be safely returned. Here
in Beaumont, Texas I am raising money to send to the legal defense fund for the
FLDS families. About ten years ago my family was similarly attacked by
CPS. You're not fighting against flesh and blood, but against principalities,
against wickedness in high places. The power of prayer defeats them. I thank God
for the safe return of my children and pray for the safe return of yours.
Lets look at it another way. A 14 yr old child has the choice of being forced
to have sex with a man 20 yrs older than her, or of being forced to cope with a
new way of living? I am a parent, life has its stress and tradgedies
everywhere. Children are resiliant if enough love, support, and coping skills
are given to them. I would rather help a child cope with a new lifestyle
instead of rape. Isn't having children at age 14 abuse also? There is no
way these kids could have won, no matter what the state did or didn't do. The
important thing now is what is being done to help them cope! Whats done is
done, now clean up the mess that both the state and the sect have created! Had
these 14 yr old girls gotten pregnant outside of the sect, what would their
lives have brought? These are still children, and they still need hope, love,
and as much help as anyone can offer them.
Yes indeed this is traumatic! I too was taken from my mother by CPS (but that
was long, long ago). The FLDS children need to be removed because their mothers
are not in a position to protect them. The mothers are abused (and may not
realize it... just as my own mother) and unless the mother asks for help and
wants out of the FLDS culture, she should not be given custody of her children
just to teach them (expecially the girls) to accept this riduculous alliegence
to the men who need at least three wives to het into "heaven." I need three
icecream cones to get to "heaven"...lol