Don't you have anything better to do yet Mr. Doug then to continue crying about
the Stadium?! Everyone who is crying with you is going to, one time or another,
go to the stadium whether for a game or concert and realize how nice,
convenient, and state of the art it is. Afterwards you will see too that this
stadium will bring in more money than you may ever admit to. So go complain
about the Utah Flash and something less entertaining. By the way, you never
mention how much personal money Mr. Dave Checketts has put into the stadium
before it even broke ground.
AMEN! I couldn't have said it any better... No really, I couldn't have said it
I happen to agree with Doug on this one. The whole stadium thing is a rip off
from the get go. Why should the public have to support Dave and his hobby. If he
wants to bring a sports team here then he should buy the land and build the
stadium with his own money. It is a business. If he brings a product that the
consumers want, then he makes money. If not then he loses money. We the public
shouldn't have to pay for him to risk running his pet projects to see if they
work or not. If this is such a sure thing then Dave should put all of his money
into it. If he doesn't have enough money to do it all himself then find some
private investers to help come up with the money, not the pubic taxpayer! If the
project is a sucess then Dave wins with big money for himself, not the taxpayer.
If it fails, then he walks away with a small loss to himself (at least to
someone with big bucks) but the taxpayer winds up paying for it for years.
Maybe the "economic" benefits to the Salt Palace, Winter Olympics, and Franklin
Covey field haven't been as high as some expected, but is anyone saying it
wasn't worth the investment?!? Those projects were some of the best things that
happened to Utah in the last century! Once this stadium is built, it will be the
same--A Utah landmark that brings joy and happiness to many Utahans. No one will
question its worth and the little cost we had to front. (Not to mention our
part of the cost comes from the tax on visitors.)
Mr. Optimistic needs to open his eyes. Mr. Robinson is exactly right. Dave
Checketts and Mary Kay Huntsman were worried about Dave Checketts and Mary Kay
Huntsman - and nobody else. The stadium is a boondoggle by the rich, for the
rich, and of the rich. But then, as we all know, he who has the gold makes the
Ask 45,000 soccer-playing kids around the state if they would like to have a
professional soccer team with their own stadium here in Utah so they can go to
games with their parents, teams, and friends. They will invariably say yes! Do
they care about the cost? NO. Neither do I as a tax paying adult.Let
go of the finances and embrace family friendly activities that will surround
this stadium and the soccer team. This whining about finances is a tired old dog
that has been beat one too many times and just wants to lie down and rest and
then play with the children in the yard.Let the highest soccer-playing
populous per capita in the nation enjoy the stadium, the game, the team, instead
of walk through the mire and goo spread by fiscal tightwads and 'watchdogs' with
nothing to do but hate, spurn, and beat down this poor dog named soccer and all
associated with it.
Well, Jordan, the Salt Palace & Winter Olympics Games have proved to be
everything we expected. Franklin Covey: Nope. One of those three you described
is a stadium, one is a convention center and the third was a global event. As a
multiple choice question, I say Sandy's soccer stadium looks like Franklin
Covey...not a convention center or global event. Hmmm.
If there were no stadiums for sports i guess there'd be no reason for a sports
section in the paper and no sports writers. So when you say no economical impact
how about your job! How many jobs are there for sports writers where there are
no sports. Just say thank you and write about sports not your narrow minded
wallet. O and you must be using a lot of hotels these days if your so worried
about the cost.
of the 45,000 soccer playing kids only about 2000 are really athletically
inclined and the others are there for the "participation" aspect of soccer.
Sure my daughters play soccer (of course the boys play football) but we'll never
go to a soccer game at that stadium.....why would we when we could find about
1000 better things to do in our beautiful state besides watch a team lose
(again) 2-0. The stadium is a deal that benefits only a very few given the cost
we all incur. I will vote against everyone who pushed this through today, we
should all do the same.
When I bought my house, the price was $310,000. The realtor didn't tell me the
cost was $850,000+ or whatever after the interest is paid. When you get a loan,
there is interest to be paid, everyone knows that. Don't act like its some big
conspiracy. Stadiums go up with public money all the time. The community will
Maybe if it were in SLC, but in Sandy! What a joke.
"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light,
and light for darkness."You folks can criticize Doug Robinson all
you want, but at least he has intelligence to see what is happening here -- that
the wealthy are lining their own pockets at the public's expense -- and has the
guts to call evil evil.Thank you, Doug. I commend you for your
Well-stated, Mr. Doug. Anyone who starts an article with a quote from George
Costanza deserves to be heard. You have been a voice of reason throughout this
entire episode of incredibly stupid decisions on the part of public officials
that climaxed in the profoundly dumb stunt of everyone gathered at the State
Capitol with Real Salt Lake soccer scarves around their necks. They were there
to announce that the taxpayers of Utah would be stuck with this bill for years
to come. Nice work.
Give me a break, soccer haters. This isn't abnormal to help pay for stadiums and
other private interests. Why aren't people up in arms for the millions given as
incentives to other private ventures in the state? Let it go.
Here is my bottom line...SOCCER IS THE MOST BORING THING THAT I COULD EVER
IMAGINE WATCHING! Why waste money on something that is so painful to watch?
Leave soccer to the little kids and high schools. If we are going to waste
taxpayer money on stadiums let's waste it on genuine sports!
this article. I brought up many of these points in a comment on the artical you
reference. The PC police at the Deseret News would not print it.Glad you were able to get this past them. Keep up the good work, Doug.
Can't wait 'til the stadium is complete. Go RSL!
Hay when the team folds they can alwase convert it to a football field so that
Jordan can play a home game!!!
Doug, you've got to be kidding me! Your understanding of finance and
particularly public finance is dazzling. Next time somebody asks me how much I
paid for my car, should I tell them it cost me $29,500 or should I add in the
all the projected interest and tell them that it cost me $34,219? Or better
yet, should I tell people that my $239,000 house cost me $515,853.Your argument is intellectually dishonest, and only stupid people will fall
Doug, as a culture, we in Utah don't care much for confrontation, so when you
refer to the governor and his wife in a less than positive way, people
immediately come to the conclusion that you are not a very nice guy. What
business did the governor have in pushing this through after independent
auditors discovered the stadium didnt make sense financially? I would not vote
for him again. The comment was made that we should consider how much money Dave
Checkkets has contributed to the deal. So whats the point, that hes a nice guy?
If hes such a generous man, why doesnt he throw some of his money at education
or the arts? Checketts is a businessman who put up the money because he hopes to
make more money. Kudos to Sandy city officials for their integrity in standing
up for what was right even though it went against the governors personal
preferences. Some officials even liked the idea of the stadium, but it did not
make financial sense. Sure, some tax payers will enjoy the stadium, but whatever
happened to representing the majority?
This is the same Sandy City who wants to create its own school district because
the district wouldn't help pay for the stadium. It's all politics!
I could not care any less about 45,000 kids, not one of them is mine and that is
where my concern is. As a family we cannot stand soccer so you can rest assured
that this is one soccer hater that will never, and I say again never, set foot
in that soccer stadium for any reason Soccer, concerts or whatever the case. If
you who own the 45,000 kids want a soccer stadium than take up a collection and
pay for it yourselves. Soccer, Dave, Greg, and the rest of the soccer thieves
ought to get out of my pocket and out of my face. Doug you are right again keep
up the good work.
A couple of things...First of all, the economic boon to the
surrounding area will not be solely attributed to the stadium. If you remember,
a massive development project is planned to go up around the stadium, as
well.Secondly, this is a sub-100 million dollar stadium. That is
CHICKEN FEED. Want to ask the New York tax payers how much the new Yankee
stadium is going to cost? That's the problem with Salt Lake residents - they
want to be big-time, but they continually think small-time.Thirdly,
THIS IS BEING FUNDED WITH TRANSIENT ROOM TAXES. Unless you are a tourist
staying in a Utah hotel, this is not your money. Look it up.Finally, I find it highly amusing that people are basing so much of their
opinion on the perceived quality of the team, and of the sport in general. We
get it, you don't like soccer. Does that mean the rest of us who do should
suffer? I hate hockey, but do I picket the E Center (a much more expensive
structure)? No. The Jazz have never won a championship. Do they deserve their
Neutral Man. You say when you bought your house for $310,000 the realtor didn't
quote you a price of $850,000 which included the interest. When you bought your
house the Governor and State Legislature didn't force your friends and neighbors
to cough up $100,000 to help you pay for it either like they have forced the
taxpayers to do for Mr. Checketts. The Governor and legislature aren't giving me
any handouts either to pay for my property. If they would, I have a bunch of
good business propostions for them to look at. Let Mr. Checketts pay for his own
properties just like the rest of us do or give us all the same benefit of
tapping into the taxpayer spigot.
I love it, family of 8, we eat, drink, sleep soccer. And I have 6
siblings...with 6 kids each, and they love soccer. We will all be at that great
stadium for many years to come. Thanks to Checketts and Huntsman for your great
vision. Go RSL!
Anyone with any intelligence would have realized that the stadium was gonig to
cost more, once interest was included. I think this is now become a story
because of poor reporting to begin with. Had any of the reporters actually done
research instead of relying on word of mouth, they would have found the interest
and could have reported it much sooner. Now with the stadium well underway, what
do they think is going to happen? There is no point to this ranting by yet
another anti-soccer person. I hate the Jazz, but you don't hear me whinning
about them every week.
Thanks, DougI'm sure there is pressure from your editorial staff for
you to keep your opposition to government financing of private enterprise to
yourself. After all, Dave Checketts is a good church and family man. We should
support those good values.This isn't about hating on soccer or any
other sport or real estate development. It is simply about what is an
appropriate use of public money. Maybe they can give vouchers to those who also
want a piece of the public pie but don't necesarily like soccer. Then they can
buy us all off.How many votes will it take to put a check on this
kind of arrogant ambition? 20 votes anyone?
The Desnews has been totally misleading on this topic since last week. The
numbers haven't changed from the beginning. The reporter from the Desnews
showed up to the City Council meeting and finally understood the numbers. Tada!
News story. Stadium costs are going up dramatically because the reporters
didn't report the interest on bond payments in the first place.
So did Doug just dust off an old article from last year and submit it for this
week's column? Most of the time when a columnist is on vacation the newspaper
just prints a statement reading that there is no column this week.
Robinson conveniently leaves out Energy Solutions Arena in his short list of
local projects that have received public funds, as have the vast majority of
articles and columns written about this issue. Would he call that project a
waste of tax dollars? I doubt it. Without it, there would probably be no
Gateway, there would have been no Olympics, and the Jazz probably wouldn't be as
successful as they are. Furthermore, I highly doubt that if you researched how
much public money went into that building you would see the interest added into
the figures. So let's all turn a blind eye to the economic successes (since the
economic impact seems to be the only thing that matters to everyone at the Des
News) and focus on the "failures," at least until it comes time to build a
stadium for a Major League Baseball team. Then we'll see what all the
former-sports-writers-turned-columnists have to say.
To Ryan For your information, the Utah Jazz building was bought and paid
for by Larry Miller. He put up his business' and home as collatoral to borrow
the money from a bank. Then paid it off with his profits from the Jazz games and
other events at the Jazz building. Which is one of the reasons he was real happy
when the Jazz when into the play-offs. Cause the furthar they went into the
play-offs the more money it brought in for him to pay his loan off. He did it
with his own money and not the public taxes. Larry Miller took the risk with his
own money and it paid off for him. He didn't ask the public to pay for it with
him. Where Dave is asking the public to take the risk with him. If it pays off
he gets the profits and if it doesn't the public wind up paying for it while he
walks away with a loss yes, But it is just small change for him. So leave the
Jazz building out of it.
Its funny that these two articles all the sudden appear around elections, and if
you are going to cast your vote for people who supported the stadium that is
pretty lame and a waste of a vote. There are more important issues facing the
state of Utah than a soccer stadium. I find it funny that Utahns are up in arms
over this stadium and they want to oust everyone involved but in the same breath
a lot of the same people are in support for President Bush and the trillions of
tax money wasted on the War in Irag, the War on Drugs, the War on terrorism etc
etc. There are bigger fish to fry than a group of politicians who believe there
is an economic benefit to Utahns for building a soccer specific stadium.
Again as Ryan mentioned, WE ARE NOT PAYING FOR THIS. It is coming out of Hotel
Taxes. So its the visiting NBA teams, college teams, triple A baseball teams,
AFL teams, MLS teams; Corporations flying people in. Everyone who stays in a
hotle in Salt Lake County. Unless your name is Rick Majerus and you live in a
hotel, then this is not your dollars coming out of your pocket. If this was a
property tax or sales tax issue then that would be different, but its not.
You're 100% wrong about Larry Miller and the Delta Center. Larry paid for the
BUILDING with his own money, but the land and infrastructure are 100% PUBLICLY
FINANCED! This is almost the EXACT DEAL Dave Checketts got for the soccer
stadium. The stadium is privately financed.The only difference?
Both groups are supposed to pay the public back for that land. Checketts is
paying it back at almost $200k per year. Larry Miller is paying it back at $3
per year.No, that's not a typo - 3 dollars every year.The soccer stadium is actually a BETTER DEAL for the public than the Delta
Center was. Please everyone (especially DLG), get the facts before you share
DLC, the prime real estate that LHM got for basically free doesn't hurt him. LHM
got money and incentives too, don't be naive.
Money is fungible. No matter where it comes from, every dollar the county
spends on the stadium is one that it can't spend on anything else, or that it
must make up by raising taxes. We are paying for this.
GREAT ARTICLE DOUG!!! Let me see- the teachers will get a 9-10% raise this
year, turns out to be less than 4%. the teachers will get a $1,000 bonus this
year if they have worked less than 5 years- turns out to be $600. The stadium is
going to cost $45 Million. Whoops it's $78 Million or $90 Million- who knows.
My questiion- can anyone in Utah add? You have to love these guys. Jay
Soccer has done more to help us raise a nation of wimps than anything else.
Lets give everyone a trophy even if they can't kick a ball. Have to make sure
they feel good about themselves even if they know they can't play the game worth
a lick. What a joke. the only bigger joke I know is the stadium deal. We, the
public, should never have to pay for a private, money-making deal for few rich
individuals. Where are these peoples morals and ethics?
First the stadium deal by the idiots up on Capitol Hill..the SAME guys in favor
of Referendum 1....Please, everyone....look at these guys and ask yourself "Do
they really represent the majority of Utahns, or are they just looking out for
their own greedy self interests"?
Get over it. Your short sighting whining about the costs fail to even
acknowledge the monies that will be coming to this state for years to come. The
government rutinely spends money on projects where there is no return. We spend
hundreds of millions of dollars are year fixing and making roads where there
will be no money coming back (except pollution) and you whine about a project
where you will actually see a return on investment. Name me another government
funded project that has a return on investment. Get over it already.
Incorrect Jim Janney, that is not how public money works. Public money is set
aside for specific purposes. TRT money - the fund that the stadium
infrastructure is being paid for with - can only be used for tourism specific
projects. Since big international soccer games draw people from all over the
world, it was a logical choice to spend that money in that way.Had
the stadium not happened, that money simply would not have been collected. The
TRT would've simply gone away.Quick summary of where we stand:- NO, the stadium money could not have been spent on schools or roads.-
NO, the money could not have been allocated to another project.- NO, there
is no tax increase for anyone, including hotel patrons! It was simply a time
extension of the already-existing transient room tax.As somebody
above already wrote, PLEASE check your facts before posting.
Such a beautiful game, played by the worlds greatest athletes. Most soccer guys
I know walked onto their varsity football teams after being begged to come help
them out. Soccer...breeding success.
Mr.Robinson: With all due respect, your article is highly subjective and totally
biased.You forget about the national impact the RSL stadium is going
to have on soccer fans all over the U.S.We, for once, are already
planning our fifth trip to your beautiful state, if nothing else, to admire your
land, rejoice in your hospitality and to celebrate the completion of such
impressive facility.Whenever in Texas, let us know. The trip to Old
Mexico and the "tasty Margaritas" are on the house for you or any other Utahan
@Neutral Manyes as a matter of fact it WAS disclosed to you that
your 310k loan would in fact end up costing you 850k if paid back at the rate
indicated in your loan papers. If you chose not to read that particular piece of
information thats your choice. It WAS however disclosed to you, prior to the
time you made the committment to pay it all.The total price of the
stadium however was NOT disclosed to anyone ( that I know of ) prior to a
decision being made on funding.
This whole soccer stadium mess is really a boondoggle for the Checketts family.
Thanks Dave for showing us what you really are like. And John and Mary Kay have
lost my support for this horrible decision. Thanks Doug for writing something
Yeah, 28 million does seem like a lot of money. Oh wait, how much money are we
voting to put on our property taxes today for 5 new government
buildings.........$192 million. Why does it cost $192 million to build 5
buildings? Oh, and whats the interest payments on that? Definatley a lot more
than they are going to tell us. How about doug write an article on that.
Really, this soccer stadium is pennies compared to how badly our taxes are being
misused. I think they stadium is going to do just fine.
From the same Legislature and Governor that brought you vouchers.When does Huntsman come up for re-election.
Given the current state of our economy, rise in fuel costs, decline in taxes
from TRT, decline in pro soccer attendance nation wide....E.T. Barnum had it
right " A fool and his money are soon parted"Like so many things goverment
in Utah has done, from syn- crete, to the Great Salt Lake pumps,just another
failure waiting to happen. Not a very well heeded message from the voters, who
are the... REAL fools here. Throw the bums out on the next election, or stay
silent about this shell game. Have a good day.
Once again another worthless article that does nothing but instgate people about
an issue long since dead. There's nothing that can be done about the stadium
now. Thanks for wasting everyone's time Deseretnews and Thanks again for making
everyone cheezed off!
"..decline in pro soccer attendance nation wide.."This was the best
year for MLS, attendance wise, since the inaugural season in 1996. MLS regular season attendance for the past 3 years:2005 -
15,1082006 - 15,5042007 - 16,770
We have all been bamboozled by the Governor and his band of misfits in the
legislature. Huntsman and any other Stadium thief will NEVER get my vote.
Hopefully the MAJORITY of us that strongly opposed this deal have long
memories.Also, please don't say it didn't affect us because it was
from transient room tax. That is the most flawed argument I have ever heard.
They took the money from the coffers that could have been used on more pressing
needs and sunk it into a stadium that not many support. It doesn't matter where
the money came from, it isn't available for other projects.If you
support the stadium, thats fine. I won't change your mind and you won't change
mine. I just hope those of us that didn't want this (And thats over 70% of us if
Dan Jones Polls are to be believed) will remember when future elections come up.
That's the beauty of democracy right.Lastly, to those of you who
live in SLC and are supporting your tax dollars going to the Stadium, I sure
hope you voted yes to the new Public Safety building yesterday. If not, your
priorities are way out of whack!
To all you who think your not paying for it your just plain wrong. The Hotel tax
that could have been spent on other projects has been diverted to a stadium.
Your tax dollar will pick up the short fall in the other areas.Let
me assure you, Visitors to the state are not paying for it, you are!
Great article Doug.If the soccer stadium will be such a financial
success why were private investors not willing to finance it 100%? It should
bring them a great return on their investment if it turns out as successful as
Dave Checketts and other claim.
If the owner were Larry Miller and the exact same scenerio occurred Robinson
would be singing his praises. Let go of it Robinson. We're sick and tired of
your complaining about soccer. And one thing more--where do you get
some of your best track athletes from? The soccer team. You should know since
you recruit some of your best runners at Alta High from the soccer team.
"Jim is wrong" is correct in noting that there are restrictions on how transient
room tax funds can be spent. However, a soccer stadium is hardly the only
tourism related project that the county could fund, if it were allowed to make
its own decisions. Now, and for the next twenty years, any other eligible
projects will either have to go unfunded or be paid for out of other revenues.
The fact remains: we are paying for this.
Anyone notice that this article was posted on ELECTION DAY! Talk about beating
a dead horse into the ground. I feel that this paper has had an agenda against
the stadium from the start. Fact is that they should cover what is happening on
the field more, so that people will come to the games more and continue to build
a great community atmosphere with RSL, just like we have with the Jazz.
Everyone should thank Dave Checketts because he had the vision to bring a team
here at a time when the league probably could have easier gone to a bigger
market. Now cities like Vegas, Milwaukee, Seattle, Philadephia, Portland, and
Atlanta are lining up and scrabbling to get a team. Yeah and I can guarantee
you that all will need to have a stadium deal in place before that happens AND
it will probably cost the public a lot more that what Salt Lake will pay. For
the record, the Toronto stadium was paid by 100% public financing and New Yorks
Stadium will cost a lot more in public financing that what SLC got.
Thanks for your comments. Could not agree more with Doug. This issue just
boils my blood.And what will happen? Nothing. We'll just keep paying
higher and higher taxes.Larry Miller didn't get his stadium paid for did
he? Why should golden boy Dave Checketts?I simply don't get it. This is
a losing proposition.Thanks for calling a spade a spade.Terrible.
I agree with all the people that denounce Doug Robinson's short-sided opinions.
He seems to be a very suspicious and angry person.
With everyone complaining about how our politicians dont want to fund public
schools, did anyone realize that the TRT Tax will actually generate excess
revenue that will pour into the Jordan School District for the next 30yrs. It
appears that the lions share of this fund will go to the school district and a
minor percentage will go to the RSL stadium. Not to mention the 20 million
bucks that went to the stadium that would have been used to build a PARKING LOT
for the Expo Center. At least now the parking will be on the stadium grounds
and we get to have both. Quit your complaining and go to www.rslstadium.com to
get the facts people. Lets not forget the "embarassment" of having Peter Coroon
announcing a stadium deal in front of David Beckham than rennegging months
later. Talk about integrity, lying, a just "trying to be a politician" to look
I use to like Doug Robinson's articles but find it to be very rare that I do
anymore. We get it, you hate soccer, the stadium deal,the BCS, and Michael Vick
as that is all you ever seem to write about anymore! Well as much as you hate
soccer is as much as I hate seeing another one of your boring articles on
cross-country running. From what I've heard you seem to be quite narcissitic
and controlling. Try taking a deep breath and find something else to complain
I use to like Doug'd articles buy rarely do so now. We get it! You hate
soccer, the stadium deal, the BCS, and Michael Vick/Vince Young. As much as
you hate soccer is as much as I hate reading another one of your boring
cross-country running articles. Try finding a new subject to complain about.
Wine, complain, and moan. That's all everyone did when the light-rail plan was
approved. Like RSL stadium, the light-rail was met with strong public
disapproval. However, once up and running the light-rail has been a fantastic
addition to the county and people have changed their minds about it. The same
will happen for RSL stadium.
I used to love Doug's articles but no more. The Sandy Stadium will be great for
the community and the state.
It's painful to see who bitter so many people are towards soccer. It is the
sport that the world embraces, and yet we scorn it. The most watched game in the
nation is not, as many would believe, the Super Bowl, but rather the Mexico vs.
U.S. National soccer game. The sport is continually growing, and seeing how it
doesn't interfere with other U.S. sports, why not embrace it?As for
those that say Larry Miller payed for his stadium, I would suggest you check
your local records. The stadium WAS publicly funded, and Larry still has a few
more years before it is paid off. Everyone enjoyed the winning years with
Stockton and Malone, that we forget the numerous terrible seasons the Jazz had.
There was a time when Miller planned on selling the team, and he even went so
far as to sell shares of ownership in the team. Real is having a rough start,
just as the Jazz, but with our support whey will grow in the sport. Embrace the
growth, and be open minded. Also, think of the job opportunities the stadium is
and will create.
ha ha suckers the stadium is being built whether you like it or not. Get over it
doug! Soccer is here to stay.
As a former DesNews subscriber I'm not surprised that Mr. Robinson is back at it
again writing on one of the only subjects that he has found interesting in the
past two years. So he hates soccer, we get it. So he thinks the stadium is a
bad deal for the public, we get it.Well, Mr. Robinson has been heard
loud and clear on numerous occasions as well as his cronies over at DesNews.Some of us would like to be heard as well. We're sick of having to have
our subscription fees and advertising dollars go to fund bad reporting. Quite
plainly we're tired of the same old stories from you Mr. Robinson. We the
readers don't get to vote on your continued employment, but if we did, we'd take
our money and spend it on some more accurate, informative, and interesting
reporting. There must be something else you could write about rather than
continue to estrange more and more readers from your column and from the